Choosing to kick out Gryff than is the better option. We already know that the next episode we will go to the Whitehills and they think we want to expel Gryff, hence saving Ryon is the only possibility and the Whitehills don't have a clue. And than send him to the Glenmores, even if the traitor does find out it won't be useful to the Whithills because they would have to go against 2 families.
To know everyone, you must know their past. It's always best to check if everyone remains true to their past. The only two who aren't true to their past are Royland and the Maester. If Royland was true to his past, he would have agreed with Duncan 50% of the time at the first council of Ethan. Royland said we're not prepared but wants to fight, which everyone knows is a bad strategy, yet he is one of the best strategists in Westeros.
Choosing to kick out Gryff than is the better option. We already know that the next episode we will go to the Whitehills and they think we w… moreant to expel Gryff, hence saving Ryon is the only possibility and the Whitehills don't have a clue. And than send him to the Glenmores, even if the traitor does find out it won't be useful to the Whithills because they would have to go against 2 families.
''Royland said we're not prepared but wants to fight''. Yes, because he wants to fuck those whitehills. He always talks straight. He doesn't want to wait. He wants to act. He wants to do something. When Gryff kicked your ass and you said ''Take him, Royland'', he fought with them. Why would he risk his life? After that they were gonna kill him but Gryff stopped them and said ''No, let him watch this''. So he is not the fucking traitor. Her mother wants to save Ryon and their house. But %99 Ryon. So she do anything to save Ryon no matter what. I think that makes her the suspect. Duncan wants to save House Forrester. Lord Forrester trusted him for Christ's sake. And what do you think that he wants to find the North Grove?So he is not the fucking traitor. Maester...well he seems normal guy. I don't know what to say about him. But he doesn't want to see any bloodshed. So, maybe he is the traitor. At least, %50.
To know everyone, you must know their past. It's always best to check if everyone remains true to their past. The only two who aren't true t… moreo their past are Royland and the Maester. If Royland was true to his past, he would have agreed with Duncan 50% of the time at the first council of Ethan. Royland said we're not prepared but wants to fight, which everyone knows is a bad strategy, yet he is one of the best strategists in Westeros.
Really? Killing them would just end up in more blood, possible Forrester blood. Even a hothead like Royland knows that, he was probably just trying to get them down.
I have not seen the science of this. Can someone post it? Onl6 thing I can say for him is he lost his last house. He might nit want to see that happen again so he goes to the stronger house.
The traitor would want one of two things. Bloodshed immediately (Royland) or change (Maester). You said it yourself that Lady Forrester would want Ryon safe in her arms, hence she wouldn't say anything about a plan to do just that (80% not the traitor). A well known strategist plans before he acts, Royland was next to two guards. A strategist would attack the guards first, not go straight towards Gryff.
''Royland said we're not prepared but wants to fight''. Yes, because he wants to fuck those whitehills. He always talks straight. He doesn't… more want to wait. He wants to act. He wants to do something. When Gryff kicked your ass and you said ''Take him, Royland'', he fought with them. Why would he risk his life? After that they were gonna kill him but Gryff stopped them and said ''No, let him watch this''. So he is not the fucking traitor. Her mother wants to save Ryon and their house. But %99 Ryon. So she do anything to save Ryon no matter what. I think that makes her the suspect. Duncan wants to save House Forrester. Lord Forrester trusted him for Christ's sake. And what do you think that he wants to find the North Grove?So he is not the fucking traitor. Maester...well he seems normal guy. I don't know what to say about him. But he doesn't want to see any bloodshed. So, maybe he is the traitor. At least, %50.
The traitor would want one of two things. Bloodshed immediately (Royland) or change (Maester). You said it yourself that Lady Forrester woul… mored want Ryon safe in her arms, hence she wouldn't say anything about a plan to do just that (80% not the traitor). A well known strategist plans before he acts, Royland was next to two guards. A strategist would attack the guards first, not go straight towards Gryff.
