Aw, man, I really wanted. . .
To drive Rhys into complete madness or villainry. I'm a little disappointed this wasn't an option and that the ending didn't involve the group having to essentially "pull him back" from his purge of power. When I saw the preview image for episode five, this is what I was expecting. Not to mention, I intentionally tried to drive him insane. . not telling anyone, keeping his distance, agreeing with Jack, etc, etc.
Anyone else wanted this or tried to achieve this?
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Well, why not? I don't always want to play as the hero, ya know.
That's kinda what I wanted to do. Throughout the entire season I was a complete dick with Rhys and to make him like Handsome Jack, so when I had the option to rule Hyperion I wanted Rhys to completely forget about his friends and eventually betray Jack because 'there's only one space at the top'. But no, Jack tells Rhys he's gonna be the first candidate to have a metal skeleton inside him which ended all my dreams of being a dick, well, a powerful dick.
I know your pain. Except I wanted Rhys to remember and care about his friends, so it was even more devastating when he decided turning on them would be more beneficial. Even better if it was under Jack's guidance, I'd say!
Yeah, that's pretty clever. There have been option though when Jack reveals his plan to say something like "Oh.. Cool" but be uneven about it and see where it goes from there but nope. That's why ruling Hyperion didn't really make a difference (apart from that pizza).
Worth it. It was a damn good pizza.
A lot of people did want this, but I suppose the whole point was to show that Jack was an even worse villain than Rhys and could never be a good person, EVER, and that despite how much of an asshole you could make Rhys be, he still had some standards.
I don't understand why anyone thought Jack would suddenly have a change of heart. I played along because I was legitimately curious what he had in mind. Aside from other reasons, of course, but the way you state makes sense at least. Just wish there were more options, haha.
Maybe the "Evil" ending could be Rhys's random nightmare...
"AHHHHHH FIONA AHHHHHH I JUST DREAMED I WAS KILLING EVERYONE AHHHHHHH-"
"Ssssh!"
Basically, like the other Bioshock 1 ending, except it was a dream.
This would be interesting and I do wish it was possible.
Yaaaas.
I'd like that option tbh
I was 99% sure this would happen. I was eagerly awaiting getting punished for my choices. The way the plot just railroaded itself to lead to one specific outcome kinda made me lose interest in Telltale games.
Don't get me wrong, it was an awesome narrative, and I enjoyed it immensely, but it was also my first ever TT game and I was expecting my choices to matter, since choice is the main gimmick of these games. I knew railroading was an issue in previous TT games, but I hoped they've since decided to give the players more agency. Ultimately that didn't happen, and I don't think I want to feel this disappointed again, no matter how good the story is. I'm not bashing, it was an amazing story for people who played it the 'right' way, but just not what I was personally looking for.
I would have liked it if the rule Hyperion track had more of a negative effect on the whole thing. Something like an alternative ending or at the very least a greater degree of animosity from the others after the fact.
I bet you loved Mass Effect then.
Looks like someone should play infamous series playing on bad karma.
Nope. Couldn't even get past the first hour. Wasn't bad, just didn't like it.
This I will consider, yes.
I'd say stick with it for a couple hours. If you love game where you can act like a bad guy, then Mass Effect is a must play.
You said you don't wanna always play as a hero. Well, I give Infamous if you didn't play them.
Maybe I'll give it a shot then.
A bad guy in Mass Effect? I disagree. You can be pretty ruthless, sure, but your goals are always the same, saving the universe. What I'm personally looking for is the ability to be a petty, selfish dick. The only games that satisfactorily let me be a villain (and still be victorious) were the Fallout games. Particularly Fallout New Vegas where I supported the Legion. In FO3 the most I could do in terms of the main plot was nuke Megaton, poison the purifier - which was pretty stupid - and kill-sat the Citadel. Satisfying, yes, but more chaotic-evil rather than the lawful/neutral-evil I desired.
Other than that, Infamous, as mentioned below. Bioshock 1 (and maybe 2? Haven't played that one). KOTOR 1 and 2, but those are old as balls. Saints Row 2, but there being a dick is kinda the only way to play the game. Hopefully Fallout 4 in two weeks.
