What’s wrong with objectifying the womens?
Why am I not surprised
Men get objectified in a much worse way.
Right, beca… moreuse there's some poor 13 year old boy out there who was objectified by a 17 year old girl when she asked him to send her nudes several times.
But yeah, men get objectified a whole lot more. There are male strip clubs in video games where some desperate lonely girl spends all her time staring at fake dicks ffs.
Snow is the only character that had very prominent high heels, (which you can see how she walks is pretty obviously different from other females in other games as its her whole body walking, which already makes me question how true the whole "high heels breaking animation" thing is when Snow who clearly wore high heels clearly walks different than other females) the next would be Holly also in Wolf Among Us. After that I can only think of Vicki Vale and Selina in Batman who both dont even wear "true high heels"
Also I just think the whole "We were told to never show feet" to be pretty meme worthy. They almost never showed close ups of peoples feet walking anyway, male or female, only time I remember them every specifically focusing on feet is during Wolf Among Us Ep 4 when Bigby is walking in the Butcher Freezer.
Also another point is, it probably doesnt break any rigs or skeletons because Snow reuses some of Bigby's animations lmao
So, just Carley?
Also I dont understand the reasoning of "we never showed female feet during walking animations due to character rigs … morebeing based heel walking animations" considering Walking Dead was the game that started the whole reuse the animations assets rigs and character skeletons over and over again and females just wore sneakers in that game, why not just use the rig for female walking animation that was based as if they were wearing sneakers?
Yeah, the only character who rigs any sort of bell in that regard is Snow White and that's the wrong game.
I'm going to assume if there's any persistent truth there, then they basically just broke how the animation to environment should work in favor of making the heel aspect as non-distinguishable as possible.
Also, that could only apply to the later ANF era games.
(also if the whole sam thing was changed last second, shouldnt there be a model in the game somewhere stil… [view original content]
...Oh yeah, now that you mention it. I barely remember her doing much walking.
Also I just think the whole "We were told to never show feet" to be pretty meme worthy.
It does sound like one, doesn't it?
They almost never showed close ups of peoples feet walking anyway, male or female, only time I remember them every specifically focusing on feet is during Wolf Among Us Ep 4 when Bigby is walking in the Butcher Freezer.
Yeah it's mostly only in suspense scenes involves sneaking.
Also another point is, it probably doesnt break any rigs or skeletons because Snow reuses some of Bigby's animations lmao
Really now?
Like, I definitely noticed a few animations reused from Luke, Carlos, and Carver throughout the game, but I never gave it much thought.
Snow is the only character that had very prominent high heels, (which you can see how she walks is pretty obviously different from other fem… moreales in other games as its her whole body walking, which already makes me question how true the whole "high heels breaking animation" thing is when Snow who clearly wore high heels clearly walks different than other females) the next would be Holly also in Wolf Among Us. After that I can only think of Vicki Vale and Selina in Batman who both dont even wear "true high heels"
Also I just think the whole "We were told to never show feet" to be pretty meme worthy. They almost never showed close ups of peoples feet walking anyway, male or female, only time I remember them every specifically focusing on feet is during Wolf Among Us Ep 4 when Bigby is walking in the Butcher Freezer.
Also another point is, it probably doesnt break any rigs or skeletons because Snow reuses some of Bigby's animations lmao
TT intern: "God, you did an amazing job on her character design! She's going to look great in-gam-"
Character Designer: "No! What are you… more doing!? You can't mention her character design out loud!"
Intern: "What do you mean? Why no-"
(Kevin barges in)
Kevin:
(nsfw)
Best example of Snow reusing Bigby's Animation is during episode 3 here at 13 seconds of this video
Honestly the real reason they never ever focus on feet is in reality because they reuse so much god damn animation every character's feet start to either float in the air to clip through the ground due to different character hights, not because females are rigged for high heels.
Exactly.
the next would be Holly also in Wolf Among Us.
...Oh yeah, now that you mention it. I barely remember her doing much … morewalking.
Also I just think the whole "We were told to never show feet" to be pretty meme worthy.
It does sound like one, doesn't it?
They almost never showed close ups of peoples feet walking anyway, male or female, only time I remember them every specifically focusing on feet is during Wolf Among Us Ep 4 when Bigby is walking in the Butcher Freezer.
Yeah it's mostly only in suspense scenes involves sneaking.
Also another point is, it probably doesnt break any rigs or skeletons because Snow reuses some of Bigby's animations lmao
Really now?
Like, I definitely noticed a few animations reused from Luke, Carlos, and Carver throughout the game, but I never gave it much thought.
I think the TFS model was to resemble her S1 look. But let's looks at how the design has changed over the years. And because it's important to the subject, I'm going to have to go down the Clementine-ethnicity rabbit hole a bit.
Clem started off as white in pic #1. When Lee was created, she was changed to better compliment him. As a result, Clem became black in some fashion (we can at least agree her daddy was black, right?). When S1 released, she was lighter. In S2, she tanned up a bit and looked more believable to be Ed and Diana's parents daughter. ANF rolls around and she looks like Mariana's sister. She lightened up. Her hair became less coily and more wavy/straight. Her nose shrank along with several other altered features. TFS comes to light and we see Clem looking like a mash-up of all the possible future looks (based upon the past models). With that said, she heavily favors her S1 design more than anything.
