You know what? I'm sick of this.
All these people here who go around saying "all I care about is survival" and "I hope this guy dies and I don"t care" and other things like, just, fuck 'em.
On the TV show, Dale's death hit me so goddamn hard. "Losing our humanity, that's a choice". When Dale died, those words really drove home with me. So you know what? I'm nice to everyone. I save everyone. I care about everyone. and I'll be damned if I'm going to turn into fucking Shane Walsh(asshole) and drop a salt lick on a living man's head, kill a man after I broke his entire life, Force a man to shoot his own son, agree with a crazed bitch, or let Ben die because of fucking goddamn Kenny. I'm sick of Kenny. Ben does not deserve to die. And I'll kill off every walker in America before I let Doug die for nothing. I'm done with this "Survival of the fittest" shit. We keep our humanity.
On the TV show, Dale's death hit me so goddamn hard. "Losing our humanity, that's a choice". When Dale died, those words really drove home with me. So you know what? I'm nice to everyone. I save everyone. I care about everyone. and I'll be damned if I'm going to turn into fucking Shane Walsh(asshole) and drop a salt lick on a living man's head, kill a man after I broke his entire life, Force a man to shoot his own son, agree with a crazed bitch, or let Ben die because of fucking goddamn Kenny. I'm sick of Kenny. Ben does not deserve to die. And I'll kill off every walker in America before I let Doug die for nothing. I'm done with this "Survival of the fittest" shit. We keep our humanity.
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Comments
What if Kenny was choking Ben to death, and the only option would be to kill Kenny to save Ben's life. What would you do?
Also I thought Lilly just needed compassion. She lost her mother, father and consequently became mentally unstable and untrustworthy of group members. She just needed support for the tough time. :c
I guess it's all about perspective!
There is no humanity when you are dead. Because you cease to BE. Surviving equals humanity and humanity is evolutionary based on the set of circumstances the human or group is living in.
If there were no survival of the fittest, it is more than likely that YOU wouldn't be here now.
Yeah, you got a point there, however, I'm pretty sure it IS possible to sirvive keeping your humanity. OP, I applaud you.
Odd, you really sound like Lilly, surviving over everything else
Humanity isnt really part of human nature, if other people are doing it yeah, but if the majority says, humanity is wrong, they will follow (e.g. crawford)
I get what your saying regarding Dale.. He was the moral fiber of the group and tried to maintain not only his humanity, but the rest of the group's as well.
However, in the end, it really didnt serve him well.. Nor did Shane's losing his.
How about Sophia? Proably the most sweet, innocent character.. She never did anyone harm. Walkers didnt care!
Point is, the humanity thing is pointless! Walkers dont care how nice or mean you are, Bandit's and Cannibles, don't care.
I think it's easy to argue over humanity when you really dont have the worries. Try waking up one day and find yourself in the middle of a ZA.. go through the same or similar things as the characters and see how long your humanity serves you!
My playthrough looks similar to yours. Some people said that episode 4 was darker than episode 3, but for me, it was much more positive. Chuck died saving people, so kudos to him. He was an alright guy. Lee took charge, kept people alive when he could. He got a doctor for Omid, so even Omid gets a reprieve. Kenny was able to pull himself together to put down the zombie kid and work on the boat. At the end with people knowing Lee's bitten, they've pulled together to save Clem. Even Ben decided he's going to try again for her.
Kenny stayed behind to work on the boat, which is great. There's someone working on the escape plan, and everyone else is going to get Clem back. (I'm actually a bit worried about people who take everyone, and leave no one behind to work on escape, but hopefully I'm wrong, and taking everyone is the "best" route.)
Sure, everyone will probably die, but there's a lot of humanity left. So for the OP, the survival of the fittest people are already the walking dead. Don't join them.
Team humanity to the end! And yes, humanity doesn't stop people from dying. It just means that there was a quality of life and satisfaction staying alive a bit longer, whereas the survival of the fittest people might as well just give up. (Look at Crawford. All survival of the fittest did was make them miserable before they died anyway.)
There's room on my boat for you
It is morals, ethics and societal norms that I think you guys are talking about...not humanity. The core of humanity is being human, living....or surviving...without that there is no such thing.
Someone can go off and forget their manners and morals but that doesn't make them less human. Makes them deviant. BUT if the majority of the population shifts and deviance is the new norm......whole different problem.
Let's face it, survival is a pipe dream for most people. I'll do my damnedest to make Clem that one exception...but when it comes to me, I'm not holding out hope. And if I'm going to die, I might as well die as someone I can be proud of.
