even though they were never seen talking in Season 1, except for one time in which she told him that Duck was sick, and he brushed her off by telling her to get on the train.
I know this isn't important but he speaks to her when they first meet at Hershel's farm, he can also speak to her in the meat locker saying "we need you Clementine" or "this will help us get back home" when she says she wants to go home. Also in Crawford, Clem happily says "your back!" probably directed at both Kenny and Lee in which Kenny replies to her saying something like "yeah we did pretty good too" so there is more than once he does speak to her but yes they didn't interact much in season 1. She had Lee for that obviously and in season 2 i always felt that Kenny saw her/started seeing her as his own daughter when he mistakenly called her Duck.
I don't think jealous is the word for Jane but i do feel she wasn't happy that Clem seemingly didn't want to leave Kenny and go with her so she resorted to what she did as her way of kind of forcing Clem to leave him
but Kenny and Clementine's friendship.
Kenny became obsessed with Clementine, even though they were never seen talking in Season 1, … moreexcept for one time in which she told him that Duck was sick, and he brushed her off by telling her to get on the train. Could he have been attempting to replace Duck? It's likely, because we see that he lost most interest on Clementine as soon as AJ was born. I'm not taking that as friendship—especially since some players were waiting to get away from him as soon as possible—unless you make Clem follow him everywhere and let him make decisions for her and for Rebecca's baby.
I don't think Jane was jealous of Kenny. She was genuinely trying to get her to see how dangerous being around him was. Of course, that's a matter of opinion, but I can't see it any other way. I explicitly want to state that it doesn't mean Kenny wasn't doing what he thought was best for the two kids.
Oh, I actually appreciate you mentioning all those times! I had legitimately forgotten about them, so now Kenny being attached to Clementine feels ~a little~ more natural. It kind of makes sense that they didn't interact much, because a nine-year-old girl and a commercial fisherman can't have a lot of things in common, but still, she was seen talking to Glenn, Katjaa and Lilly.
I like how you described how Jane felt toward Kenny and Clem's relationship. I agree, for the most part. I don't think Jane wanted Clementine for herself just because; something makes me think that she wouldn't have cared if Clem had been with Lee at the time.
even though they were never seen talking in Season 1, except for one time in which she told him that Duck was sick, and he brushed her off b… morey telling her to get on the train.
I know this isn't important but he speaks to her when they first meet at Hershel's farm, he can also speak to her in the meat locker saying "we need you Clementine" or "this will help us get back home" when she says she wants to go home. Also in Crawford, Clem happily says "your back!" probably directed at both Kenny and Lee in which Kenny replies to her saying something like "yeah we did pretty good too" so there is more than once he does speak to her but yes they didn't interact much in season 1. She had Lee for that obviously and in season 2 i always felt that Kenny saw her/started seeing her as his own daughter when he mistakenly called her Duck.
I don't think jealous is the word for Jane but i do feel she wasn't happy that Clem seemingly didn't want to le… [view original content]
Oh, I actually appreciate you mentioning all those times! I had legitimately forgotten about them, so now Kenny being attached to Clementine feels ~a little~ more natural. It kind of makes sense that they didn't interact much, because a nine-year-old girl and a commercial fisherman can't have a lot of things in common, but still, she was seen talking to Glenn, Katjaa and Lilly.
No problem lol. It's easy enough to forget. We have to remember that originally Kenny was always going to die saving Ben/Christa before they made a U-turn and brought him back for S2 so this is probably another reason they didn't have Kenny and Clem interact much in S1. Another thing to mention although again not important, we could assume they built on some sort of relationship off screen during the 3 month time gap. A lot of Kenny and Clem's sudden relationship in S2 is more realistic due to her friendship with Duck and she liked Katjaa and so obviously cared about Kenny as well through them.
I like how you described how Jane felt toward Kenny and Clem's relationship. I agree, for the most part. I don't think Jane wanted Clementine for herself just because; something makes me think that she wouldn't have cared if Clem had been with Lee at the time.
You could say that Jane saw Clem as a replacement for her sister just the same as Kenny thinks of Clem as his daughter replacing Duck. Damn i really really wish i could have seen how Lee would react to Jane's character as a whole as well as what she did at the end and I'm pretty certain if he were still around he would have definitely helped Kenny a lot more and calm him down at times.
