Season 2 Review, Part 2: I Love How Kenny Changed This Season
Here’s the link to Part 1, which is about how great Clementine was this season.
I hated Kenny in Season 1. He was petty and mean. He would have let Lee die in the drug store just because Lee tried to save Larry. And even though Kenny was supposed to like kids, he refused to save Clementine from the Stranger just because Kenny was mad at Lee. This happens if you disagree with Kenny in any way over the course of the season, no matter how many times you save his family. (Granted, you can convince him to help save Clementine if you say she’s your family, but at that point, why would you want the help of someone who had such low moral fiber that he wouldn’t save a little kid just because he was mad at her guardian?)
Sure, I felt sorry for him for losing Katjaa and Duck, but I also wasn’t really sure that loss had affected him on the level it should have. I mean, he handled it incredibly well. I would have been curled up in a ball on the floor waiting to die, if I were him. But he just beat up Lee, cried, refused to move when you needed a map, got drunk, and carried on. I mean, that’s how some people would react to losing their job. On the one hand, his reaction could show both that he was deeply affected by his loss AND that he was strong enough to handle it that well. On the other hand, his reaction could show that he was only affected by his loss on the same level he would be affected by losing his job. I wasn’t sure which it was. (Though if it was the former, I admired him greatly).
When he talked about Katjaa’s suicide, he said gave a speech saying that when things are tough, “you stick around to help the ones you love.” And he was right of course, but it would have helped me believe he was really affected by his loss if he had been a little wrong and considered the option of suicide just a little. That’s why I had mixed feelings about Kenny’s final scene in Season 1, where he “died” saving Ben (or Christa, but I’ve never actually seen that version, so I can’t speak to it).
I knew the writers couldn’t possibly expect me to believe that Kenny couldn’t have just quickly shot Ben and then joined Lee safely behind the gate. No, Kenny made the intentionally suicidal choice to shut Lee behind the gate and then shoot Ben and THEN try to fight his way out through a zombie horde.
“So at least, that shows he was really affected by losing his wife and kid,” I thought. “But then, what was all that fuss about sticking around to help people?” At that point, it could have been a contradiction or it could have shown deeper levels to Kenny. I didn’t care enough about Kenny to think much about it, but if I had, I doubt I could have found an answer before Season 2.
And then there’s his relationship with Ben himself. I hoped the writers didn’t expect me to believe that Kenny had completely forgiven Ben. Don’t get me wrong. Kenny was way too hard on Ben, and I’m glad Ben’s big speech seemed to help Kenny sympathize with Ben. But, come on. Kenny was NOT the type to forgive.
If the writers expected me to think that Kenny had completely forgiven Ben before he died, that would have been a sugary sweet, meh sort of ending for their story together. And I don’t suppose I would have really minded it since I didn’t care for either character that much, but I preferred my more realistic head-canon that Kenny was suicidal and just decided that, on the way out, he should do something nice for Ben, not because he had forgiven Ben but because he had developed enough sympathy for Ben that he didn’t want him to be eaten alive by zombies. Still, I couldn’t say for sure what his relationship with Ben was at the end.
Then, Season 2 came along to answer these questions.
I loved Kenny in Season 2. I wasn’t overjoyed to see him back in Episode 2, but that was because I was sure he would throw me under the bus if I ever once disagreed with him, which I was also sure would happen in no time. I didn’t know Kenny was different now. Not only did Season 2 answer my questions about Kenny, but it actually made me like Kenny. That was something to behold, and it might have been because I used to hate Kenny and because he was so flawed as a human being that I ended up, not just liking, but loving Kenny. He changed so much, and it is a rare and blessed character that can change for the better in gradual, believable ways.
First off, in Season 2, it become clear that he STILL has less than warm, fuzzy feelings toward Ben, when he called him a “shitbird.” And I know a lot of people didn’t like that, but I thought it was nicely consistent behavior for Kenny. So I liked it.
Secondly, in Season 2, it becomes clear that he was deeply affected by the deaths of Katjaa and Duck, and all the pain has indeed made him suicidal, but only in lapses. The rest of the time he’s staying strong in spite of the pain, which means he has deeper levels and it wasn’t a straight-up contradiction for him to “die” saving Ben.
