Is Telltale trying to show us being un-moral is necessary to survive?
I really think that is one of the biggest lessons so far in season 2.
(I think) Telltale is trying to show us that there are benefits to being the "Bad guy". If we steal the watch in episode 1, in episode 2 it is shown that the watch can help benefit the way Nick looks at you. (If you give it to him, he appreciates it because it was Pete's watch.)
Then, if you refuse to give the dying man water, you can choose to give it to someone else in episode 2.
Now my point is, I think the huge lesson telltale is trying to give, is that in order to survive we have to be the bad ones.
What do you think? Do you think that's what they're trying to prove?
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I don't know what refusing water or stealing a watch have to do with survival.
I guess I worded that part wrong. What I mean to say, is that doing the bad things, actually turn out to be better. When compared to season 1, that is opposite.
Not all the time. Telltale's point is not to be a "goody-two-shoes" too much. Sometimes being too nice can have punishing results in real life.
I think they're trying to be realistic. In the world we live in, sometimes doing the good thing isn't always the right one when push comes to shove. It's unfortunate, but is also how things are. And it'd definitely be amplified in a zombie apocalypse, or in any desperate situation for that matter. Although of course I wish this wasn't true.
Yeah, but it seems so far in season 2, one of the points were showing bad is better.
Sometimes the bad choice is the necessary choice. They are pushing that point this season it seems, but it was prevalent in season one also. Even though there were no/little repercussions for choosing the 'good but wrong' choice in season one. When they say our choices matter more this season I believe this is why those choices will matter more.
Yeah, that could be why they have gone on that route so far.
Good point. Never thought of it like that.
I do like the idea of bad things happening to those who choose the morally correct option. Like those who chose to protect Alvin got pistol whipped by Carver.
I'm not sure if I personally approve of a game that subliminally informs its player that being an asshole is the only way to succeed in life. I've always despised Oliver Stone's WALL STREET for roughly the same reason.
What could you do with the water?
If you saved Pete, you could give it to him, while he is dieing.
And, (I'm not sure on this one) If you saved Nick, then I think you can give the water to Rebecca at a later time. (Like I said, I could be completely wrong on that one.)
Telltale attempts to place faith in players' hands to mold Clementine's destiny --or route, in any event-- determining between grey and greyer.
Fuck Wall Street.
But.. being an ass hole is fun.
What helps prove your point, is Walter and Matthew's scenarios, they are both very nice and end up dying because of it, Matthew trusting Luke and Clem enough to lower his guard and Walter giving Bonnie supplies and sending her off without knowing of her true intentions gets him killed and the whole group captured.
No, playing hide and seek is fun. Being an asshole will just get you killed.
The appeal of a lot of the conflict isn't about choices being one-dimensionally good or evil. It's about finding the balance between grey morality and realistic consequences. e.g. Giving a someone your last bit of food is a generous sentiment, but you're obviously not going to have those supplies for use later on.
I do find the watch choice a bit ironic though. Didn't see any immediate reason to take it apart from the intent of stealing it.
Every episode is going to give you an option to retain an item. Ep1 was the water. Ep2 was the watch.
By Ep5 you'll have to combine 5 items to make the zombie cure.
Depends more on how you are an ass hole, less on just being an ass hole.
I think that's a walking dead theme period
You just watch... the 4th or 5th episodes will have all your choices flung back at you, It might seem like being the bad guy is good right now.. but you might regret it later. In my play through i try to make the Selfless choices so i dont feel regret when the journey is over.
Yes, especially with the Bonnie part.
So the watch is an ingredient? Cool
Cool profile pic, is that from FF?
Yeah, I, like 90% of peeps, left it.
this has been a recurring theme in post apocalyptic fiction since the beginning of time
Thanks.
Tina/Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI), as depicted in Dissidia 012 Final Fantasy.
Original artwork: oka (a.m.)
You're welcome ;D Dissidia was an awesome game btw
In real world today unmoral things are sometimes way to survive and in zombie apopyse sure really zone in on that aspect. The writers said themselves plan is to give you hope then take it away quote from writers. Two games this year(2013) gave me this feel TWD and TLOU and minute something bad happened enjoyed game more then understood anything could happen at anytime this world is merciless. Suicide theme shocked me could'nt believe a game with play with such sensitive subject and the tension and fear heighten for me Then knew mentality this game not scared to do anything excited me for remaining chapters like games that make world gritty more realistic like film dark knight my favorite film but also do in intelligent way not all shock factor which i appreciate.
There's no ulterior agenda from Telltale. These moral quandaries are just staples of survival fiction, The Walking Dead universe and RPGs in general.
There is being moral and their is being stupid. Walt was just stupid with Bonnie.
Also their are times when being moral is smart, if your being purely psycho Nick and Alvin will be dead
I got Clem pistol whipped in the stomach to save Alvin's life. Clem is still alive, and so is Alvin.
Things aren't black and white they are actually gray so taking the watch doesn't necessarilly mean it's bad.
One of my big complaints about Season 1 was that you could play a 100% goody two-shoes from start to finish and never really suffer for it.
Refuse to smash in Larry's head? Kenny does it for you and takes all the blame.
Refuse to take the supplies from the stranger's car? You're overruled and the supplies get taken anyway, again allowing you all the benefit and none of the blame.
Shoot the woman in the beginning of Episode 3 in order to put her out of her misery? You've still got plenty of time to snap up lots of supplies anyway.
And so on. A zombie apocalypse is all about the moral quandaries and sometimes having to suffer for doing the right thing, so I hope there are a lot more choices in Season 2 that benefit you for acting like a selfish jerk and punish you for acting like a selfless saint. Not that they should all be like that, but enough so that you're repeatedly left feeling ambivalent about which choice is the 'right' one.
Yeah i agree it was good to have consequences. I still think Alvin should be shot cannon if you give yourself up. I dont get how the two guards just let clem run up like that.