Yeah i think Jane just didn't want to be alone and she went about getting what she wanted in a stupid and dangerous way. I think if you choose the alone ending and leave Jane she begs Clem not to go and says something like "I can't do this alone" where as with leaving Kenny (in the alone ending) he accepted Clem's decision pretty much straight away.
Oh, I actually appreciate you mentioning all those times! I had legitimately forgotten about them, so now Kenny being attached to Clementine… more feels ~a little~ more natural. It kind of makes sense that they didn't interact much, because a nine-year-old girl and a commercial fisherman can't have a lot of things in common, but still, she was seen talking to Glenn, Katjaa and Lilly.
I like how you described how Jane felt toward Kenny and Clem's relationship. I agree, for the most part. I don't think Jane wanted Clementine for herself just because; something makes me think that she wouldn't have cared if Clem had been with Lee at the time.
I cannot believe I didn't see this post until it got necrobumped. You my friend, have crafted the perfect Kenny Vs Jane thread that could end all Kenny Vs Jane threads. Your points are valid and reasonable, you've made me go into deep thought, and you've change my outlook of the entire game. Props to you, man. Seriously, this thread is amazing.
Trust me I was all for Jane actually I was in the middle I just wanted the group to stay together but hearing Jane's words for 'Clem stay out of this' I knew she was up to something bad and I focused on calming Kenny.
To be honest I replayed the episode and noticed how much Jane pushes Kenny who just wants Clem and AJ safe yeah he was crazy for awhile but he lost his wife, son, second wife and then he thought he lost AJ I think Kenny deserves some peace but no Jane pushes him to attack her.
I'm not saying I hated Jane to be honest she was cool but Kenny is more trustful since I knew him so well.
I found Kenny intolerable as a character in a game and so I killed him. Obviously I can't say I'd kill a man in real life, especially given that the situation was needlessly added to have the players stumble just long enough to make the choice seem more intelligently woven than it was.
Sure, I enjoyed killing Kenny from a completely biased standpoint. But one thing I'm really growing tired of is this notion of decisions having to include a "reward/consequence" payoff. The game that still pulled off decision making the best in my opinion is undoubtedly Spec Ops: The Line. A game with a very distinctively morbid and nihilistic approach to challenging choices that don't exactly affect the progression of the plot with any real noticeable payoff's. However, I thought and pondered about them long after I finished it and still find interesting ideals hidden within them. Every facet loosely changing and prodding the player with morally impossible answers to questions that aren't even fully presented in the first place.
The reason I bring up The Line is because I find that if a game is trying to test and push the gamers reaction to the edge, it's best done with little build up and it definitely shouldn't hold the players hand through it. The predictability of the final scene was so fucking forced, I was genuinely angered by it.
Both choices may be the right ones, but I personally still prefer Jane over Kenny by far. And your words have given me that extra back up to those people who basically think I'm nuts for believing in her instead of him. Literally makes me think a different way about the game.
I'm probably insanely late but I thought I'd share my opinion on this debate.
The reason why I agree so much with the op is that I personally drew a huge connection to both characters. Though they were flawed. Both screwed up one way or another. I'll start with Kenny.
Kenny: I remember crying when I saw Kenny alive at the bunker. I felt that when I lost lee I needed someone that I knew from the start and losing Kenny (at first) had me terribly sad cause we didn't know exactly how he died. After replaying the game I realized there's only one positive thing you can do for the one character that sticks around to the end of Season 2. Sure, you could have dick sucked lily and her fatass dad. But they didn't stick around. I did feel bad for lily knowing how stressed she was but it didn't matter what I did, Kenny was the one at the end of the season and this isn't exactly Lily's fault but that's how the game was made so the one thing you could do was build up the relationship with him, both with Lee, and with Clementine. Since my replay, which I considered to be my "final draft" rather than a rough, sticking with Kenny in most situations was a rather good idea (while in others he was just outright wrong and had me neutral) Now Kenny did seem like he was losing it after sarita but in my personal life I've lost people just like him and probably reacted the same way, if not worse. I grew so close to his personality that Kenny was my #1 priority to stick by, I felt like I was safe, especially if I could fix him up. I eventually defeated my depression and I believed I could help Kenny...let go of his crazy side. But in a world like that, it was impossible. Sure he beat the shit out of that Russian kid, and though I was completely against it (I tried to comfort that FUCK) he still shot (all of us) LOL but in the end Kenny was frickin right. The man was crazy, and he had me fooled to siding with Jane for a while.
