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Wallace and Gromit demo crashes on startup unless i disconnect from the internet.

DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
edited October 2009 in Game Support
Here's some awesome bug i can reliably reproduce on my System.

EDIT 1: Just after writing this it now works even with the active internet connection. I'll look into it. Just sad i can't debug it now.

EDIT 2: Some moments later it went back to it's buggy behavior. I made a video this time and will upload and link it here.

EDIT 3 The video demonstration is online now.

The Wallace and Gromit demo crashes on startup unless i disconnect from the internet.
I know it sounds crazy, but I tried it a bunch of times in each situation to make sure the internet connection really is responsible for the bug.
The crash is not just the application process disappearing like in several other cases. It throws an error message. In German it is "WalaceGromitDemo funktioniert nicht mehr". I don't know exactly how the English one is, but it translates to something like "WalaceGromitDemo has stopped working" which I read in a different thread.

At first i just deactivated the network interface in Windows and tested the game several times.
I wasn't sure why it helped, therefore for the next test I disconnected my Internet connection in my router with the same result.



But now it get's really strange. The demo worked before i installed my new graphics card, a Radeon 4850. I have not reinstalled the game since then, therefore data corruption is very unlikely. However i don't know what else has changed softwarewies. It's been a time I played the demo, and since then there were several windows update cycles.
I would try what happens when I reinstall the Nvidia 7600 GT again, but i don't want to change anything big now to keep the bug reproducable.
AS you can see i am more interested in debugging than getting it running, therefore i am not looking for support in this case.

My guess the game tries to connect to telltale, and gets an invalid response of some kind, which causes a buffer overflow which crashes the game.

Maybe something similar is the cause for some of the other startup crashes we see in this forum.

If i am in a good mood i'll check what is transfered before and during the crash with wireshark.

I hope we can figure this out.

For now I'll attach my zipped DxDiag.txt. If you could use any other information for debugging, just ask.
I am confident i can handle it.

Comments

  • ShauntronShauntron Telltale Alumni
    edited July 2009
    That is strange. I'll forward it to the web team. Good detective work :)
  • qvistqvist
    edited July 2009
    Seem to have a similar problem with TOMI:
    http://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=169698&postcount=45
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    We have someone who confirmed the same bug, but in ToMI.
  • optrirominiluikusoptrirominiluikus
    edited July 2009
    The problem I have described in http://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9354 also seems to be caused by this. Have tried it several times, disconnecting and then reconnecting to the net, and the game (Sam & Max 104) starts fine when I'm not connected.
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    optrirominiluikus wrote: »
    The problem I have described in http://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9354 also seems to be caused by this. Have tried it several times, disconnecting and then reconnecting to the net, and the game (Sam & Max 104) starts fine when I'm not connected.

    That's good news. The more are affected, the more will benefit when it's fixed.
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    I made two wireshark captures of the crashing Wallace&Gromit demo.
    I'll attach them here. Maybe they contain anything useful.
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    This might be relevant. So far everyone who had exactly this problem is using Vista.

    DjNDB: Windows Vista™ Business
    medintern: Windows Vista Home
    optrirominiluikus: Windows Vista ???
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    Qapla'!

    I just woke up and started taking another look at W&G. I was wondering why i didn't ever see any problem reports while it crashed and looked around in windows vista. I found the option to watch problem reports and started digging.

    From there on the major problem was pretty easy to narrow down. Just look at the reports below. There are also two reports that were not related to it. Further ToMI is affected as well.

    I was able to fix it by uninstalling IE8 and therefore running IE7. You can see the exact version information of ieframe.dll in the pictures.

    Since IE8 is delivered automatically via Windows Updates affected people can block it with Microsoft's IE8 Blocker until the problem is resolved.
    It's not really user friendly though and I doubt it is a good solution for inexperienced users, because the update might be necessary at some point and will not be shown again until it is manually unblocked.

