Why no console version for New Zealand? We have an R18 rating.
So, guys... what's going on? Unlike the Aussies, we have an R18 rating and have R18 games on the shelf along with all the other titles. Games that haven't been rated (and were blocked from Australia) haven't had any issues here, so what's the holdup?
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Sorry, I couldn't help myself.
Chances are the best you'll be able to do will be to download the demo/trial since using a debit/credit card won't work since they are tied to the physical postal address. Of course, if you have a mate, they could buy you a psn cars for your country of choice and load it onto this UK/us account.
you have said that the game is not releasing on consoles here in AU and NZ because of classication laws, but what i don't understand is how come you have not registered the game for a classification review yet and there is no evidence on the website about the classification. so even though your worried the game may be classified, why don't you just register for the classification so that you can see for yourself if the game is banned and if it does you can re apply for the classification when the R18 bill comes into effect. the only other option is to wait until next year when the r18 bill comes into effect, but not many people could wait that long.
could you please rethink about this issue because lots of people here in Australia and New Zealand are being affected and NZ should have the game.
i will wait for your reply
thanks, mr00droidman
I don't know anything about the financial cost of the classification process; but it will certainly cost time in man hours, and having seen some parts of this game I am 100% certain it would fail the process in Australia on the basis of previous cases. It would be a waste of time and money trying (when that time is better spent on making the remaining episodes even better!)
I'm not so sure about NZ but the situation can be brought to TellTale's attention in a better way than being frankly rude to them.
There is no reason why we should miss out I don't think they should miss out either, I'm guessing you're not affected by this if your not your reply will mean nothing at all if it is true then you commenting in this thread says a lot
No it doesn't affect me, but dismissing someone's opinion as irrelevant based purely upon their geographical location is as bad as, well, restricting a game from one country based on a different country's censorship laws
Anyway, as far as I've been able to tell you can still get it online for Mac/PC so it's not like you can't find a way to play it if you're that determined...
http://www.censorship.govt.nz/industry/industry-games.html
From a supposed backwards country no less. Classic.
Cost is around $1,400. Far too much to warrant initiating a foreign fan base? Pfft.
Amazing how little yanks know bout Australasia.
First of all: I don't feel like anybody is being rude. I understand your excitement to play a game so many others are talking about. I'm sorry you can't get it on console at the moment.
Typically, our games come to New Zealand because as long as a game is not restricted in Australia, we release in both countries for the cost of just 1 rating. It's been pointed out in this thread already that we pretty much have no chance at getting an Australian rating until early 2013 (when new certification laws come into effect). That said, there IS a way to bypass the Australian rating and attempt to get a game rated directly in New Zealand (See: Mortal Kombat), but the cost of the rating must be weighed against the potential for sales in that reigon. Start by considering the cost of the title. Mortal Kombat has a better chance to make money in New Zealand because it costs roughly 55 dollars MORE than Episode 1 of The Walking Dead. That means they can sell less copies of their game than us and still make money. Even if you opt for the season pass on PSN, Mortal Kombat is still more than twice the cost of The Walking Dead. That means we need to sell a VERY high volume of games in New Zealand to justify the cost (in both time and money) of a New Zealand only rating.
So, to answer your question: It's a business decision, not a middle finger. Trust me, this is NOT an issue of us disliking our fans in New Zealand, or forgetting about them! Some people in this thread have suggested methoods for getting the game on console already, but my suggestion would be to get it on PC/mac!
At any rate, I hope this sheds some light on the issue. Again, I'm sorry that we couldn't get this game to your consoles at the same time as places elsewhere, but I just wanted to point out some reasons why and say without spoiling any potential future plans that you guys are on our radar!
Hey, BrYan - thanks for explaining.
I guess my best hope is to hold out for some time in the future when Australia might allow them through. :cool:
Thanks again for the reply.
@_BrYan_
Thanks for the response - your explanation of the rationale behind the decision is at least understandable, if still unpalatable (and I would seriously question the assumption the game would not pass muster under Australian classification). To forestall further ill-feeling, I'd suggest the "powers that be" make these details more widely known to the gaming public, especially that percentage (albeit comparatively small) resident in NZ.
While I understand this is a business decision to not release in NZ, due to our market being too small and that we are basically at the mercy of the Aus classification board here, this is still very unpalatable and would have been nicer to know prior to the release of the game, rather than the day of. Had i known, that TWD was not going to gain release in NZ, I wouldn't have been so hyped for it and probably wouldn't have followed it as closely as I did hungering to play this game.
If we are such a small market, businesswise, I can't see how we could be on the radar unless there are plans to release TWD here (and AUS) come 2013 and the change to the r rating classification to the video game industry there. Can't come soon enough in my opinion.
now i buy it thru steam at least they wont ban it there
This is pretty much exactly what I thought would be the case. At the end of the day, for a business to do something, the numbers have to add up. Otherwise you wouldn't be in business, and making these great games for us all to play!
