I asked for Empirical evidence and statements not for face Expressions if i read jane's at Expressions that time when aj start crying i don't see it how you said that she didn't want clem to hear him it seem to me like she saying "she will be so mad at me for that "
during the fight, how can you say to someone angry trying to kill you the baby is a live? that dosen't seem right, cus when i fight with ppl never come to my mind to say something they like so i can save my self and look like an idiot, i don't even talk when i fight i only focus on my oponent and how i can beat him other than that no another thinking comes to my mind
Right? Hopefully none of their friends or family ever have a rough patch or a mental break or else they'd apparently deserve to be put down like a rabid dog (this is the common simile).
Honestly, I hate her after that season 2 ending. You don't put a helpless crying baby in danger just to prove a point to a mentally unstable… more man. Kenny needed help, not to be put to the test - I honestly cannot understand how so many people think it was justified to kill Kenny because he wasn't doing good mentally and might freak out, like, think about what that man has been though?
Honestly I just love Lee a lot and with Kenny being my only connection to him, I wanted to keep him as close to me as I could for as long as I could. Imagine there being no one in the entire world who knows what you've been through and who knew your family, than one lil' old crazy man. You'd protect him.
Something Rebecca and Alvin clearly didn't think about.
To be fair, Alvin and Rebecca were living in a settlement filled with supplies and order with connections in high(or rather low) places; meanwhile, Clementine, Jane, and eventually AJ are/were more or less vagabonds, often wandering out in the woods.
And even then, it's possible that its more Carver's fault than either of theirs.
Say what you want about Jane, but by committing suicide she saved somebody else from having to go through the same experiences as Clem and AJ.
Something Rebecca and Alvin clearly didn't think about.
Something Rebecca and Alvin clearly didn't think about.
To be fair, Alvin and Rebecca were living in a settlement filled with suppli… morees and order with connections in high(or rather low) places; meanwhile, Clementine, Jane, and eventually AJ are/were more or less vagabonds, often wandering out in the woods.
And even then, it's possible that its more Carver's fault than either of theirs.
If Jane stayed alive then she would've been literally incapable of taking care of herself and it would've been Clementine who would have to not only take care of her but also AJ. My point on this was not that Jane became depressed from her pregnancy but saw herself as a liability to Clementine in the long term so she disposed of herself. However Katjaa had a depressed and reckless man whom she loved; whom loved her back. She saw that her little boy was dying and that the man she loved was broken into pieces yet she decides to kill herself to not have to deal with the pain even though her and Lenny could've worked their way around it.
Though in the end it just comes down to it being poor writing from Telltale who rather than pushing the game out to it's best ability, decided to do a mediocre opening where a display of the illusion of choice screams at the player.
It was selfish, sure. But nothing you just listed is worse than leaving Clem after making her kill Kenny and airing herself as the better protector. She could have at least tried to find a better group for the kids before taking herself out.
You just love leaving out specific details to suit your purpose in bashing a character.
Katjaa left all of the grieving to Kenny and multiplied that by killing herself. She didn't consolidate with her Husband and tried to work through the pain and depression but left him to do all of it. She put the group in significant danger as her flesh wouldn't start rotting as she shot her brains out which would've meant that the smell of blood and flesh would've attracted walkers and not only that but the loud gunshot. She literally could've gotten everyone else killed. This does not make her an all round bad person but it shows that rather than trying to make Duck's death worthwhile by making it out with Kenny she decided to give into selfishness.
While Jane on the other hand arguably isn't the best character she served her purpose and went beyond in some situations. One of the situations being where she shares a tactic with the group about the zombie blood, where if you urge her then she will risk her life to save sarah, she comes back and helps the group.
Stop trying to shade more hate on a character by justifyig the reasons of another. Especially if you are trying to cast a shadow over the redeeming characteristics and the possible outcomes of what ifs.
Katjaa killed herself out of grief and an inability to cope with losing son to the Walker Virus and being unable to bare sparing him that ex… moreistence by personally killing him. She was a mother, a wife, a medic(of animals), and moral backbone.
Jane apparently killed herself out of a combination of guilt and psychological issues. She was a Darwinist, a killer(including possible sororicide), a delinquent, and a hypocrite.
I was merely pointing out that Katjaa and Jane were two different people with vastly different alignments and that their death's showed that.
Katjaa was someone who was always compassionate of others right down to being a doctor and fit in with many of the virtues that the other characters believe in; Jane was someone who went against many of those virtues, willing to cross lines other characters wouldn't and was distinguished by her aloof behavior towards others. Katjaa killed herself because she couldn't deal with taking someone else's life; Jane killed herself because she couldn't deal with giving someone else life.