Two years after their deaths, he still has issues concerning Katjaa and Duck, as apparent from him calling Clem “Duck” at the dinner table. Which at the very least means he was thinking about Duck when he said that, and at the very most means he was substituting Clem for Duck subconsciously. I think he may also have been substituting Sarita for Katjaa, for no other reason than that they both have accents. (I know that’s not a good reason, and it could just mean Kenny has a thing for women with accents, but it’s too much of a coincidence to mean absolutely nothing I think.) And later on, he may have been substituting AJ for Duck. That’s definitely the vibe I got from his interactions with AJ anyway. Subconscious substitutions reflect a very deep hurt. As do suicidal thoughts and actions.
Which brings me to my third point. In Season 2, it becomes clear that all the pain of loss has indeed made Kenny suicidal, but only in lapses. The rest of the time he’s staying strong in spite of the pain, which means he has deeper levels and it wasn’t a straight-up contradiction for him to “die” saving Ben.
In the tent after Sarita died, Kenny basically said he wished Carver had killed him (so was it purposely suicidal to take the walkie talkie?). And then, when Rebecca goes into labor, Kenny stays behind to face a horde of zombies, which I’m quite sure the writers MEANT to look suicidal. And then, if you shoot Kenny, he expressly states that he wished for death many times.
Putting it all together, he was affected deeply enough by the loss of his family to feel a desire for death, but he also knew that the right thing to do was to keep going to help the people he loved, so he did keep going. And he tried to keep living and loving. So there was no character contradiction, only the same human contradiction we all face when we face an internal battle between what we know and what we feel. Thanks to Season 2, I am now quite certain about this aspect of Kenny’s character, and I love it.
But what I love perhaps even more is the way in which Kenny developed as a human being. He was probably always a survivor, but he wasn’t always selfless, understanding, and sober. In Season 1, he wouldn’t even help save Clem from the Stranger; in Season 2, he nearly dies for her when he takes the blame for the walkie talkie. In Season 1, he hates Lee the whole season through for doing one thing that may or may not have had the side effect of getting Katjaa and Duck killed; in Season 2, he forgives Clem in less than an episode for cutting off Sarita’s arm and getting her torn apart by zombies. In Season 1, he seems to keep track of every little offense so that, at the end, he can claim you aren’t a reliable friend even if you killed Larry; in Season 2, he only brings up one small offense and only to tell Clem that he was sad she sat with Luke but he was still proud of her. In Season 1, he got drunk over Katjaa and Duck and the boat (or lack thereof); in Season 2, he refuses a bottle of alcohol when Clem offers it to him.
I think it’s apparent that Kenny knows he made some mistakes when Lee was around and he doesn't want to repeat them with Clem.
But all of this was done believably, without rewriting Kenny as some kind of saint. He’s still stubborn and hot-headed, he still blamed Clem somewhat for Sarita’s death, and he still seemed dangerously unstable near the end of the season. (So unstable that it made me understand Bonnie’s loyalty to Carver better, since I still wanted to by loyal to Kenny even though everyone was saying he was Carver 2.0 and he seemed like he really might be.)
It’s hard for me to comment on Kenny’s complete arc since it ends in different ways, but omitting the fight with Jane and his death, I was captivated by Kenny’s journey from a drunken, petty asshole to a sober, selfless best friend.
Comments
Here's what happens if Kenny helps Christa:
Click here
As for your review, very nicely done. It was a well written and in depth analysis of Kenny's character and his journey throughout two seasons of this game. Most cases it's been the other way around (someone liked him in Season 1 but became so bored of his character that they hated him in Season 2) but it's nice to see a different perspective. I've often felt the same way that he did want to die, but he couldn't muster up the strength to do it himself, that's why he tried to save Ben or Christa and protected Clem from Carver. He felt it would finally end his suffering and give him that peaceful death that he has always wanted since Katjaa and Duck, but he never got it. It got to the point that his only purpose to keep on going was Clementine and AJ, which makes me curious as how Kenny will turn out if we ever see him again if you decided to stay at Wellington.
You Killed Kenny...
No.. not another one..