I agree samjaza, I think this would most likely have gained certification in Australia as well, but at the end of the day the bean counters make the final decision and weigh up the costs vs profit at the end of the day. I am surprised that TTG didn't submit for certification and rather assumed, rightly or wrongly, that the would be denied certification and so didn't bother.
I just hope that this does not set a standard that other developers decide 'what's the point of the throwing money at certifying a game in Aus, they'll just refuse classification' and don't even bother trying. Yes,we are a small market comparatively, to US and EU, but surely that shouldn't stop a developer from trying.
Exactly, pretty piss-poor effort to just "assume" it wouldn't pass classification in Oz. I've always felt sorry for Aussie gamers and their ridiculous law, but now it's affecting us Kiwis too, even though it would definitely pass classification here. Funny I can watch the TV series with it's very gory scenes but can't play the cartoon-game version.
Guess there'll be a few either getting the Steam version, or using a US Live account with US points to play it then....
:mad:
http://games.on.net/article/15025/Grey_Areas_How_Postal_III_Slipped_Through_the_Net_Updated_with_Official_Response_from_ACMA
in short - is a big no no with some very large fines that can be read about here
As the chap mentioned before, there is considered a business decision here to not have the game available for download via consoles.. Admittatly I do not know all the financials in making a decision like this (man hours in prep of paper work, cost to put on XBLA etc etc) however, if there is truth in the aforementioned article about the cost to get it graded around the $2600 mark seems pretty cheap to open the game up to BOTH NZ and Aus markets for console. I can understand TTG is not a behemoth like Blizzard/Activision with streams of gold flowing into the coffers..
But for just a little cost, you could have came out with the argument "sorry guys, we got Refused Classification we are not going to mod the game. Soz" and having your fans then vent anger towards the Govt. Instead you give a pretty weak excuse and saying "we don't think it would even pass - so we didn't even bother... But but but that's not the middle finger to ya's" I mean come on.. That is a pretty lame excuse by anyone's mark..
I must admit, I am disappointed.
I meant to say a prepay visa card as they have no address tied to them, but ive heard cards can be used on diffeeent markets not sure if true however.
Thanks
Good luck
Enjoy if it works
IMaKitch
From what I've been reading, they didn't try - it wasn't banned or turned down by Australia's Classification Board, because they didn't even submit it for review - or did I miss a post somewhere?
Thats pretty much the Gist of it. That's pretty much what people are annoyed at Telltale about.
Let's put this in perspective.
Here in Australia, I can...
Slap the tits of bare chested strippers and hookers, receive a BJ from a glory hole in a strip club bathroom while taking Steroids in Duke Nukem Forever.
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I can turn my assailant's head into an exploding watermelon, being showered with blood, brain and eyeballs in Fallout3/New Vegas/Dead Island/Dead Space, Not to mention ripping men's spines out through their ass in Darkness 2 - all the while having the F and C bomb being thrown around left and right.
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I can by following the onscreen prompts and mouse movements, Interactively have on screen sex with a woman in Fahrenheit (In an Ironic twist this scene was actually removed and censored for the American version..)
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I can investigate the child molestation and rape of an underage 14 year old girl in L.A Noire
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I have complete access to the "No Russian" mission in Modern Warfare 2.
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I can Kill children in Deus Ex/Fallout1+2/Baldurs Gate.
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..yet Telltale didn't even bother trying to submit their Cel-shaded graphic adventure game.
Is this The "sales vs cost of rating" business decision they were talking about? A couple of grand tops?
Thanks for your reply however I do not accept this. Obviously you need to make money however my issue is not the game coming to AUS or NZ it was your communication. As far as I'm aware there was NO warning or press release stating that the game was not going to be released on these regions. I for one like many fans am very excited and whilst I can simply download the game of my alternate American PSN account I will not. I do not want to pay 1 cent to your company due to this unfathomable event. It's disgraceful. Only if the game is released on the AUS and NZ PSN will I purchase this game. If you had given us plenty of warning about this I would not be upset. But you got me all excited and hyped up only to tell us on a forum post that it won't be coming. Seriously disappointed.
I just wanted to say thanks. Thanks for leaving us in the dark here TTG. It's really good of you, you know? I hyped your game to friends. Anticipated it. Lost sleep wanting to play it. Now I look like a fool coz I can't even play it. Don't worry I saw your solution, however there's a small problem. I don't have a good enough PC to run the game. Again, thanks. Hopefully you'll reconsider your stance and get the product to me on my desired platform. (XBOX360)
Yours truly, A New Zealand XBOX gamer.
For far too long I, along with the rest of the Western world, have watched as Australia descended deeper and deeper into a closed, fascist society.
Your government censors art in the form of films, music and videogames. Why? Because they don't deem it appropriate for full grown adults? Sounds like book burning behavior to me.
It is time for the Aussie people rise up and take to the streets and make your government hear you.
Take back your country, Australia. Take it back! Then you, along with your New Zealand brethren, can play whatever the hell you want when you want.
Am i the only one who put these two together? yeah it sucks that you guys haven't got it yet, but its clearly only a delay.