If there's more current-gen games that let you play the villain protagonist do let me know, cause I crave that.
I think Jack wanting to shove a metal skeleton into his body kinda made Rhys realise it's better to get the fuck out of this madness rather than in |D
I mean the plot should've been different for your idea, I was kinda hoping for this as well but oh well, Telltale had other plans.
Yeah, Mass Effect is not exactly you playing the villain. That's not what I really meant to say. You can, in some instances, act somewhat villainous, which is what I meant with it. I do agree with you that you can not be outright villainous, and that you will still save the world, but at least it gives you the choice between doing so renegade (somewhat villainous-ish) or paragon (real hero-like), which is more than other games offer these days.
The main problem is that when it comes to a game where the player character still has a personality of their own, there's a limit to how far it can be feasibly taken before it starts deconstructing the very basis of the character the developers created and/or intended the character to be in the first place. It leads to a conflict of interest, as the player's interpretation of a character will not always line up the developer's own interpretations of the character. You read between the lines one way, Telltale does another way. Driving Rhys insane might sound like a captivating story-line/character arc to you, but there's a high chance that the reason it can't happen is because it does not at all line up with the intended character and personality of Rhys. Telltale are the ones that created this character, they're the ones that came together to determine the major design philosophies that make up who he is, from clothing to his manner of speech, and you can only give the players so much elbow room in 'driving' a character through dialogue/interaction before they completely run it off the road.
And that's just the drawback of it: you simply can't have a pre-determined character and allow the player complete/majority freedom over the choices. You can't account for every individual person's interpretations and perceptions towards a character without having to sacrifice a specific character arc or story-line. At that point, giving the character a definite story-line is fully up to the player and hoping they play by the rules. And if there's one abundantly clear fact about gaming, people will never play by the rules if they're given the opportunity not to.
I don't mean to sound like a dick here, but none of us are developers. We have our ideas of what makes a character work, sure, but none of us were there during the design meetings or hanging out in the writer's room. In comparison to the developers, we don't understand the characters at the same technical/mechanical level as they do. And that level of understanding is a crucial element when you begin to factor in player choice/player agency. If we were handed the reigns, we would take the characters in the direction we want them to go, not necessarily one that conforms to where the story in general is going, or one that conforms to the central dynamics and dichotomy between other characters and elements of the game. We're given the power to run whatever the developers intended into the ground if we so please. That's why Telltale has to 'railroad' people to some extent, because at the end of the day, they're the ones telling the story. They allow us to make choices and tailor the story, and that's the extent of it. Just like tailoring a suit, we can change the cuff sizes and all of that shit, but we can't decide to make the suit hot pink and engrave "FUCK YOU" into it in gold just because we wanted to or because we just could. There's a reason that Lee is always nice to Clementine in TWD, and why she always looks up to Lee; if that relationship between the two simply didn't exist, the entire game would fall apart completely. And that's why the player can only be allowed to go so far before the leash is reeled back in.
There's a design philosophy that spans the entirety of character creation during the development process. Love it or hate it, the developers set the ground rules for a character. Giving a player full control over the actions of the character have the potential to completely undermine the integrity of the character, and go against the major design philosophies involved in the creation of the character in the first place. What you may think is an interesting story-line to follow, chances are the reason you're not able to do it in game is because it simply doesn't mesh with any of the design goals Telltale intended for the character of Rhys. There's a reason why the games that allow you the most freedom in doing whatever the hell you want star main characters that don't speak or really have any personality of their own. The blank-slate/empty vessel character is the only way to make it work at the most efficient level.
Now I'm not trying to attack you here or say that your idea is bad, but from the way I see it, it's an unfortunate fact that allowing player choice to factor that heavily into the narrative without compromising other areas of the story would be too difficult due to the sheer amount of variables individual players throw into the equation, especially with the type of story they're attempting to tell, and the type of narrative they decided to use in order to tell it.
