It's too easy to NOT get killed..
In TWDG, whenever you have to escape from the walkers or a person trying to kill you, it is always just too easy to get away from them. The only one time I ever had any trouble was playing as Lee when you have to shoot the walkers in the school in Crawford that are outside that medical room. You'd of thought that when there are times you have to stroll through herds of them, there would be at least some sort of challenge like having to react to the buttons quicker, aim a gun better or quickly figure something out.
It would make it more of a game and not an easy interactive movie, plus it would last longer too.
Do you guys agree?
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The Walking Dead, in my (pretty unpopular, I guess) opinion, is not even a game, per se. It's an interactive movie/story. And it's a damn good one at that, but, as I said, it's not a game.
It seriously lacks gameplay elements, adding some of those would make a difference, but, it wouldn't be much of an interactive story anymore.
TWD is more of a game than visual novels, which are widely considered games, at least in Japan, including visual novels that have little to no gameplay at all (XBlaze for PS3 and Vita). TWD is a point-and-click adventure game which has just as much, if not even more gameplay mechanics than old school point-and-click games like King's Quest.
Yeah, in comparison to some, of course. But, in comparison to others, hardly. I never played a lot of adventure or point-and-click games, the only ones I played were "The Legend of Kyrandia", and I was still a little kid at that time.
I'll try to elaborate a bit on my position, therefore, I'll give you an example of "gameplay" in TWD:
You fight off the zombies - you shoot them, stab them, smash them etc. And that's where the problems start to appear.
You see, whenever you shoot the zombies, you suddenly have unlimited ammo. I tried shooting in Episode 4, and found out that your ammo effectively doesn't run out.
The belltower fight scene is the one that looked terrible in terms of gameplay. Not only there was no variety in zombie killing, but you are also given only one way of killing a zombie. And did I mention that you could click "Kill Zombie" about 2-3 meters away from it and Lee would still play this scene out as if you had anything to do with it other than click a mouse button?
The only thing ever coming close to a gameplay is the fight scene in the alley, in Episode 5. If you keep Lee's hand, you can pick up a glass shard, which will give an additional way to kill zombies. And, that's it.
As for visual novels, well, Japanese are weird like that. Their JRPGs are scripted to the last, and linear as hell. No wonder they think something that's not a game is considered an actual game. I've only known of one good Japanese RPGs and that happens to be "Dark Souls", I guess it's because of it's Western style.
At this point, I don't care if it is a game or not. It's interactive media. Visual novel, interactive text, adventure game. Whatever. I could give a crap about the gameplay, I just want a good story presented in a unique way. Gameplay has it's place obviously, and Telltale has some, but the main point they make is on the story over anything else. If I had to say is it closer to a visual novel than say a typical adventure game, I'd say it's closest to the visual novel any day. But why that makes things worse somehow is absolutely beyond me. People need to look and see that what Telltale has done is broaden the horizons of western interactive media into something that is more inclusive of the views in Japan: that is, it is allowed to be focused almost entirely upon storytelling.
Don't get me wrong, there's a time and a place for gameplay, Telltale makes a small attempt to even keep it in their games. But the main thing that makes Telltale what they are is that they recognize that an hour of zombie slaying is much less relevant to a story than fifty-five minutes of dialogue and five minutes of zombie bashing. Gameplay is important, but not so much with Telltale, and that's a great thing. It's interactive media diversifying itself and saying: A game doesn't have to be a collection of button smashing and random things for fun. It can be a whole new way to experience stories, and that's what they are doing. And they're doing it very, very well.
I'm glad that it's easy not to get killed b\c I can't stand seeing a 11 year old girl getting devoured by Walkers.
I actually agree with your statement, for the most part.
I see your point, however, there's no such thing as what constitutes as a game based on minor gameplay elements, whether it's having infinite ammo, or regenerating health in the game industry. I mean take the original Dragon's Lair that came out in 1983 for example. It's still considered a game, despite the only interaction being QTEs while everything else plays in animated cutscenes. It's also hailed as being the first "Interactive movie" game and one of the top 10 arcade games of all time.
Another example is XBlaze, which I'll bring up again. It's considered a game both in Japan and the west, and also serves as a prequel to the Blaze Blue fighting games; yet the only gameplay the game has is allowing the main character to view news articles on his mobile phone and depending on whether you have him read all the articles, some, or none at all changes what happens to the characters around him as well as the plot.
Back to your point of clicking to "kill zombies". A lot of old point-and-click adventures have that mechanic, in terms of clicking to kill enemies whether they're close to you or not, it's a basic staple of the genre.
Also, visual novels and JRPGs aren't the same genre. And there have been numerous JRPGs with non-linear stories: Chrono Trigger, Tales of Symphonia, the Growlanser series, the Megami Tensei sereis (all of these I recommend to try by the way), and probably more I'm forgetting.
Yeah, I honestly think the reason I haven't died once in Season 2 is because of how I can't let that happen to Clem ;-;
Some Lee death scenes were almost funny to a certain extent ("PUT THE GUN DOWN, BITCH!") but all Clem death scenes are unwatchable.
I'm not talking about "clicking to kill zombies", I'm taking about the very mechanic that is used. You don't kill them through an action, or by using a weapon, no. You just click a button, that's it. It being a staple of the genre doesn't make it better.
I know that JRPGs and visual novels aren't the same genre of games. What I was talking about is this - the visual novels, as you described them, are considered games despite hardly being a game. My example was that JRPGs are hardly RPGs (at least, of usual, Western type), despite being considered so. Effectively, something is being called or described as one thing, but it's not, or it's not fully qualifies for it.
