Ep. 2 Carver vs EP. 3 Carver

As you may had noticed Carver changed between this two episodes i didnt liked him in ep2 as a person but yes like a villian he was smart and evil but now in ep 3 he is not as clever as in ep 2 and this gap seems to have been filled with more evil cause i really did heated this episode , how he made Carlos slap Sarah , how he killed Reggie,how he beated up Kenny and Alvin he was just insane .
Which Carver do you like the must i dont really know cause i like clever villians but the way he makes me hate him in this episode is just incredible.

EDIT:i also noticed they never explain why Carver was so unestable it was just like "He is evil just cause" i expected them to explain why he became like that cause he seemed like a dictator that was going crazy
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Comments

  • Episode 2 Carver did seem way more intelligent. Episode 3 Carver was just there to make us hate him.
  • edited May 2014
    THIS HAPPEN FOR CHANGE THE WRITTER....NICK BRECKON WRITE THE EPISODE 2 AND THE EPISODE 3 IS WRITTER FOR THE AMATEUR AND BAD WRITTER CALLED PIERRE SHORETTE.


    THIS NEW GUY CALLED PIERRE SHORETTE NEVER PLAY WALKING DEAD I THINK...SEE THE PLOTHOLES OF EPISODE 3,EXAMPLE THE TIME THAT APPEAR LUKE IN EP 3(IF NICK DIE IN EP 2NEVER QUESTION WHAT HAPPEN WITH NICK....AND MUCH OTHERS BAD DECISIONS OF THIS WRITTER.
  • I liked him in episode 2 more. He was calm, mysterious and intelligent. If ep2 carver was written like ep3 carver then he would have been slapping Clem in the cabin asking her where the people are.
  • I disagree. I hated him in both.
    JonGon posted: »

    Episode 2 Carver did seem way more intelligent. Episode 3 Carver was just there to make us hate him.

  • but atleast in ep 2 i hated and liked him at the same time now in episode 3 he is just hateble
    Carley123 posted: »

    I disagree. I hated him in both.

  • But you can agree with him in episode 3
    ps3gamer095 posted: »

    but atleast in ep 2 i hated and liked him at the same time now in episode 3 he is just hateble

  • IM CONFUSED here...
    Navoletti posted: »

    THIS HAPPEN FOR CHANGE THE WRITTER....NICK BRECKON WRITE THE EPISODE 2 AND THE EPISODE 3 IS WRITTER FOR THE AMATEUR AND BAD WRITTER CALLED P

  • Episode 2. He was calculating, intelligent, and didn't need to be violent to intimidate me. After re-watching the cabin scene yesterday I almost feel like EP2 Carver is a different person completely. So much potential there for a great character, and the idea of the cabin group having done something really bad in the past had me interested in their backstory. But I guess that plot point was dropped since it turns out they'd never done anything wrong and were simply being secretive for the sake of it. It wasn't even explained what exactly motivated them to leave in the first place or how they did it.

    Episode 3 Carver was your typical psychopath villain, I didn't find him memorable at all.
  • yeah i can agree ep.3 Carver is an awful person
    Carley123 posted: »

    But you can agree with him in episode 3

  • Calm in episode 2 he beat the shit out Carlos's and broke his fingers. Then he shot Walter in the back of the head for no reason but to piss off Kenny which he is probably regretting right now if you know what I mean. The point am trying to get a cross is this carver is carver you can't change who he is now because its too late its over it doesn't matter if one person wrote him one way and another person wrote him they other way its his character and we have to live with the character telltale has given us. Hopefully we get a dlc or a flash back explaining his character further until then we well have to wait.
  • edited May 2014
    Calm in episode 2 he beat the shit out Carlos's and broke his fingers. Then he shot Walter in the back of the head for no reason but to piss off Kenny which he is probably regretting right now if you know what I mean. The point am trying to get a cross is this carver is carver you can't change who he is now because its too late its over it doesn't matter if one person wrote him one way and another person wrote him they other way its his character and we have to live with the character telltale has given us. Hopefully we get a dlc or a flash back explaining his character further until then we well have to wait.
  • This wouldn't have happened if they didn't change writers. I liked episode three but there were a few changes that didn't fit. Such as Clementine fighting unlike how she usually fights, Carver talking a dramatic change in character, and a lack of direction with some of the more inexperienced voice actors for the episode... you know who i'm talking about.
  • the thing i really liked about ep 3 was how emotional Carlos and Alvin´s deaths were and how funny Troy's was XD
    _Juice_Box_ posted: »