Now, onto Jane.
Jane: When I had met her I was so skeptical about her personality. I think one of Jane's main problems was that she did not get nearly as much screen time as Kenny did. Yet I grew so god damn close to her that I agreed with her on pretty much everything and we absolutely kicked ass together (I'm sure most of you did too) I was even about to leave Sara behind at the house. Why? Because the thing about Jane is, she is a mirror reflection of what I would be like if I was surviving in an apocalyptic world. Literally. Everything she said, EVEN THE PART ABOUT THE BABY PUKING lmfao believe it or not I thought to myself holy fuck, this girl is literally me. I'd be a lone wolf and I sure as hell wouldn't let people "bring me down with them" and if shit went south I'd have left like she did. That's what a survivor does, and I swear this girl had me so convinced that she was my solution to surviving that I begged to leave with her. On. every. playthrough. and she did this with only about half of the time that I knew Kenny. Now she ain't perfect. I sure as hell see myself doing something absolutely fucking retarded like her like leaving the baby locked in a car to prove a point about an insane man. Jane saved (us) 2 times I believe and when she came back to help us against the soviets it was a huge relief. but I wouldn't push Kenny around like that. The whole fight wouldn't have happened if she had just shut her Luke cock holster. I even sided with Kenny in the car cause she kept provoking a broken man, and me of all people would know what it's like to be provoked while broken, and the reactions it could siphon... but seriously. This girl was me. and I respected her until the very end.
My choice: When I had seen that me and like 30% of the players stayed with Kenny I was pretty surprised. What first came to mind was that "Damn, 70% of players actually sticked with her, probably because PUSSY or shes straight up cute or some shit like that, cuz ya know. internet" but I know a good portion of them were players that chose her because they thought she was the best chance for survival. The truth is, to me, she wasn't. She abandoned me once and I took it to heart like a little girl would (except in real life) and, should the situation ever arise where shit hits the fan, I know she'd save herself. The most humane thing she woulda done was scream "IM SORRY" while watching my 11 year old ass get ripped a new one by painful fucking zombie hands and teeth. And just like that, she'd be disappeared into the wind. That convinced me, but ONLY at the end of the story with Kenny. Now keep in mind when Jane died I was hoping so badly that Kenny just got flipped back over and I had an option to save them both. When I heard the clean stab I said fuck dude. fuck fuck fuck. one of them just had to die didn't they? I actually got so angry I was ready to shoot Kenny but I, logically, as an 11 year old with a BABY, wouldn't survive alone, so I forgave him. And after that, I had no regrets seeing the "moral ending" with Kenny. I saw a man that risked everything to get 2 kids that he didn't fucking know before the apocalypse to safety. I thought that moment when he said you should go inside with AJ was one of the bravest manliest fucking moments I've seen in a video game and if it weren't for the many drama-filled movies with choices just like the game, it would have been WIDELY recognized as one of the best moments in gaming history. That was a true hero right there. Oh, and I walked my ass into that damn city and said to my screen "Kenny, fucking hold out for a few more months and come back to me bro."
That so called insane fuck showed his spark of humanity and I will never regret saving him. Sure, had I been an adult survivor in the game, i'd have said fuck the baby from the beginning, the world had millions of em die already, would have put him out of his misery and not let him come into such a cruel world. Same goes for sara. If I had the choice to, I woulda shot the girl in between the eyes before she got ripped apart by her worst nightmare.
But Kenny...Kenny risked so much. I haven't felt this way about a game in a really long time and this man, insane or not, saved the lives of 2 children.
Jane would have left, or died trying. Let's also keep in mind she lost the fight with Kenny no matter what I chose to do. She lost. Kenny, by technical point of view...was superior.
R.I.P. Jane, you beast of a survivor you. Don't ever fuck with a man who's lost his love and hope, he'll stab you in the heart if you try him.
While it's hard to justify the trap Jane laid for Kenny, it's hard not to notice how quickly Kenny went into full-on murder mode because the universe didn't give him his desired outcome.