You just love leaving out specific details to suit your purpose in bashing a character.
Katjaa left all of the grieving to Kenny and mult… moreiplied that by killing herself. She didn't consolidate with her Husband and tried to work through the pain and depression but left him to do all of it. She put the group in significant danger as her flesh wouldn't start rotting as she shot her brains out which would've meant that the smell of blood and flesh would've attracted walkers and not only that but the loud gunshot. She literally could've gotten everyone else killed. This does not make her an all round bad person but it shows that rather than trying to make Duck's death worthwhile by making it out with Kenny she decided to give into selfishness.
While Jane on the other hand arguably isn't the best character she served her purpose and went beyond in some situations. One of the situations being where she shares a tactic with the group about the z… [view original content]
'Merely pointing out' I've engaged with you before and seen the way you interact with users that disagree.
Did she take the Hippocratic Oath or a Veterinary one? I can guarantee you it was the latter, therefore she isn't a doctor but a mere veterinarian and there are big differences between working on a human or animal. You need to stop giving her the extra credit that she doesn't deserve because whilst I agree with you that Katjaa was a great character there isnt much more to it. Even with someone like Carlos, he wasn't as resourceful as his title perceived him to be and that's because of the virus. Katjaa wasn't even forced to kill Duck so where is this coming from? I can agree that her intentions were selfish but that was caused by the depression but she one bit was NOT consideration about Kenny and the devastation he would have to endure. You even see that it takes a toll on him especially after Sarita dies where he just goes insane and is willing to brutually beat a teenager up because he has no other way of venting out all his emotions.
Jane's actions were also selfish as fuck, i don't disagree but there are many angles to look from to speculate on her actions. Such as her not wanting to be a liability and possible put Clementine and AJ in danger, not wanting to bring another being into the horrific world. She's unpredictable but if she trusts you enough then she proves herself to be a useful ally who will share her tactics and knowledge for your benefit.
You're simply someone who puts things out of perspective, giving an enormous amount of undeserved credit and taking the credibility from other characters away.
I was merely pointing out that Katjaa and Jane were two different people with vastly different alignments and that their death's showed that… more.
Katjaa was someone who was always compassionate of others right down to being a doctor and fit in with many of the virtues that the other characters believe in; Jane was someone who went against many of those virtues, willing to cross lines other characters wouldn't and was distinguished by her aloof behavior towards others. Katjaa killed herself because she couldn't deal with taking someone else's life; Jane killed herself because she couldn't deal with giving someone else life.
Empirical evidence and statements? Lawl. Jane's modus operandi was leaving children behind to die (her sister and Sarah). She constantly complains about AJ and what a liability "it" will be. She left a baby in the middle of a snowstorm with walkers and didn't say anything even to save her own life and stop the fight.
I asked for Empirical evidence and statements not for face Expressions if i read jane's at Expressions that time when aj start crying i don'… moret see it how you said that she didn't want clem to hear him it seem to me like she saying "she will be so mad at me for that "
during the fight, how can you say to someone angry trying to kill you the baby is a live? that dosen't seem right, cus when i fight with ppl never come to my mind to say something they like so i can save my self and look like an idiot, i don't even talk when i fight i only focus on my oponent and how i can beat him other than that no another thinking comes to my mind
She comes back for Clementine in s2. Shows as the game goes on that she needs Clementine (if you choose to walk away from her, she even says "I need you, okay! Is that what you want to hear?") And she even promises Clementine that she'll never abandon her again.
So to have her kill herself as a way of writing her off didn't really make sense to me. Would have been better to have her eaten by walkers
Also, why didn't she shoot herself in the head? She wanted to be a walker?
I think her killing herself is a bit stupid.
She comes back for Clementine in s2. Shows as the game goes on that she needs Clementine (if… more you choose to walk away from her, she even says "I need you, okay! Is that what you want to hear?") And she even promises Clementine that she'll never abandon her again.
So to have her kill herself as a way of writing her off didn't really make sense to me. Would have been better to have her eaten by walkers
Also, why didn't she shoot herself in the head? She wanted to be a walker?
What's weird is that Jane even acknowledges that killing zombified Nick must have been hard for Clem, yet forced her through the exact same situation again.
Keep in mind that its more or less confirmed that Jane wouldn't have done the same. Like I said, she probably just preferred the old fashion rope method over a headshot and may have been banking on Clementine shooting her afterwards. Given the implications of her mental status, though, that may not have been the case.