I have to say my votes for the mother I know you said don't say it but there it is shes been caught sending messages to the whitehills and constantly makes the bad plays the healer seemed to actually have eathan's back and royland and Duncan have been with the house for a number of years so I fell the only choice is the mother
Butt. A mother going against the eldest to save the youngest. Sounds awfully familiar. I still don't see how giving away their plans would benefit her. She is always advocating the backup plans like Mira. (The decision to save Ryon might be a distraction, since this happens either way) She also isn't presented as a choice really... which COULD be suspicious. DAH.
Like stated before, I think Royland is the least likely option. He's loyal to the core for House Forrester and Ironrath, I just can't see it… more.
And plz don't say the mother is the traitor because ... I mean come on you guys why would you even think of that XD
Because, a good mother would do anything for her child. If Lady Forrester believes feeding the Whitehills info will keep Ryon safe, I can easily see her being the traitor
This plot has almost 0% of failing if done correctly, and Rodrik knows how to plan as well as Royland. The fact that you have few men also means you have a better chance of slipping past, which Lady Forrester knows. I said Royland was and is a brilliant strategist, if you have been paying attention. But always going against strategy when you're a brilliant strategist is suspicious, but not as suspicious as widening all your senses to a plan of action like the Maester.
Or maybe she thinks the plan would fail and would rather ensure Ryon's safety than have him be punished in a failed rescue attempt.
Just because Royland has an anger problem, it doesn't mean he's a poor strategist.
Really? Killing them would just end up in more blood, possible Forrester blood. Even a hothead like Royland knows that, he was probably just trying to get them down.
We know nothing about Highpoint or it's forces so we can't possibly know the success rate. The Forresters don't have the man power, the information or the right individuals to pull off an infiltration mission.
"A well known strategist plans before he acts, Royland was next to two guards. A strategist would attack the guards first, not go straight towards Gryff."
If Royland does the opposite to what a well known strategist would do, that makes him a poor one, no?
This plot has almost 0% of failing if done correctly, and Rodrik knows how to plan as well as Royland. The fact that you have few men also m… moreeans you have a better chance of slipping past, which Lady Forrester knows. I said Royland was and is a brilliant strategist, if you have been paying attention. But always going against strategy when you're a brilliant strategist is suspicious, but not as suspicious as widening all your senses to a plan of action like the Maester.
The success rate is decided by your initial choice. The Whitehills know your initial plan, but not that you made a decision between 2 plans. While we the players don't know the layout, the characters we play do.
Royland is a brilliant strategist, yet he doesn't act like it for some reason after the Red Wedding aka the beginning of episode 1. That does make him suspicious. Think of an experienced climber all of a sudden he'll make history by jumping off a 1000 ft. That's the best comparison I could think of for Royland.
We know nothing about Highpoint or it's forces so we can't possibly know the success rate. The Forresters don't have the man power, the info… morermation or the right individuals to pull off an infiltration mission.
"A well known strategist plans before he acts, Royland was next to two guards. A strategist would attack the guards first, not go straight towards Gryff."
If Royland does the opposite to what a well known strategist would do, that makes him a poor one, no?
But the Whitehills and the Forresters hate each other, I'd be surprised if anyone in Ironrath has ever stepped foot in Highpoint, let alone been there long enough to memorise its layout.
I agree that he's hardly showing any signs of being a great strategist but he hasn't had much opportunity to do so. You could argue waiting is the best strategy but wait too long and you're just going to get crushed. Plus his anger at the Whitehills probably clouds his better judgement. Maybe the loss of his family and fear of it happening again makes him want to prevent it at all costs.
The success rate is decided by your initial choice. The Whitehills know your initial plan, but not that you made a decision between 2 plans.… more While we the players don't know the layout, the characters we play do.
Royland is a brilliant strategist, yet he doesn't act like it for some reason after the Red Wedding aka the beginning of episode 1. That does make him suspicious. Think of an experienced climber all of a sudden he'll make history by jumping off a 1000 ft. That's the best comparison I could think of for Royland.
It would be Asher's current age minus 17-19, not that far back.
I agree with fear making him furious more than anything else, and Lady Forrester has a similar past but her fear turns more towards alertness and secrecy.
But the Whitehills and the Forresters hate each other, I'd be surprised if anyone in Ironrath has ever stepped foot in Highpoint, let alone … morebeen there long enough to memorise its layout.