People die all the time and plenty of folks had to come back minus a beloved person... but Kenny (who was creeping the baby's mother out by being so fixated on it) didn't try to find out what happened, he just jumped straight to violence.
Jane is a cold one and her plan could have easily resulted in the death of the baby, so not winning any prizes here... but she proved her point about Kenny with a minimum of effort.
In terms of Jane. She was always pretty up front about thinking the group was a dumpster fire and was just passing through... but stayed on because she saw something in Clem and wanted to pass on a bit of knowledge before heading out.
And the group WAS a dumpster fire after it merged with Kenny's group. Neither was a particularly good group to begin with, but were horrible together... even worse than the S1 group with two leaders who wouldn't lead and a defacto leader no one listened to when they were hellbent on visiting murder farms.
Anywho, Jane was probably right for refusing to let me leave with her because she's not a group person.
Kenny is scary af, man. Mike is strong enough to carry huge tubs of water with ease, and he was still scared of Kenny.
Now let's go back to season 1 and think about all the stuff she saw or heard Kenny do.
Why would she form an attachment with him? Jane makes more sense.
On of my favourite things about Clementine's character is that she doesn't really behave like normal little girls in this sense. Most little girls would have likely been closest to Luke once he befriended her early in the game, Sarah or even Rebecca when she calmed down. Clementine instead found role models in the angry, unstable guy or the distant loner.
On of my favourite things about Clementine's character is that she doesn't really behave like normal little girls in this sense. Most little… more girls would have likely been closest to Luke once he befriended her early in the game, Sarah or even Rebecca when she calmed down. Clementine instead found role models in the angry, unstable guy or the distant loner.
Kenny is scary af, man. Mike is strong enough to carry huge tubs of water with ease, and he was still scared of Kenny.
Now let's go back to… more season 1 and think about all the stuff she saw or heard Kenny do.
Why would she form an attachment with him? Jane makes more sense.
On of my favourite things about Clementine's character is that she doesn't really behave like normal little girls in this sense. Most little… more girls would have likely been closest to Luke once he befriended her early in the game, Sarah or even Rebecca when she calmed down. Clementine instead found role models in the angry, unstable guy or the distant loner.
No I don't think it's that, so much as it was her natural personality. Clementine got attached more to certain people she met more than others who you wouldn't normally expect. Was pretty obvious that she missed Lee more than she did Christa in season 2 despite being with Christa for longer. When Kenny asked her to stay at Wellington, she was crying because she would never see him again. She cared about him (and Jane) more than any cabin group member at the time
Kenny is scary af, man. Mike is strong enough to carry huge tubs of water with ease, and he was still scared of Kenny.
Yeah, I was j… moreust being a little contrarian partially for the sake of it.
Now let's go back to season 1 and think about all the stuff she saw or heard Kenny do.
Why would she form an attachment with him?
I know, that was a bit of the bigger issue I had with the two of them.
Jane makes more sense.
...Eh, somewhat.
On of my favourite things about Clementine's character is that she doesn't really behave like normal little girls in this sense. Most little… more girls would have likely been closest to Luke once he befriended her early in the game, Sarah or even Rebecca when she calmed down. Clementine instead found role models in the angry, unstable guy or the distant loner.
Clementine formed an attachment with Kenny through Duck and Katja. Everyone in S1 said, did, or had done some incredibly scary things for a child to learn about or witness. Kenny's actions were attempting to do what he thought would protect his family best. When he lost them, he made some pretty horrible choices. Clementine also made some pretty horrible choices for losing her parents -- one that ultimately cost Lee his life. There's a sort of kinship and understanding there.
As a little girl, I couldn't pick Jane. She tells a story of leaving her sister behind, and leaves a newborn baby in an unknown location to have a battle royale with Kenny to 'prove' to Clementine his instability. This isn't something that needs proving, as Clem's already seen Kenny as unstable towards Ben. But what she also saw upon meeting him in the cabin is that people could overcome loss as he did with Sarita. It takes a long time, and he wasn't there completely, but he moved forward.
Kenny is scary af, man. Mike is strong enough to carry huge tubs of water with ease, and he was still scared of Kenny.
Now let's go back to… more season 1 and think about all the stuff she saw or heard Kenny do.