(for the record i haven't played it yet either due to it not being on Ipad yet)
I'm an Australian who has supported and praised Telltale Games in the past. I cleared my schedule for the weekend expecting to play this game. I'd even bought the Microsoft Points in advance. It would have been nice to know this region was not part of your release plans, since we're on your radar and all.
I worry that your company's decision sets a dangerous precedent for other developers to forgo classification submission here entirely. You say that you have pretty much no chance of getting a rating in Australia, but what is this statement based on when you haven't actually attempted classification submission for the game?
I understand the financial risk of classification refusal, but I have to wonder if your decision is based on the country's reputation rather than a considered interpretation of the OFLC's guidelines. I'd be interested to know how you think the content of your game exceeds the standards of acceptability in Australia. If it's true to the source material, The Walking Dead's treatment of strong themes should be justified by context moreso than any other violent game that actually has been granted approval here recently.
I apologise if the following seems a bit rude but I have numerous issues with your post. First, it seems you are incredibly ignorant to the market and the audience in New Zealand. It costs $1431NZD to have an electronic game classified by the OFLC, which is around $1170USD at current exchange rates, which would only take ~360 copies sold to cover assuming that platform holders take their standard ~30%. If you don't think you can sell 360 copies in a country with an install base of ~100,000 Xbox 360s and ~90,000 PS3's where The Walking Dead has become a very popular TV show then you must think your product is extremely poor or you have done little to no market research and instead chose to ignore the market to save yourself the trouble.
Further more since you would have already had episode 1 classified and further episodes are released as DLC you would not need to get further episodes reclassified meaning there would be no cost to bring them over, which you would know if you had done research. Also since New Zealand and Australia have a very open relationship when it comes to Ratings, there is a discount when getting a piece of media that has been rated in New Zealand rated in Australia where you pretty much get the "Two Ratings for the price of one" that you seem to want. Having worked in getting New Zealand Television exported to Australia I can tell you this is the case.
I also find it highly unprofessional that you didn't even bother to submit for classification and didn't notify this section of the audience until a day before the official release, meaning we had been following the media released for this game and built up anticipation only to be let down. If you had bothered to look at previous classifications for Australia you would see they allowed games like Fallout New Vegas which probably has much more brutal violence and a more realistic style than The Walking Dead game.
I am disappointed to see how this was handled in such a lazy and incompetent manner. I feel sad for the hard working development team members that put hard work and effort into this game to have it ruined by business decisions made by people who couldn't be bothered doing their job. I find myself in a position where I doubt I will ever purchase another TellTale product, and I bought Jurassic Park. You are right, this is not a middle finger, it is dropping your pants and shitting on us.
With all due respect to your entitlement to make your own business decisions I would like to still state that I think this is a sorry state of an excuse.
It costs approximately $1,500NZ to classify a game in NZ according to the NZ classifications website. We all know on the NZ Playstation store this game would have retailed for around $30NZ (because Sony like to rip us off, but that's not the point) It would take only 50 copies of the game to cover the censorship fee, any copy of the game sold after that would put you back in profit. Are you seriously saying that you can't sell more than 50 copies of this game in NZ across both consoles?
According to Statistics NZ as of September 2010 there were 1,499,900 people in New Zealand between the age of 15-39, I think I can safely assume this is your targeted demographic. From that population base I'm pretty sure you'd sell your required number of copies and more.
I welcome correction in these figures if anyone can prove me wrong, however based on these figures your excuse that you can't release it here because of profitability simply doesn't wash. I think it's more to do with the fact you like to lump New Zealand in with Australia most likely because of a lazy approach to censorship rules.
You could get the censorship rating if you wanted to and it doesn't take a game with a retail price of $120 per copy to do it successfully in our market, it just takes a little effort and desire.
Edit; As posted by ConflictNZ above, I probably haven't accommodated for distributor margins and costs, but as he also pointed out it still only requires a small number of copies to be sold to cover the censorship fee.
But I thought I should also point out, that without a doubt you'll likely also be making a reasonable profit in other regions, putting the business profit argument aside. You could always just cover the censorship fee and take the $1500NZ out of your overall profit as an expense. In the grand scheme of things I'd be worried if this was the difference between you making a loss and a profit overall.
At least that way you'd be making some loyal fans and customers here instead of making them resent you and likely affect your potential future sales.
Games far more violent and gory have made certification in Aus, as others have rightly pointed out, and if the game is refused classification then fans of the series, though only from a single part of the world, wouldn't be taking their frustrations out on the developer, but on a government who has archaic beliefs about censorship.
I understand from Bryan's post that there are 'future plans' in store for us, but waiting for the classification rating to change in 2013 may well be too late as those fans will not wait another 10 months or so to play this game, they will either get it off steam or the TTG store for PC (still illegal to sell unrated games in Aus though) or through other region PSN stores, where you would likely get it for half the price as we would pay here in NZ/AUS (being that I expect TWD to retail for somewhere between NZ$10-15 per episode).