I agree that he's hardly showing any signs of being a great strategist but he hasn't had much opportunity to do so. You could argue waiting is the best strategy but wait too long and you're just going to get crushed. Plus his anger at the Whitehills probably clouds his better judgement. Maybe the loss of his family and fear of it happening again makes him want to prevent it at all costs.
Duncan doesn't seem likely at all, idk why people keep saying this. Lord Forrester was likely the most sensible person in the House, and he trusted Duncan more than his own wife and children hence "The North Grove." Duncan states his concern for the safety of the Forresters when he goes to visit Gared, and Gared even says something along the lines of "If finding the North Grove can help in any way, than so be it," which, to me states that Duncan is asking Gared to go find it sooner rather than later as a way of trying to help the Forresters.
Duncan would indeed seem suspicious for being so "submissive" to the Whitehills if it wasn't for these factors, and I think anyone paying attention would agree. Gwyn even states that her family is dangerous(in a sense) and that "the best thing to do is to submit and do as they say or shit will hit the fan." That said, I think Duncan is just a sensible guy, he acknowledges the importance of "playing it cool," and I'd be disappointed in the writers if they undermined his intelligence by making him the traitor, even if it was just him trying to look out for the Forresters safety, SOMETHING has to be done and I believe he knows that.
I firmly believe it's Lady Forrester and I'm sticking by that decision. I speak more about it in a thread I made if you'd like an explanation as to why.
He's not the traitor, he to loyal to the house to be the traitor.
Duncan on the other hand seems far more likely, since he basically wants them to surrender House Forrester to their life long enemies.
You know something? It may be Duncan and royland. Imagine what a kick in the teeth that would be. It'd mean your council is growing smaller. Family is a big theme in game of thrones. Any it feels like the whole world against your family.
Ryanoo, i completely agree with everything you said. My reasoning, almost to a tee. I think one of the most important character revelations we have had is that Lord Forrester chose to have Gared tell Duncan his secret. And Only Duncan.
He didn't choose to say 'tell my children' (one of which is the new Lord), not 'ask the Maester for help', not 'you must tell My Wife', not Royland, or Malcom (who seems capable). Only tell Duncan. Which to me, states that he trusts Duncan implicitly. And does not trust the rest of them. So, if that is the case, why didn't the late Lord Forrester trust his own family? Even with his dying wish?
Duncan doesn't seem likely at all, idk why people keep saying this. Lord Forrester was likely the most sensible person in the House, and he … moretrusted Duncan more than his own wife and children hence "The North Grove." Duncan states his concern for the safety of the Forresters when he goes to visit Gared, and Gared even says something along the lines of "If finding the North Grove can help in any way, than so be it," which, to me states that Duncan is asking Gared to go find it sooner rather than later as a way of trying to help the Forresters.
Duncan would indeed seem suspicious for being so "submissive" to the Whitehills if it wasn't for these factors, and I think anyone paying attention would agree. Gwyn even states that her family is dangerous(in a sense) and that "the best thing to do is to submit and do as they say or shit will hit the fan." That said, I think Duncan is just a sensible guy, he acknowledges the importance of "playing it … [view original content]
Ryanoo, i completely agree with everything you said. My reasoning, almost to a tee. I think one of the most important character revelations… more we have had is that Lord Forrester chose to have Gared tell Duncan his secret. And Only Duncan.
He didn't choose to say 'tell my children' (one of which is the new Lord), not 'ask the Maester for help', not 'you must tell My Wife', not Royland, or Malcom (who seems capable). Only tell Duncan. Which to me, states that he trusts Duncan implicitly. And does not trust the rest of them. So, if that is the case, why didn't the late Lord Forrester trust his own family? Even with his dying wish?
What i'm saying about lady forrester is why would she betray herself ... her house ... her sons and daughters ... it doesn't make any sense when you think of it
Right, but there must be some underlying reasoning to why he doesn't trust any of them.
I mean he gave the children the 'Keys' to the map, but didn't tell them that they were keys, or about the Grove itself. I could understand not telling them all, but surely the new Lord?
Probably because he needed to choose a sentinel and he wasn't fully trained to be Lord. That's my reasoning behind not informing Ethan. Talia was probably the only one who knew something more, as she could seal alliances.