Why would she put AJ in a car with a window slightly open for him to breathe if her plan was to kill him? Why not just throw him to the walkers? Take note that every single car in the game had closed windows yet that designed that specific one to have one window slightly opened.
I understand hating her for what she did to Kenny, but isn't distorting her actions in order to make her seem like a baby murdering anti-christ a bit too much?
There is nothing in my book called (read between the lines ) i know one thing you sow something happing than its happined . i didn't see throw a baby in the snow for walker i saw him in a protected car like clem did at the alone ending flashback
(She left her sister to die )
Well cus her sister give up what you want her to kill her self for her sister who give up the life?and how do you know that jamie was a chiled
(Wanted to leave sarah) i would agree with you if there was a point of saving sarah, I saved her to change her self but she didn't as jane said some ppl just can't change and sarah didn't so she was right about her ther is nothing wrong of what jane did she acted how her surviver experience that she collacted from her life at the ZA thats all.
Empirical evidence and statements? Lawl. Jane's modus operandi was leaving children behind to die (her sister and Sarah). She constantly com… moreplains about AJ and what a liability "it" will be. She left a baby in the middle of a snowstorm with walkers and didn't say anything even to save her own life and stop the fight.
Learn to read between the lines.
Mmm...fair point, but its generally assumed that Jane was the older of the two. Actually, I never actually thought about that. Maybe it's the Molly parallels.
i would agree with you if there was a point of saving sarah, I saved her to change her self but she didn't as jane said some ppl just can't change and sarah didn't so she was right about her ther is nothing wrong of what jane did she acted how her surviver experience that she collacted from her life at the ZA thats all.
You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front of her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize that Jane was technically wrong, right? Considering Sarah ended up doing practically everything opposite of what Jane said she'd do and all.
There is nothing in my book called (read between the lines ) i know one thing you sow something happing than its happined . i didn't see thr… moreow a baby in the snow for walker i saw him in a protected car like clem did at the alone ending flashback
(She left her sister to die )
Well cus her sister give up what you want her to kill her self for her sister who give up the life?and how do you know that jamie was a chiled
(Wanted to leave sarah) i would agree with you if there was a point of saving sarah, I saved her to change her self but she didn't as jane said some ppl just can't change and sarah didn't so she was right about her ther is nothing wrong of what jane did she acted how her surviver experience that she collacted from her life at the ZA thats all.
and how do you know that jamie was a chiled
Mmm...fair point, but its generally assumed that Jane was the older of the two. Actually… more, I never actually thought about that. Maybe it's the Molly parallels.
i would agree with you if there was a point of saving sarah, I saved her to change her self but she didn't as jane said some ppl just can't change and sarah didn't so she was right about her ther is nothing wrong of what jane did she acted how her surviver experience that she collacted from her life at the ZA thats all.
You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front of her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize tha… [view original content]
I've seen other people say that and for what it's worth, I don't think she was lying. She may have been embellishing somewhat, but I think it's safe to say she did exist. Her behavior noticeably changed whenever she was brought up(by Jane herself ), after all.
(You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front of her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize that Jane was technically wrong, right? Considering Sarah ended up doing practically everything opposite of what Jane said she'd do and all.)
Well 3 years or maybe 2 was more than enough for carl grimes, and his father and mother was around him the only reason that killed sarah was her father, so yeah she didn't get the chance to change after he died cus she didn't even try.
I can't put clem as a
Compared principle for cus clem was 8 years old when the sh#t started her young age more than enough to explain why she took to long to be a surviver and sarah is a teenager unlike her so she must by that time learn how the world work around her all teenagers do it at this time of thier own life.
For jane as a Compared principle (when all this started me and my sister ) she said when all this started and we all know her story and what a hard choice she did for surviving if she was weak as sarah that time she should be dead, or die like her sister did maybe even with her sister, but she was strong from the start that why she made it so long and she is not like sarah.
So the right Compared principle for sarah is jamie.
Those two just give up
and how do you know that jamie was a chiled
Mmm...fair point, but its generally assumed that Jane was the older of the two. Actually… more, I never actually thought about that. Maybe it's the Molly parallels.
i would agree with you if there was a point of saving sarah, I saved her to change her self but she didn't as jane said some ppl just can't change and sarah didn't so she was right about her ther is nothing wrong of what jane did she acted how her surviver experience that she collacted from her life at the ZA thats all.
You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front of her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize tha… [view original content]
Okay dude, no offense, but your grammar/spelling/whatever needs a teeny bit of work.
the only reason that killed sarah was her father, so yeah she didn't get the chance to change after he died cus she didn't even try.
