304... Yes. YES. Dear GOD, YES! And after the big reveal with
Charlie Ho-Tep being the Master
, it went from awesome to, well, there isn't even a WORD for how awesome it got from there. Great job, guys. You knocked it so far out of the park that it circled all the way around the globe and hit some dude's car in the parking lot.
Funnily enough, I seem to be the only one who's been consistently impressed by each episode. After each one, my main thought has been 'how are they going to top this?' And each time it was consistently done. I think I really love how much the series has become less about being completely random and is now a proper parody- I'm a huge fan of detective stories of all kinds, from sherlock to Bogart, and this season has just really ridden on that style. I think you can be pretty out there with ideas as long as you stay true to the core wide appealing humour based in this genre, and that's exactly what this season has done, so that it's easy enough for just about anyone to get in on the fun.
Best of the Season, or best of the series as a whole?
Saying episode 304 is better than 301, 302, and 303 does it absolutely NO justice, because that's comparing something exceptional against something exceptionally bad.
On the other hand, with the rest of the series? That's hard to say. It's definitely up there, in the top three or five episodes of Sam and Max. No longer is Season Three marinating in its own failure at the very bottom of the list, the Season actually has a REALLY GOOD episode sitting on a golden throne with the rest of the greats. It had excellent puzzles, generally great use of camera angles, it had a well-done story, the humor was top-notch and intelligent in places, the whole thing finally came together wonderfully. No element was simply riding the other to half-competency, it all worked together to finally create something worth playing, which is certainly an understatement.
Out of interest, why do you consider the other episodes to be so bad? I can see that some people may not be happy with the feeling that each one isn't quite as revelatory due to this being a longer reaching story arc in comparison to other seasons, but writing and gameplay wise this season has been the strongest TellTale game to date, with or without episode 4.
Out of interest, why do you consider the other episodes to be so bad? I can see that some people may not be happy with the feeling that each one isn't quite as revelatory due to this being a longer reaching story arc in comparison to other seasons, but writing and gameplay wise this season has been the strongest TellTale game to date, with or without episode 4.
Yea, it'll be nigh impossible for telltale to top TDP if a fourth season is made.
Funnily enough, I seem to be the only one who's been consistently impressed by each episode.
You aren't!
I guess I'm wrong to love They Stole Max's Brain! more than The Tomb of Sammunmak, but this newest episode tops even that. The writing in particular was top notch.
Best of the Season, or best of the series as a whole?
Saying episode 304 is better than 301, 302, and 303 does it absolutely NO justice, because that's comparing something exceptional against something exceptionally bad.
On the other hand, with the rest of the series? That's hard to say. It's definitely up there, in the top three or five episodes of Sam and Max. No longer is Season Three marinating in its own failure at the very bottom of the list, the Season actually has a REALLY GOOD episode sitting on a golden throne with the rest of the greats. It had excellent puzzles, generally great use of camera angles, it had a well-done story, the humor was top-notch and intelligent in places, the whole thing finally came together wonderfully. No element was simply riding the other to half-competency, it all worked together to finally create something worth playing, which is certainly an understatement.
Best of the Season, or best of the series as a whole?
Saying episode 304 is better than 301, 302, and 303 does it absolutely NO justice, because that's comparing something exceptional against something exceptionally bad.
On the other hand, with the rest of the series? That's hard to say. It's definitely up there, in the top three or five episodes of Sam and Max. No longer is Season Three marinating in its own failure at the very bottom of the list, the Season actually has a REALLY GOOD episode sitting on a golden throne with the rest of the greats. It had excellent puzzles, generally great use of camera angles, it had a well-done story, the humor was top-notch and intelligent in places, the whole thing finally came together wonderfully. No element was simply riding the other to half-competency, it all worked together to finally create something worth playing, which is certainly an understatement.
And your view on 302/other best episode ever, was like what, hatred? If you think that any episode of The Devil's Playhouse isn't better than Season 1 or 2, then you are really insane.