In my opinion, S2 nailed the looks down to a science. The past two episodes seasons are more about course correcting their looks into the S2S1 design.
Edit: All the egregious errors due to my failure to apply grammar and context in an appropriate fashion...
I also remember hearing revisions to female characters to make them younger/whiter/more attractive as ‘fuckability passes’
That most… more def. would explain why she went from a perfect golden brown
to...….this
As you can tell, I think she looked much better with a darker tone. They shouldn't have changed it.
That's exactly one of the moments I was thinking of, as I'm pretty sure that's a slower version of the pacing Luke does in Episode 3.
@eRock92 I think the TFS model was to resemble her S1 look.
Oh, that's likely exactly what they were doing.
In S2, she tanned up a bit and looked more believable to be Ed and Diana's parents
And then they conceived her grandparents.
ANF rolls around and she looks like Mariana's sister.
Hweeell....
She lightened up. Her hair became less coily and more wavy/straight. Her nose shrank along with several other altered features.
Her eyes also changed from amber to I wanna say a dark brown.
Then she got oily as fuck when she was changing to Gabe's look, lookin like this kinda nasty waffle color.
Best example of Snow reusing Bigby's Animation is during episode 3 here at 13 seconds of this video
Honestly the real reason they nev… moreer ever focus on feet is in reality because they reuse so much god damn animation every character's feet start to either float in the air to clip through the ground due to different character hights, not because females are rigged for high heels.
If you're vouching for him I'll have to check him out lol. My nostalgia isn't sympathy, I was busting my ass for 120 a week while they were peddling garbage, I love these guys I grew up with, they went their way and I went mine
What’s wrong with objectifying the womens?
Why am I not surprised
Men get objectified in a much worse way.
Right, beca… moreuse there's some poor 13 year old boy out there who was objectified by a 17 year old girl when she asked him to send her nudes several times.
But yeah, men get objectified a whole lot more. There are male strip clubs in video games where some desperate lonely girl spends all her time staring at fake dicks ffs.
I think it's also worth noting that Clem is pretty much malnourished, probably has been an on and off insomniac since she was 12 or even younger, and in general overwhelming stress and trauma doesn't do favors for complexion thick skinned or not.
I think the TFS model was to resemble her S1 look. But let's looks at how the design has changed over the years. And because it's importan… moret to the subject, I'm going to have to go down the Clementine-ethnicity rabbit hole a bit.
Clem started off as white in pic #1. When Lee was created, she was changed to better compliment him. As a result, Clem became black in some fashion (we can at least agree her daddy was black, right?). When S1 released, she was lighter. In S2, she tanned up a bit and looked more believable to be Ed and Diana's parents daughter. ANF rolls around and she looks like Mariana's sister. She lightened up. Her hair became less coily and more wavy/straight. Her nose shrank along with several other altered features. TFS comes to light and we see Clem looking like a mash-up of all the possible future looks (based upon the past models). With that said, she heavily favors her S1 design more than anything.
In m… [view original content]
Snow is the only character that had very prominent high heels, (which you can see how she walks is pretty obviously different from other fem… moreales in other games as its her whole body walking, which already makes me question how true the whole "high heels breaking animation" thing is when Snow who clearly wore high heels clearly walks different than other females) the next would be Holly also in Wolf Among Us. After that I can only think of Vicki Vale and Selina in Batman who both dont even wear "true high heels"
Also I just think the whole "We were told to never show feet" to be pretty meme worthy. They almost never showed close ups of peoples feet walking anyway, male or female, only time I remember them every specifically focusing on feet is during Wolf Among Us Ep 4 when Bigby is walking in the Butcher Freezer.
Also another point is, it probably doesnt break any rigs or skeletons because Snow reuses some of Bigby's animations lmao
TWAU’s female characters all have the bodies of gorgeous, busty hookers. Thing is though, most of them were, so that is justified. And in the walking dead, you have to be lean and fit to survive. A lot of people over 40 or 50 just don’t make it.
TWAU’s female characters all have the bodies of gorgeous, busty hookers. Thing is though, most of them were, so that is justified. And in the walking dead, you have to be lean and fit to survive. A lot of people over 40 or 50 just don’t make it.
Not to sound like I'm siding with friggin Poogers, Melton, or even Dex-Starr, but I love how a "term" I used as part of an audacious ranking thread was apparently an actual quota amongst the Telltale higher ups.
And here I thought they were gleaning TFS concepts from people like me. Jokingly even.
What’s wrong with this, exactly? What’s wrong with making your characters beautiful? As long as they’re interesting, this isn’t really an is… moresue.
I could go way more in-depth on this subject, but I’m on mobile and I don’t have the energy to do so atm.
Their glamoured forms were hot though, so again I prove my point.
And all those characters you named didn’t make it past 4 years. 7 years in, a bunch of kids are still kickin it.
Except Holly and Bloody Mary.
And in the walking dead, you have to be lean and fit to survive. A lot of people over 40 or 50 just don’t make it.
Which is why Kenny, Alvin, Carver, Walter, Joan, and probably Clint were up and about.
Uh-huhuhuh, no they ain't. Like, I don't know what you're into, but nah man nah.
Also, I'm surprised you didn't just say, "Holly looks like an oldish whore, though."