    This wouldn't have happened if they didn't change writers. I liked episode three but there were a few changes that didn't fit. Such as Cleme

  • Yeah. I mean, I fucking hate Troy, but his death was hilarious. Also, yeah, I never thought i'd cry at Alvin's death. I was crying enough as it was then he said "Take care of my girls. I have a feeling it's gonna be a girl." I cried like a baby.
    ps3gamer095 posted: »

    the thing i really liked about ep 3 was how emotional Carlos and Alvin´s deaths were and how funny Troy's was XD

  • Episode 2 Carver was what made me like his character in the first place, Episode 3 is what made him one of my favorite characters. Okay that's a lie, he was one of my favorite in A House Divided as well, but I just like him more in Episode 3 than I did in Episode 2.
  • But in Ep 2, he broke Carlos' fingers with purpose. It was so he can goad Rebecca into coming out. He also killed Walter as payback for Johnny's death. In episode 3, he'd shoot first and ask questions later. All he was ever doing in episode 3 was beating someone up or pissing someone off.

    Calm in episode 2 he beat the shit out Carlos's and broke his fingers. Then he shot Walter in the back of the head for no reason but to piss

  • I don't think they did anything wrong with Carver besides killing him maybe a little too early. In episode 2 he was smart with Clementine because he knew she isn't dumb. Like he said in episode 3, "I know it when I see it." He played it up for Clementine so that he could squeeze information out of her without being too obvious or giving away his identity and motives.

    When he reappeared at the lodge he had everyone right where he wanted them, so he could drop the act. He was straight to the point. He asked Carlos right off the bat, "Where's Rebecca?" He proceeded to use violence to get what he wanted.

    When all went accordingly enough to plan, he brought them back to the camp where his true nature that Rebecca mentioned was revealed. He had sensible enough ideas, but horrible morals and a dreadful temper. Carver certainly left his mark on Clementine's and her friends' lives, especially depending on how the player had her behave around him.
  • edited May 2014
    He told Carlos to hit Sarah because she was everything he didn't want his child to be so in a way he was toughing up Sarah was it right fuck no but it was a reason same with Reggie he was tired with Reggie messing up so he killed him and finally betting the shit out of Kenney he needed to show they others the price for going against his back and to let them know not to fuck with him their reason's here you just got to dig deeper.
    BenUseful posted: »

    But in Ep 2, he broke Carlos' fingers with purpose. It was so he can goad Rebecca into coming out. He also killed Walter as payback for John

  • Carver was more mysterious and intelligent in episode 2, whereas in episode 3 he wasn't so subtle and was even rather predictable.
  • edited May 2014
    This was a great episode. Carver was such an evil and terrible person in the game with his tyrannical leadership and social Darwinist ideology . Props to telltale for making me actually enjoy the walking dead. The TV show was super boring and I stopped watching during season 2 when that kid gets shot ala friendly fire. Of course I had Clementine watch Kenny end Carver's life. Clementine isn't any old sissy little child and she certainly isn't some kind of sadistic kid who gets off on tormenting others. Clementine had to witness that event because you cannot allow a reckless murderer to rise again and create further havoc. Now it's time to let this crackhead woman loose like Ben in season 1. At least Ben wasn't intentionally malicious. I miss Carley too, if I ever see Lilly again she's getting strapped to a tree with plenty of loud music for the walkers to feast on.
  • edited May 2014
    and this is why Nick Breckon should of wrote episode 3. i thought Carver's character was more compelling in episode 2. In episode 3 Carver was nothing more than The Governor 2.0
  • edited May 2014
    He's the same character in both episodes.

