Fables is now public domain, claims Willingham
I dont know if it holds weight or if its a last ditch effort from Bill. We'll see where it goes !
https://billwillingham.substack.com/p/willingham-sends-fables-into-the
Update: DC responds that it is in fact not Publi Domain. We'll see where it goes from here
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Reading his statement is interesting for sure. Pretty sizeable chunk is about frustrations with Telltale and DC but it also is kind of vague about what exactly happened. Sounds kind of like DC licensed Fables without him having any input and not paying him correctly for Wolf Among Us. But it seems his main gripe is far more related to DC running things past him and wanting to change deals than Telltale.
I think main takeaway is copyright sounds like a huge mess. I do wonder if this means anything for Wolf 2. I think the main issue with this statement is I am like 90% sure Wolf is its own IP and wouldn't be considered public domain. Like how Gearbox and 2K had to buy back the Tales license even though they own Borderlands.
I think the best thing I can think coming out of this is maybe some former Telltale staff will release some original Wolf 2 stuff? Probably not because it seems most likely the reason a ton of Stranger Things stuff came out and not Wolf was simply because Wolf was barely even starting production.
...Well, this is interesting.
Time to make my own The Wolf Among Us, with blackjack and hookers.
Pretty sure it already has those. Well, OK, it's not so bad as to have blackjack.
So, uh, let me know when I can legally download the complete Fables series from a legitimate site.
Ngl that's pretty based, and knowing how comicbook publishers like Marvel and DC tend to function when it comes to royalties and paying their creators, hearing that he was getting screwed over constantly isn't that big of a surprise. Good for him for being able to keep Fables IP for so long, and being able to let go of it on his own terms.
I assume this means that the Fables revival is shopped elsewhere cause I don't see a world where DC would read a statement like this and still want to do anything with him lol.
I dunno, the fables revival only got 3 issues left. HOPEFULLY they just push em out because I wanna read em and they've been delayed so many times.
Apparently the last Fables comics are still going to be same as normal with DC but I imagine that after the run is done it is over and if he wants to continue it would need to be by himself or find someone else to partner with.
Honestly kind of weird to have just been talking about why he was talking about Wolf not being canon and well I guess this was probably a major factor.
Oh I didn't know it was meant to be a 12 issue run. I thought it was a new ongoing.
Judging from the press release it seems like he legally can't do more fable stories without DC. I dunno if contract says he can only do it under tye DC label, and he obviously wont do that, or whatever the conract says but that was my understanding of the last couple paragraphs of the press release.
Introducing Fable Tales, starring totally new and original characters like Hughie Lycan and Hail Ivory.
Yeah idk it is all pretty messy. My understanding was it sounded like he was obligated to finish the current set amount of comics he already agreed on with DC. And then it would be over because I do not see DC working with him after this. I assumed after that if it is considered public domain it means he can keep making Fables comics. I think my confusion is how he would be the one who can say public domain now anyone can use it while he himself would not be allowed to do it. But I really have no idea. Could be something weird like he could continue it on his own but can't refer to it as being issue number whatever but instead a "non continuation or reboot" wink wink
As I say I think the simplest explanation is the most likely. Most likely he's written in his contract that he can only publish Fables stuff under the DC banner.
I love that this place has been in a sort of limbo for years now waiting for Wolf S2. I'm still excited but I'm starting to have a mini experience of what the half life fans were going through with half life 3
I mean it's possible it's weird though because he sounds like he's definitely still butthurt about Telltale a bit because they supposedly decided to "hide" the original S2 script from him for years (i don't think he's talking about the new one from Adhoc) and also imply DC comics still owe him 50% of the money for the Telltale game despite having been paid for the original amount promised it looks like he had to work for it though that's scummy and the frustration is kinda understandable especially when it's about money but i'm not gonna lie he also sounds like he's hard to work with if i'm being honest.
Anyway,so if we're going off from what we know and how they were to only make 3 episodes due to budget reasons i imagine then they probably had something resembling a story.
Not to mention from the developers who were working on it and were laid off at the time saying how it was going to be this super amazing game which could've just been them trying to keep face but also why lie by that point after the company went under so maybe it's not out of the possibility that we might get to see what they were working on one day.