And all those characters you named didn’t make it past 4 years. 7 years in, a bunch of kids are still kickin it.
Because of other humans being asses. Or in Kenny, Carver, and arguably Joan's case, cause they were being asses.
Their glamoured forms were hot though, so again I prove my point.
And all those characters you named didn’t make it past 4 years. 7 years in, a bunch of kids are still kickin it.
TL;DR: make your characters however you like. Sensitive self-righteous crusaders have no morally consistent claims against you backed either by rigorous logical reasoning or solid empirical evidence.
I'm sorry, but I have to write this because I cannot stand the soft and/or hard bigotry of self-righteous moral crusaders on Twitter and other social media platforms who think they know better than everyone else on how a particular collective of people should be represented because they think they are uniquely endowed with divine knowledge on how a group of people should be shown and that everyone else who disagrees is a sinner that needs to be corrected and shown the light.
In terms of designing characters that have a visual representation, you usually want your main characters to have a distinctive look so they stand out from the rest of the characters since they're the main focus. You can either make them look unusual, or you can make them look attractive and make side or background characters much more average looking. This also applies to villains too. Of course, this is assuming that characters are a significant focus in the story, which they do not necessarily have to be. It makes sense as a design choice, too. If your goal is not to make your characters an important focus of the story, then you'd likely make them more average looking since they will be visibly less distracting, which will allow more emphasis on the other elements of the story.
I think I am seeing a couple of themes throughout this thread that are worth pointing out.
One of them appears to be Colorism, which is a concept practically identical to racism, where people with lighter skin tones are perceived as more attractive intelligent, and successful than those with darker skin tones. It's a bit more complex than that, but that's more or less the gist of it. I would need to see empirical evidence that this is actually the case, not mere anecdotes which can possibly be better explained away by other factors. Still, if we assume that this is actually true, which I haven't seen any solid proof that it is, then my hypothesis would probably be that lighter skin tones may be perceived as more attractive because lighter skin tones emphasize facial features more than darker skin tones do, since lighter skin reflects back more light than darker skin tones do, showing facial contours and the facial structure more than darker skin would. There may also be an association of lighter skin with less damage from UV radiation and darker skin tones with more damage, which has an association with nobility in the past, since the nobility didn't work outside under the scorching sun, resulting in lighter, less UV-damaged skin, while the working class did. This is all purely speculation on my part though, assuming that such a concept actually does have empirical evidence backing it, instead of just merely opinion from sensitive self-righteous crusaders against 'dark skin oppression.'
On the subject of skin lightening, it is not a European concept. In fact, Europeans, especially American Europeans, seem to want to desire golden tan skin instead of pale, lighter skin. The cultures that appear to be the biggest consumers of skin lightening products are African and Asian cultures (includes both South Asians (Indians) and Southeastern and Eastern Asians). Very generally speaking, lighter skin tones are desired in these cultures because of their association with nobility. In contrast, in Western cultures, tan skin tones are desired for their association with leisure, prosperity, and vigor, while pale skin tones are seen as corpse-like--i.e. lacking vitality. Do not take these general statements without a grain of salt -- they are speculative to a large degree.
Now, if we assume that such a phenomenon is true and it is widespread, what are the implications of it, assuming it is viewed as an actual problem that needs to be solved?
The implications would be that light skinned people are inherently oppressing dark skinned people by their very existence, and that they deserved to be punished for being light skinned, or that dark skinned people should be handicapped to be equalized with light skinned people. This is ironically patronizing to those that are dark-skinned--they are unable to fairly compete with the light-skinned without special help from someone else to either lower their light-skinned competition or artificially elevate their status automatically. Of course, this will only end in disaster: people who were born with the 'oppressor' skin tone ( in this case, light vs. dark) will automatically be assumed guilty of oppressing someone of the 'oppressed' different skin tone despite possibly having never even known of them, and all without any trial for their guilt. How is this morally defensible?
Now, I've only touched upon Colorism, but this type of logic can be applied quite easily to any set of mutually exclusive and opposite categories: men and women, the attractive and the ugly, the tall and the short, the old and the young, light-eyed and dark-eyed, thin and fat, etc.
The general procedure is take collective C and collective not-C, assign C the oppressor, and not-C the oppressed for whatever reasons that necessarily qualify one group as the oppressor and the other as the oppressed based on some mystical subjective oppression criteria according to the individual's subjective value judgements, and now the prescription is either that all of C need to be punished to help all of the not-C, or that all of the not-C need to be handicapped to compete with the C.
Of course, the problem with this sort of analysis is that the common characteristic of any collective is an arbitrary choice, and even the oppressor and oppressed roles can be swapped for many of the different characteristics. No meaningful collective can be derived. No meaningful knowledge can be gained this way, at least in the way of proving or disproving oppression, which itself is a subjective value judgement--assuming we are being very liberal with the definition of oppression; the only valuable knowledge will be the specific empirical knowledge that is to be gained which cannot have any value judgements attached to it--and hence is not a proof of any 'isms'. The more conservative (and actually meaningful definition) of oppression is where a group G of people hold down the not group-G of people through coercive means. The key feature of real oppression is the use (or threat) of physical force to keep the oppressed down and the oppressors up. Extending oppression to a widespread social dis-preference of a particular feature without the use of coercion makes the word lose its weight--just about anything can fall under that definition--and is rather insulting to those who have experienced tangible oppression in their life, by equating one's own dissatisfaction with a characteristic's social treatment to violent force used against individuals who possess a certain characteristic.