    Those that didn't like him in Ep3 just didn't like the exposition.

    Socio/psychopaths are intelligent and charming when they need to be. That's what makes them so dangerous in the first place. They draw you in and by the time you realize they're insane (if you realize it) you're already under their spell or trapped physically.

    Consider people in abusive relationships. How do they get there in the first place? They're drawn in by the mystery and intelligence.
  • edited May 2014
    Sure, he's the same character, in name and role as a leader of a community, but his characterization is without a doubt very different. In episode 2 he was portrayed and talked about as a smart, cunning man, as shown by his instant notice of how many moves it would take to win the chess game (though it's funny in hindsight that since the chess pieces shown to us actually don't reflect the winning move he specified, it seems like he's just making shit up, even though that was obviously not the intention). Not once did he fly off the handle and mutilate someone in a blind rage, or even kill them for no reason. He was methodical every step of the way.

    In episode 3 he was nothing but a bully the entire time. Not once did he display any smarts or cunning. He was just your typical cocky bad guy, putting all the heroes together and just hoping they'd fall in line, and then acting like a cheesy ruthless dictator when they didn't. He even used the "we're not so different, you and I" trope, for god's sake. Plus, his "place of safety" is falling apart the whole time, walkers are getting in, and you just get the feeling this guy is an idiot on a power trip.

    And even if he was just hiding his true nature behind (apparently faked) intelligence and mystery, then that still doesn't rectify what people were disappointed with. All it means then is that TellTale set him up to be interesting, and then decided to turn him into a walking cliche. Intentionally or unintentionally, it remains a damn shame.

    He's the same character in both episodes. Those that didn't like him in Ep3 just didn't like the exposition. Socio/psychopaths a

  • edited May 2014
    First off, if you want anyone to take you seriously, work on your grammar...and your spelling.

    Second, a plot hole is an inconsistent occurrence in the flow of logic that can ruin the story. How can Luke saying hi to Nick make the story better?

    Third, I get that you're entitled to your own opinion about Pierre Shorette but don't say that he's a bad writer and not have any reasonable arguments to back it up.
    Navoletti posted: »

    THIS HAPPEN FOR CHANGE THE WRITTER....NICK BRECKON WRITE THE EPISODE 2 AND THE EPISODE 3 IS WRITTER FOR THE AMATEUR AND BAD WRITTER CALLED P

  • > Not once did he fly off the handle and mutilate someone in a blind rage, or even kill them for no reason. He was methodical every step of the way.

    ...Pretty sure he broke two of Carlos's fingers. You know, the *doctor* he needed to deliver his child? How the hell was that "methodical?" It was just a brutal strong-arm tactic. Same with killing Walt and (in my game) Alvin.

    Personally, all I got from Episode 2's portrayal of Carver was that he was great at manipulating people and getting inside their head. And that was demonstrated quite well by how he was able to have Reggie and Bonnie defending him despite all the shit he did. He talks about "forgiveness" and "love" to get people to think that by not killing them, he's doing them a favor. And that gives him a lot of control and leverage over his people. That was all he needed. I didn't expect some kind of evil genius out of him.

    Also, the "place of safety" wasn't falling apart. The place of safety was the inside of the compound. It's only the expansion outside that's wasn't secure.
    damkylan posted: »

    Sure, he's the same character, in name and role as a leader of a community, but his characterization is without a doubt very different. In e

  • I like ep 3 more because we see him more often.
  • Of course not, that's not Carver, as Kenny pointed out, its Bill...

