Well I guess will just have to wait and see what happens.
Hopefully Kenny is still the same good guy we knew in season 1, and hopefully Luke is alright.
I agree with you 100%.
And my playthrough is the same as yours.
In that, Kenny, Lee and Clementine are like family.
The only thing that would make me turn against Kenny, is if he killed a member of the group, without any reason at all,( Like Lilly did to Carly).
Even so, it would still be hard to turn against him.
The difference is, Clem only knows Luke for one week. She definitelly likes and cares about him, but people saying that he is like a brother… more for Clem isn't true. Kenny was part of Clementines life for a much longer time then Luke was and he/she considers him/her as " family ", atleast in my playthough. I like Luke, don't get me wrong here, but i will be one my old Bros side no matter what!
And about that: " What do you think of Luke as Clementine's guardian? "
Clem doesn't need a guardian, she can take good care of herself. She needs someone she can count on and who is there for her no matter what. (Kenny/Luke)
You don't owe him shit. Especially after all of the dickish things he did. He has only ever done two kind things for my Lee. He saved me in the first episode, which he neutralized by letting you die two episodes later, and then he let me not telling him that I was a murderer go, which he probably only did because he didn't give a shit after his wife died.
Well Kenny and my Lee were pals.
I had his back, and he had mine.
I saved Duck from those walkers on Herschel's farm.
And I stood up to Larry at the drug store.
And when it came to the meat locker, I held Lilly back while Kenny kept Larry from re-animating.
When I thought about how quick the kid back at the motel turned, I didn't see a whole lot of options.
Looking back, I wish there could've been a way to save Larry.
I really do.
But without his medicine, and with the very real risk of him coming back as a walker, and not to mention the fact Larry could easily overpower both men, it seemed the only solution.
However I did not go along with kenny about looting the station wagon.
Kenny then saved my Lee at the drugstore.
( Incidentally, I did not, and could not, go along with Kenny about leaving that girl in the street as bait, and thus euthanized her).
I did agree with Kenny about leaving Lilly behind after she killed Carly.
Lilly had no proof whatsoever that Carly had been helping the bandits!
Plus, Lilly's cold attitude towards helping other survivors, really sickened me.
When Kenny and my Lee brought Ben and his wounded friend back to the motel, in an effort to try and save the latter, Lilly and Larry felt I should've just left them to die.
That's just wrong!
After Lilly killed Carly, that was the last straw!
Hence, I left her on the side of the road, with no regrets whatsoever.
After that, I euthanized Duck so Kenny didn't have to.
As well as the boy in the attic, after seeing how hard it was for Kenny to go through with it.
And finally, when Clementine went missing, Kenny repayed my loyalty by jumping to help me find her, even though I had opted for going alone.
And when my Lee collapsed, Kenny cut his arm off, in an attempt to save my Lee's life.
And finally, when Ben fell in the alleyway, and after I refused to abandon Kenny, he pushed my Lee back and locked the gate, getting him out of danger.
So all things considered, Kenny has done alright by me.
Hence I owe him.
You don't owe him shit. Especially after all of the dickish things he did. He has only ever done two kind things for my Lee. He saved me in … morethe first episode, which he neutralized by letting you die two episodes later, and then he let me not telling him that I was a murderer go, which he probably only did because he didn't give a shit after his wife died.
Lilly had no proof that Carly was working with the bandits!
So there was no reason for Lilly to kill Carly.
Personally, I think she just did it out of hate.
Lilly had a reason to kill Carley... And showed remorse...
Anyways, I gotta know, if Kenny is the kind of guy who would do things like th… moree door incident (which, had Lee died there, it would've been MUCH worse than the Carley situation) REALLY the right person to raise Clem?
And also, I doubt Christa is dead.
Lilly had no proof that Carly was working with the bandits!
So there was no reason for Lilly to kill Carly.
Personally, I think she just did it out of hate.
Granted she was under a lot of stress.
However, it doesn't make what she did to Carly right.
There's no excuse for murder!
Killing in self-defense is one thing.
Cold-blooded murder, is something totally different.
You're not implying Kenny perhaps harmed Luke in some way, are you?
I'm not trying to jump the gun!
I'm just trying to understand exactly … morewhat you're saying.