Kenny was the only one who you could trust from season one.. He may have been hot tempered but he was certainly trustworthy. Looks like you fell for Jane's manipulation of provoking a man who has lost everything and making Clem shoot him, or you may of just shot him in the head after he kills jane which is just too cold and out of character for Clem, Kenny was always the same man inside all along, always cared for the kids and puts them before himself.
Kenny ftw
Kenny was always my friend, even though I beat him up ;3
Same.
I think we can all remember Kenny as the man who lost so much and faced insanity in the eye and beat it because he redeemed himself through Clem and Aj.
Get ready for hate
meh, let them hate. If they think killing the last person that truly wants whats best for Clem and even losing an eye for her and then going off with the manipulating she devil is a better ending then i totally respect that.
Thanks, I'd never seen it before. It's pretty epic.
And I'm glad you liked the review. I'm curious how Kenny will turn out during the start of Season 3 too. I mean, obviously, he's determinant, so he has to die, but what will he be like before that point? I wonder if we'll be seeing shades of his unstable self before he dies, or if he'll just be our good ol' friendly neighborhood Kenny. 
I did fall for Jane's manipulation, but I didn't end up going with her. I certainly couldn't trust her after what she did, so I left her. However, I do think Kenny was dangerous too. Whether he meant to or not, he and Jane hurt Clem emotionally and physically in their fight. When I said I still don't know if I'd done the best thing for Kenny by killing him, I was saying that.....well, I was saying exactly that. There is a sizable fog of moral ambiguity surrounding the finale of Season 2, and I consider that a triumph by the writers. That they were able to create such a morally ambiguous scenario that even in hindsight I can't say which option I prefer more, to kill Kenny or not to. But the whole Kenny/Jane thing is not what I want this thread to be about, so I guess I should probably delete that part.
He always did have friend-like qualities that I appreciated. I just couldn't bring myself to really call him a "friend" in Season 1.
I don't know if I'd quite say he faced and beat insanity. I think we see him facing his own emotional volatility, and I think he didn't exactly win. See, even if he does end up with Clem, which I think is the happiest ending, he did hurt Clem physically and emotionally just a few days earlier because he couldn't control his anger towards Jane. If I were Clem, I would greatly appreciate the happy moments with Kenny (like the moment they leave Wellington together), but I wouldn't feel like I'd be safe with him forevermore. And if I were Kenny, I wouldn't feel like I had won any sort of battle, and I think the game shows that he in fact doesn't feel like he's won. After all, he tells Clem to leave him because he knows -- he's SEEN -- that he can't take good care of her. I think it's a lot more complicated than just "Kenny is a hero," even though I love him as a character.
He hurt Clem physically and emotionally? when did he ever physically hurt Clem? that only happens by accident if you try and save Arvo, and your telling me Kenny screaming at her once is even that bad? He apologised for it and I already knew before hand he didn't mean it. And from my perspective he did win that battle, he had every reason not to go on, he pushed on after Duck and Katjas death, pushed on after losing an eye and further pushed on after Saritas death. When you see them 9 days later you can tell Kenny is just being his usual happy self because he still has the baby and Clem to care for, he had every reason to turn on the group, to put a bullet through his head and end himself, but he kept pushing on.
He faced insanity and beat it.. for now at least...
It's funny how you describe Season 1's version of Kenny as an asshole. I actually got along with him pretty well and liked him, while disliking the character who appears from beyond the grave in Season 2.
What did you do to Kenny in Season 1? Hate on his kid? Try to revive a dead man? Beat him up while he was grieving?
I am not attacking Kenny by any means. This whole post was meant to be about how great a character Kenny is, but I think some of the facts about his flaws help him remain interesting as a character.
I didn't even think of the Arvo- and Sarita-related moments when Kenny hurt Clem, but those count, too. I was only talking about the finale fight with Jane where he and Jane knocked Clem to the ground several times and made her start bleeding from her gunshot wound. It doesn't matter if those were accidents. Kenny and Jane are still responsible for the harm they caused. It's not as bad as if they intentionally hurt her, but it's still bad, and they are responsible for their actions. Just like the driver of a car is still responsible if they accidentally hit a pedestrian, especially if they were driving drunk or angry or whatever.