And what makes you so sure of that? Was there a scene that explicitly showed she didn't want to help out the group? Did she stay put and quiet when the herd showed up following Rebecca's screams? Because the fact that she does none of goes against the idea that she didn't try.
I can't put clem as a Compared principle for cus clem was 8 years old when the sh#t started her young age more than enough to explain why she took to long to be a surviver and sarah is a teenager unlike her so she must by that time learn how the world work around her all teenagers do it at this time of thier own life.
But that's part of the point of her character: to show what Clementine would be like if Lee didn't stop treating her like something for him to protect and teach her what she'd need to know to survive should he die.
Also, Sarah would've been 12-13 when things started and we're flat out told that she spent a decent amount of time living at Howe's as a normal upstanding (and working?) citizen when Carver wasn't as unstable. The fact that she's confirmed to have PTSD, which matches up with certain scenes implying she's witnessed some traumatic things, lends credence to the idea that Carlos started overly patronizing her and leaving her out of as much conflict as possible specifically to avoid triggering her. You can't expect a dog to roll over just because you tell it to; you have to teach it or at least give it the proper encouragement--which is what Lee did before anything happened to him. And its also what Sarah herself was willing to go behind Carlos's back to seek before Carver showed up.
For jane as a Compared principle (when all this started me and my sister ) she said when all this started and we all know her story and what a hard choice she did for surviving if she was weak as sarah that time she should be dead, or die like her sister did maybe even with her sister, but she was strong from the start that why she made it so long and she is not like sarah.
Not quite sure what you're getting at here, but I'll my best. If you're saying that Sarah and Jane are near opposite, then no shit. As for her making a choice to survive, I'll once again say that she had time to make that decision while also pointing out this: Jane doesn't actually know what happened to Jaime that day. She had deluded herself into thinking that Jaime's possible death was the "right" thing to do so she wouldn't have to think about it, yet it still droves everything she did at that point. Sarah knows that Carlos had been killed firsthand and even says as much in the trailer park. And while she certainly fell into a funk over it, she still made an effort to put that aside when it became apparent that that was the wrong to do, to the point that you could argue that her trying to delude herself into thinking Carlos wasn't dead was an attempt to put her feelings to rest so that she could keep moving forward and become stronger. After all, that's essentially what Jane did and everyone says she's strong, right?
So the right Compared principle for sarah is jamie.
Those two just give up
That's a pretty black and white way of looking at it. Just because a character is "strong" doesn't mean they don't have moments of weakness and just because someone doesn't like conflict doesn't mean they won't get their hands dirty if they have to: Kenny and Sarita are proof of that. Jane and Sarah are very different on the surface and even then, Jane was comparing Sarah now to Jaime back then purely based on her own emotional/psychological hangups, so while there were similarities that made her say those two were the same, it doens't mean she couldn't be(and ultimately was) wrong.
And even without that, you're also forgetting an important distinction: Jaime had been lethargic for months, requiring Jane to barter with and even force her to keep moving on many occasions; all it took was slap to bring Sarah back to reality, after which she just did what she was told to do and even somewhat went out of her way to help everyone get away from the incoming herd. So while she may have indeed showed some of the same symptoms Jaime might've when things first went bad, she clearly showed signs of eventually recovering from that by the end of the day.
(You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front … moreof her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize that Jane was technically wrong, right? Considering Sarah ended up doing practically everything opposite of what Jane said she'd do and all.)
Well 3 years or maybe 2 was more than enough for carl grimes, and his father and mother was around him the only reason that killed sarah was her father, so yeah she didn't get the chance to change after he died cus she didn't even try.
I can't put clem as a
Compared principle for cus clem was 8 years old when the sh#t started her young age more than enough to explain why she took to long to be a s… [view original content]
(Okay dude, no offense, but your grammar/spelling/whatever needs a teeny bit of work.)
I tryed but i never get any better at english
(But that's part of the point of her character: to show what Clementine would be like if Lee didn't stop treating her like something for him to protect and teach her what she'd need to know to survive should he die.)
She's an 8 years old girl you know not like a 15 years teenager she need to be protected and learn protecting her self if she was a teenager she not gonna need someone to tell her how to do in her live all the teen start Building their own life at this time of thier lifes but there is one thing they still need from parents the wrong\the bad way or the right\the good way of life as an example of a teenager gone in the wrong why of life in the walking dead is that girl in your avatar the one who killed omid she is a teen isn't it she did know how the world is bad and she know that if she she can't be weak and need to survive that why she becomes strong but she acted the wrong way of her life she robed the ppl to survive with out thinking of outcomes and that what get her killed.