Why would she form an attachment with him? Jane makes more sense.
Kenny's a fighter. He never quit on anyone/anything with times were hard. When the going gets tough, the tough get going, but Jane wouldn't know anything about that. She always gave up before even trying. I liked her, but she was too weak-willed. She didn't have that DRAGON ENERGY Kenny had.
Clementine formed an attachment with Kenny through Duck and Katja. Everyone in S1 said, did, or had done some incredibly scary things for a … morechild to learn about or witness. Kenny's actions were attempting to do what he thought would protect his family best. When he lost them, he made some pretty horrible choices. Clementine also made some pretty horrible choices for losing her parents -- one that ultimately cost Lee his life. There's a sort of kinship and understanding there.
As a little girl, I couldn't pick Jane. She tells a story of leaving her sister behind, and leaves a newborn baby in an unknown location to have a battle royale with Kenny to 'prove' to Clementine his instability. This isn't something that needs proving, as Clem's already seen Kenny as unstable towards Ben. But what she also saw upon meeting him in the cabin is that people could overcome loss as he did with Sarita. It takes a long time, and he wasn't there completely, but he moved forward.
I definitely agree. I wish they'd included more opportunities to form attachments to all of the characters in S2, and I'd be lying if I said I hadn't been disappointed with the ploy for the final battle. I thought that beneath Jane to do, just as the S3 ending for her didn't fit for me.
I don't think it was beneath her but it seemed so random at that point. One moment it seemed like she was about to apologize to Kenny, then she pulls that?
huh? is the middle of a blizzard really a good time for such schemes?
I definitely agree. I wish they'd included more opportunities to form attachments to all of the characters in S2, and I'd be lying if I said… more I hadn't been disappointed with the ploy for the final battle. I thought that beneath Jane to do, just as the S3 ending for her didn't fit for me.
Comments
It's been happening a lot lately.
Kudos to you for taking the time to write all that down.
i feel glad i'm not the only one who choose jane but i feel sad/terrible for shooting kenny.... because i don't want him to go more worse ..
I know this isn't important but he speaks to her when they first meet at Hershel's farm, he can also speak to her in the meat locker saying "we need you Clementine" or "this will help us get back home" when she says she wants to go home. Also in Crawford, Clem happily says "your back!" probably directed at both Kenny and Lee in which Kenny replies to her saying something like "yeah we did pretty good too" so there is more than once he does speak to her but yes they didn't interact much in season 1. She had Lee for that obviously and in season 2 i always felt that Kenny saw her/started seeing her as his own daughter when he mistakenly called her Duck.
I don't think jealous is the word for Jane but i do feel she wasn't happy that Clem seemingly didn't want to leave Kenny and go with her so she resorted to what she did as her way of kind of forcing Clem to leave him
And this thread was necrobumped.
Fuck!
Op is still my fave user tho...
Oh, I actually appreciate you mentioning all those times! I had legitimately forgotten about them, so now Kenny being attached to Clementine feels ~a little~ more natural. It kind of makes sense that they didn't interact much, because a nine-year-old girl and a commercial fisherman can't have a lot of things in common, but still, she was seen talking to Glenn, Katjaa and Lilly.
I like how you described how Jane felt toward Kenny and Clem's relationship. I agree, for the most part. I don't think Jane wanted Clementine for herself just because; something makes me think that she wouldn't have cared if Clem had been with Lee at the time.
No problem lol. It's easy enough to forget. We have to remember that originally Kenny was always going to die saving Ben/Christa before they made a U-turn and brought him back for S2 so this is probably another reason they didn't have Kenny and Clem interact much in S1. Another thing to mention although again not important, we could assume they built on some sort of relationship off screen during the 3 month time gap. A lot of Kenny and Clem's sudden relationship in S2 is more realistic due to her friendship with Duck and she liked Katjaa and so obviously cared about Kenny as well through them.
You could say that Jane saw Clem as a replacement for her sister just the same as Kenny thinks of Clem as his daughter replacing Duck. Damn i really really wish i could have seen how Lee would react to Jane's character as a whole as well as what she did at the end and I'm pretty certain if he were still around he would have definitely helped Kenny a lot more and calm him down at times.