Kenny was so obsessed with getting revenge on Jane, he hurt Clem repeatedly and still didn't stop fighting Jane. He didn't stop until one of them was dead. He knew Clem cared about both him and Jane, and yet he forced Clem to either shoot Kenny or let Kenny kill Jane. That choice had to hurt Clem emotionally, as did the lack of concern her friends were showing her when they hurt her physically because they were so intent on getting at each other. Those actions of Kenny and Jane show a lack of responsibility and care for Clem, and it's something Lee would never have done.
I definitely agree Kenny was valiantly fighting and winning in the battle against his depression and suicidal tendencies. All I said before was that he wasn't winning the battle against his emotional volatility as evidenced by the fact that he let his anger towards Jane get the better of him.
But that was one of the good things about Kenny this season. He became a better person without becoming a saint, and who knows? Maybe he could have become better still. Maybe not. That's what makes him so complicated and realistic.
I agree I mean. Jane's ending felt a lot more strange and less logical and especially with that family of weirdos at the gates.. Jane's ending to me came off as more like a punishment for allowing yourself to be deceived by Jane's mind games. Should have been an option to shoot Jane in the forehead as well..for deceiving and manipulating Clem like that. I would had been upset actually if I had fallen for the scam and shot Kenny. Only to discover Jane was playing a game all along to get rid of Ken so she could have Clem all to herself to replace the dead sister she left behind to die.
But I did try to see things from Janes perspective and it just did not add up to me. Maybe I was just turned off by Jane's character after the way she talked about Sarah when she had just lost her father not more than half a day ago.
I get what your saying but that fight was not fully Kenny's fault, Jane provoked him into purposely fighting with her, he was already on the breaking point and just hanging in there and what does she do? Insult his dead family, tell him that everyone talks about him behind his back and finally pushes him too far and hiding AJ and making Kenny think he's dead. Also the fight could of gone a lot differently if Jane hadn't drawn her knife and slashed Kenny, that just escalated things, she could of also said that AJ was alright to de escalate things.
Jane brought everything on herself, which ultimately led to her death in my play through . So I don't think it was only Kenny that made Clem do that, but also Jane.
I completely agree: Kenny and Jane are BOTH responsible for the fight.
Well I can commend you for not going with her. She tricks you into killing someone who is close, Plus I think unless you are a Kenny hater the ending where he dies is the saddest and most disappointing. I think some people who shot Kenny either panicked or just shot whoever was on top.
To me the choice was simple.. choose a survivalist that could ditch you any time or choose your family (kenny
)
I helped give Larry CPR and I didn't steal from the Stranger's car and...who knows what else I did that ALSO made Season 1 Kenny mad? (I may have given food to Ben? I don't remember.) But mostly I think it's the Larry thing that can turn him against you. You can save Duck and Katjaa till you're blue in the face, but try to save Larry, and Kenny's suddenly saying you weren't there for him and suspecting you of being a child molester. But even if you do kill Larry, Kenny may still refuse to save Clem from the Stranger. So the point I was trying to make is that, in Season 1, you can do things that are simple matters of a difference of opinion, where all morals are ambiguous (like if you give Ben food in Starved for Help or if you opt to stay at the motor inn when Kenny is pushing to leave), and Season 1 Kenny will hate you merely because you didn't choose his side. Season 2 Kenny will not. (Like if you sit with Luke at dinner or if you say the group shouldn't try to escape when they were in Carver's van or if you say the group should wait to leave the Civil War ruins at the end of Amid the Ruins, etc., etc., etc.)
TWDGFTW you need a dose of this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMa_D9XQ-5g
Hahahaha! That's adorable.
I actually disagreed with Kenny about anything outside his family, particularly after Episode 2. It's like he was making a deliberate effort to be petty and spite Lee. Guess killing a man did change him.
Did you use the "Clem is family" argument with him? Because unless you've been consistently unpleasant to him, that actually works. It did for me.