Yeah maybe sarah was 12\13 years old when every thing started but in season two she's 15 ,she should start understandig the life around her even if her father don't want her cus she's no longer a young kid she's a teen who should start opning his eyes about the wourld around him, and he have a good guide around him the cabin group. She is not gonna stay her father baby girl forever.
(Was there a scene that explicitly showed she didn't want to help out the group?)
That what i mean by saying she didn't even try cus she didn't even try to change or help ppl after when her father died after i said to her (grow up)more and more after i asked her to change (just try can you do that) but she Literally didn't try she only set down and huged her knees.
(Jane doesn't actually know what happened to Jaime that day)
Wait a sec is that mean that jamie maybe still alive i mean is she the new (I got lucky real lucky) nightmare, pls no not againkenny is enough i want him to be the only lucky one in TWD, how jamie will survive and she's lost the life hope at that time when jane left her.
(That's a pretty black and white way of looking at it. Just because a character is "strong" doesn't mean they don't have moments of weakness and just because someone doesn't like conflict doesn't mean they won't get their hands dirty if they have to: Kenny and Sarita are proof of that. Jane and Sarah are very different on the surface and even then, Jane was comparing Sarah now to Jaime back then purely based on her own emotional/psychological hangups, so while there were similarities that made her say those two were the same, it doens't mean she couldn't be(and ultimately was) wrong.
And even without that, you're also forgetting an important distinction: Jaime had been lethargic for months, requiring Jane to barter with and even force her to keep moving on many occasions; all it took was slap to bring Sarah back to reality, after which she just did what she was told to do and even somewhat went out of her way to help everyone get away from the incoming herd. So while she may have indeed showed some of the same symptoms Jaime might've when things first went bad, she clearly showed signs of eventually recovering from that by the end of the day.)
So true
Okay dude, no offense, but your grammar/spelling/whatever needs a teeny bit of work.
the only reason that killed sarah was her father,… more so yeah she didn't get the chance to change after he died cus she didn't even try.
And what makes you so sure of that? Was there a scene that explicitly showed she didn't want to help out the group? Did she stay put and quiet when the herd showed up following Rebecca's screams? Because the fact that she does none of goes against the idea that she didn't try.
I can't put clem as a Compared principle for cus clem was 8 years old when the sh#t started her young age more than enough to explain why she took to long to be a surviver and sarah is a teenager unlike her so she must by that time learn how the world work around her all teenagers do it at this time of thier own life.
But that's part of the point of her character: to show what Clementine would be like if Lee didn't stop treating… [view original content]
She's an 8 years old girl you know not like a 15 years teenager she need to be protected and learn protecting her self if she was a teenager she not gonna need someone to tell her how to do in her live all the teen start Building their own life at this time of thier lifes but there is one thing they still need from parents the wrong\the bad way or the right\the good way of life
True.
as an example of a teenager gone in the wrong why of life in the walking dead is that girl in your avatar the one who killed omid she is a teen isn't it she did know how the world is bad and she know that if she she can't be weak and need to survive that why she becomes strong but she acted the wrong way of her life she robed the ppl to survive with out thinking of outcomes and that what get her killed.
Ah yes, Michelle. She definitely came across as a bit of nihilist for exactly that reason, casually robbing and taking advantage of people to get by since the world is messed up for everyone. She's a character I wish had stuck around to add some variety to the cast/rogues gallery, as well as provide a personal antagonist for Clementine and potentially Sarah as well.
Yeah maybe sarah was 12\13 years old when every thing started but in season two she's 15 ,she should start understandig the life around her even if her father don't want her cus she's no longer a young kid she's a teen who should start opning his eyes about the wourld around him, and he have a good guide around him the cabin group. She is not gonna stay her father baby girl forever.
Yeah, that seemed to be the direction they were setting up at first. I am very very curious as to what half of their original plans were.
That what i mean by saying she didn't even try cus she didn't even try to change or help ppl after when her father died after i said to her (grow up)more and more after i asked her to change (just try can you do that) but she Literally didn't try she only set down and huged her knees.
To be fair, what exactly was she gonna do at that point? Luke simply told her to stay with Kenny and Rebecca, who just let her chill out to think things over. Aside from maybe accompanying Clementine on the trip over to the observation deck or even taking back up her gun training lessons now that Carlos is gone, there wasn't much for her to do anyway. I think the main problem with her(and to a lesser degree, Nick and Alvin) determinant status is that they give her nothing much to do
after she's save, right up to not having participate in the defense of the observation deck after warning everyone about the herd even though they kill her off in the same scene. Really, aside from maybe giving Luke's character development in the final episode more weight, there was no real reason to kill her off beyond not having to include her anymore.