After all, saying Kenny harmed Luke in some way, or visa versa, is a very serious implication.
And generally one that shouldn't be made without hard evidence.
So what exactly are you suggesting?
Even if you think Kenny murdered Luke, like Shane did Otis, I'd like to know.
Granted she was under a lot of stress.
However, it doesn't make what she did to Carly right.
There's no excuse for murder!
Killing in self-defense is one thing.
Cold-blooded murder, is something totally different.
Edit the title. "What do you think of Clementine as Luke's guardian" is much more accurate.
On second thought, make that. "What do you think of Clementine as everyone's guardian"
Yeah, I don't think Kenny would kill Luke either.
Kenny has killed to survive, but that doesn't make him a cold-blooded murderer.
Here's my theory, provided what you're saying turns out to be true, perhaps Kenny and Luke started having a very heated argument, Kenny slugged him, and accidentally knocked Luke out.
And maybe he's afraid to tell Clementine that, worried about how she would react, if she found out Kenny decked him.
After all, it wouldn't be the first time Kenny took a poke at someone.
Remember what happened with Larry at the drugstore?
Larry wants to throw Duck out, whom he thinks has been bitten, and provided if Lee tells Kenny to knock Larry out, Kenny does punch Larry, which Larry responds to by knocking Kenny on his ass.
She was never going to get proof. She realized that. As long as she still existed within the group, nobody was ever going to 'fess up. Not to Lee. Not to anybody. As crazy as she was, she was smart. She took Carley's aggressiveness as defensiveness, and people get defensive when they feel guilt. At least that was what was going in her head. So what did she do? She made a gut decision. Kill the guilty one. She talked about never trusting Carley, but you know what? She never trusted Lee, either. Well, it's possible she didn't. In that route, she fucking despises Lee. More so than Carley could ever dream of pissing her off. This is fucking proof that Lilly did not kill out of spite. If she did, everybody's favorite golden voice would have died a lot sooner.
Lilly had no proof that Carly was working with the bandits!
So there was no reason for Lilly to kill Carly.
Personally, I think she just did it out of hate.
Really? Because I find him making decisions and trying to keep Clem safe is more of a guardian role. Clem hasn't helped Luke much. Luke was Clem's biggest supporter once Pete convinced him to be. He offered her food, when nobody else did. He saved her life from those walkers.
I've got a feeling (a bad one) that it is possible for Luke to become Clem's guardian. It's a profitable choice for the producers, and it's … morequite practical... BUT, Telltale's bigger on storytelling ethics than just mere profit, so I'm going to give my good faith and say no, they'll be more creative than that. Luke becoming a guardian is... honestly, kinda cliche. I got nothing against that guy, but it'd be more interesting for me to see an eleven year old survive all the way throughout the series without much help. That's what really set Clem apart as a character since the beginning of Season 2 (or hell, Season 1, if you wanna count her treehouse).
Yes people do get defensive when they feel guilty.
There's an old saying: "A guilty person will often scream the loudest."
And Ben was the one who was flipping out the worst!
But it's also natural for an innocent person to defend themselves against false accusations.
For example, think if you were accused of something you didn't do, would you not defend yourself?
Of course you would!
And the way Lilly was yelling and screaming, to remain calm would not be easy.
All of that could've been avoided if Lilly had not approached the situation while angry.
Of course at that point, Lilly could not be reasoned with.
Her whole attitude suggested, to me, that she was just looking for someone to blame.
Whenever there's a situation that needs to be addressed, it's always smart to make sure you're calm, before going to deal with it.
Anger, screaming, and displays of temper never help a situation.
And since Ben turned out to be the one responsible, Lilly thus gunned down an innocent, not to mention, unarmed woman.
She was never going to get proof. She realized that. As long as she still existed within the group, nobody was ever going to 'fess up. Not t… moreo Lee. Not to anybody. As crazy as she was, she was smart. She took Carley's aggressiveness as defensiveness, and people get defensive when they feel guilt. At least that was what was going in her head. So what did she do? She made a gut decision. Kill the guilty one. She talked about never trusting Carley, but you know what? She never trusted Lee, either. Well, it's possible she didn't. In that route, she fucking despises Lee. More so than Carley could ever dream of pissing her off. This is fucking proof that Lilly did not kill out of spite. If she did, everybody's favorite golden voice would have died a lot sooner.
