Why did Jon Snow abandoned *****?
Can someone, please, explain me why did Jon Snow act like a complete jerk towards Gared in this episode? I really enjoyed Jon and Gared's scenes together, they have seemed like friends and comrades, but I didn't expect him to give up so easily and abandon Gared. He just said something like "I hope the Gods will be with you while your head gets chopped off." It looks so stupid, especially after Gared and Jon befriended each other.
Frostfinger decided to get rid off Gared no matter what and even Finn's possible testimony didn't chage his mind. He so openly shows his personal dislike towards Gared that Jon's decision to abandon his friend looks even worse. The player can choose "The Night's Watched betrayed me" as Gared and it's so damn true. Any thoughts?
Comments
I agree, in that case fuck the nights watch. Finn was a positive witness that he didn't, yet Frostfinger ignored him anyway, so what was he bloody point in even trying?
The point of Finn sticking up for you was to show the pay-off of choosing to befriend him in a previous episode. If you didn't befriend him, then he condemns you to Frostfinger. It was never going to make any difference. The people writing the narrative needed a reason to force you to desert and for those die-hard night's watch loyalists, your impending death was the only thing convincing enough.
He's got bigger things to worry about at the moment. Like trying to protect everyone else at the Wall, not just you. He only just met you and you've confessed to killing Britt. Even if he does believe you, what did you expect him to do? He's about to leave for Craster's Keep, which is a time-sensitive mission. Even if he stayed behind and stuck up for you, that wouldn't have kept you alive. Ser Alliser isn't going to listen to him about you. Cut him some slack.
Jon could have told Frostfinger not to execute Gared for the crime he didn't commited! There are people to protect Gared from unfair punishment - Maester Aemon, for example. Jon was in the same situation after he returned from the free folk, yet his brothers defended him. He knows what it feels like and that's why his decision to leave his friend in danger looks so bad written - Jon woul've have stood up for his friend in both the novels and the TV show, especially, if he's not guilty.
Jon didn't act like a jerk to Gared in my playthrough. In fact, he acted too nice, considering I spit in his face by breaking my word and yet he hopes the gods to be with him. As for that last quote, all I can ask is: What? It's actually the other way around: The Watch didn't betray Gared, it was him that betrayed everything he and the Watch stand for. I don't even know how it can be interpreted otherwise.
Jon doesn't have any real power at this point. He's not Lord commander yet so it's not like he can give orders to Frost finger who out ranks him
Gared was only defended himself, because Britt admitted his intention to kill Gared anyway and attacked (if the player didn't attack him first, of course). But the question is that Jon did nothing to help Gared. That's why Jon's ingnorance is so strange and unreasonable. If your friend (or good comrade, whatever) is in danger, any man will try to help. And here it's Jon Snow - man of honour, true friend and simply a good guy.
I don't know.. my Gared didn't betray the watch. He tried to stop the fight with Britt and only acted in self-defense. Jon even believed me.. but like someone else said.. the mission to Craster's was time sensitive and he couldn't allow himself to be drawn into a long heated argument even for someone he considers a friend.
Sure Gared was planning on desertion but he can't be guilty of something that never came to fruition until he was imprisoned first.
My John didn't act like a jerk. I dunno what you did to piss him off, but mine simply said he was sorry for me and though he understands why I did it, there's nothing he can do about it
What ignorance? Why would Jon help Gared? Gared killed his brother Britt, one of his own, he has to die. And again, he wishes the gods be with Gared, that's more help than what he deserves.
whispers Jon
1) Jon has zero authority at this point in the storyline, so Frostfinger doesn't need to listen to him.
2) Jon doesn't know Gared isn't guilty and depending on how you played it, you basically are guilty, even if you didn't start the fight.
3) It's not Gared's fault, but from Jon's perspective, you seem to have let him down.
4) Like I said, Jon was about to leave for Craster's Keep within the knowledge that if he didn't get there before Mance did, the Night's
Watch would be screwed. He hasn't got the time to stick around and defend Gared. Jon's not the Messiah, he can't save everyone.
5) The story needed Gared to be sentenced to death in order to move forward. The writers did write themselves into a corner a bit, because they needed Gared to desert, but that doesn't make the story implausible. You may have wanted Jon to defend you, but the
game didn't.
6) What makes you think you're Jon's friend? He's nice to you and considers you a 'brother', but he's like that to everyone who hasn't wronged him, because he understands that cooperation and trust is how to get the Wall to function. To him, you're basically just another new recruit who has potential. But maybe Frostfinger was right and you were trouble all along.