(Okay dude, no offense, but your grammar/spelling/whatever needs a teeny bit of work.)
I tryed but i never get any better at english
(B… moreut that's part of the point of her character: to show what Clementine would be like if Lee didn't stop treating her like something for him to protect and teach her what she'd need to know to survive should he die.)
She's an 8 years old girl you know not like a 15 years teenager she need to be protected and learn protecting her self if she was a teenager she not gonna need someone to tell her how to do in her live all the teen start Building their own life at this time of thier lifes but there is one thing they still need from parents the wrong\the bad way or the right\the good way of life as an example of a teenager gone in the wrong why of life in the walking dead is that girl in your avatar the one who killed omid she is a teen isn't it she did know how the world is bad and she know that if she she can… [view original content]
I hope the haters who say such vile things about Kenny or any other character aren't like that in real life because the things some of them say makes me question if they would treat people in real life the same way
Right? Hopefully none of their friends or family ever have a rough patch or a mental break or else they'd apparently deserve to be put down like a rabid dog (this is the common simile).
I tryed but i never get any better at english
Great. Now I feel like an asshole.
She's an 8 years old girl you know not like … morea 15 years teenager she need to be protected and learn protecting her self if she was a teenager she not gonna need someone to tell her how to do in her live all the teen start Building their own life at this time of thier lifes but there is one thing they still need from parents the wrong\the bad way or the right\the good way of life
True.
as an example of a teenager gone in the wrong why of life in the walking dead is that girl in your avatar the one who killed omid she is a teen isn't it she did know how the world is bad and she know that if she she can't be weak and need to survive that why she becomes strong but she acted the wrong way of her life she robed the ppl to survive with out thinking of outcomes and that what get her killed.
Ah yes, Michelle. She definitely came across… [view original content]
Okay I am not jane's fan but how jane was trying to kill aj by puting him in a car, do you have an Objective evidence for that, when i look … moreto it I see it like aj the one who gets ppl killed or hurt when he is in a car, clem puted him in a car in the flashback, dose that mean she Was trying to kill him?
How natasha died because of jane?
I gotta call Jane defenders out on this. She was able to take care of them for the least amount of time throughout any of the flashbacks. This is evident by AJ's character model, which appears to be newborn in her flashback, the others seem to have had AJ grow to 2 years old. I just keep thinking about how people said going with Jane was the best option and just end up laughing seeing as her death was out of selfishness and ENTIRELY preventable.
This thread is about saying how shit a guardian Jane is and yet STILL you bring Kenny up in the convo even though this has nothing to do with him hahaha jeez these Kenny haters...i guess they have to make themselves feel better some way lol
Totally! I have said the same thing @VengefulKenny
I hope the haters who say such vile things about Kenny or any other character aren't l… moreike that in real life because the things some of them say makes me question if they would treat people in real life the same way
Comments
I asked for Empirical evidence and statements not for face Expressions if i read jane's at Expressions that time when aj start crying i don't see it how you said that she didn't want clem to hear him it seem to me like she saying "she will be so mad at me for that "
during the fight, how can you say to someone angry trying to kill you the baby is a live? that dosen't seem right, cus when i fight with ppl never come to my mind to say something they like so i can save my self and look like an idiot, i don't even talk when i fight i only focus on my oponent and how i can beat him other than that no another thinking comes to my mind
Right? Hopefully none of their friends or family ever have a rough patch or a mental break or else they'd apparently deserve to be put down like a rabid dog (this is the common simile).
Say what you want about Jane, but by committing suicide she saved somebody else from having to go through the same experiences as Clem and AJ.
Something Rebecca and Alvin clearly didn't think about.
To be fair, Alvin and Rebecca were living in a settlement filled with supplies and order with connections in high(or rather low) places; meanwhile, Clementine, Jane, and eventually AJ are/were more or less vagabonds, often wandering out in the woods.
And even then, it's possible that its more Carver's fault than either of theirs.
Still. They should be prepared for anything.
If Jane stayed alive then she would've been literally incapable of taking care of herself and it would've been Clementine who would have to not only take care of her but also AJ. My point on this was not that Jane became depressed from her pregnancy but saw herself as a liability to Clementine in the long term so she disposed of herself. However Katjaa had a depressed and reckless man whom she loved; whom loved her back. She saw that her little boy was dying and that the man she loved was broken into pieces yet she decides to kill herself to not have to deal with the pain even though her and Lenny could've worked their way around it.
