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Does anyone think Carver was right?

TalimancerTalimancer Banned
edited May 2014 in The Walking Dead
That Clementine is like him. A leader. I really think she has the potential and Rebecca's child will prove that. Clementine is the Shepard and Kenny is her Sheep dog. That's one of the reason I let Clementine watch Carver's death, she needs to be hardened. The group needs a Lee.

Comments

  • MusicBoxMusicBox Banned
    Of course Clem is a leader but I think Carver is wrong when he says she's like him. Clem is not a psychopath who mentally and physically tortures people because they are weak. She's strong, a survivor but not evil.
  • TalimancerTalimancer Banned
    Ah, but what Carver does is use his "Shepard" status like that. He is still a leader to his people at heart, he has kept them alive as long.
    MusicBox posted: »

    Of course Clem is a leader but I think Carver is wrong when he says she's like him. Clem is not a psychopath who mentally and physically tortures people because they are weak. She's strong, a survivor but not evil.

  • SergeantSnookieSergeantSnookie
    edited May 2014
    I think Clem has the potential to be what Carver could have been if he wasn't a violent psychopath. A legitimately good leader but one who still has sense of morality and an actual value for human life. Like Lee was. Or...could have been I guess.

    So he was right. But I think he was also wrong.
  • alostguy25alostguy25
    edited May 2014
    Clem is definitely a leader, the fact that when the group doesn't know what to do ( ie. shut down a turbine), they look to Clem. Whether or not she's like Carver, I think that'll depend mostly on player choices. That's why I have two playthroughs : one where I'm "normal" (do the things I'd do in that situation) and one where I'm "tougher" ( told Sarah to grow up, etc...) just to see how It'll span across the season and season 3.
  • beversollbeversoll
    I would agree that Clementine is a leader, but I do not think she is as sadistic as Carver at this point. Clementine steps up to crawl through duct work, sneak on the roof and into Carver's office, etc throughout Season 1 and 2. Clementine has adjusted in a brutal, violent existence that has been thrust upon her. However, at this point, she has maintained her morality. You can see this when she is concerned about other people and puts her neck on the line for them, i.e always sticking up for Ben in season 1. If Clementine continues to survive in this world she could turn into someone like Carver.
  • TalimancerTalimancer Banned
    That would be an awesome S3. Clem is older and the episode changes her attitude and time between the season.
    beversoll posted: »

    I would agree that Clementine is a leader, but I do not think she is as sadistic as Carver at this point. Clementine steps up to crawl thro

  • PridePride
    edited May 2014
    Yes, he is right in some things. They're both leaders. They're both capable of making tough decisions.

    HOWEVER, Clementine can use those traits for good. She can use the ability to make tough calls for good. She can use her innate leadership for good. THAT's how she's can prove Carver wrong the best. That she's not like him. She can prove that this kind of strength can be used to truly help good, weaker people who are unable to bear that burden, not rule over and kill them.

    Honestly, this reminds of Rurouni Kenshin and the Shishio arc. Haha.
  • MrLeeMrLee Banned
    Yup she is not evil
    MusicBox posted: »

    Of course Clem is a leader but I think Carver is wrong when he says she's like him. Clem is not a psychopath who mentally and physically tortures people because they are weak. She's strong, a survivor but not evil.

  • AWESOMEOAWESOMEO Banned
    He got it all wrong, he wants the weak to improve or else he will kill them, no sane person thinks like that.

    But he is right about Clem and him being leaders.
  • TyranitarTyranitar
    We're the leader. We make the choices.
  • _Juice_Box__Juice_Box_
    edited May 2014
    He is insane. Of course Clementine is the leader, whether she realizes it or not. I mean, every decision someone else makes almost always is brought up to Clem before the decision is made. They don't want to admit it, but Clem is the smartest out of all of them, and she's the youngest.

    Overall though, no Clementine is not like Carver. Just because they both have the ability to lead doesn't mean they're alike.
  • KingdomSlayahKingdomSlayah
    His philosophy is only the strong survive. I can't completely agree with him. His intentions are in the right place, but his execution is ALL wrong. There needs to be balance--a fine line. Without it, everything will be chaos. You can't be too lenient, but you can't be too harsh.
  • K-K-KennyK-K-Kenny
    edited May 2014
    Yup.He's right about they have somthing in common,and I think how Clem will turn out to be is depends on how we choose.That's why TT killed him off pretty early and gives this "thing" for us to think about.
  • jamex1223jamex1223
    the whole point of carver was to test clementines humanity. this guy was trying to fuck with her head, just like the sith fucked with Anakin's. see if clem will eventually keep a straight head even while living in that crazy world
  • KCohereKCohere
    A leader, yes. A tyrant like Carver? No.
  • NonoruNonoru
    Being a leader doesn't imply being necessarily a tyrant. Granted, you would have to make tough decisions at some points, but if you lose your humanity, then it's proof that you already lost to the world.