I didn't buy this game for Game Play Mechanics.
Actually, the game is hard. That part where you had to decide who gets what food and stuff. Yeah, I read the title
What the hell do you mean its "not a game." Telltale makes point-and-click action and adventure games! They are doing fine for what they promise to bring us.
What about the puzzles? Most of them aren't quite challenging, but a few of them did stump me a bit, aren't games supposed to have some kind of challenge in order to be a game? I sort of call it a mediocre adventure game from time to time.
I consider something "a game" when it has a good gameplay and story (and all that goes along with the story), or if it has great gameplay and mediocre story (if it has some story mode/campaign at all).
The Walking Dead has a great story, but mediocre gameplay, which, in my opinion (I put emphasis on that), doesn't qualify as a game. It's a great interactive story, sure, but it doesn't compensate for the lack of gameplay.
And, in fact, read the points of my opponents, you'll find a few interesting things to read.
Puzzles aren't enough to qualify for a good gameplay. They're a neat thing, yeah, but that's not enough, in my opinion (again, I put emphasis on that).
You're not clarifying type of gameplay. Telltale doesn't promise first person shooters or anything. They promise point and click style games, and they deliver that.
It's still technically a game -an electronic game in which players control images on a television or computer screen- but I do agree it doesn't have stellar, or even very interesting game play. But I didn't come here for game play... did you?
And when did I ever say I want a first-person shooter or something like that from them? I just state my opinion, I don't accuse Telltale of not delivering a first-person shooter, or RPG, or strategy or whatever.
No, I knew what it was from the start, and I wasn't expecting any good gameplay. Still, that's not why I'm here.
What if they're challenging and make you think?
Puzzles don't count as gameplay!? I agreed with you to SOME of your points but this one is just stupid. How the hell do puzzles not count as gameplay!?
I said they aren't enough to qualify for a good gameplay, all right? Puzzle by itself isn't enough for that, you have to add more gameplay features, not just puzzles.
Before you start to misinterpret somebody, read a comment again.
That wasn't my point. My point was that puzzles aren't enough a gameplay feature on their own, regardless how good they are.
I heard you the first time my phone crashed before I could edit my comment. So apparently puzzles game all have bad gameplay because that's all they have to offer? Puzzles!? So all of telltales games or the entire adventure genre has not up to par gameplay! Because they rely on inventory puzzles. What do you consider GOOD gameplay. A adventure game doesn't play itself. SOMEONE has to play the game and solve the puzzles.
sigh Puzzle games are a different kind of games altogether. I'm talking about the games who (supposedly) have other gameplay features to offer, not just puzzles.
And I don't really get your last point. Did I ever say "Oh, it would be awesome if the game was playing itself so I could just watch it"?
The point of the game is the choices you make with other people, that's the main focus.
Okay I can see your point. the adventure game genre is another story. But you're on a website dedicated to adventure games. Were you expecting praise for saying an adventure game has "bad" gameplay?
Okay then.
Actually, lemme rephrase that, they're more than enough if we're talking about puzzle games, but not for any other games that feature other gameplay features (sorry for saying that twice).
I was stating my opinion, that's it. I'm not a seal or a dolphin expecting praise or some snack for the stuff I say. I was pretty much expecting backlash.
From what I hear (my experience with Telltale is limited to their three latest installments only), their games actually got simpler, and they did feature a better gameplay (at least, the one a player could expect from an adventure game). But, as I said, I've only heard about it, and I actually don't know if it's true.
Well, I guess AllThatRemains was right, even if she was sarcastic (pay this bit no mind, it's me thinking out loud).
It's okay dude it's your opinion and I should accept it. I'm sorry I lost my "cool".
It's fine, dude. I don't often argue with people, this thread rectified it a bit.
You're playing an adventure game... you do know what they are right?
Telltale says it's to move onto the story without causing a cluster of deaths that distract from the story but a little challenge never killed anybody.
Well except Lee. And Clementine.
Then what constitutes as a game or an RPG in your opinion? Some of the RPGs I listed, like Shin Megami Tensei are as much of an RPGs like say, Dragon Age: Origins minus the character creation feature. The first three Shin Megami Tensei games for example, feature a mute protagonist that responds to NPCs with dialogue choices, and depending on how consistent your choices are throughout the game the protagonist either aligns himself with YAHWEH, Lucifer or neither, effectively changing the story.
You also contradict yourself in your first paragraph. You say you don't use an action to kill them, yet say you kill them by clicking a button, which is an action. An action no different than pushing down on a button to have a character shoot or slash their sword in an action game.
Very well, you win. I have no will to continue arguing. I will respond, though, because otherwise it would be just rude.
I had no experience with the games you listed, I admit (except for Dragon Age). RPGs like Dragon Age, Mass Effect, other Bioware titles and The Elder Scrolls series - these are the games I consider RPGs, IMO. I've already covered what constitutes as a game in my opinion in one of my previous posts.
And I guess I didn't elaborate enough on that last point you make. What you do in TWD is clicking a round circle on your target (if you, for example, attack), which will prompt your character to attack it in an animated sequence, that happens immediately afterwards without any need for additional impact from you. Slashing with a sword or shooting with a pistol requires more than clicking a round circle on a target.
But, as I said, I'm not willing to argue anymore.
I think S1E2 was the hardest not to die.
The Danny shooting you when you look out of the barn door one, it got me like 3 times.
The hardest one not to die at was...
" Put the Gun down, Bitch! " I mean who couldnt resist picking that!
I don't exactly agree with you but, I think if they added some more gameplay tactics to The Walking Dead, that would be cool.
Choosing who to sit with has been the most difficult moment in my life.