    Broken:
    f4373_1248409893.png

    Working:
    1da12_1248409763.png

    Problem Reports:

    Produkt
    WallaceGromitDemo.exe

    Problem
    Funktioniert nicht mehr

    Datum
    22.07.2009 17:52

    Status
    Nicht berichtet

    Problemsignatur
    Problemereignisame: APPCRASH
    Anwendungsname: WallaceGromitDemo.exe
    Anwendungsversion: 2009.3.12.21508
    Anwendungszeitstempel: 49b9b5e5
    Fehlermodulname: ieframe.dll
    Fehlermodulversion: 8.0.6001.18783
    Fehlermodulzeitstempel: 4a0515d7
    Ausnahmecode: c0000005
    Ausnahmeoffset: 0012fa32
    Betriebsystemversion: 6.0.6001.2.1.0.256.6
    Gebietsschema-ID: 1031
    Zusatzinformation 1: fd00
    Zusatzinformation 2: ea6f5fe8924aaa756324d57f87834160
    Zusatzinformation 3: fd00
    Zusatzinformation 4: ea6f5fe8924aaa756324d57f87834160




    Produkt
    WallaceGromitDemo.exe

    Problem
    Beendet und geschlossen.

    Datum
    23.07.2009 01:38

    Status
    Nicht berichtet

    Beschreibung
    Aufgrund eines Problems kann dieses Programm nicht mehr mit Windows kommunizieren.

    Problemsignatur
    Problemereignisame: AppHangXProcB1
    Anwendungsname: WallaceGromitDemo.exe
    Anwendungsversion: 2009.3.12.21508
    Anwendungszeitstempel: 49b9b5e5
    Absturzsignatur: 4926
    Absturztyp: 128
    Auf Anwendungsnamen wird gewartet: svchost.exe:DNSResolver
    Auf Anwendungsversion wird gewartet: 0.0.0.0
    Betriebsystemversion: 6.0.6001.2.1.0.256.6
    Gebietsschema-ID: 1031
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 1: c5693575bed56805b370bc072380431d
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 2: 46cd
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 3: a21fa4be2a517bdf4e6ac9fe1228845e
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 4: 4926
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 5: c5693575bed56805b370bc072380431d
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 6: 46cd
    Zusätzliche Absturzsignatur 7: a21fa4be2a517bdf4e6ac9fe1228845e




    Produkt
    WallaceGromitDemo.exe

    Problem
    Funktioniert nicht mehr

    Datum
    23.07.2009 17:05

    Status
    Nicht berichtet

    Problemsignatur
    Problemereignisame: APPCRASH
    Anwendungsname: WallaceGromitDemo.exe
    Anwendungsversion: 2009.3.12.21508
    Anwendungszeitstempel: 49b9b5e5
    Fehlermodulname: StackHash_15ea
    Fehlermodulversion: 0.0.0.0
    Fehlermodulzeitstempel: 00000000
    Ausnahmecode: c0000005
    Ausnahmeoffset: 03d0467e
    Betriebsystemversion: 6.0.6002.2.2.0.256.6
    Gebietsschema-ID: 1031
    Zusatzinformation 1: 15ea
    Zusatzinformation 2: 31558b49dcaef01104f255155eb08c1e
    Zusatzinformation 3: 2a6e
    Zusatzinformation 4: 67d38bb9eabd9b1f79fee3b864bb495b






    Produkt
    MonkeyIsland101.exe

    Problem
    Funktioniert nicht mehr

    Datum
    22.07.2009 19:02

    Status
    Nicht berichtet

    Problemsignatur
    Problemereignisame: APPCRASH
    Anwendungsname: MonkeyIsland101.exe
    Anwendungsversion: 2009.7.6.29796
    Anwendungszeitstempel: 4a52df42
    Fehlermodulname: ieframe.dll
    Fehlermodulversion: 8.0.6001.18783
    Fehlermodulzeitstempel: 4a0515d7
    Ausnahmecode: c0000005
    Ausnahmeoffset: 0012fa32
    Betriebsystemversion: 6.0.6001.2.1.0.256.6
    Gebietsschema-ID: 1031
    Zusatzinformation 1: 9c72
    Zusatzinformation 2: 64a63c849784a033a9bf745993abbdaa
    Zusatzinformation 3: 2ad1
    Zusatzinformation 4: 999b30fe67a078fa00446f6c82bb717d