Right, but there must be some underlying reasoning to why he doesn't trust any of them.
I mean he gave the children the 'Keys' to the map… more, but didn't tell them that they were keys, or about the Grove itself. I could understand not telling them all, but surely the new Lord?
What a surprise. Carly once again brings logic and sense to whats going on. It was incredibly obvious to me in this last episode that you are exactly right. A military leader knows when he's beat and when he's outgunned. He knows when to hold back and when to fight. "Sir" Royland has, throughout the entire series been pressuring you to fight and look meaner than you obviously are. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that "egging on" the Whitehills will only justify them in destroying the Forresters. So, if I was so loyal, why would I CONTINUOUSLY convince my King to egg them on?
In episode 4, he asks that you (at least in my play through) use your new army to accompany you to the Whitehill's stronghold only after JUST getting it back, thus leaving it completely unguarded. How could a LOYAL military tactician come to that conclusion?
Why Duncan? Why would he do that? It would disappoint Gared. Gregor Forrester and Duncan were likely to be friends as Gregor tells Gared to only tell his uncle about this North Grove.
He's not the traitor, he to loyal to the house to be the traitor.
Duncan on the other hand seems far more likely, since he basically wants them to surrender House Forrester to their life long enemies.
The problem is that you are giving Telltale too little credit and looking down on them as just standard video game designers. In any normal game that is one thing. The fact that this is Telltale making Game of Thrones... you have to consider there is a bit more at play and look beyond the obvious.
I think that Royland's 'answer with violence' is intended to be the devil on Rodrik's/Ethan's shoulder. All the POV characters get two chara… morecters who pull them one way or the other and force them to make choices (Rodrik = Duncan/Royland, Gared = Finn/Cotter, Mira = Tom/Sera, Asher = Beskha/Malcolm). Those characters are supposed to make decision-making harder for the player and encourage them to take certain paths, and Royland is supposed to beat his chest to encourage the player to take more violent actions while Duncan encourages patience and submission.
That's about as far as I think his hot-headed personality is supposed to go as opposed to undermining the house, but it's worth noting regardless.
You DO know that people can put on airs and do something called "pretend". It's when you make people believe one thing, usually about yourself, and prove to do another. Considering this game starts with the Red Wedding and the game itself is Game of Thrones, a little falsehoods and betrayal shouldn't be unexpected... even from an apparently "open" person like Mr. Royland.
Consider this. Why would a tactical military leader senselessly pressure his lord to be aggressive against a vastly more powerful army?
I have a feeling that you're trolling but I'll respond seriously anyway. As someone previously stated, Royland is the most straightforward p… moreerson and isn't afraid to tell you how he feels. I'd go as far as to say he couldn't be deceptive, even if he tried.
Comments
Choosing to kick out Gryff than is the better option. We already know that the next episode we will go to the Whitehills and they think we want to expel Gryff, hence saving Ryon is the only possibility and the Whitehills don't have a clue. And than send him to the Glenmores, even if the traitor does find out it won't be useful to the Whithills because they would have to go against 2 families.
Playing the game without reading their history means you are more likely to make a mistake.
Why I think this is bullshit
If he wants freaking war then why the hell would he feed info to the whitehills
I kind of hope the traitor is Duncan because I can't stand him.
He wants to fight a losing war, and throughout his entire life he only entered wars he would win. That alone is enough to not trust him.
Players don't need codex to understand what's going on in the game.
To know everyone, you must know their past. It's always best to check if everyone remains true to their past. The only two who aren't true to their past are Royland and the Maester. If Royland was true to his past, he would have agreed with Duncan 50% of the time at the first council of Ethan. Royland said we're not prepared but wants to fight, which everyone knows is a bad strategy, yet he is one of the best strategists in Westeros.
That is some good reasoning LukaszB. Hope it shakes out this way.
I have a feeling we'll find out who the traitor is soon also, if we pay attention to Gwyn.