What’s wrong with this, exactly? What’s wrong with making your characters beautiful? As long as they’re interesting, this isn’t really an is… moresue.
I could go way more in-depth on this subject, but I’m on mobile and I don’t have the energy to do so atm.
What’s wrong with objectifying the womens?
Why am I not surprised
Men get objectified in a much worse way.
Right, beca… moreuse there's some poor 13 year old boy out there who was objectified by a 17 year old girl when she asked him to send her nudes several times.
But yeah, men get objectified a whole lot more. There are male strip clubs in video games where some desperate lonely girl spends all her time staring at fake dicks ffs.
Did you honestly think I wouldn’t see this? You were kicked out of a Discord server because you were being rude, obnoxious and offensive, it doesn’t mean you should spend your entire life on this forum trying to make my time here a living hell by accusing me of bullshit. @Blind Sniper knows of my innocence, and that’s because a sent him quite a few screenshots of what I said in the right context instead of trying to manipulate people into believing me because I was kicked out of a Discord server and because I have a different view regarding the infinite mysteries of the world, and I’m always happy to go digging for more. You literally ripped into me because I said for all we know it is possible that there is a God, I never said there was one. Now stop messaging me.
What’s wrong with objectifying the womens?
Why am I not surprised
Men get objectified in a much worse way.
Right, beca… moreuse there's some poor 13 year old boy out there who was objectified by a 17 year old girl when she asked him to send her nudes several times.
But yeah, men get objectified a whole lot more. There are male strip clubs in video games where some desperate lonely girl spends all her time staring at fake dicks ffs.
Did you honestly think I wouldn’t see this? You were kicked out of a Discord server because you were being rude, obnoxious and offensive, it… more doesn’t mean you should spend your entire life on this forum trying to make my time here a living hell by accusing me of bullshit. @Blind Sniper knows of my innocence, and that’s because a sent him quite a few screenshots of what I said in the right context instead of trying to manipulate people into believing me because I was kicked out of a Discord server and because I have a different view regarding the infinite mysteries of the world, and I’m always happy to go digging for more. You literally ripped into me because I said for all we know it is possible that there is a God, I never said there was one. Now stop messaging me.
You know full well what I’m talking about. You think because I deleted the server that suddenly erases the hurtful things you said? Whenever I try to cheer myself up, by for example cracking jokes about how society works now like in this instance, you try to shut me down. Do you actually want me to be miserable, you sick twisted fuck?
You know full well what I’m talking about. You think because I deleted the server that suddenly erases the hurtful things you said? Whenever… more I try to cheer myself up, by for example cracking jokes about how society works now like in this instance, you try to shut me down. Do you actually want me to be miserable, you sick twisted fuck?
No one knew what I was talking about when I brought up that example of a 17 year old girl asking a 13 year old boy, a minor, for nudes. No one knew that I was actually talking about you, the 17 year old guy that you are, who asked a 13 year old girl for nudes like the creep/pedophile you are. But since you had to go and write that whole long paragraph I didn't read 5 sentences of, you drew more attention to it. Does that make any sense for you now? It's funny how you chose the most active thread to drag this out in.
I have that screenshot you know? The one you’re referring to, and I think you’ll find it quite evident that I was not asking for nudes, and that I was just taking the piss, like always. Turn to exhibit A, for example, I ask EVERYBODY for nudes, do I mean it? No. I’m literally the one teenager in existence, believe it or not, who hates it when people ONLY talk about sex, sure I do it too on occasions, but I’m either taking the piss or it’s a one off
So come on, ya sad fuck, if you srsly wanna go come on, spread all the lies you want because I know it ain’t true, and I have literal screenshot evidence to support it if you wanna go there
Edit: oh shit, I just noticed that in the screenshot, I help year 7’s with their reading, and I do it 2 times a week, I literally asked my friend if we could only do ONE day with them. If I were a pedophile, don’t you think I’d want to spend as much time with them as possible?
No one knew what I was talking about when I brought up that example of a 17 year old girl asking a 13 year old boy, a minor, for nudes. No o… morene knew that I was actually talking about you, the 17 year old guy that you are, who asked a 13 year old girl for nudes like the creep/pedophile you are. But since you had to go and write that whole long paragraph I didn't read 5 sentences of, you drew more attention to it. Does that make any sense for you now? It's funny how you chose the most active thread to drag this out in.
There's actually a screenshot of you saying something along the lines of "I'll cook whatever you want in the future if you send me a nude". Let me look for it. And it's not like you only asked for her nudes once either
If I were a pedophile, don’t you think I’d want to spend as much time with them as possible?
Yeah, because you told a 13 year old girl she turns you on, 10,000,000 times more than she already did because she plays video games.
You sure as hell meant this though.