And your view on 302/other best episode ever, was like what, hatred? If you think that any episode of The Devil's Playhouse isn't better than Season 1 or 2, then you are really insane.
Guess I'm insane then, because while I loved 302 and 304 immensely, 301 and 303 were pretty mediocre in my opinion. At least compared to Season 2, that is.
Call me easily entertained, or something more fitting, but I believe splash1 is right. I still believe I'm insane enough, though.
Even the so-called "mediocre" episodes entertained me far beyond the greatest episode of the previous seasons (btw season 1 was better than season 2, by my own comparison) simply because of its feel, improved puzzle structure, interesting new locations, interesting new CHARACTERS that are not created by the sole purpose of being funny by bashing myths or stereotypical pop culture clichés, and a better story that's less "bizarrely funny" but more "completely bizarre and more thrilling". I replayed the entire Season 2 2-3 days ago. It was great that time, I guess... But now I feel like they were nothing but stairway steps for the franchise to evolve into the thing we're getting during these months.
it was FREAKIN' AWESOME!!!!!! Personally, I don't care what the review guys at Samandmax.co.uk say, I really Loved this episode. It's the first episode that actually left me speechless with the twists and turns.... (And not just from the endings like in episodes 1 + 2). so it's not my ultimate favorite, it is definitely an episode worth having
Draw up another set of committal papers, more insanity here.
No, I don't think 304 is the best episode yet. I don't think any TDP episode could be the best IMO. While I have enjoyed the more detailed plot and "cinematic"-ness of TDP, none of that can compensate for the smaller number of puzzles and their overall lack of difficulty in comparison to those of past seasons.
There have been some brilliantly creative puzzles in TDP (even one each in 301 & 303), and I applaud Telltale for innovating new game mechanics with the Toys of Power. But they were over-used and made puzzle-solving repetitious in smaller gameworlds that lacked the interactive complexity of previous seasons.
I'm not sure 304 is even my favorite of TDP, it might be a close second to 302. Though 302 started slowly puzzle-wise, I think it ended up being the most challenging episode of the season, with the reel-switching, mole curses and a few environmental puzzles adding a degree of complexity above that provided by the toys.
Draw up another set of committal papers, more insanity here.
No, I don't think 304 is the best episode yet. I don't think any TDP episode could be the best IMO. While I have enjoyed the more detailed plot and "cinematic"-ness of TDP, none of that can compensate for the smaller number of puzzles and their overall lack of difficulty in comparison to those of past seasons.
There have been some brilliantly creative puzzles in TDP (even one each in 301 & 303), and I applaud Telltale for innovating new game mechanics with the Toys of Power. But they were over-used and made puzzle-solving repetitious in smaller gameworlds that lacked the interactive complexity of previous seasons.
I'm not sure 304 is even my favorite of TDP, it might be a close second to 302. Though 302 started slowly puzzle-wise, I think it ended up being the most challenging episode of the season, with the reel-switching, mole curses and a few environmental puzzles adding a degree of complexity above that provided by the toys.
I agree with this post entirely. 304, while it has good writing, story and puzzle creativity, is too easy to even deserve being in the top 5. 302 has been the only episode this season with good difficulty, and the only episode so far this season that is I think is awesome enough to be in the top 5 episodes. The others (including 304) have been too easy. 204 still stands at the top, with 205 closely behind. Thankfully, the ending to the last episode suggests that we might not see
I enjoyed 304, but really only for the finale. The first two acts had an interesting premise, but lacked the content, puzzles and atmosphere to back them up - possibly because most of it was designed as a bunch of red herrings for the plot twist. Also, the writing and cutscenes seemed strangely...off at times.
Without the finale, I might call it the weakest game of the season so far (which isn't actually too bad, since I've loved the other episods and enjoyed 304). Then again, I felt the same way about episode 104 of Tales of Monkey Island, which lots of people loved. Both had a very cinematic feel, tying up all of the loose plot ends but losing the focus on the gameplay in the process.
But hey, they both delivered, plot-wise.