''Royland said we're not prepared but wants to fight''. Yes, because he wants to fuck those whitehills. He always talks straight. He doesn't want to wait. He wants to act. He wants to do something. When Gryff kicked your ass and you said ''Take him, Royland'', he fought with them. Why would he risk his life? After that they were gonna kill him but Gryff stopped them and said ''No, let him watch this''. So he is not the fucking traitor. Her mother wants to save Ryon and their house. But %99 Ryon. So she do anything to save Ryon no matter what. I think that makes her the suspect. Duncan wants to save House Forrester. Lord Forrester trusted him for Christ's sake. And what do you think that he wants to find the North Grove?So he is not the fucking traitor. Maester...well he seems normal guy. I don't know what to say about him. But he doesn't want to see any bloodshed. So, maybe he is the traitor. At least, %50.
If you make him engage the soldiers, he draws his swords but he does not use it, instead he uses the handle of the sword. Very fishy.
Really? Killing them would just end up in more blood, possible Forrester blood. Even a hothead like Royland knows that, he was probably just trying to get them down.
It's maybe him, but I think Maester Ortengryn is the traitor.
I have not seen the science of this. Can someone post it? Onl6 thing I can say for him is he lost his last house. He might nit want to see that happen again so he goes to the stronger house.
The traitor would want one of two things. Bloodshed immediately (Royland) or change (Maester). You said it yourself that Lady Forrester would want Ryon safe in her arms, hence she wouldn't say anything about a plan to do just that (80% not the traitor). A well known strategist plans before he acts, Royland was next to two guards. A strategist would attack the guards first, not go straight towards Gryff.
Or maybe she thinks the plan would fail and would rather ensure Ryon's safety than have him be punished in a failed rescue attempt.
Just because Royland has an anger problem, it doesn't mean he's a poor strategist.
I have to say my votes for the mother I know you said don't say it but there it is shes been caught sending messages to the whitehills and constantly makes the bad plays the healer seemed to actually have eathan's back and royland and Duncan have been with the house for a number of years so I fell the only choice is the mother
Butt. A mother going against the eldest to save the youngest. Sounds awfully familiar. I still don't see how giving away their plans would benefit her. She is always advocating the backup plans like Mira. (The decision to save Ryon might be a distraction, since this happens either way) She also isn't presented as a choice really... which COULD be suspicious. DAH.
How did he end up with House Forrester anyways? His loyalty could overcome his sense.
This plot has almost 0% of failing if done correctly, and Rodrik knows how to plan as well as Royland. The fact that you have few men also means you have a better chance of slipping past, which Lady Forrester knows. I said Royland was and is a brilliant strategist, if you have been paying attention. But always going against strategy when you're a brilliant strategist is suspicious, but not as suspicious as widening all your senses to a plan of action like the Maester.
His parents died, and the Forresters took him in and promised to help him avenge his parents death, which they did and he got the final word.
Currently the Boltons and Whitehills are fighting the lords that are responsible for his parents death.
Why pull out your sword in the first place then?
We know nothing about Highpoint or it's forces so we can't possibly know the success rate. The Forresters don't have the man power, the information or the right individuals to pull off an infiltration mission.
"A well known strategist plans before he acts, Royland was next to two guards. A strategist would attack the guards first, not go straight towards Gryff."
If Royland does the opposite to what a well known strategist would do, that makes him a poor one, no?
The success rate is decided by your initial choice. The Whitehills know your initial plan, but not that you made a decision between 2 plans. While we the players don't know the layout, the characters we play do.
Royland is a brilliant strategist, yet he doesn't act like it for some reason after the Red Wedding aka the beginning of episode 1. That does make him suspicious. Think of an experienced climber all of a sudden he'll make history by jumping off a 1000 ft. That's the best comparison I could think of for Royland.
But the Whitehills and the Forresters hate each other, I'd be surprised if anyone in Ironrath has ever stepped foot in Highpoint, let alone been there long enough to memorise its layout.
I agree that he's hardly showing any signs of being a great strategist but he hasn't had much opportunity to do so. You could argue waiting is the best strategy but wait too long and you're just going to get crushed. Plus his anger at the Whitehills probably clouds his better judgement. Maybe the loss of his family and fear of it happening again makes him want to prevent it at all costs.
It would be Asher's current age minus 17-19, not that far back.