Well, they kinda sort of help each other out I suppose. More like kind of a partnership/friendship, rather than a guardian/kid relationship. I think Kenny would be a better guardian for her, but I'm interested in Luke's group so I really don't know.
Yes... That is true... But Ben was flipping out in a different WAY than Carley, so that may have affected it, but nonetheless...
This is also true...
Of course she was. She was trying to find the culprit. By yelling and screaming, she was hoping to draw the guilty one out of their shells. Make them "scream the loudest."
Something tells me she was relatively smart and calm behind the crazy talking.
Yeah. She did kill an innocent woman. But she did so with reason. Of course, she was wrong, but the way that she was right on almost every single level says something. She didn't kill out of spite. She didn't relentlessly attack. She strategically chose what she wanted to do, and, fortunately, chose wrong (I would MUCH rather have Ben until the end than Carley). All you've done here is support me.
Yes people do get defensive when they feel guilty.
There's an old saying: "A guilty person will often scream the loudest."
And Ben was the… more one who was flipping out the worst!
But it's also natural for an innocent person to defend themselves against false accusations.
For example, think if you were accused of something you didn't do, would you not defend yourself?
Of course you would!
And the way Lilly was yelling and screaming, to remain calm would not be easy.
All of that could've been avoided if Lilly had not approached the situation while angry.
Of course at that point, Lilly could not be reasoned with.
Her whole attitude suggested, to me, that she was just looking for someone to blame.
Whenever there's a situation that needs to be addressed, it's always smart to make sure you're calm, before going to deal with it.
Anger, screaming, and displays of temper never help a situation.
And since Ben turned out to be the one responsible, Lilly thus gunned down an innocent, not to mention, unarmed woman.
I just came to say, Ken hitting Carver doesn't seem that crazy to me. He wasn't that far away, and he was standing the fuck still, with his head wide out in the open, with more than enough margin for error for Ken to try to kill him.
Interesting view I must say.
Granted, Clementine seems to be no stranger, when it come to dealing with walkers.
However, there's always so… moremething new she can learn.
Like handling a rifle.
That's never not useful.
And Kenny obviously has the know-how, nevermind the skills, to train Clementine to be a crack shot.
When you consider how he nailed Carver, who at the time was using Alvin as a human shield.
Even though Kenny didn't kill Carver, the fact that he nailed him is truly impressive!
And I do think, aside from knowing how to survive, she needs to have someone teach her how to be a good person.
Lee, in my game, gave her a good foundation, in that respect.
But now, like any construction project, further building needs to be done, so that eventually the task will be completed.
If I knew Luke better, I'd be more comfortable with him mentoring Clementine.
Luke seems like a nice guy, but then people are not always what they appe… [view original content]
I do agree, it's a difficult idea to get used to.
Especially with Kenny in the picture.
In many ways I think Kenny would be better suited … moreto the task of taking care of Clementine.
And admittedly, Luke's disappearing during Carver's raid, doesn't help build my confidence in him.
But I guess will see what Luke's made of in season 3.
As a teammate, yeah.
As a "brother", yeah.
As a caretaker ? It depends on how they put it.
Clementine is very tough for her age, but she has yet to learn everything about survival (Christa making a fire).
Know what I'm saying ?
Clementine being the guardian of everyone is not really realistic (except Sarah). An adult, even if stupid has more authority than a child.
That's why Kenny would be great for the role.
He's older, has more life experience, and his skills with a rifle, along with what other survival skills he's picked up in the last two years since we saw
saw him, are priceless.
I think, from those perspectives, he'd be a better mentor for Clementine, than Luke.
Although Luke does have one trait, that Kenny still seems to lack at this point, and that is the ability to look at things from an objective point of view.
That, and the fact that he appears to be able to remain calm when things are going to hell around him.
And on a personal note, I think Pete would've also been a great mentor for Clementine.
Like Kenny, he was older, had more life experience, while being able to keep an objective viewpoint, and remain calm under pressure.
However, his age might've proved to be an issue.
In that kind of an environment, a man needs to be able to move fast, and someone as old as Pete may find that a challenge.
Plus, respectfully, there's only so much punishment a 55-65 year old body can take.