Yeah i think Jane just didn't want to be alone and she went about getting what she wanted in a stupid and dangerous way. I think if you choose the alone ending and leave Jane she begs Clem not to go and says something like "I can't do this alone" where as with leaving Kenny (in the alone ending) he accepted Clem's decision pretty much straight away.
the only way this could happen is someone purposely going through back pages and not seeing the date.
I cannot believe I didn't see this post until it got necrobumped. You my friend, have crafted the perfect Kenny Vs Jane thread that could end all Kenny Vs Jane threads. Your points are valid and reasonable, you've made me go into deep thought, and you've change my outlook of the entire game. Props to you, man. Seriously, this thread is amazing.
This was beautifully worded.
Trust me I was all for Jane actually I was in the middle I just wanted the group to stay together but hearing Jane's words for 'Clem stay out of this' I knew she was up to something bad and I focused on calming Kenny.
To be honest I replayed the episode and noticed how much Jane pushes Kenny who just wants Clem and AJ safe yeah he was crazy for awhile but he lost his wife, son, second wife and then he thought he lost AJ I think Kenny deserves some peace but no Jane pushes him to attack her.
I'm not saying I hated Jane to be honest she was cool but Kenny is more trustful since I knew him so well.
It's all subjective.
I found Kenny intolerable as a character in a game and so I killed him. Obviously I can't say I'd kill a man in real life, especially given that the situation was needlessly added to have the players stumble just long enough to make the choice seem more intelligently woven than it was.
Sure, I enjoyed killing Kenny from a completely biased standpoint. But one thing I'm really growing tired of is this notion of decisions having to include a "reward/consequence" payoff. The game that still pulled off decision making the best in my opinion is undoubtedly Spec Ops: The Line. A game with a very distinctively morbid and nihilistic approach to challenging choices that don't exactly affect the progression of the plot with any real noticeable payoff's. However, I thought and pondered about them long after I finished it and still find interesting ideals hidden within them. Every facet loosely changing and prodding the player with morally impossible answers to questions that aren't even fully presented in the first place.
The reason I bring up The Line is because I find that if a game is trying to test and push the gamers reaction to the edge, it's best done with little build up and it definitely shouldn't hold the players hand through it. The predictability of the final scene was so fucking forced, I was genuinely angered by it.
Both choices are right because that's a choice game so there is no 'wrong' option
The end.
Thank you for writing this. Seriously.
Both choices may be the right ones, but I personally still prefer Jane over Kenny by far. And your words have given me that extra back up to those people who basically think I'm nuts for believing in her instead of him. Literally makes me think a different way about the game.
I'm probably insanely late but I thought I'd share my opinion on this debate.
The reason why I agree so much with the op is that I personally drew a huge connection to both characters. Though they were flawed. Both screwed up one way or another. I'll start with Kenny.
Kenny: I remember crying when I saw Kenny alive at the bunker. I felt that when I lost lee I needed someone that I knew from the start and losing Kenny (at first) had me terribly sad cause we didn't know exactly how he died. After replaying the game I realized there's only one positive thing you can do for the one character that sticks around to the end of Season 2. Sure, you could have dick sucked lily and her fatass dad. But they didn't stick around. I did feel bad for lily knowing how stressed she was but it didn't matter what I did, Kenny was the one at the end of the season and this isn't exactly Lily's fault but that's how the game was made so the one thing you could do was build up the relationship with him, both with Lee, and with Clementine. Since my replay, which I considered to be my "final draft" rather than a rough, sticking with Kenny in most situations was a rather good idea (while in others he was just outright wrong and had me neutral) Now Kenny did seem like he was losing it after sarita but in my personal life I've lost people just like him and probably reacted the same way, if not worse. I grew so close to his personality that Kenny was my #1 priority to stick by, I felt like I was safe, especially if I could fix him up. I eventually defeated my depression and I believed I could help Kenny...let go of his crazy side. But in a world like that, it was impossible. Sure he beat the shit out of that Russian kid, and though I was completely against it (I tried to comfort that FUCK) he still shot (all of us) LOL but in the end Kenny was frickin right. The man was crazy, and he had me fooled to siding with Jane for a while.
Now, onto Jane.