7) Maybe Maester Aemon did try to defend Gared, although there's little reason he'd even know him specifically. But Alliser's not necessarily going to listen to him and waste his time on a possible brother-killer. Which leads me to...
8) Westeros is a horrible, unjust place and the Wall is where the horrible, unjust people get sent. Sometimes innocent people get executed. Some of Jon's brothers defended him, but that's because they already knew and respected him. Gared hasn't been there long enough for that and Finn sticking up for him alone just wasn't enough.
That's a girl name
What the hell was he meant to do? He's not the Lord Commander yet. He doesn't hold any power. And he hardly acted like a jerk. If you tell him what happened, he'll say he believes you. If he could do something, I reckon he would.
Really?
There's just nothing to be done. And why should he sacrifice his honor and become a fugitive for a new recruit who almost instantly broke his vows?
Hopefully we are done with the nights watch now, I never wanted to join them
Ah... the Britt defenders return.
I just love how everyone expects someone to just let someone kill them because of vows. It's called Self-Defense. Why should Gared die because the person who killed his family is insane?
I'm not defending anyone here. I'm saying that from Jon's point of view, there's clearly a breach in the vows pronounced earlier. Sure, Gared was attacked (and it's his right to defend himself), but that doesn't change that fact.
Yeah, I was choking back bile when I said my oath. I hate the Nights Watch. I hate the Wall. I hate that whole viper's nest. I'll happily take my chances amongst the Free Folk.
If you promised him you wouldn't hurt Britt, and also tried to avoid fighting him, then Jon Snow was just a big asshole. But I straight told him I can't make a promise like that and attacked Britt as soon as I could, also lied to Frostfinger's face so when he abandoned me I felt like "ok, fair enough". xD
I'm still miffed that we were forced into this. And I'm slightly annoyed at Duncan, indecisive bastard. "Become a ranger if you can!" Okay, done. I hope you're proud of me-- "I need you to leave please, find the North Grove." COME ON, UNCLE.
That said, I wasn't mad at Jon Snow. He sympathized with me greatly, I couldn't ask for more than that from him.
Yeah if he wanted Gared to go beyond the wall, he could've just put him on a ship in Bear Island and make him reach the frozen coast.
Surely it would've been easier than making him take the watch vows and break him.
I just wish they could've made it a little bit better if Finn was your friend and Britt didn't fall off the Wall.
Like, there's no way they'd actually believe Gared killed Britt in self defense without compelling testimony to the contrary. With that, Frostfinger could have said, "We're locking him up until morning. Then we'll decide what to do with him." Then Cotter could come by and say, "Hey, Gared. Frostfinger's got pretty much everyone in there against you. Finn and I tried to talk them into reason, but they're just too upset about a brother dying. They want blood, so I'm gonna break you out."
That way it seems a little less like "Oh, the word of not-Alliser-Thorne Frostfinger is totally enough to warrant execution. He has such a high rank of being not-Master-at-Arms-but-somehow-responsible-for-new-recruits-this-week. Let's kill Gared in the morning!"
Because he has more important things to worry about at the moment, with the situation at Craster's.
There's nothing really he can do about Gared's situation without breaking his vows.
And we all know how our dear Jon feels about his precious vows.
You're right, it could have been handled smarter, so that it didn't feel like you were being punished for something you had no control over. But I guess the writers thought, 'Well, you have to desert either way, because that's where the story is going, so we might as well go all out and say we're going to kill him from the start. That way, both Gared and the player will feel betrayed by the Night's Watch and won't feel so bad about breaking their vows.'
The way I look at it, Jon did what he could under the circumstances. He said he believed Gared when he pleaded self-defense and he did make an attempt to argue with Frostfinger, who seemed to refuse listening to any sort of reason. Unfortunately, Jon is just a steward at this point and is extremely limited. Maybe he'll pardon Gared when he's made Lord Commander. Who knows?
Jon tried. There was no reasoning with Frost Finger. Jon couldn't do much else he asked frost finger if there was anything else that could be done. And Jon was in hot water at the time, he had just returned from being with the wildlings, so he had little say. The mission to craster's was ok'd because they thought there was a good chance for Jon to die.
In my playthrough Jon Snow was nice and believed Gared when he said it wasn't his fault/he was attacked. He tried to reason with Frostfinger and ask if there was anything else they could do punish to Gared but Frostfinger wouldn't hear it. Then Jon left and looked very sorry for Gared.