That's another reason Kenny would be great.
He's a bit older, but he still has enough youthful stamina.
Hah! No, not really. Some adults are so incompetent that they wish they had the intelligence of a child. Trust me, some of the guys at the metal cleaning facility are some of the dumbest motherf*ckers to walk this planet.
As a teammate, yeah.
As a "brother", yeah.
As a caretaker ? It depends on how they put it.
Clementine is very tough for her age, but she … morehas yet to learn everything about survival (Christa making a fire).
Know what I'm saying ?
Clementine being the guardian of everyone is not really realistic (except Sarah). An adult, even if stupid has more authority than a child.
Exactly.
Luke, I will say is very smart, reasonable, and observant.
He seems to be able to read people pretty well, though not as well as Pete, but then again that comes with experience.
Caretaker, I will agree, is not quite the right way to describe Luke.
Mentor is much more suitable!
Unlike a caretaker, a mentor will not only look after and protect their protege, but also train and encourage their protege to learn how to think, act and reason for themself.
And that's exactly what Luke has been doing, at least until he disappeared.
And I'll also agree, that Clementine is very tough, tougher than most kids are at that age.
I would personally say she needs more of someone who's like a father.
As a father figure will be able to train her, and yet still give her counsel when it's needed.
And that's another reason why Kenny would be good for that role.
Don't get me wrong, Luke seems to have very well towards Clementine.
But Kenny has the experience of being a parent, and knows what it takes to train a child.
As a teammate, yeah.
As a "brother", yeah.
As a caretaker ? It depends on how they put it.
Clementine is very tough for her age, but she … morehas yet to learn everything about survival (Christa making a fire).
Know what I'm saying ?
Clementine being the guardian of everyone is not really realistic (except Sarah). An adult, even if stupid has more authority than a child.
You make many good points.
I apologise for being hasty in my judgement.
But what I don't understand is why he abandoned her when Carver attacked the group.
Luke might be a good mentor, but in my mind, he bailed at a very critical moment.
Lee and Clem had a Dad Daughter bond and that can never be beat. But I feel like Luke will be like a big brother to her :) Before Carver, everyone in the cabin had some type of family member or partner except Luke. And Clem doesn't have parents. So they basically have no one and everyone else in the group has there own family to only look after.
Luke and Clem are like bro/sis. I think they'll just continue to look out for each other, but a guardian role is usually to do with a father/daughter or a mother/daughter bond, which they don't have. I will say though, they make a good team.
Never there for her? I can give you a list of the things he did for her.
* Saved her life in the forest. If it wasn't for him and Pete,… more then Clementine would've been eaten alive.
* Defended her from the group and apologized when he failed because he was outnumbered.
* Convinced the group to let Clementine out of the shed. Remember when Luke opened the shed after the walker attacked? Well if you listened to the kitchen conversation, he was arguing that they let Clem go and apologize for being assholes.
* Made Nick apologize for almost shooting Clem and and being "aggro."
* Fed her and took the time to listen to her story and sympathize with her. I believe it was best for Clem to talk about her trauma rather than repress it.
* Went out to look for Clem when she went missing. Remember when Rebecca said that she tried to convince Luke to not go look for her, but he couldn't leave her out there.
* He's giving her first hand … [view original content]
Comments
I think he has already proven that he isn't.
I agree with you 100%.
And my playthrough is the same as yours.
In that, Kenny, Lee and Clementine are like family.
The only thing that would make me turn against Kenny, is if he killed a member of the group, without any reason at all,( Like Lilly did to Carly).
Even so, it would still be hard to turn against him.
I'm still willing to give him the benefits of a doubt.
Besides, I owe him that.
You don't owe him shit. Especially after all of the dickish things he did. He has only ever done two kind things for my Lee. He saved me in the first episode, which he neutralized by letting you die two episodes later, and then he let me not telling him that I was a murderer go, which he probably only did because he didn't give a shit after his wife died.
Well Kenny and my Lee were pals.
I had his back, and he had mine.
I saved Duck from those walkers on Herschel's farm.
And I stood up to Larry at the drug store.
And when it came to the meat locker, I held Lilly back while Kenny kept Larry from re-animating.
When I thought about how quick the kid back at the motel turned, I didn't see a whole lot of options.