Look at Lilly, she lost her humanity and now no longer a part of the group and winds up
Lilly lost her humanity when kenny lost his.
Don't ever mistake it any other way.
But I also saved Ben.
Survival's important, but so is your humanity. Otherwise, you're not really alive, blood pumping, sure, but... not human. It's possible to balance the two.
To become an animal that would kill, steal, rape and injure without a thought is what it would be like to lose that humanity aspect and you would be no better than a walker.
Just to be clear on my position, humanity and survival are two different things. Humanity allows you to relate to, care for and feel for someone else, it doesn't mean you'd charge blindly into 30+ walkers to save one person who you don't know or otherwise make stupid choices that would compromise you or your group.
There you go.
Honestly, I would have let Kenny do it. Reason why? Because Ben really did kill Kenny's family. In fact Ben has nearly gotten the group killed several times, and Ben isn't learning very fast. That kind of endless stupidity cannot continue forever because you can't watch Ben 24/7 to make sure he doesn't do something to get everyone killed. If he doesn't smarten up on the quick, he needs to be cut loose.
A mistake here and there, sure. But all of Ben's mistakes have been life or death. You have to think about it in different terms. You have to think about how every decision might hurt or kill someone. Each decision needs to be weighed. There is no room for carelessness. And Clementine has more smarts than Ben does. Ben is an idiot.
A strong group is necessary, you need to rely on everyone doing their job. That takes trust. Ben weakens the group. It's one thing to protect the group from outside elements. It's another to try and protect from both outside and inside elements. You are fighting two battles, and the inside element (Ben) is much more damaging because it further weakens the group. Every time the group dynamic breaks down into arguing, the group is vulnerable and exposed.
That said my Lee saved him, because that's who he is.
And you shouldn't.
You have to pick and choose.
This is why, for me, Ben got to live and that girl in Macon (ep 3) got to be a distraction.
Save the ones you can, and don't cry over the ones you can't.
If that group assualted us earlier if Ben wasn't giving them supplies, it all could have played out very similar minus Carly's death IMO.
Of course one always picks the welfare of the whole over the individual in most survival situations but you cannot lose your humanity or you already lost since that is what separates us from the beasts and the walkers.
I always felt like doing the right thing, but the choices started to blur... beating someone to his near death with my bare hands, killing someone trapped in a bear trap in cold blood? Where am I heading... and I really asked myself.
I jumped at Chuck for telling me how to deal with Clem, even though he was right and beat the crap out of Kenny for being in denial about Duck's imminent death. I became more and more temperamental and felt caught at more and more occasions.
Episode 4 now was a different thing. I had accepted the impossibilties to save others, I was shown just how little I was able to teach that little girl, given that I was going by our RL society... and suddenly every decision I made felt wrong.
And then came Ben... dangeling on Lee's wrist... I decided I will not change who I was, and won't submit to what my Lee has become. I pulled him up... and now - it feels wrong.
In the end there was Kenny, saying he was unable to come, wanting me to beg. That's when I finally snapped, telling him to fuck off! The first decision in a long time that felt good!
Choices might not matter to everyone on these forums... for me they do. A great game!
I've read it's getting a disc once the last episode is out... if it's true, I'm definitely getting it.
they ought to include more then just the five episodes on the disc like commentarys or alternate endings or a cutscene film viewer based on your decisions
As ofr the second, it's an unlikely scenario. Am I behind an unclimable fence through which I can shoot? Is it certain Ben is dying? How clear is Ben's culupability for the deaths he feels guilt over?
Have I told Ben how much danger he's putting himself in by telling Kenny what he did (and what was that, exactly?)? If yes, then he's taking responsibility for his actions, and by killing Kenny here I'd be supporting Ben's decsision to tell him, something I had previously and completely opposed.
In TWD, the game, we're living in a world where it can be the height of irresponsibility and complicity in murder not to execute another human being. It may be right to let Ben accept the consequences of his decision to tell Kenny. After all, Ben presumably wants to be punished. He wanted me to drop him during our narrow escape, but DIDN'T HAVE THE GUTS to simply jump down into the pack of walkers. He's the kind of guy who commits suicide by cop, letting some poor bastard take the guilt for his death because he doesn't have the courage of his own convictions.
If he simply wants to come clean, why not leave Kenny a letter of confession to find after Ben has left the group? It's clear Ben wants to be punished. Why should I interfere at this point? If I kill Kenny, talk about enabling a drama queen!