My take on Kenny's/Jane's fate in S3.
IT'S FINE
Speaking as someone who despises S2 and think it all was a complete nosedive in quality for the story S1 set up.
I honestly think those fates were perfectly in line with both of their characters given on where S2 left off.
I know some fans don't want to hear this but Kenny was a rather impulsive and reckless kind of guy who would always make brash decisions right in the moment that would end up being questionable and lead to mixed results and that recklessness of telling a teenager who's never driven before to speed up in the wilderness got him killed.
Jane is a flip flopping inconsistent character writing wise so it doesn't surprise me that the writers ended up making her selfish and unable to accept the reality of taking care of two babies and teenager which I've always felt she was selfish even when she says she cared for Clementine. She's also a complete idiot as far as can tell from S2.
But I guess these deaths never "hit me" considering I've always felt Jane was a badly written character given how inconsistent she was and bringing Kenny back from the dead with no viable explanation was one of the BIGGEST WRITING FUCK UPS I've ever seen in an ongoing narrative and it didn't help that he ended up getting most of the spotlight by the end of S2 by going through a watered down version of his same arc from S1.
Now, are all of these scenes really short and kind of abrupt? Yes and that's probably the biggest issue.
Weirdly though, in a meta sense, I feel like the abrupt and short nature of these scenes showcases Telltale semi acknowledging on how much of a complete disaster S2 was and so far I'm actually kind of appreciating the new direction S3 is headed but only time will tell once S3 is finished.
Comments
Hey Moderators, can you put spoiler tag on this one?
You say it's fine but agree that it was handled in a rushed way, which is the main issue for a lot of people. The choice leaves no impact other than shocked disbeleif, which is not a positive thing.
And telltale are guilty themselves in blowing up the expectations with the whole "42 starting points and your choices impacts Clementines character" statement with the world builder.
Honestly, I'm just glad I can officially act like S2 never happened.
AJ
Okay, S2 still never happened to me. You have no idea how much I don't care for that shitty narrative.
Doesn't mean Telltale will completely ignore it. We're probably in for a lot of Kenny, Jane, Luke, Rebecca and Alvin references in the future.
Sure, they won't completely ignore it but that doesn't mean I have to act like S3 is the third sequel.
It doesn't really seem to me like that was Telltale's intention either.
I actually think it was given the way they created the import save system.
I think it inflated expectations at the very least.
Jane's suicide was an act of selflessness toward Clementine. How could she ask a medically inexperienced kid to take care of a weak woman whom she cares about, a toddler whom she cares about, and a baby, all at the same time, let alone deliver said baby?
That's one way to look at it.
I will be glad to listen to you if you'd like to offer a different perspective!
Naw, it wasn't handled well at all. At the very least I think they should have had flashbacks for Clem working towards the current time. Showing either Clem travels with Kenny/Jane or alone to that point. With a major event triggering a flashback that shows what happened with Jane/Kenny.
They threw away so much potential here like in Michonne, Batman, and Game Of Thrones. Also, they could have easily made the first episode two hours. Seems like I got took for a fool with S3 so far lol.
Not saying it was handled well technically but I don't agree it's inconsistent, I just flat out don't care because I don't consider S2 canon because I hate that story.
i just wanna know where a.j is at this point
Kenny is probably the best out of the three, if only because it felt the most well paced. Still, feels like something was missing from it. A connection with him? A little more time spent on him postcrash? Maybe his stunt double crash dummy should've been visibly fighting back? I don't know.
Edith could've benefitted from not feeling crunched in terms of timing and explanation. Especially once you remember that Wellington was supposed to be an armored place for people to take shelter in for a while and yet Edith is a bit of nervous wreck for some reason.
And I have my issues with Jane.
Meh They were alright, but you can't argue about those ugly character models though.
hey don't know you know what there futures are if you want, for example Jane lovers you can just abandon her and leave her alive just off-screen will Kenny people you don't have to worry as if you either abandon Kenny or leave him and stay in wellington he will still be alive during the new frontier as for example with Kenny if you abandon him at the rest stop its highly likely when your walking through the horde Kenny's getting rejected by wellington and for both possibly ways to you could leave him he will still manage to find that car and likely hell make it to Florida and become a sailor as clementine isn't driving the car it wont crash and Kenny actually knows how to drive so he would have managed to make it to Florida and its likely he's living the way pets crew is sailor and fisher and completely safe on the water. What do you guys think of that perspective.
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I enjoyed the scene I got with Kenny, personally.
Sure, it wasn't what I wanted, but it was nice to have that final moment with him. And his death was how I wanted him to go out...for the most part. Could've gone without him being crippled and helpless.
But, aside from the crippled and helpless thing, I'm glad he went out doing exactly what I trusted him to do back in Season 2. Protecting Clementine and AJ.
It does make me feel a bit worried, though, as this was, in my opinion, one of the laziest ways Telltale could have handled the endings.
I really wanted them to have more impact than a seven minute scene. I also don't want Telltale to go back to the days of determinant characters dying no matter what.
EDIT: Considering there's no edit discussion button, I'm here to state my opinion has fully changed from saying it's fine to that the Kenny and Jane flashbacks are badly put together and poorly executed.
Especially considering how here-and-gone they are.
Honestly, I would have held back and showcased plenty of flashback scenes throughout the episodes before the inevitable flashback scene that shows their fate.
Same. Kenny's was easily the best since it felt like it was appropriate for the situation and I felt like I got some worth while elaboration since they left Wellington but Edith and especially Jane's was way too rushed and arbitraty.
I was really hoping Telltale would go all out and give Kenny and Jane their own mini-storylines, told in Clem's flashbacks throughout the season.
But, alas, Telltale did what they usually do.