Though in the end it just comes down to it being poor writing from Telltale who rather than pushing the game out to it's best ability, decided to do a mediocre opening where a display of the illusion of choice screams at the player.
You just love leaving out specific details to suit your purpose in bashing a character.
Katjaa left all of the grieving to Kenny and multiplied that by killing herself. She didn't consolidate with her Husband and tried to work through the pain and depression but left him to do all of it. She put the group in significant danger as her flesh wouldn't start rotting as she shot her brains out which would've meant that the smell of blood and flesh would've attracted walkers and not only that but the loud gunshot. She literally could've gotten everyone else killed. This does not make her an all round bad person but it shows that rather than trying to make Duck's death worthwhile by making it out with Kenny she decided to give into selfishness.
While Jane on the other hand arguably isn't the best character she served her purpose and went beyond in some situations. One of the situations being where she shares a tactic with the group about the zombie blood, where if you urge her then she will risk her life to save sarah, she comes back and helps the group.
Stop trying to shade more hate on a character by justifyig the reasons of another. Especially if you are trying to cast a shadow over the redeeming characteristics and the possible outcomes of what ifs.
I was merely pointing out that Katjaa and Jane were two different people with vastly different alignments and that their death's showed that.
Katjaa was someone who was always compassionate of others right down to being a doctor and fit in with many of the virtues that the other characters believe in; Jane was someone who went against many of those virtues, willing to cross lines other characters wouldn't and was distinguished by her aloof behavior towards others. Katjaa killed herself because she couldn't deal with taking someone else's life; Jane killed herself because she couldn't deal with giving someone else life.
'Merely pointing out' I've engaged with you before and seen the way you interact with users that disagree.
Did she take the Hippocratic Oath or a Veterinary one? I can guarantee you it was the latter, therefore she isn't a doctor but a mere veterinarian and there are big differences between working on a human or animal. You need to stop giving her the extra credit that she doesn't deserve because whilst I agree with you that Katjaa was a great character there isnt much more to it. Even with someone like Carlos, he wasn't as resourceful as his title perceived him to be and that's because of the virus. Katjaa wasn't even forced to kill Duck so where is this coming from? I can agree that her intentions were selfish but that was caused by the depression but she one bit was NOT consideration about Kenny and the devastation he would have to endure. You even see that it takes a toll on him especially after Sarita dies where he just goes insane and is willing to brutually beat a teenager up because he has no other way of venting out all his emotions.
Jane's actions were also selfish as fuck, i don't disagree but there are many angles to look from to speculate on her actions. Such as her not wanting to be a liability and possible put Clementine and AJ in danger, not wanting to bring another being into the horrific world. She's unpredictable but if she trusts you enough then she proves herself to be a useful ally who will share her tactics and knowledge for your benefit.
You're simply someone who puts things out of perspective, giving an enormous amount of undeserved credit and taking the credibility from other characters away.
Empirical evidence and statements? Lawl. Jane's modus operandi was leaving children behind to die (her sister and Sarah). She constantly complains about AJ and what a liability "it" will be. She left a baby in the middle of a snowstorm with walkers and didn't say anything even to save her own life and stop the fight.
Learn to read between the lines.
I think her killing herself is a bit stupid.
She comes back for Clementine in s2. Shows as the game goes on that she needs Clementine (if you choose to walk away from her, she even says "I need you, okay! Is that what you want to hear?") And she even promises Clementine that she'll never abandon her again.
So to have her kill herself as a way of writing her off didn't really make sense to me. Would have been better to have her eaten by walkers
Also, why didn't she shoot herself in the head? She wanted to be a walker?
Funny you should say that cause I initially thought she should've had Kenny's flashback while watching it the first time.
I...don't know to say there, tbh. Just assume she didn't have a gun or preferred not to do it that way.
Keep in mind that its more or less confirmed that Jane wouldn't have done the same. Like I said, she probably just preferred the old fashion rope method over a headshot and may have been banking on Clementine shooting her afterwards. Given the implications of her mental status, though, that may not have been the case.
Why would she put AJ in a car with a window slightly open for him to breathe if her plan was to kill him? Why not just throw him to the walkers? Take note that every single car in the game had closed windows yet that designed that specific one to have one window slightly opened.
I understand hating her for what she did to Kenny, but isn't distorting her actions in order to make her seem like a baby murdering anti-christ a bit too much?