    Produkt
    MonkeyIsland101.exe

    Problem
    Funktioniert nicht mehr

    Datum
    22.07.2009 19:03

    Status
    Nicht berichtet

    Problemsignatur
    Problemereignisame: APPCRASH
    Anwendungsname: MonkeyIsland101.exe
    Anwendungsversion: 2009.7.6.29796
    Anwendungszeitstempel: 4a52df42
    Fehlermodulname: ieframe.dll
    Fehlermodulversion: 8.0.6001.18783
    Fehlermodulzeitstempel: 4a0515d7
    Ausnahmecode: c0000005
    Ausnahmeoffset: 0012fa32
    Betriebsystemversion: 6.0.6001.2.1.0.256.6
    Gebietsschema-ID: 1031
    Zusatzinformation 1: 9c72
    Zusatzinformation 2: 64a63c849784a033a9bf745993abbdaa
    Zusatzinformation 3: 2ad1
    Zusatzinformation 4: 999b30fe67a078fa00446f6c82bb717d
  • medinternmedintern
    edited July 2009
    Ah, thanks DjNDB. Think I will just run the game without the internet connection working, as uninstalling IE8 is too much work for me. But hopefully, this will get Telltale on the correct fix.
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    medintern wrote: »
    Ah, thanks DjNDB. Think I will just run the game without the internet connection working, as uninstalling IE8 is too much work for me. But hopefully, this will get Telltale on the correct fix.

    That's a good solution i guess. Might not work with the treasure hunt though, because it sends data to the website, and i don't think it will do that at a later point without starting the game.

    I am confident that this information will be valuable for telltale and help them to debug the issue.

    I wonder if this also occurs in Windows XP with the same IE8 version.
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    @Shauntron
    Speaking of the Internet Explorer.

    Are you guys at TTG prepared for the Windows 7 release in October?
    In Europe it will be delivered without any Version of Internet Explorer.
    Since the Launcher depends on it the game would not work on European systems unless the Internet Explorer is installed manually.
    That could lead to a lot of angry support requests by people getting forced to install it, if it's not dealt with carefully.

    Because of that and the dependency on specific versions as this bug shows you might want to consider developing a new launcher, maybe one that checks whether a minimal browser/HTML-renderer provided by you is installed and otherwise downloads it.

    EDIT 1: There is a chance that the Internet Explorer will be installed anyway, but can be deactivated. Whatever that means.
  • quesofreakquesofreak
    edited July 2009
    I'd like to add my experience, running ToMI on a Dell Vostro 1500, Chrome browser, WinXP, and Directx9.0c.

    ToMI was working fine this morning. I played the game a bit in the jungle, and then tried the "treasure hunt" minigame. I got the first map, and went to the site to see the exclusive background treasure.

    When I tried to load ToMI later, it would freeze on a white screen after the Lucasarts and TellTale logos come up, before the menu screen appears.

    Now, it only loads as DjNDB suggests: when I unplug my internet wire.

    Is it possible that the Treasure Hunt feature is crashing the game at the menu?
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited July 2009
    quesofreak wrote: »
    Now, it only loads as DjNDB suggests: when I unplug my internet wire.

    Is it possible that the Treasure Hunt feature is crashing the game at the menu?

    I don't feel like speculating at this point. What is your Internet Explorer Version?
  • medinternmedintern
    edited July 2009
    DjNDB wrote: »
    That's a good solution i guess. Might not work with the treasure hunt though, because it sends data to the website, and i don't think it will do that at a later point without starting the game.

    I am confident that this information will be valuable for telltale and help them to debug the issue.

    I wonder if this also occurs in Windows XP with the same IE8 version.

    Yeah, treasure hunt does not work -- but hopefully your detective work will help telltale solve the problem. Thanks for all of your hard work with this.
  • BlueToxicBlueToxic
    edited August 2009
    DjNDB wrote: »
    I wonder if this also occurs in Windows XP with the same IE8 version.

    I'm also having this problem, I'm running Windows XP Professional SP3 and I have IE version 8.0.6001.18812 installed.
  • medinternmedintern
    edited August 2009
    I have just been playing the game with wireless turned off. Has telltale ever fixed this problem?
  • jbarrettjbarrett
    edited August 2009
    I'm having the same issues with W&G.

