So what's recognized as canon in the Telltale games?

edited May 2010 in Sam & Max
This is just something for you chronologically-obsessed Sam and Max fans. Obviously the comics are canon ("Remember that time in the Philippines?" from 202 is a direct reference to one of the first published comics), but are Hit the Road and the Animated Series canon, too? I can't find a single reference to either, or at least anything I can remember.

Comments

  • edited May 2010
    This is just something for you chronologically-obsessed Sam and Max fans. Obviously the comics are canon ("Remember that time in the Philippines?" from 202 is a direct reference to one of the first published comics), but are Hit the Road and the Animated Series canon, too? I can't find a single reference to either, or at least anything I can remember.

    I think "canon" and "Sam & Max" don't get along very well.
  • edited May 2010
    ^this

    Also, Max being President. That's the only thing canon in Sam & Max and it annoys many people. I, for one, find it amusing, but a bit overdone. Like a well-done clown at a restaurant.
  • edited May 2010
    Well, Sam & Max have Jesse James' severed hand mounted in their office, which I would consider a reference to Hit the Road.
  • edited May 2010
    StonkBad wrote: »
    Well, Sam & Max have Jesse James' severed hand mounted in their office, which I would consider a reference to Hit the Road.

    But for some reason it's the opposite hand, and in season two it seems to be missing a finger.
  • edited May 2010
    Yeah, Jesse James' hand. I feel like there was another Hit the Road reference as well, but I can't think what it is. Maybe the fact that Bosco's in the 60s sells guns, liquor and baby needs?

    I think that Hit the Road and the comic are both canon to the Telltale games, but the cartoon is so different in tone that it isn't. There's a lot of things that I made up about Sam & Max that are true to me, and that's one of them.
  • edited May 2010
    The Telltale games are really internally consistent. That's all that really matters, though. Since we're not talking about epic narrative arcs here, is "canon" really that important? Or even important at all?

    The way I see it, they reference previous adventures, but not to really say "this concretely happened" or anything along those lines. They're not building any walls that say "Because episode 6 of the animated series says THIS, they COULDN'T HAVE done ____ in Sam and Max episode 304". Other adventures seem to more vaguely exist in the past, and they'll be referenced here or there, but I wouldn't say they're tied to them.
  • edited May 2010
    The Telltale games are really internally consistent.

    And not even always that :p Like in 102 the newspaper talk about Brady Culture being arrested and sent to prison, but in 205 the Poppers seem to say they beat him to death then and there. I doubt they put a corpse in prison or that the poppers would break into prison just to beat him to death.

    And episode 204 isn't even consistent with itself :p It's a whole paradox and it's better not to thing too much about it, or you start wondering how Sam & Max finished 102 without the singing contract and other things like that, and how both realities can coexist. (Them doing it the way we played Season 1, and them re-doing it while their older self don't).
  • edited May 2010
    What follows is the basic list of canon material. All continuity errors between them can be explained with 'there is an explanation but pray you never learn it because it'd be as boring as hell'.

    The Comics
    Hit the Road
    The Animated Series
    The Big Sleep (the comic on the Telltale site)
    The Seasons and Machinimas

    Just because something's canon doesn't mean Telltale will (or even can) feature it in a game. Unless Telltale makes some serious deals with the rights holders (which would probably involve something akin to selling one's soul to a man with goat legs), they can never refer to something from Hit the Road or the animated series unless it first appeared in one of Purcell's comics. Even then, Telltale's stated that they want to avoid making references just to make hardcore fans happy.
  • edited May 2010
    Canon in Sam & Max doesn't exist. If it did, it would just get in the way. I'm pretty sure that Purcell said something to that effect in one of the numerous interviews he did recently.
  • edited May 2010
    S@bre wrote: »
    Canon in Sam & Max doesn't exist. If it did, it would just get in the way. I'm pretty sure that Purcell said something to that effect in one of the numerous interviews he did recently.
    A quick Google search yielded this interview:
    How concerned are you by the ‘canon’ of Sam & Max? ILDC wants to know where in New York Sam & Max’s office is and Snapshot asks how old the pair are meant to be. Do you know this, or does it not bother you?
    I think ‘canon’ can get in the way if you worry about it too much. A lot of people like to organize every detail in character series. For the Telltale series it’s more important to maintain a continuity from season to season. In the comics I was never concerned about it at all.
  • edited May 2010
    The events of Freelance Police have got to be canon, and can probably be applied to explain all the differences we've seen so far.
  • edited May 2010
    I just like to see the adventures of Sam and Max as totally random. That really suits the absurt humour. Besides I think references are not trying to make the story canon, they are just meant to be funny to people that reconized them.
  • puzzleboxpuzzlebox Telltale Alumni
    edited May 2010
    Avistew wrote: »
    I think "canon" and "Sam & Max" don't get along very well.

    "Cannon" and "Sam & Max" though, I could see that working out great.
  • edited May 2010
    Avistew wrote: »
    And not even always that :p Like in 102 the newspaper talk about Brady Culture being arrested and sent to prison, but in 205 the Poppers seem to say they beat him to death then and there. I doubt they put a corpse in prison or that the poppers would break into prison just to beat him to death.
    It's a side-effect of the 204 timetravelling ;).
    BiggerJ wrote: »
    Unless Telltale makes some serious deals with the rights holders (which would probably involve something akin to selling one's soul to a man with goat legs), they can never refer to something from Hit the Road or the animated series unless it first appeared in one of Purcell's comics.
    Ehm, that's not how references work. After all, if it worked like that, parodies could pretty much never exist, nor humorous adventure games.
  • edited May 2010
    How do you pronounce 'canon?'
  • edited May 2010
    Here's how I think of canonity in the Sam and max series:

    Past episodes are most important
    Past Seasons are a little bit less
    Other produced Telltale material is a little bit less
    Surfing the Highway and The Big Sleep are just a little less
    Hit the Road goes here

    I usually try to trick myself into thinking that the cartoon never happened.