Really loved the episode. Had much variety, kept me interested. Playing as Max was a real surprise Brillant. Hope the finale can top that, then this is my favourite season yet
Entire season's been sort of lackluster to me - funny, but the psychic toy gimmick has gotten old at this point. I thought 303 was far more fun than 304 personally, and do in fact rank 304 among the lower third of S&M episodes in terms of quality.
Best of the Season, or best of the series as a whole?
Saying episode 304 is better than 301, 302, and 303 does it absolutely NO justice, because that's comparing something exceptional against something exceptionally bad.
On the other hand, with the rest of the series? That's hard to say. It's definitely up there, in the top three or five episodes of Sam and Max. No longer is Season Three marinating in its own failure at the very bottom of the list, the Season actually has a REALLY GOOD episode sitting on a golden throne with the rest of the greats. It had excellent puzzles, generally great use of camera angles, it had a well-done story, the humor was top-notch and intelligent in places, the whole thing finally came together wonderfully. No element was simply riding the other to half-competency, it all worked together to finally create something worth playing, which is certainly an understatement.
I think you come form a HUGE majority there, Dashing.
Numbered reviews and aggregates of those numbers are crap. There is no objective science to quality, and the weight of the different rating systems is entirely disparate. An 80 in one system is equivalent to a 70, 90, or 50 in another. And in a world in which people bitch about anything below an 80 as crap reviews, in a world in which absolutely NOTHING gets scored below a 75 unless it is meant to be universally reviled, low 80s are pretty bad.
But hey, let's assume your metacritic is some sort of objective quality meter. Something with enough weight that it can make the points that win arguments. Why should we bother playing Sam and Max? Shouldn't we play the 359 games that are better than the highest-rated Season Three episode, or 257 games better than Chariots of the Dogs? Games that include the ranks of Peggle, Sims 2, Sims 3, GRID, KOTOR II?(source). Surely, if these numbers were capable of giving us an objective assessment of the quality of a game, we'd have plenty of things to bother with that aren't Sam and Max or Telltale at all.
Also, it's generally not considered "good" to fall 100 places down the list.
But hey, let's assume your metacritic is some sort of objective quality meter.
I don't think anyone pretends reviews are objective or strictly about quality. Metacritic, though, by aggregating multiple sources, is a better indicator of opinion than any single review source could be.
Shouldn't we play the 359 games that are better than the highest-rated Season Three episode, or 257 games better than Chariots of the Dogs? Games that include the ranks of Peggle, Sims 2, Sims 3, GRID, KOTOR II?
Now that's a straw-man argument if I've ever seen one. Of course choosing games along those lines would be silly. But that doesn't make it silly -- or groundless, or bad, or wrong -- to use reviews as one source of information in deciding what games to play. I do, and I know lots of other gamers who do as well.
Nah, 304 is not my favourite. I loved 302 so much more and really enjoyed even 303 that the majority seems to hate. For me the best parts of 304 were the beginning and finale (so excluding the part from getting out of the diner to let's say cloning) and these were really cool with good plot, characters and lots of humour!
Comments
Being able to directly control Max for the first time was amazing!
That was Sam in Max's body.
I can only imagine how good 305 will be.
Unless someone wants to bring out the point-and-click isn't direct control discussion out here of course.
Saying episode 304 is better than 301, 302, and 303 does it absolutely NO justice, because that's comparing something exceptional against something exceptionally bad.
On the other hand, with the rest of the series? That's hard to say. It's definitely up there, in the top three or five episodes of Sam and Max. No longer is Season Three marinating in its own failure at the very bottom of the list, the Season actually has a REALLY GOOD episode sitting on a golden throne with the rest of the greats. It had excellent puzzles, generally great use of camera angles, it had a well-done story, the humor was top-notch and intelligent in places, the whole thing finally came together wonderfully. No element was simply riding the other to half-competency, it all worked together to finally create something worth playing, which is certainly an understatement.
Yea, it'll be nigh impossible for telltale to top TDP if a fourth season is made.
You aren't!