    So no, I don't think Clementine is anything close to Carver's distorted way of natural selection.
  • ravensepravensep
    Please guys don't be manipulated by Carver's words. (My) Clementine would be the person that stands for everyone, protects everyone, and hell dieing for everyone wouldn't matter at all (ehh depends upon the story but still).

    Carver is a bully who needs the weaker people to follow him. You guys wana know why Carver is weaker than Clementine? because he was not strong enough to protect the weaker people (Reggie).(my) Clementine on the other hand is not leaving Kenny, protected Pete, protected Alvin (ep 2), and is trying to guide Sarah (though I turned out to be mean to her)
  • KCohereKCohere
    We had the same thought lol
    Nonoru posted: »

    Being a leader doesn't imply being necessarily a tyrant. Granted, you would have to make tough decisions at some points, but if you lose you

  • ForClementineForClementine
    edited May 2014
    Clem is very much a natural leader. Even in season 1, a lot of players' decisions were based on her own opinions on the situation. I think this last half of the season is going to be focusing on Clem having to find a balance between becoming a Carver-type leader or becoming the type of leader at least my Lee was...

    But I do hope that the choices Clem has to make get more and more extreme and awful, so when Clem has to make a particularly evil one for the sake of the group, she thinks back to Carver's "we're more alike than you think" speech and auuuugh chills
  • Yo-da-ManYo-da-Man
    Nope his survival of the fittest philosophy had died with him because he got jumped by a little girl
  • RigtailRigtail
    During that conversation, Carver actually made quite a few good points which I would agree with. Though he didn't have to kill Reggie, he was right about him, he was weak. Overall, I think Carver is doing good and isn't that bad of a person, just his rules are a little strict and the consequences are stricter. Other than that, there's nothing wrong with him.
  • NonoruNonoru
    Seems like it. x)
    KCohere posted: »

    We had the same thought lol

  • Megami_KizukanaiMegami_Kizukanai
    edited May 2014
    C̲̲̿L̲̲̿E̲̲̿M̲̲̿E̲̲̿N̲̲̿T̲̲̿I̲̲̿N̲̲̿E̲̲̿ ̲̲̿D̲̲̿O̲̲̿E̲̲̿S̲̲̿ ̲̲̿A̲̲̿L̲̲̿L̲̲̿ ̲̲̿T̲̲̿H̲̲̿E̲̲̿ ̲̲̿W̲̲̿O̲̲̿R̲̲̿K̲̲̿
  • SonEdoSonEdo
    No more words of wisdom from the man himself.
  • GorthaurGorthaur
    Clementine is a leader, but that's more thanks to Lee than Carver. Lee was a very strong leader and morally upstanding (at least, that's how I played him).

    You don't have to be a sociopathic murderer to be a good leader. Carver wasn't right.
  • deleted45551884deleted45551884 Banned
    She's strong sure, especially when you compare her to the other kids: Duck and Sarah. But is she like Carver, no. I hope not. I don't want a governess.
  • chiffchiff
    I never saw Carver as evil, so much as having incredibly bad standards of what cost survival is worth. The success of his camp was testament to the ideas he had. Carver didn't seem to enjoy doing the things he did, he saw them as his burden.

    I wouldn't be surprised if we see Clem have to make a decision that confirm's Carver's association of the two of them.
    MusicBox posted: »

    Of course Clem is a leader but I think Carver is wrong when he says she's like him. Clem is not a psychopath who mentally and physically tortures people because they are weak. She's strong, a survivor but not evil.

  • TheShadowManTheShadowMan
    edited May 2014
    Well I fucking hate Carver but it was scary how much sense he made at times... I think Clementine will have from this point on a deep struggle because of the similarity pointed out by Carver. Can't wait to see where this is all going.
  • brbsmokingbrbsmoking
    Well... i'' just say: if u let her watch then you'll confirm Carver's words...
  • WalkingdeadDanielleWalkingdeadDanielle
    SergeantSnookie your comments are always so f****** good!
    SergeantSnookie posted: »

    I think Clem has the potential to be what Carver could have been if he wasn't a violent psychopath. A legitimately good leader but one who s

  • FangsterFangster
    In a Way yes. He had some Moments. Then ruined it again with Dictatorship at its finest and too much Cruelness. As said above. There has to be a Balance. Like nobody would have stand fully behind him. It was all based on Fear. He got what he deserved. Fine Example for a good written purely Villain though.
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