    The funny part of it is, I've played all of S&M Seasons 1 & 2, ToMI Episodes 1 & 2, and the first W&G episode FotB without issues.

    I have played many of the episodes post-install of IE8 without issue until now.

    It seemed to work for me as well once I disabled my internet connection.

    Hopefully this gets resolved.

    Thanks!
  • PikePike
    edited September 2009
    Just had the same problem here with the W&G demo on Vista Home Premium SP2 + IE8. Telltale, is there any progress on solving this?
  • JedExodusJedExodus
    edited September 2009
    Same deal, Vista Home Premium 64-Bit, will show the Telltale and Aardman logo if lucky then throw me out, works fine with the internet connection disabled though. Don't have this problem with TOMI though, it's a shame cos i'm on a Telltale binge at the moment and just finished Sam & Max Season 2 and wanted to dip into W&G's demo just to see how well our Yank friends got on with the British humour
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited September 2009
    JedExodus wrote: »
    Same deal, Vista Home Premium 64-Bit, will show the Telltale and Aardman logo if lucky then throw me out, works fine with the internet connection disabled though. Don't have this problem with TOMI though, it's a shame cos i'm on a Telltale binge at the moment and just finished Sam & Max Season 2 and wanted to dip into W&G's demo just to see how well our Yank friends got on with the British humour

    Luckily the bug seems to be restricted to the Demo only.
    I did not run into the problem with any W&G Episode or other TTG Series even after reinstalling Internet Explorer 8.
    Your best option is to start the demo without internet connection.
  • JedExodusJedExodus
    edited September 2009
    DjNDB wrote: »
    Luckily the bug seems to be restricted to the Demo only.
    I did not run into the problem with any W&G Episode or other TTG Series even after reinstalling Internet Explorer 8.
    Your best option is to start the demo without internet connection.

    Cheers, as long as it's only the demo affected then happy days, now I just need to morally justify another spending spree
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited September 2009
    JedExodus wrote: »
    Cheers, as long as it's only the demo affected then happy days, now I just need to morally justify another spending spree

    Having fun is a great justification.
  • JedExodusJedExodus
    edited September 2009
    DjNDB wrote: »
    Having fun is a great justification.

    Touché
  • MolborkMolbork
    edited September 2009
    I get the same crash, with my 4850 vid card on XP.

    Does the actual game(not demo) do this?
  • DjNDBDjNDB Moderator
    edited September 2009
    Molbork wrote: »
    I get the same crash, with my 4850 vid card on XP.

    Does the actual game(not demo) do this?

    Not on my system.
  • BugenBugen
    edited October 2009
    Another report, since it threw me off, too: I'm running XP with IE8, on a Dell laptop which came with an nVidia "Quadro NVS 110M" graphics adapter. I didn't even think of disconnecting from the Internet until I saw this thread.

    ToMI episode 1 worked without a hitch, and the only other Telltale game I have at the moment is the retail CD release of Sam & Max Season 1. (The demoes I've tried of season 2 and SBCG4AP haven't caused any trouble, though -- this seems to be the odd exception.)
  • NagiTheNeuroticNinjaNagiTheNeuroticNinja
    edited October 2009
    Seems that the main problem of this stems from digital purchases,mine being from direct2drive, leaving the download manager or in other cases, background updaters and bit torrent dna from other updaters and shields for online games being locked in registry. I use a modem/router through my isp, it's an updated dsl service link in texas through windstream, it seems these problems started for me when they doubled the connection speed on their entire network(couple other isps did as well as soon as it became an option) and the router uses mac specific filters and firewalls. I believe this coupled with intense download rates and the key check that digital services use to verify authenticity of the key for optional application updates and whatever else you sign up for without reading small print(non personal system specs for use with error database and technical doccumentation aren't the major issue..) Simply put the clients through direct2drive seem to see this issue frequently when they use the key interface instead of dlm verification. I believe the resolution may just to be to pause downloads and uploads while booting the app,seems to work for me(also saves you from having to restart downloads if you use ie without any resume interface) but until these services decide on a more stable means for product verification the users suffer for their dumb decisions. I don't need to go into detail here but please let me know if this is the same for the rest of you.
This discussion has been closed.