Oh well. At least we got something. Though, to be honest, it was difficult to really get invested in my scene with Kenny, because I knew exactly what was gonna happen. It was too obvious.
The moment I saw Clem driving, I thought "This shit's gonna fucking crash and Kenny's gonna get fucked up". Then, I thought "Nah, the writers are better than that."
...sometimes I'm too optimistic when it comes to Telltale.
While I'm moderately satisfied with how Kenny's fate played out, I think Jane's was horrible. Had I gotten that flashback, it would've really left a bad taste in my mouth.
The one thing I enjoyed about her flashback was the fact that you could choose AJ's middle name. I kinda wish Jane had been alive in my playthrough, just so that I could give him the name 'Luke', in memoriam of the adorable southern man who made me bawl my eyes out for weeks after NGB.
Aaand, I've started rambling. Sorry. It's 4 AM and I'm going off only a few hours of sleep. I'm not even sure if half of my post makes sense.
Wow, you're managing to spin this as Jane doing a great thing?? Just wow. Even if Jane would be eventually become a liability, she didn't have to leave Clementine alone like that. She could've done anything else besides taking the easy way out. You dont just give up, you stick it out for the people you Care about. She didn't even say goodbye, she just lied and went and offed herself. Jane was a selfish, wretched creature who couldn't hack it for even a few months as Clementines guardian.
Jane was going to become a liability soon and her duty had been fulfilled; there was no point in her sorrowful existence anymore. Looking at the bigger picture, she did Clem a favor by committing suicide. I agree that she should've talked to Clementine and said goodbye, and perhaps stayed with her for a little longer.
Remember that, unlike Kenny, she didn't put Clementine in reckless danger.
Really? I usually like to read your comments even if I don't always agree with you, but I'm just shaking my head right now. How in the world was that an act of selflessness? You think people who kill themselves are thinking about the well-being of others? They are giving up. They are taking the easier route because they don't want/can't face their problems. When Jane faces a problem she always decides to run away, she doesn't want to deal with it, which is exactly what she did, but this time in a more determinant way. Personally, I think both Kenny and Jane's death scenes were incredibly rushed and lazy, but when I saw Jane's ending, I wasn't even surprised because it was definitely something I could see her do. One last act of selfishness.
I am reasonably satisfied with the outcome of Jane's ending after all.
You can always fill the rest with educated headcanons.
It is apparent that you have the conviction that people who commit suicide in our world are cowards, though that's debatable. In any case, your opinion on the suicide we relate to is not applicable into this case, in which the pregnancy of Jane would have ended up with more stress on Clementine's shoulders than she could've handled.
You might say that Jane's motivation for her suicide was to selfishly free herself of the burden of being a mother and I would agree, but, nonetheless, we have to recognize that a byproduct of her death was Clem not being forced to look after and collect supplies for a sick woman and two babies, on her own.
You know what would've made that a little better: a suicide note.
Same here. Minus the Kenny and maybe selfishness parts.
Her duty was not fulfilled. Looking at the bigger picture, she should've stuck it out for Clementine and AJ as long as she possibly could've without becoming an acutal liability. The baby would not be born for several months; Jane did not need to kill herself at that very moment. What if Clementine got in trouble on the perimeter sweep and needed Jane's help? Anything could've happened and Jane selfishly chose to leave the children alone in the world instead and tough it out or find an alternative to suicide.
Do not even get me started on reckless danger. All of her decisions are reckless and dangerous, going back as far as season 2. Even her season 3 decisions are horrible.... giving a young girl a tattoo which can be easily infected in the apocalypse, committing suicide despite being the guardian for a young child and an infant. Kenny was teaching Clem new skills like driving a manual and wanted to teach her and AJ how to fish and swim and survive. He would've NEVER willingly left them to fend for themselves like Jane did.
...Oh my goodness, I think I just figured out another small potential cause of the problem: they got the two mixed up!
I never said they are cowards though. Some people can deal with shit better than others. But I don't believe that those who decide to kill themselves, no matter how much of a trouble they were to the people around them, are doing everyone a favor. They are choosing to end their lives and let the people that care about them live with the pain of their deaths and with the thoughts "what if I could do something to prevent this?".
Why couldn't Jane just leave a note and leave if she thought she would be such a burden? Or kill herself away from Clem and AJ? Why couldn't she shot herself instead of hanging? Or just try to abort if she thought having a kid was so terrible? She didn't want to decide. She didn't want to live with the guilt. She took the easiest route. And she did what she did knowing full well Clem would see her and would have to put her down when she turned. It's funny how people thought Jane "was much more capable than Kenny" because she wasn't "unstable like Kenny" when these flashbacks just showed the opposite. Putting aside how rushed both endings were, at least Kenny stayed and protected Clem and AJ for 1 or 2 years before dying.
Somehow, leaving an 11 year old to raise AJ on her own with a limited amount of supplies, isn't putting Clementine in reckless danger?
We have to understand that, despite everything, Clementine is still a child and while through the miracle of plot writing, she somehow manages to do it in the alone ending (which I haven't seen yet), she's not truly capable enough to care for a child completely on her own. Especially when she believed that she had the security and support of Jane, a well equipped survivor and someone Clementine had sacrificed a lot for, had trusted and had gone through enough trauma to be at that point with them, and what does Jane decide to do? She decides to add to said trauma by killing herself. By giving up. Leaving Clementine truly alone, losing yet another person she deeply cared for. And the most insulting thing? Jane choose to not even give an explanation and decided to hide the truth from Clementine. It was selfish, pure and simple, in my opinion, anyway.
You didn't think Kenny's ending was rushed? They literally came up with the quickest way to get rid of him. It would be the same thing if Clem and Kenny were just walking down the road and Kenny fell on a ditch and died.
I do not have the energy or desire to have a discussion with you, Venge.