I have that screenshot you know? The one you’re referring to, and I think you’ll find it quite evident that I was not asking for nudes, and … morethat I was just taking the piss, like always. Turn to exhibit A, for example, I ask EVERYBODY for nudes, do I mean it? No. I’m literally the one teenager in existence, believe it or not, who hates it when people ONLY talk about sex, sure I do it too on occasions, but I’m either taking the piss or it’s a one off
So come on, ya sad fuck, if you srsly wanna go come on, spread all the lies you want because I know it ain’t true, and I have literal screenshot evidence to support it if you wanna go there
Edit: oh shit, I just noticed that in the screenshot, I help year 7’s with their reading, and I do it 2 times a week, I literally asked my friend if we could only do ONE day with them. If I were a pedophile, don’t you think I’d want to spend as much time with them as possible?
I have that screenshot you know? The one you’re referring to, and I think you’ll find it quite evident that I was not asking for nudes, and … morethat I was just taking the piss, like always. Turn to exhibit A, for example, I ask EVERYBODY for nudes, do I mean it? No. I’m literally the one teenager in existence, believe it or not, who hates it when people ONLY talk about sex, sure I do it too on occasions, but I’m either taking the piss or it’s a one off
So come on, ya sad fuck, if you srsly wanna go come on, spread all the lies you want because I know it ain’t true, and I have literal screenshot evidence to support it if you wanna go there
Edit: oh shit, I just noticed that in the screenshot, I help year 7’s with their reading, and I do it 2 times a week, I literally asked my friend if we could only do ONE day with them. If I were a pedophile, don’t you think I’d want to spend as much time with them as possible?
I can see this topic being locked pretty soon but I think it's possible that Emily might've been been talking about Selina, especially her season 2 model. She looks completely different in season 2 and a hell of a lot more white and busty.
Another thing that bothers me & is fairly related is that Selina doesn't use textures without a full face of makeup. Even when she wakes up in the morning in S1EP3 she's got heavy eyeliner and full lipstick. Which is crazy, again, because they would have painted her base skin textures before adding makeup ?
I can also see the heels issue being a prevalent in the Batman games, considering Selina/Vicki/Martha/Harley all wore heeled shoes.
Can you two please stop waving each other's dirty laundry around
Not only is this unrelated to the topic at hand, but I'm pretty sure no one in here cares, including me
So uh, yeah, stop
As I avoid the dangerous stuff that shall not be named, let's get back on topic.
I know this is the TWD thread an all, but we have already mentioned TWAU and Batman. What about GOT, GOTG, or TFTBL? Did those games follow under the same issues as Emily and others mentions?
GOT's female characters were in long dresses, so it was hard to tell how they walked. Beskha was a very against-the-grain character in terms of stereotypical video game female design. I'm not too well versed in all the video game character stereotypes, so I'm not sure how tall, strong, tomboy-ish women of color (would Beskha be considered a POC?) are stereotyped in games.
TFTBL is a bit weird because I don't think Fiona was really sexualized. Sasha was clearly supposed to be the "hotter sister" as clearly show in the game (it was basically spelled out in bold size 99 Arial font). Their boots had heels if I'm correct. I don't remember how all the females on the station dressed. I think this game might be a good one to bring into the fold.
I still haven't played GOTG, so someone else can talk about that one.
The problem is that designers were forced to change the designs for characters because some suit-wearing-upper-management-schmuck thought those characters weren't "fuckable" enough. It's also just one more example of how the upper management of Telltale took over many of the creative decisions instead of the devs who actually know what they're doing.
If you take TFS for comparison, it becomes more obvious, since they seemingly got to do their own thing with it. It just feels more authentic. I'm dreading the thought of what the characters of TFS would've looked like, if some stooge from upper management had any say in it.
What’s wrong with this, exactly? What’s wrong with making your characters beautiful? As long as they’re interesting, this isn’t really an is… moresue.
I could go way more in-depth on this subject, but I’m on mobile and I don’t have the energy to do so atm.
Did you read my other things I say that to everyone. Did you see the things I said to Graffio in the other server? Do you really think that I, a 17 year old, would really wanna pick up someone who is going into their mid 20’s?
I ask EVERYBODY for nudes, do I mean it? No.
There's actually a screenshot of you saying something along the lines of "I'll cook wha… moretever you want in the future if you send me a nude". Let me look for it. And it's not like you only asked for her nudes once either
If I were a pedophile, don’t you think I’d want to spend as much time with them as possible?
Yeah, because you told a 13 year old girl she turns you on, 10,000,000 times more than she already did because she plays video games.
You sure as hell meant this though.
I would stop but this asshole won’t stop taking the things I say out of context and I’m pissed off and fed up with it. This clearly isn’t going to stop cos he’s just gonna keep flaming it in, so we can either threaten both of us with perma bans, ban both of us for a week, or ban one of us, cos knowing this guy it won’t stop and this’ll probably be stuck on the forums for life considering we’re both here. I’m sure if somebody tried to spread lies about you you’d also want to argue back with them, so if you have any great ideas on how to get this guy to piss off then I’m all ears.
I mean I wouldn’t be mad if you did ban me, as long as he goes too, cos he’s honestly starting to push me over the edge rn. Just know that I’ve already been over this with blind once before, and have showed him a few instances that prove my innocence, which is why Dex was banned the first time, and he was warned to stop twice, and as you can say he started egging it on out of nowhere.
Can you two please stop waving each other's dirty laundry around
Not only is this unrelated to the topic at hand, but I'm pretty sure no one in here cares, including me
So uh, yeah, stop
Comments
There probably is in terms of possibility.