Same, I wish the rule Hyperion scenario lasted longer than a few minutes. I understand both choices need to converge for the game to move ahead, but taking longer than a minute or so would have been cool.
If your ok with Text-based games then the site "choice of games" has a ton that let you play the bad guy. You can play as fairly evil in Dragon Age: Origins (more so than the other Bioware games I've played at least). The Borderlands series has several Immoral characters that you can play as, though they aren't decision based. You can play as as a needlessly violent person in both Deus Ex and Dishonored, but that probably isn't what you're looking for. Honestly there really isn't much out there for playing as a (smart) bad guy in decision-based games (other than C.O.G.).
Great points. People love to forget that controlling a character doesn't make them YOUR character. They have their own thoughts and feelings about things, we just get to control how they act on said feelings. This is why it always bothers me when people complain about not being able to ditch Chloe in Life Is Strange, she's been Max's best friend since childhood and Max feels guilty about abandoning her, she isn't just going to turn around and start hating her.
Sorry for ranting about an unrelated game, it's just something that bothers me. Perhaps people complaining about not being able to have Clem hate Kenny is a better example.
While this is all true, the main issue for me personally is the fact that Telltale did let me shape Rhys' character in a certain way for 4 episodes... and then made episode 5 in which his personality doesn't match the way I've been playing him at all. What was the point of allowing me to choose all those rude, selfish and jerkass responses if in episode 5 Rhys will suddenly be nice and friendly to Fiona and Sasha? Why let Rhys betray his supposed best friend Vaughn for money and power if you're gonna make them true best friends in the ending anyway?
There's not much gameplay in Telltale games, 'this game adapts to the choices you make, the story is tailored by how you play' is the whole point of them. So having the story evolve in the same way no matter what kinda defeats the purpose for me. And besides, I honestly think there were many ways in which TT could have made the episode different for players who made certain choices and still have an ending that worked with BL3. Rhys and Fiona could have been whisked away just the same while being enemies or reluctant allies instead of friends. I just feel like this episode was chock full of missed opportunities.
Yeah, I've played all of those, and you're right, it's not really what I want. DA:O had a few amusing options but it still had the same issue Mass Effect had, i.e. the whole 'save the world' deal. Also the gameplay bored me to tears, it was so slow and tedious. DA2 and Inquisition kinda did away with the evil douche shtick altogether. In Borderlands the evilness is kinda cosmetic, sure you can play as Nisha or Wilhelm but you'll be doing the same things no matter who you are. In Deus Ex or Dishonored you can basically just kill or not kill people... and you'll miss out on a lot of XP if you choose to off everyone in Human Revolution... thanks, game.
I know of Choice of Games but never played anything from there, maybe I should try, though I'm not sure if I'll be into text-based stuff. Fallout 4 is probably my best bet right now, if that fails me too I guess I'm screwed. :P (But seriously if Fallout won't let me be evil then the end is nigh anyway).
I highly recommend at least trying C.O.G.'s out, they have free demos for all of their games on their website, so you won't have to pay to find out. They also have a few free games (usually shorter in length).
And yeah, developers need to step up their game on allowing you to be the bad guy.
I'll probably give them a try, yes.
But, the more pressing issue that I just noticed is - wth is wrong with your name? Was it so hard to put an 'i' between the 't' and the 'm'? Did you make a typo? Were you outright trying to be annoying? Is there sth I don't know that I should know? This is very disconcerting to me, you know...
(Hint - I'm not actually being serio... no, wait, this does bother me).
Typo. Sadly Telltale doesn't let you edit your name. I love that it bothers you though hahaha.
(Ouch, joke's on me, I made myself sad again).
Or have him claim to have rejected Hyperion either way, and have Fiona point out he'd given orders over the intercom that indicated otherwise if he'd actually accepted.
I missed the unreliable narrator in the later eps...
I would have liked a choice similar to the 'did you really push him out the van or did you have tea?' narration. It's fine fine if they both ended at not wanting to be a suit for Jack to wear, but it would have been neat to have a moment where the Rhys that chose Hyperion bluffed about his choice or how well that choice went.