Also i'm not sure what this means for The Wolf Among us 2 or any possible sequels the legal ramifications and implications of this have to be insanely complicated.
I think the first game was still under contract from Warner Brothers ? Unless i'm wrong,so depending on the extent of the contract they had with them they would have to honor it regardless,in theory they could probably make more games without their permission after whatever contract they're bound to or if they decide to end it but i doubt they'd be able to make money from it again i could be wrong but that's what it looks like to me.
I think the main reason anyone would "lie" about the actual quality of what Wolf 2 was going to be probably comes down to simply not wanting to bad mouth something you were working on. It is like how a studio is never going to say "This new game we are making actually isn't as good as the last one. Please buy it!" Kind of same situation. "Our whole studio got laid off and this project I was working on was vaporware and probably would have been a disappointment. Hire me!" Not exactly the best ring to your latest project when you are job hunting. Thus why sources for it being 3 episodes and believed it may have been outright canned even if the studio didn't shut down were anonymously shared with journalist.
I'm sure plenty of original devs had grand ideas for it but it honestly seems that Wolf 2 entered pre production for only like 2 months before everything fell apart. It was probably most likely a general draft was made for the story and I believe one article mentioned they were doing some very basic animation testing (as there is video of a Telltale animator doing animation listed as Bigby but it is very generic and obviously being made just for testing rather than planning out a scene.) Then there was also that one video proposing potential pause menu designs. So generally I don't think there is much to show other than if someone releases the drafts. Maybe there is some concept art out there too.
My only confusion with this public domain thing is I am pretty sure Wolf Among Us is considered its own license. So any character originating from the game would be a no go and you couldn't name your own Fables stuff Wolf Among Us. I think Telltale even said they had to license Wolf back to DC for the comic adaptation and again, similarly to how even though 2k has the Borderlands IP they did end up needing to buy Tales, it wasn't simply given to them. (Although they did use Telltale characters, but I assume a lot of this is based on agreements we may not know about plus Telltale was gone and those characters would be in a bit of a limbo at the time.)
For licensing for a Wolf 3 I think the thing about this is again, I think Wolf was always Telltale's. I think even Bill Willingham said years ago it was always Telltale's call to make another. Without ever seeing their actual agreements we don't really know. I know some reports were for how many seasons they licensed but it could be how many seasons they would simply cooperate with each other. I could be completely wrong (and I wouldn't be surprised if I was) but I do think Telltale's versions of these IPs are technically their own thus why these licenses were bought up by others to be used even though it would mean the licenses are now in hands that weren't originally assigned to when made because they technically are their own thing.
Yeah my thoughts were also that this could very well have been just kind of damage control on the devs part (like when the lots of them mentioned the Funlabs leak was totally fake and not real at all which i never fully believed honestly) i had doubts because Bill said they had a script for years that they kept from him but for all we know it could've just been a general draft of what it would look like like you said.
Maybe we'll get to see that one day who knows,i'll also take your word for what Bill said about this because i don't remember maybe Telltale will talk about this eventually but until then we really can't tell what this means for TWAU's future in case they want to make more games.
Ended up finding what I was thinking about. It was a tweet of his where he said it was not up to him but Telltale (and Warner) so I could easily be wrong. However a more recent Tweet about Wolf 2 after it was announced he said he was never kept in the loop about this stuff and after reading his article it sounds like he was upset with how Wolf ended up being licensed out. So yeah, no idea and probably not worth digging that much into without ever knowing what these contracts ever were.
And uh... Obviously the funlabs thing was an elaborate fan made fake. It just happened to end up on a company website that just happened to have worked with Telltale in the past!
Also this whole thing is just putting me down a memory hole of how many weird moments there have been leading up to this game lol
Yep, this was the expected response from DC>
https://looper.com/1395584/dc-comics-rejects-fables-creator-public-domain-claim-vows-necessary-action/
Well copyright things cannot be Public Domain unless the holder of the copyright lets it be (in this case DC holds the copyright to it) or seventy years or so years pass if I remember correctly. But Bill Willingham did allow DC to take the Fables license so that may be why he cannot do it.