Looking back, I wish there could've been a way to save Larry.
I really do.
But without his medicine, and with the very real risk of him coming back as a walker, and not to mention the fact Larry could easily overpower both men, it seemed the only solution.
However I did not go along with kenny about looting the station wagon.
Kenny then saved my Lee at the drugstore.
( Incidentally, I did not, and could not, go along with Kenny about leaving that girl in the street as bait, and thus euthanized her).
I did agree with Kenny about leaving Lilly behind after she killed Carly.
Lilly had no proof whatsoever that Carly had been helping the bandits!
Plus, Lilly's cold attitude towards helping other survivors, really sickened me.
When Kenny and my Lee brought Ben and his wounded friend back to the motel, in an effort to try and save the latter, Lilly and Larry felt I should've just left them to die.
That's just wrong!
After Lilly killed Carly, that was the last straw!
Hence, I left her on the side of the road, with no regrets whatsoever.
After that, I euthanized Duck so Kenny didn't have to.
As well as the boy in the attic, after seeing how hard it was for Kenny to go through with it.
And finally, when Clementine went missing, Kenny repayed my loyalty by jumping to help me find her, even though I had opted for going alone.
And when my Lee collapsed, Kenny cut his arm off, in an attempt to save my Lee's life.
And finally, when Ben fell in the alleyway, and after I refused to abandon Kenny, he pushed my Lee back and locked the gate, getting him out of danger.
So all things considered, Kenny has done alright by me.
Hence I owe him.
Lilly had no proof that Carly was working with the bandits!
So there was no reason for Lilly to kill Carly.
Personally, I think she just did it out of hate.
Logically speaking, she was under a lot of stress at the time. But I still hate her guts for killing my potential love interest for the game.
I think Clem is more of Luke's guardian than vice versa...
Granted she was under a lot of stress.
However, it doesn't make what she did to Carly right.
There's no excuse for murder!
Killing in self-defense is one thing.
Cold-blooded murder, is something totally different.
I'm not necessarily saying he murdered luke I'm saying something happened that hes refusing to tell Clem something
He´s a good guy, but he can´t really safe clem from the zombie apocalypse.
I didn't mean to say what she did was right - I meant to say that what she did was human. Take that as you will. :P
Hell yeah. That little girl keeps on surprising me with each episode of season 2, being far more mature than the other 'grown-ups.'
Yeah, I don't think Kenny would kill Luke either.
Kenny has killed to survive, but that doesn't make him a cold-blooded murderer.
Here's my theory, provided what you're saying turns out to be true, perhaps Kenny and Luke started having a very heated argument, Kenny slugged him, and accidentally knocked Luke out.
And maybe he's afraid to tell Clementine that, worried about how she would react, if she found out Kenny decked him.
After all, it wouldn't be the first time Kenny took a poke at someone.
Remember what happened with Larry at the drugstore?
Larry wants to throw Duck out, whom he thinks has been bitten, and provided if Lee tells Kenny to knock Larry out, Kenny does punch Larry, which Larry responds to by knocking Kenny on his ass.
What do you think about that theory?
She was never going to get proof. She realized that. As long as she still existed within the group, nobody was ever going to 'fess up. Not to Lee. Not to anybody. As crazy as she was, she was smart. She took Carley's aggressiveness as defensiveness, and people get defensive when they feel guilt. At least that was what was going in her head. So what did she do? She made a gut decision. Kill the guilty one. She talked about never trusting Carley, but you know what? She never trusted Lee, either. Well, it's possible she didn't. In that route, she fucking despises Lee. More so than Carley could ever dream of pissing her off. This is fucking proof that Lilly did not kill out of spite. If she did, everybody's favorite golden voice would have died a lot sooner.
Really? Because I find him making decisions and trying to keep Clem safe is more of a guardian role. Clem hasn't helped Luke much. Luke was Clem's biggest supporter once Pete convinced him to be. He offered her food, when nobody else did. He saved her life from those walkers.
His intro scene begs to differ.
That's an interesting point... But Luke is still a better candidate than Ken.
Nah, if anyone, Clem seems to be heading towards being more of NICK'S guardian...temporarily that is.
Yes people do get defensive when they feel guilty.
There's an old saying: "A guilty person will often scream the loudest."