Jane: When I had met her I was so skeptical about her personality. I think one of Jane's main problems was that she did not get nearly as much screen time as Kenny did. Yet I grew so god damn close to her that I agreed with her on pretty much everything and we absolutely kicked ass together (I'm sure most of you did too) I was even about to leave Sara behind at the house. Why? Because the thing about Jane is, she is a mirror reflection of what I would be like if I was surviving in an apocalyptic world. Literally. Everything she said, EVEN THE PART ABOUT THE BABY PUKING lmfao believe it or not I thought to myself holy fuck, this girl is literally me. I'd be a lone wolf and I sure as hell wouldn't let people "bring me down with them" and if shit went south I'd have left like she did. That's what a survivor does, and I swear this girl had me so convinced that she was my solution to surviving that I begged to leave with her. On. every. playthrough. and she did this with only about half of the time that I knew Kenny. Now she ain't perfect. I sure as hell see myself doing something absolutely fucking retarded like her like leaving the baby locked in a car to prove a point about an insane man. Jane saved (us) 2 times I believe and when she came back to help us against the soviets it was a huge relief. but I wouldn't push Kenny around like that. The whole fight wouldn't have happened if she had just shut her Luke cock holster. I even sided with Kenny in the car cause she kept provoking a broken man, and me of all people would know what it's like to be provoked while broken, and the reactions it could siphon... but seriously. This girl was me. and I respected her until the very end.
My choice: When I had seen that me and like 30% of the players stayed with Kenny I was pretty surprised. What first came to mind was that "Damn, 70% of players actually sticked with her, probably because PUSSY or shes straight up cute or some shit like that, cuz ya know. internet" but I know a good portion of them were players that chose her because they thought she was the best chance for survival. The truth is, to me, she wasn't. She abandoned me once and I took it to heart like a little girl would (except in real life) and, should the situation ever arise where shit hits the fan, I know she'd save herself. The most humane thing she woulda done was scream "IM SORRY" while watching my 11 year old ass get ripped a new one by painful fucking zombie hands and teeth. And just like that, she'd be disappeared into the wind. That convinced me, but ONLY at the end of the story with Kenny. Now keep in mind when Jane died I was hoping so badly that Kenny just got flipped back over and I had an option to save them both. When I heard the clean stab I said fuck dude. fuck fuck fuck. one of them just had to die didn't they? I actually got so angry I was ready to shoot Kenny but I, logically, as an 11 year old with a BABY, wouldn't survive alone, so I forgave him. And after that, I had no regrets seeing the "moral ending" with Kenny. I saw a man that risked everything to get 2 kids that he didn't fucking know before the apocalypse to safety. I thought that moment when he said you should go inside with AJ was one of the bravest manliest fucking moments I've seen in a video game and if it weren't for the many drama-filled movies with choices just like the game, it would have been WIDELY recognized as one of the best moments in gaming history. That was a true hero right there. Oh, and I walked my ass into that damn city and said to my screen "Kenny, fucking hold out for a few more months and come back to me bro."
That so called insane fuck showed his spark of humanity and I will never regret saving him. Sure, had I been an adult survivor in the game, i'd have said fuck the baby from the beginning, the world had millions of em die already, would have put him out of his misery and not let him come into such a cruel world. Same goes for sara. If I had the choice to, I woulda shot the girl in between the eyes before she got ripped apart by her worst nightmare.
But Kenny...Kenny risked so much. I haven't felt this way about a game in a really long time and this man, insane or not, saved the lives of 2 children.
Jane would have left, or died trying. Let's also keep in mind she lost the fight with Kenny no matter what I chose to do. She lost. Kenny, by technical point of view...was superior.
R.I.P. Jane, you beast of a survivor you. Don't ever fuck with a man who's lost his love and hope, he'll stab you in the heart if you try him.
I expect a backlash from Jane fans after your post even though your post was very honest and entirely based on your opinions
While it's hard to justify the trap Jane laid for Kenny, it's hard not to notice how quickly Kenny went into full-on murder mode because the universe didn't give him his desired outcome.
People die all the time and plenty of folks had to come back minus a beloved person... but Kenny (who was creeping the baby's mother out by being so fixated on it) didn't try to find out what happened, he just jumped straight to violence.
Jane is a cold one and her plan could have easily resulted in the death of the baby, so not winning any prizes here... but she proved her point about Kenny with a minimum of effort.