From what I can tell, there's 6 key decisions that affect Kenny's opinion of you:
Who you save on Hershel's farm (although you do have the potential of winning back his trust even if you save Shawn)
Siding with him when Larry's threatening to throw Duck out
Giving Duck food
Giving him food (this one is more optional, though. If you didn't save Duck, or sided with Larry in the drugstore, doing this can win him back over)
Helping him Kill Larry (this along with shooting Duck are the biggest deciders)
Shooting his son for him
Those are the key choices that will actively determine his 'choice' at the end of episode 4.
I think Kenny was the easiest for them to write. They just wrote a pissed off, insecure redneck and called him Kenny. Remember when he said "how you stay alive and help the folks you care about" then in Season 2 said that he's wanted to die for so long.
On a side note we should have snappy nick names for groups like:
Lee's Legion instead of Motor Inn Group
Clem's Crew as S2 group
Carver's Crooks as Carver's Camp
Bastard Bandits as the Bandits
"Help the folks you care about" gets Clementine and AJ to wellington and begs for the kids to be let in and making a sacrifice, Pretty much achieved what he said in season one.
Isn't that the point
He doesn't believe in killing himself, despite how much he wants to die, so he just continues living with the hope that something or someone will just finally kill him one day
He even says he asked for it
Kenny FTW. Still have a little hope somewhere in the farest corner of my mind that TT won't just throw him out of game in first 5-10 minutes.
Funny. The very first time around, I saved Duck - then reloaded and tried to save Shawn, only to lose my patience with restarting a second time when Shawn died anyway.
I did most of those 'pro-Kenny' choices, although it was less out of loyalty than it was being generally pragmatic and humane. :P
I did all of those in my original playthrough except Killing Larry and Shooting Duck and maybe giving Kenny food. But I've heard people say that they sided with Kenny on all major decisions and he still initially refused to help save Clem from the Stranger. On the other hand, I've heard one person say they sided against Kenny on some big decisions like Killing Larry and Kenny didn't refuse to help save Clem at all. So...I don't know exactly what it is that determines his choice, but I know it can be extremely petty things.
I do think that it's the Killing Larry thing that determines how nice Kenny is to you for the rest of the season though. I was always nice to Katjaa and Duck, saved Duck on Hershel's farm and in the Drugstore, and gave Duck and Clem food, and Kenny seemed to like me just fine up until I gave Larry CPR. Then, he said I wasn't there for him, and he implied that I didn't take good care of Clem ("Do you even talk to that girl anymore?"), and he threw me under the bus for shooting the screaming girl by the Drugstore, and he didn't try to help me when I was trapped underneath the door inside the drugstore, and he asked if I had been convicted of touching kids, and he was just generally unpleasant, throwing in words like "dick" and "asshole" in sentences he doesn't otherwise say if you do Kill Larry.
No, I didn't use the Clem is Family argument. Like I said the review, I didn't want the help of a man who would, like Lee said, "let a little girl die because" he was mad at me.
Yeah, he may have been easy to write, but obviously that's not a bad thing. I think they ended up writing him very well.
Me too. "Hold on to that hope. It's the one thing all of this can't take away." To quote Lee. (I think? lol)
The game seems to work on an "all or nothing" basis regarding Kenny's decision. As in, if you don't do even one of the above choices, he simply won't go with you. As long as you shoot Duck and look out for his family though, you can still convince him.
And you'd be right about Larry determining his attitude for episode 3 and beyond. He'll continue to bitch at you whenever he gets the chance from that point forward. Also, he does the touching kids line either way. The tone of voice he uses changes based on your relationship, though.
Idk he seemed like way more of a prick. At least in S1 he had redeeming features and more sensible.
I dont think TellTale will fuck up this time with desetminate charcaters, they probibly planned for all the Cabin groups to die determinatly and then realized how it was going to cause huge problems, which is why alot of the determinate characters weren't used well after their first death
I hope you're right.
Ah, you're right about the touching kids line, and I've never seen a playthrough where you couldn't convince him to save Clem by saying Clem is Family, but I just didn't think I should HAVE to convince him. He seems to like kids so much, but he had the massive amount of immaturity and spite needed to let a kid possibly die because he didn't like the guy going to save her. I dunno. I was just done with him at that point. But he won me back over, lol
I find it easier to swallow him being a dick to a grown man than it is for him to yell at a little girl.