I guess I'm wrong to love They Stole Max's Brain! more than The Tomb of Sammunmak, but this newest episode tops even that. The writing in particular was top notch.
And your view on 302/other best episode ever, was like what, hatred? If you think that any episode of The Devil's Playhouse isn't better than Season 1 or 2, then you are really insane.
I guess there's a lot of us insane people around here, then :rolleyes:
Even the so-called "mediocre" episodes entertained me far beyond the greatest episode of the previous seasons (btw season 1 was better than season 2, by my own comparison) simply because of its feel, improved puzzle structure, interesting new locations, interesting new CHARACTERS that are not created by the sole purpose of being funny by bashing myths or stereotypical pop culture clichés, and a better story that's less "bizarrely funny" but more "completely bizarre and more thrilling". I replayed the entire Season 2 2-3 days ago. It was great that time, I guess... But now I feel like they were nothing but stairway steps for the franchise to evolve into the thing we're getting during these months.
Some of the old humour seemed to be back, was there someone on the writing team for this episode that wasn't on that last three?
I won't call you anything like that - I don't have issues accepting that people might have different opinions than I do
No, I don't think 304 is the best episode yet. I don't think any TDP episode could be the best IMO. While I have enjoyed the more detailed plot and "cinematic"-ness of TDP, none of that can compensate for the smaller number of puzzles and their overall lack of difficulty in comparison to those of past seasons.
There have been some brilliantly creative puzzles in TDP (even one each in 301 & 303), and I applaud Telltale for innovating new game mechanics with the Toys of Power. But they were over-used and made puzzle-solving repetitious in smaller gameworlds that lacked the interactive complexity of previous seasons.
I'm not sure 304 is even my favorite of TDP, it might be a close second to 302. Though 302 started slowly puzzle-wise, I think it ended up being the most challenging episode of the season, with the reel-switching, mole curses and a few environmental puzzles adding a degree of complexity above that provided by the toys.
I agree with this post entirely. 304, while it has good writing, story and puzzle creativity, is too easy to even deserve being in the top 5. 302 has been the only episode this season with good difficulty, and the only episode so far this season that is I think is awesome enough to be in the top 5 episodes. The others (including 304) have been too easy. 204 still stands at the top, with 205 closely behind. Thankfully, the ending to the last episode suggests that we might not see
Without the finale, I might call it the weakest game of the season so far (which isn't actually too bad, since I've loved the other episods and enjoyed 304). Then again, I felt the same way about episode 104 of Tales of Monkey Island, which lots of people loved. Both had a very cinematic feel, tying up all of the loose plot ends but losing the focus on the gameplay in the process.
But hey, they both delivered, plot-wise.
The best episode is still Abe Lincoln Must Die.
I think you come form a HUGE majority there, Dashing.
Ep1 Metacritic: 81
Ep2 Metacritic: 83
Ep3 Metacritic: 74
In fact, Episode 1 and 2 top the rating for "The Passing", (75) the recent L4D2 campaign!
(And don't tell me about Episode 3 getting a lower score, because apparently they're ALL bad)
But hey, let's assume your metacritic is some sort of objective quality meter. Something with enough weight that it can make the points that win arguments. Why should we bother playing Sam and Max? Shouldn't we play the 359 games that are better than the highest-rated Season Three episode, or 257 games better than Chariots of the Dogs? Games that include the ranks of Peggle, Sims 2, Sims 3, GRID, KOTOR II?(source). Surely, if these numbers were capable of giving us an objective assessment of the quality of a game, we'd have plenty of things to bother with that aren't Sam and Max or Telltale at all.
Also, it's generally not considered "good" to fall 100 places down the list.
I don't think anyone pretends reviews are objective or strictly about quality. Metacritic, though, by aggregating multiple sources, is a better indicator of opinion than any single review source could be.
Now that's a straw-man argument if I've ever seen one. Of course choosing games along those lines would be silly. But that doesn't make it silly -- or groundless, or bad, or wrong -- to use reviews as one source of information in deciding what games to play. I do, and I know lots of other gamers who do as well.