    Carver is the wanderer, Bill is merely a maniac...
  • edited May 2014
    I thought if I added "in a blind rage" it would make it clear, but apparently not. By "methodical", I'm talking about how every action he takes serves a purpose and isn't just him being a bully. Notice how he's allowing for time in between everything he does to Carlos to intimidate Rebecca to come out, and he stops right away when his purpose is served. He doesn't fuck Carlos up even more to the point of leaving him in a vegetative state just to be a dick. Carlos is much less bruised if you give up, showing that even when he pulled out the knife, he wasn't going to kill him. He was just going to continue the torture until Rebecca inevitably gave up.

    Also, the fact that he needed Carlos is why he chose him, because Rebecca knows full well that she needs Carlos too, as Alvin pointed out. It wasn't him taking out his rage issues on someone. It was brutal and unnecessary, of course, but it served his purpose, because going to look for them posed a problem as Johnny pointed out.

    Maybe you interpreted it differently, and that's fine. But with all this in mind, I for one think there's a world of difference between that and the wide eyed psychopath fucking up Kenny and going way overboard just because he was pissed.

    Killing Walt was in direct response to Kenny killing Johnny, and was also a tactic to get Kenny to surrender. Ditto Alvin, and Carver also points out the man that Alvin killed, so it could also be a matter of killing those who kill his own, including people already in your circle. Kind of like Rick's "you kill, you die" rule in the comic. Again, methodical and logical. Carver doesn't even go nuts on Kenny after he's killed Johnny and determinately shot him right in the arm. Why would he not fuck up Kenny there, but do it because Kenny was sneaking radios around? Answer: Because he was clearly changed between episodes 2 and 3.

    I for one *was* expecting some kind of genius because that's the way TellTale was building him up. A man whose brutality is matched by his great intelligence that makes him a force to be reckoned with. Fast forward to episode 3, we got the guy on the ground at everyone's mercy, making cracks about Kenny's eye and telling Rebecca he'd shoot her and the baby before they left despite all the trouble he went through getting her back, and vilely telling Rebecca that he knew she enjoyed having sex with him (or rape, depending on how you read it). He just comes off like some drunk abusive husband after all the build up.

    Edit: And you know, in retrospect, I actually would have enjoyed that if it came after an episode where he was outsmarting everyone and kept his general demeanor from the previous episode. It'd be nice to see him show his true colors *then*, instead of having it just be the same thing we got throughout the episode (just more wordy), because I actually did like that scene well enough for what it was. I enjoy when a leader has fallen in fiction and is reduced to ranting because he knows he's lost. It's just the context of it all that left something to be desired, at least for me.

    Meh, I never got the impression that he had some great control over his people outside of simple fear and having muscle from blind idiots/similarly evil bastards to back him up. Basically, like others have said, he was just the Governor again. More specifically, season 3B Governor from the TV show, where he's acting like a psycho and talking about taking them all to war, and you just start to wonder why the hell anybody would follow someone who's clearly fucked in the head. Obviously, the justification is "because they're all stupid and easily led", which can work and does have precedence in the real world, but it lessens the threat of the leader if he doesn't ever come off as some kind of mastermind who knows to handle people rather than just scare them into complacency. But that's just my reading of it. Maybe I'll change my mind when I read the dialogue again more closely.

    Fair enough point on the defenses, though considering how easy it was for the damn walkers to get into that comic shop, I'd say that a compromised outer defense can easily lead to serious problems for the inner safe areas. If a herd got through that and hung around, they'd be completely trapped until the defenses inevitably fell to the strength of the herd.
    DomeWing333 posted: »

    > Not once did he fly off the handle and mutilate someone in a blind rage, or even kill them for no reason. He was methodical every step

  • CAPS LOCK YAY
    Navoletti posted: »

    THIS HAPPEN FOR CHANGE THE WRITTER....NICK BRECKON WRITE THE EPISODE 2 AND THE EPISODE 3 IS WRITTER FOR THE AMATEUR AND BAD WRITTER CALLED P

  • edited May 2014
    In my opinion the death of Reggie was a little bit off. I don't think alot of people in Carvers actual group where fine with that desicion. He killed him over nothing. I mean if they need more time to pick these fruits then they just have to work longer then they were supposed too. So i guess there must have been another reason he killed him. Probably he though that the group got to big with all the new people around and wanted to get rid of the weakest person so the food supplies last longer.