...Why would you put that in my head?
Snow is the only character that had very prominent high heels, (which you can see how she walks is pretty obviously different from other females in other games as its her whole body walking, which already makes me question how true the whole "high heels breaking animation" thing is when Snow who clearly wore high heels clearly walks different than other females) the next would be Holly also in Wolf Among Us. After that I can only think of Vicki Vale and Selina in Batman who both dont even wear "true high heels"
Also I just think the whole "We were told to never show feet" to be pretty meme worthy. They almost never showed close ups of peoples feet walking anyway, male or female, only time I remember them every specifically focusing on feet is during Wolf Among Us Ep 4 when Bigby is walking in the Butcher Freezer.
Also another point is, it probably doesnt break any rigs or skeletons because Snow reuses some of Bigby's animations lmao
TT intern: "God, you did an amazing job on her character design! She's going to look great in-gam-"
Character Designer: "No! What are you doing!? You can't mention her character design out loud!"
Intern: "What do you mean? Why no-"
(Kevin barges in)
Kevin:
(nsfw)
Exactly.
...Oh yeah, now that you mention it. I barely remember her doing much walking.
It does sound like one, doesn't it?
Yeah it's mostly only in suspense scenes involves sneaking.
Really now?
Like, I definitely noticed a few animations reused from Luke, Carlos, and Carver throughout the game, but I never gave it much thought.
Holy shit, that's an actual song?
Best example of Snow reusing Bigby's Animation is during episode 3 here at 13 seconds of this video
Honestly the real reason they never ever focus on feet is in reality because they reuse so much god damn animation every character's feet start to either float in the air to clip through the ground due to different character hights, not because females are rigged for high heels.
Lets not
I think the TFS model was to resemble her S1 look. But let's looks at how the design has changed over the years. And because it's important to the subject, I'm going to have to go down the Clementine-ethnicity rabbit hole a bit.
Clem started off as white in pic #1. When Lee was created, she was changed to better compliment him. As a result, Clem became black in some fashion (we can at least agree her daddy was black, right?). When S1 released, she was lighter. In S2, she tanned up a bit and looked more believable to be Ed and Diana's parents daughter. ANF rolls around and she looks like Mariana's sister. She lightened up. Her hair became less coily and more wavy/straight. Her nose shrank along with several other altered features. TFS comes to light and we see Clem looking like a mash-up of all the possible future looks (based upon the past models). With that said, she heavily favors her S1 design more than anything.
In my opinion, S2 nailed the looks down to a science. The past two episodes seasons are more about course correcting their looks into the S2 S1 design.
Edit: All the egregious errors due to my failure to apply grammar and context in an appropriate fashion...
That's exactly one of the moments I was thinking of, as I'm pretty sure that's a slower version of the pacing Luke does in Episode 3.
Oh, that's likely exactly what they were doing.
And then they conceived her grandparents.
Hweeell....
Her eyes also changed from amber to I wanna say a dark brown.
Then she got oily as fuck when she was changing to Gabe's look, lookin like this kinda nasty waffle color.
That's just the way it goes.
that's awfully specific
I think it's also worth noting that Clem is pretty much malnourished, probably has been an on and off insomniac since she was 12 or even younger, and in general overwhelming stress and trauma doesn't do favors for complexion thick skinned or not.
So..yeah ?
That's how a lot of things go. Not fair, but it is what is. Feels like that's all there is, sometimes.
What about Harley?
TWAU’s female characters all have the bodies of gorgeous, busty hookers. Thing is though, most of them were, so that is justified. And in the walking dead, you have to be lean and fit to survive. A lot of people over 40 or 50 just don’t make it.
Except Holly and Bloody Mary.
Which is why Kenny, Alvin, Carver, Walter, Joan, and probably Clint were up and about.
What’s wrong with this, exactly? What’s wrong with making your characters beautiful? As long as they’re interesting, this isn’t really an issue.
I could go way more in-depth on this subject, but I’m on mobile and I don’t have the energy to do so atm.
Not to sound like I'm siding with friggin Poogers, Melton, or even Dex-Starr, but I love how a "term" I used as part of an audacious ranking thread was apparently an actual quota amongst the Telltale higher ups.
And here I thought they were gleaning TFS concepts from people like me. Jokingly even.
Doesn't matter they're dead
Their glamoured forms were hot though, so again I prove my point.
And all those characters you named didn’t make it past 4 years. 7 years in, a bunch of kids are still kickin it.
Uh-huhuhuh, no they ain't. Like, I don't know what you're into, but nah man nah.
Also, I'm surprised you didn't just say, "Holly looks like an oldish whore, though."
Because of other humans being asses. Or in Kenny, Carver, and arguably Joan's case, cause they were being asses.
Someone gets it.
TL;DR: make your characters however you like. Sensitive self-righteous crusaders have no morally consistent claims against you backed either by rigorous logical reasoning or solid empirical evidence.
I'm sorry, but I have to write this because I cannot stand the soft and/or hard bigotry of self-righteous moral crusaders on Twitter and other social media platforms who think they know better than everyone else on how a particular collective of people should be represented because they think they are uniquely endowed with divine knowledge on how a group of people should be shown and that everyone else who disagrees is a sinner that needs to be corrected and shown the light.