In terms of Jane. She was always pretty up front about thinking the group was a dumpster fire and was just passing through... but stayed on because she saw something in Clem and wanted to pass on a bit of knowledge before heading out.
And the group WAS a dumpster fire after it merged with Kenny's group. Neither was a particularly good group to begin with, but were horrible together... even worse than the S1 group with two leaders who wouldn't lead and a defacto leader no one listened to when they were hellbent on visiting murder farms.
Anywho, Jane was probably right for refusing to let me leave with her because she's not a group person.
I dunno, if you were a little girl would you pick the unstable violent man or the "cool older sister" to look after you?
Just saying.
I dunno. If you were a little girl would you pick the determined uncle or the self-righteous ditcher chick to look after you?
Kenny is scary af, man. Mike is strong enough to carry huge tubs of water with ease, and he was still scared of Kenny.
Now let's go back to season 1 and think about all the stuff she saw or heard Kenny do.
Why would she form an attachment with him? Jane makes more sense.
On of my favourite things about Clementine's character is that she doesn't really behave like normal little girls in this sense. Most little girls would have likely been closest to Luke once he befriended her early in the game, Sarah or even Rebecca when she calmed down. Clementine instead found role models in the angry, unstable guy or the distant loner.
Well she was more grown up than normal little girls after the shit she went through.
Yeah, I was just being a little contrarian partially for the sake of it.
I know, that was a bit of the bigger issue I had with the two of them.
...Eh, somewhat.
Oh, you mean the characters she should've been building relationships and dynamics with anyway?
How fuckin quaint.
Heh. "Role models."
No I don't think it's that, so much as it was her natural personality. Clementine got attached more to certain people she met more than others who you wouldn't normally expect. Was pretty obvious that she missed Lee more than she did Christa in season 2 despite being with Christa for longer. When Kenny asked her to stay at Wellington, she was crying because she would never see him again. She cared about him (and Jane) more than any cabin group member at the time
I try to be realistic when I play these games... but sometimes I also like to play up the dramatic angle.
Really? I wouldn't be so taken with the guy that dropped me and locked me in the shed.
Clementine formed an attachment with Kenny through Duck and Katja. Everyone in S1 said, did, or had done some incredibly scary things for a child to learn about or witness. Kenny's actions were attempting to do what he thought would protect his family best. When he lost them, he made some pretty horrible choices. Clementine also made some pretty horrible choices for losing her parents -- one that ultimately cost Lee his life. There's a sort of kinship and understanding there.
As a little girl, I couldn't pick Jane. She tells a story of leaving her sister behind, and leaves a newborn baby in an unknown location to have a battle royale with Kenny to 'prove' to Clementine his instability. This isn't something that needs proving, as Clem's already seen Kenny as unstable towards Ben. But what she also saw upon meeting him in the cabin is that people could overcome loss as he did with Sarita. It takes a long time, and he wasn't there completely, but he moved forward.
Saaame-ish...?
Kenny's a fighter. He never quit on anyone/anything with times were hard. When the going gets tough, the tough get going, but Jane wouldn't know anything about that. She always gave up before even trying. I liked her, but she was too weak-willed. She didn't have that DRAGON ENERGY Kenny had.
I really appreciate the creator of this thread. Peacemakers rule the world.
Like: It's fun to take hits in the kenny fight in s1, not only for drama but those are some his best acted lines in the game.
Hey, I respect your opinion.
I think the writers WANTED it to make sense both ways.
Hm...I wouldn't know. I took a hit from him one time and ended up falling off the train as a surfboard for Duck's Walker.
I definitely agree. I wish they'd included more opportunities to form attachments to all of the characters in S2, and I'd be lying if I said I hadn't been disappointed with the ploy for the final battle. I thought that beneath Jane to do, just as the S3 ending for her didn't fit for me.
I don't think it was beneath her but it seemed so random at that point. One moment it seemed like she was about to apologize to Kenny, then she pulls that?
huh? is the middle of a blizzard really a good time for such schemes?
that's not even possible, you must be misremembering. once you start the fight lee can't just get pushed out of the cab
Whatever, overdramatization.
The point is I lost a fight/argument to him and got that gameover screen once.