    Actually there might be alot of things carver had in mind we don't know. Telltale could have explained it a bit better, but at least we can think of some reasons of carver to act like he did, despite being a psychopath.

    Anybody else who thought that the writer of the episode had to cut it cause telltale games lacks the manpower to code more then around 90 minutes of gameplay in the given amount of time?
  • Carver's "evil" came from the fact that he saw himself as some sort of cult-like savior. The hardware store was his utopia. He constantly called his people 'the flock', his way 'the path', and residing in the community as 'the love'. He saw others as weak, himself as strong, and believed the exceptionally weak needed to die off. He was some kind of weird dictatorial cult leader. He wasn't "evil just 'cause".

    As for the cleverness, we really never got much indication of him being a highly intelligent man in Episode 2. He knew some chess moves and Carlos told Clementine he was very smart, but we never see much stupidity, or intelligence, from him in Episode 2 or 3. He just seems pretty average, though he has the management skills to run a community, and the psychological skills to break those down who don't agree with him.
  • > But with all this in mind, I for one think there's a world of difference between that and the wide eyed psychopath fucking up Kenny and going way overboard just because he was pissed.

    Well, Carver didn't need Kenny. He needed Carlos. From his point of view, Kenny was the clear trouble-maker in the group trying to incite a revolution within his camp. By beating him to a bloody pulp and possibly putting him out of commission for a good long while, Carver would be able to exert his dominance and crush the group's morale. It almost worked too. You saw the way the group was breaking down after they realized that they might have to leave Kenny and Rebecca behind. The only reason it didn't work was because Kenny ended up being tougher than Carver anticipated.

    > Carver doesn't even go nuts on Kenny after he's killed Johnny and determinately shot him right in the arm. Why would he not fuck up Kenny there, but do it because Kenny was sneaking radios around?

    Because he was kind of a dumb villain back then as well. It was *clearly* in his best interest to kill Kenny right then and there, both from a retributive standpoint and a logical standpoint. Kenny was clearly a threat to his power. he was headstrong and couldn't be reasoned with. Carver had no reason to keep him alive.
    damkylan posted: »

    I thought if I added "in a blind rage" it would make it clear, but apparently not. By "methodical", I'm talking about how every action he ta

  • Your avatar makes me happy.
    Healoz posted: »

    CAPS LOCK YAY

  • Haha thanks. :)

    Your avatar makes me happy.

  • i say sarah had it coming...

    He told Carlos to hit Sarah because she was everything he didn't want his child to be so in a way he was toughing up Sarah was it right fuck

  • Word! Carver did some stupid moves in the third episode.

    Carver was more mysterious and intelligent in episode 2, whereas in episode 3 he wasn't so subtle and was even rather predictable.

  • edited May 2014
    Episode 2 Carver was really awesome. He was smart, intelligent, but everyone told that Carver is violent and scary - I was very excited to see his evil mind in action. But in Episode 3 they turned him into stupid sadist. Through the episode he just punched everyone.
  • Episode 2 Carver seemed like he had order and at least some kind of code outside of your generic psychopath. If people haven't noticed Carver was very eye for an eye and a little bit more in ep 2 but in ep 3 he just goes all out psychopath. I thought he was going to be a unique villain but he fizzled flat like a soda due to writing. Maybe they had to change him to make the episode shorter.
  • this happen for the horrible writter new called Pierre shorette i hate this amateur writter and hope not see more of him.
  • ClaraHClaraH Banned
    Ep. 2 Carver seemed like he really "likes" Clem.
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