In terms of designing characters that have a visual representation, you usually want your main characters to have a distinctive look so they stand out from the rest of the characters since they're the main focus. You can either make them look unusual, or you can make them look attractive and make side or background characters much more average looking. This also applies to villains too. Of course, this is assuming that characters are a significant focus in the story, which they do not necessarily have to be. It makes sense as a design choice, too. If your goal is not to make your characters an important focus of the story, then you'd likely make them more average looking since they will be visibly less distracting, which will allow more emphasis on the other elements of the story.
I think I am seeing a couple of themes throughout this thread that are worth pointing out.
One of them appears to be Colorism, which is a concept practically identical to racism, where people with lighter skin tones are perceived as more attractive intelligent, and successful than those with darker skin tones. It's a bit more complex than that, but that's more or less the gist of it. I would need to see empirical evidence that this is actually the case, not mere anecdotes which can possibly be better explained away by other factors. Still, if we assume that this is actually true, which I haven't seen any solid proof that it is, then my hypothesis would probably be that lighter skin tones may be perceived as more attractive because lighter skin tones emphasize facial features more than darker skin tones do, since lighter skin reflects back more light than darker skin tones do, showing facial contours and the facial structure more than darker skin would. There may also be an association of lighter skin with less damage from UV radiation and darker skin tones with more damage, which has an association with nobility in the past, since the nobility didn't work outside under the scorching sun, resulting in lighter, less UV-damaged skin, while the working class did. This is all purely speculation on my part though, assuming that such a concept actually does have empirical evidence backing it, instead of just merely opinion from sensitive self-righteous crusaders against 'dark skin oppression.'
On the subject of skin lightening, it is not a European concept. In fact, Europeans, especially American Europeans, seem to want to desire golden tan skin instead of pale, lighter skin. The cultures that appear to be the biggest consumers of skin lightening products are African and Asian cultures (includes both South Asians (Indians) and Southeastern and Eastern Asians). Very generally speaking, lighter skin tones are desired in these cultures because of their association with nobility. In contrast, in Western cultures, tan skin tones are desired for their association with leisure, prosperity, and vigor, while pale skin tones are seen as corpse-like--i.e. lacking vitality. Do not take these general statements without a grain of salt -- they are speculative to a large degree.
Now, if we assume that such a phenomenon is true and it is widespread, what are the implications of it, assuming it is viewed as an actual problem that needs to be solved?
The implications would be that light skinned people are inherently oppressing dark skinned people by their very existence, and that they deserved to be punished for being light skinned, or that dark skinned people should be handicapped to be equalized with light skinned people. This is ironically patronizing to those that are dark-skinned--they are unable to fairly compete with the light-skinned without special help from someone else to either lower their light-skinned competition or artificially elevate their status automatically. Of course, this will only end in disaster: people who were born with the 'oppressor' skin tone ( in this case, light vs. dark) will automatically be assumed guilty of oppressing someone of the 'oppressed' different skin tone despite possibly having never even known of them, and all without any trial for their guilt. How is this morally defensible?
Now, I've only touched upon Colorism, but this type of logic can be applied quite easily to any set of mutually exclusive and opposite categories: men and women, the attractive and the ugly, the tall and the short, the old and the young, light-eyed and dark-eyed, thin and fat, etc.
The general procedure is take collective C and collective not-C, assign C the oppressor, and not-C the oppressed for whatever reasons that necessarily qualify one group as the oppressor and the other as the oppressed based on some mystical subjective oppression criteria according to the individual's subjective value judgements, and now the prescription is either that all of C need to be punished to help all of the not-C, or that all of the not-C need to be handicapped to compete with the C.
Of course, the problem with this sort of analysis is that the common characteristic of any collective is an arbitrary choice, and even the oppressor and oppressed roles can be swapped for many of the different characteristics. No meaningful collective can be derived. No meaningful knowledge can be gained this way, at least in the way of proving or disproving oppression, which itself is a subjective value judgement--assuming we are being very liberal with the definition of oppression; the only valuable knowledge will be the specific empirical knowledge that is to be gained which cannot have any value judgements attached to it--and hence is not a proof of any 'isms'. The more conservative (and actually meaningful definition) of oppression is where a group G of people hold down the not group-G of people through coercive means. The key feature of real oppression is the use (or threat) of physical force to keep the oppressed down and the oppressors up. Extending oppression to a widespread social dis-preference of a particular feature without the use of coercion makes the word lose its weight--just about anything can fall under that definition--and is rather insulting to those who have experienced tangible oppression in their life, by equating one's own dissatisfaction with a characteristic's social treatment to violent force used against individuals who possess a certain characteristic.
what video games would those be im asking for a friend
Did you honestly think I wouldn’t see this? You were kicked out of a Discord server because you were being rude, obnoxious and offensive, it doesn’t mean you should spend your entire life on this forum trying to make my time here a living hell by accusing me of bullshit. @Blind Sniper knows of my innocence, and that’s because a sent him quite a few screenshots of what I said in the right context instead of trying to manipulate people into believing me because I was kicked out of a Discord server and because I have a different view regarding the infinite mysteries of the world, and I’m always happy to go digging for more. You literally ripped into me because I said for all we know it is possible that there is a God, I never said there was one. Now stop messaging me.