And Ben was the one who was flipping out the worst!
But it's also natural for an innocent person to defend themselves against false accusations.
For example, think if you were accused of something you didn't do, would you not defend yourself?
Of course you would!
And the way Lilly was yelling and screaming, to remain calm would not be easy.
All of that could've been avoided if Lilly had not approached the situation while angry.
Of course at that point, Lilly could not be reasoned with.
Her whole attitude suggested, to me, that she was just looking for someone to blame.
Whenever there's a situation that needs to be addressed, it's always smart to make sure you're calm, before going to deal with it.
Anger, screaming, and displays of temper never help a situation.
And since Ben turned out to be the one responsible, Lilly thus gunned down an innocent, not to mention, unarmed woman.
Well, they kinda sort of help each other out I suppose. More like kind of a partnership/friendship, rather than a guardian/kid relationship. I think Kenny would be a better guardian for her, but I'm interested in Luke's group so I really don't know.
he's okay but it needs to be a mature person like lee
Have people actually considered that?
Yes... That is true... But Ben was flipping out in a different WAY than Carley, so that may have affected it, but nonetheless...
This is also true...
Of course she was. She was trying to find the culprit. By yelling and screaming, she was hoping to draw the guilty one out of their shells. Make them "scream the loudest."
Something tells me she was relatively smart and calm behind the crazy talking.
Yeah. She did kill an innocent woman. But she did so with reason. Of course, she was wrong, but the way that she was right on almost every single level says something. She didn't kill out of spite. She didn't relentlessly attack. She strategically chose what she wanted to do, and, fortunately, chose wrong (I would MUCH rather have Ben until the end than Carley). All you've done here is support me.
I just came to say, Ken hitting Carver doesn't seem that crazy to me. He wasn't that far away, and he was standing the fuck still, with his head wide out in the open, with more than enough margin for error for Ken to try to kill him.
Don't you mean episode 3?
As a teammate, yeah.
As a "brother", yeah.
As a caretaker ? It depends on how they put it.
Clementine is very tough for her age, but she has yet to learn everything about survival (Christa making a fire).
Know what I'm saying ?
Clementine being the guardian of everyone is not really realistic (except Sarah). An adult, even if stupid has more authority than a child.
You're right.
That's why Kenny would be great for the role.
He's older, has more life experience, and his skills with a rifle, along with what other survival skills he's picked up in the last two years since we saw
saw him, are priceless.
I think, from those perspectives, he'd be a better mentor for Clementine, than Luke.
Although Luke does have one trait, that Kenny still seems to lack at this point, and that is the ability to look at things from an objective point of view.
That, and the fact that he appears to be able to remain calm when things are going to hell around him.
And on a personal note, I think Pete would've also been a great mentor for Clementine.
Like Kenny, he was older, had more life experience, while being able to keep an objective viewpoint, and remain calm under pressure.
However, his age might've proved to be an issue.
In that kind of an environment, a man needs to be able to move fast, and someone as old as Pete may find that a challenge.
Plus, respectfully, there's only so much punishment a 55-65 year old body can take.
That's another reason Kenny would be great.
He's a bit older, but he still has enough youthful stamina.
Hah! No, not really. Some adults are so incompetent that they wish they had the intelligence of a child. Trust me, some of the guys at the metal cleaning facility are some of the dumbest motherf*ckers to walk this planet.
Kenny could play Lee's role, but not replace it.
Exactly.
Luke, I will say is very smart, reasonable, and observant.
He seems to be able to read people pretty well, though not as well as Pete, but then again that comes with experience.
Caretaker, I will agree, is not quite the right way to describe Luke.
Mentor is much more suitable!
Unlike a caretaker, a mentor will not only look after and protect their protege, but also train and encourage their protege to learn how to think, act and reason for themself.
And that's exactly what Luke has been doing, at least until he disappeared.
And I'll also agree, that Clementine is very tough, tougher than most kids are at that age.
I would personally say she needs more of someone who's like a father.
As a father figure will be able to train her, and yet still give her counsel when it's needed.
And that's another reason why Kenny would be good for that role.
Don't get me wrong, Luke seems to have very well towards Clementine.
But Kenny has the experience of being a parent, and knows what it takes to train a child.
Don't know who quoted this from season 1