    Also, another Hit the Road reference: ask about the pictures on the wall of the office in season one.
  • edited May 2010
    I consider it all canon within its own medium if that makes sense to you.... what happens in one doesn't mean it happens in the other.... but it also doesn't mean it hasn't either.
  • edited May 2010
    The only thing canon in Sam and Max for me is Rule of Funny.
  • edited May 2010
    Sam is a dog... Max is a hyperkinetic rabbity thing.. they are freelance police... they drive a DeSoto... They should look like Steve Purcell's drawings of them.
  • edited May 2010
    Avistew wrote: »
    And not even always that :p Like in 102 the newspaper talk about Brady Culture being arrested and sent to prison, but in 205 the Poppers seem to say they beat him to death then and there. I doubt they put a corpse in prison or that the poppers would break into prison just to beat him to death.

    And episode 204 isn't even consistent with itself :p It's a whole paradox and it's better not to thing too much about it, or you start wondering how Sam & Max finished 102 without the singing contract and other things like that, and how both realities can coexist. (Them doing it the way we played Season 1, and them re-doing it while their older self don't).

    Well, you can attribute the Brady Culture thing to the fact that the newspapers are shown to be inconsistent. In fact, 202 points this out-The newspapers say that Santa was arrested, and you know what really happened, as Max points out. It doesn't seem like a stretch to assume that the exact same problems occurred with Brady Culture.

    Even then, maybe muddling in time at places like Bosco's in 204 modified what happened in 101.
  • edited May 2010
    Avistew wrote: »
    And not even always that :p Like in 102 the newspaper talk about Brady Culture being arrested and sent to prison, but in 205 the Poppers seem to say they beat him to death then and there. I doubt they put a corpse in prison or that the poppers would break into prison just to beat him to death.

    Explanation: by 102, Brady had been to prison, gotten out with what little celebrity charm he had, and been killed. The newspaper was still in the box because the box had gotten stuck (and was fixed by 103). There, continuity error solved. Where's my official Telltale No-Prize?
  • PsyPsy
    edited May 2010
    I take the Terry Pratchett approach. There's no such thing as non-canon Sam and Max, just alternate timelines.
  • edited May 2010
    You can't really go wrong with the Terry Pratchett approach.
  • edited May 2010
    But for some reason it's the opposite hand, and in season two it seems to be missing a finger.

    Isn't that a reference to the comics when the pirates stole Jesse James' mummified finger? I have yet to play Season 2 or Hit the Road though so I might be missing something.
  • edited May 2010
    All canon ends up doing is getting in the way and getting retconned.
  • edited May 2010
    Power46 wrote: »
    In fact, 202 points this out-The newspapers say that Santa was arrested, and you know what really happened, as Max points out. It doesn't seem like a stretch to assume that the exact same problems occurred with Brady Culture.
    Actually, it says Santa died, upon which Max replies "No he's not, he's just sent to hell", on which Sam replies "It's better to let the kids think he's just dead".

    So no, not the same...
  • edited May 2010
    And I doubt kids really care about Brady.
  • edited May 2010
    "Because episode dysfunction of the gods from the animated series says that sam and max world uses the greek gods, they COULDN'T HAVE met Satan/went to hell in Sam and Max episode 205".


    That right there tells me either
    A. I dont know much on greek gods
    B. there is no canon from the animated series.

    Wait a minute, mac salmon was killed in the animated series(I think) which means he is alive and can return.
  • edited May 2010
    Gman5852 wrote: »
    That right there tells me either
    A. I dont know much on greek gods
    B. there is no canon from the animated series.
    C. Sam&Max are not limited by just one perception of "Gods"... expect Greek, Egyptian, Christian, Muslim, Atheist etc...
  • edited May 2010
    Can't they all be canon?
  • edited May 2010
    C. Sam&Max are not limited by just one perception of "Gods"... expect Greek, Egyptian, Christian, Muslim, Atheist etc...

    I tend to figure that dead and non-religions are more likely to be targeted.
  • edited May 2010
    Catfish33 wrote: »
    How do you pronounce 'canon?'

    This was an honest question, could anyone let me know, please? :)

    ( kannun or kaynen? )
  • edited May 2010
    I've always pronounced it the same way as cannon.
  • edited May 2010
    Sounds about right, thank you.
  • edited May 2010
    I think it's too surreal to have some sort of canon to. They are crazy, they live in a crazy universe where little makes sense. Everyone around them are crazy and bound by logic known to no man.
  • edited May 2010
    Psy wrote: »
    I take the Terry Pratchett approach. There's no such thing as non-canon Sam and Max, just alternate timelines.

    This is pretty similar to how I see it. Everything is canon, but how canon exists in relation to continuity is another thing entirely, if it even matters at all. I'm always up for an alternative timeline/universe explanation if it makes sense, and it certainly would with Sam & Max.

    Still, I think there's fun to be had in linking events or details together between the various incarnations (or separating them, as may be the case) so long as you don't take it too seriously.
  • edited May 2010
    Considering that Max's presidency, giant robot battle legislation and Jesse James's hand all remain canon until Season 3 at LEAST, I'd say Sam & Max do stick to canon pretty well, at least in the games.

    I just find it funny no references to the cartoon were made. Blocking it out, TTG?
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