What are you talking about?
You know full well what I’m talking about. You think because I deleted the server that suddenly erases the hurtful things you said? Whenever I try to cheer myself up, by for example cracking jokes about how society works now like in this instance, you try to shut me down. Do you actually want me to be miserable, you sick twisted fuck?
You just drew attention to the dog whistle I blew that no one else BUT you would've understood.
Literally none of what you just said makes any sense
No one knew what I was talking about when I brought up that example of a 17 year old girl asking a 13 year old boy, a minor, for nudes. No one knew that I was actually talking about you, the 17 year old guy that you are, who asked a 13 year old girl for nudes like the creep/pedophile you are. But since you had to go and write that whole long paragraph I didn't read 5 sentences of, you drew more attention to it. Does that make any sense for you now? It's funny how you chose the most active thread to drag this out in.
I have that screenshot you know? The one you’re referring to, and I think you’ll find it quite evident that I was not asking for nudes, and that I was just taking the piss, like always. Turn to exhibit A, for example, I ask EVERYBODY for nudes, do I mean it? No. I’m literally the one teenager in existence, believe it or not, who hates it when people ONLY talk about sex, sure I do it too on occasions, but I’m either taking the piss or it’s a one off
So come on, ya sad fuck, if you srsly wanna go come on, spread all the lies you want because I know it ain’t true, and I have literal screenshot evidence to support it if you wanna go there
Edit: oh shit, I just noticed that in the screenshot, I help year 7’s with their reading, and I do it 2 times a week, I literally asked my friend if we could only do ONE day with them. If I were a pedophile, don’t you think I’d want to spend as much time with them as possible?
There's actually a screenshot of you saying something along the lines of "I'll cook whatever you want in the future if you send me a nude". Let me look for it. And it's not like you only asked for her nudes once either
Yeah, because you told a 13 year old girl she turns you on, 10,000,000 times more than she already did because she plays video games.
You sure as hell meant this though.
I'm sad, sick, and twisted? Says the creep that begrudges a 13 year old for not wanting to date him online anymore.
I can see this topic being locked pretty soon but I think it's possible that Emily might've been been talking about Selina, especially her season 2 model. She looks completely different in season 2 and a hell of a lot more white and busty.
Another thing that bothers me & is fairly related is that Selina doesn't use textures without a full face of makeup. Even when she wakes up in the morning in S1EP3 she's got heavy eyeliner and full lipstick. Which is crazy, again, because they would have painted her base skin textures before adding makeup ?
I can also see the heels issue being a prevalent in the Batman games, considering Selina/Vicki/Martha/Harley all wore heeled shoes.
Can you two please stop waving each other's dirty laundry around
Not only is this unrelated to the topic at hand, but I'm pretty sure no one in here cares, including me
So uh, yeah, stop
I'm not the one who wrote paragraphs trying to defend myself in anyway. I clearly don't care either
As I avoid the dangerous stuff that shall not be named, let's get back on topic.
I know this is the TWD thread an all, but we have already mentioned TWAU and Batman. What about GOT, GOTG, or TFTBL? Did those games follow under the same issues as Emily and others mentions?
GOT's female characters were in long dresses, so it was hard to tell how they walked. Beskha was a very against-the-grain character in terms of stereotypical video game female design. I'm not too well versed in all the video game character stereotypes, so I'm not sure how tall, strong, tomboy-ish women of color (would Beskha be considered a POC?) are stereotyped in games.
TFTBL is a bit weird because I don't think Fiona was really sexualized. Sasha was clearly supposed to be the "hotter sister" as clearly show in the game (it was basically spelled out in bold size 99 Arial font). Their boots had heels if I'm correct. I don't remember how all the females on the station dressed. I think this game might be a good one to bring into the fold.
I still haven't played GOTG, so someone else can talk about that one.
The problem is that designers were forced to change the designs for characters because some suit-wearing-upper-management-schmuck thought those characters weren't "fuckable" enough. It's also just one more example of how the upper management of Telltale took over many of the creative decisions instead of the devs who actually know what they're doing.
If you take TFS for comparison, it becomes more obvious, since they seemingly got to do their own thing with it. It just feels more authentic. I'm dreading the thought of what the characters of TFS would've looked like, if some stooge from upper management had any say in it.
Did you read my other things I say that to everyone. Did you see the things I said to Graffio in the other server? Do you really think that I, a 17 year old, would really wanna pick up someone who is going into their mid 20’s?
I would stop but this asshole won’t stop taking the things I say out of context and I’m pissed off and fed up with it. This clearly isn’t going to stop cos he’s just gonna keep flaming it in, so we can either threaten both of us with perma bans, ban both of us for a week, or ban one of us, cos knowing this guy it won’t stop and this’ll probably be stuck on the forums for life considering we’re both here. I’m sure if somebody tried to spread lies about you you’d also want to argue back with them, so if you have any great ideas on how to get this guy to piss off then I’m all ears.
I mean I wouldn’t be mad if you did ban me, as long as he goes too, cos he’s honestly starting to push me over the edge rn. Just know that I’ve already been over this with blind once before, and have showed him a few instances that prove my innocence, which is why Dex was banned the first time, and he was warned to stop twice, and as you can say he started egging it on out of nowhere.