I agree with fear making him furious more than anything else, and Lady Forrester has a similar past but her fear turns more towards alertness and secrecy.
Duncan doesn't seem likely at all, idk why people keep saying this. Lord Forrester was likely the most sensible person in the House, and he trusted Duncan more than his own wife and children hence "The North Grove." Duncan states his concern for the safety of the Forresters when he goes to visit Gared, and Gared even says something along the lines of "If finding the North Grove can help in any way, than so be it," which, to me states that Duncan is asking Gared to go find it sooner rather than later as a way of trying to help the Forresters.
Duncan would indeed seem suspicious for being so "submissive" to the Whitehills if it wasn't for these factors, and I think anyone paying attention would agree. Gwyn even states that her family is dangerous(in a sense) and that "the best thing to do is to submit and do as they say or shit will hit the fan." That said, I think Duncan is just a sensible guy, he acknowledges the importance of "playing it cool," and I'd be disappointed in the writers if they undermined his intelligence by making him the traitor, even if it was just him trying to look out for the Forresters safety, SOMETHING has to be done and I believe he knows that.
I firmly believe it's Lady Forrester and I'm sticking by that decision. I speak more about it in a thread I made if you'd like an explanation as to why.
You know something? It may be Duncan and royland. Imagine what a kick in the teeth that would be. It'd mean your council is growing smaller. Family is a big theme in game of thrones. Any it feels like the whole world against your family.
Ryanoo, i completely agree with everything you said. My reasoning, almost to a tee. I think one of the most important character revelations we have had is that Lord Forrester chose to have Gared tell Duncan his secret. And Only Duncan.
He didn't choose to say 'tell my children' (one of which is the new Lord), not 'ask the Maester for help', not 'you must tell My Wife', not Royland, or Malcom (who seems capable). Only tell Duncan. Which to me, states that he trusts Duncan implicitly. And does not trust the rest of them. So, if that is the case, why didn't the late Lord Forrester trust his own family? Even with his dying wish?
My bet is he doesn't trust them keeping it a secret, except for Rodrik and Duncan.
What i'm saying about lady forrester is why would she betray herself ... her house ... her sons and daughters ... it doesn't make any sense when you think of it
Right, but there must be some underlying reasoning to why he doesn't trust any of them.
I mean he gave the children the 'Keys' to the map, but didn't tell them that they were keys, or about the Grove itself. I could understand not telling them all, but surely the new Lord?
Probably because he needed to choose a sentinel and he wasn't fully trained to be Lord. That's my reasoning behind not informing Ethan. Talia was probably the only one who knew something more, as she could seal alliances.
What a surprise. Carly once again brings logic and sense to whats going on. It was incredibly obvious to me in this last episode that you are exactly right. A military leader knows when he's beat and when he's outgunned. He knows when to hold back and when to fight. "Sir" Royland has, throughout the entire series been pressuring you to fight and look meaner than you obviously are. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that "egging on" the Whitehills will only justify them in destroying the Forresters. So, if I was so loyal, why would I CONTINUOUSLY convince my King to egg them on?
In episode 4, he asks that you (at least in my play through) use your new army to accompany you to the Whitehill's stronghold only after JUST getting it back, thus leaving it completely unguarded. How could a LOYAL military tactician come to that conclusion?
Why Duncan? Why would he do that? It would disappoint Gared. Gregor Forrester and Duncan were likely to be friends as Gregor tells Gared to only tell his uncle about this North Grove.
The problem is that you are giving Telltale too little credit and looking down on them as just standard video game designers. In any normal game that is one thing. The fact that this is Telltale making Game of Thrones... you have to consider there is a bit more at play and look beyond the obvious.
You DO know that people can put on airs and do something called "pretend". It's when you make people believe one thing, usually about yourself, and prove to do another. Considering this game starts with the Red Wedding and the game itself is Game of Thrones, a little falsehoods and betrayal shouldn't be unexpected... even from an apparently "open" person like Mr. Royland.
Consider this. Why would a tactical military leader senselessly pressure his lord to be aggressive against a vastly more powerful army?
Aaaaaaand it's determinant. Nice job TTL, they actually added some element of choice in this episode.