There is nothing in my book called (read between the lines ) i know one thing you sow something happing than its happined . i didn't see throw a baby in the snow for walker i saw him in a protected car like clem did at the alone ending flashback
(She left her sister to die )
Well cus her sister give up what you want her to kill her self for her sister who give up the life?and how do you know that jamie was a chiled
(Wanted to leave sarah) i would agree with you if there was a point of saving sarah, I saved her to change her self but she didn't as jane said some ppl just can't change and sarah didn't so she was right about her ther is nothing wrong of what jane did she acted how her surviver experience that she collacted from her life at the ZA thats all.
Mmm...fair point, but its generally assumed that Jane was the older of the two. Actually, I never actually thought about that. Maybe it's the Molly parallels.
You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front of her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize that Jane was technically wrong, right? Considering Sarah ended up doing practically everything opposite of what Jane said she'd do and all.
How do we even know her name was Jamie? Jamie and Jane ... rather strange name choice for sisters.
...Cause Jane said it numerous times? And yes, that name choice has not eluded me.
I'm still not sure if I believe the Jamie story. Maybe she made it up to pull Clementine away from the group.
I've seen other people say that and for what it's worth, I don't think she was lying. She may have been embellishing somewhat, but I think it's safe to say she did exist. Her behavior noticeably changed whenever she was brought up(by Jane herself
), after all.
(You do realize that Sarah never really got the chance to change given that she was killed mere hours afterward her dad got killed in front of her; Clementine and Jane had years of having an idea what happened to their family outside of their view to get themselves in functional condition. Also, (and this is something that just exposes how sloppy that overall situation/plotpoint was, but) you do realize that Jane was technically wrong, right? Considering Sarah ended up doing practically everything opposite of what Jane said she'd do and all.)
Well 3 years or maybe 2 was more than enough for carl grimes, and his father and mother was around him the only reason that killed sarah was her father, so yeah she didn't get the chance to change after he died cus she didn't even try.
I can't put clem as a
Compared principle for cus clem was 8 years old when the sh#t started her young age more than enough to explain why she took to long to be a surviver and sarah is a teenager unlike her so she must by that time learn how the world work around her all teenagers do it at this time of thier own life.
For jane as a Compared principle (when all this started me and my sister ) she said when all this started and we all know her story and what a hard choice she did for surviving if she was weak as sarah that time she should be dead, or die like her sister did maybe even with her sister, but she was strong from the start that why she made it so long and she is not like sarah.
So the right Compared principle for sarah is jamie.
Those two just give up
Okay dude, no offense, but your grammar/spelling/whatever needs a teeny bit of work.
And what makes you so sure of that? Was there a scene that explicitly showed she didn't want to help out the group? Did she stay put and quiet when the herd showed up following Rebecca's screams? Because the fact that she does none of goes against the idea that she didn't try.
But that's part of the point of her character: to show what Clementine would be like if Lee didn't stop treating her like something for him to protect and teach her what she'd need to know to survive should he die.
Also, Sarah would've been 12-13 when things started and we're flat out told that she spent a decent amount of time living at Howe's as a normal upstanding (and working?) citizen when Carver wasn't as unstable. The fact that she's confirmed to have PTSD, which matches up with certain scenes implying she's witnessed some traumatic things, lends credence to the idea that Carlos started overly patronizing her and leaving her out of as much conflict as possible specifically to avoid triggering her. You can't expect a dog to roll over just because you tell it to; you have to teach it or at least give it the proper encouragement--which is what Lee did before anything happened to him. And its also what Sarah herself was willing to go behind Carlos's back to seek before Carver showed up.
Not quite sure what you're getting at here, but I'll my best. If you're saying that Sarah and Jane are near opposite, then no shit. As for her making a choice to survive, I'll once again say that she had time to make that decision while also pointing out this: Jane doesn't actually know what happened to Jaime that day. She had deluded herself into thinking that Jaime's possible death was the "right" thing to do so she wouldn't have to think about it, yet it still droves everything she did at that point. Sarah knows that Carlos had been killed firsthand and even says as much in the trailer park. And while she certainly fell into a funk over it, she still made an effort to put that aside when it became apparent that that was the wrong to do, to the point that you could argue that her trying to delude herself into thinking Carlos wasn't dead was an attempt to put her feelings to rest so that she could keep moving forward and become stronger. After all, that's essentially what Jane did and everyone says she's strong, right?
That's a pretty black and white way of looking at it. Just because a character is "strong" doesn't mean they don't have moments of weakness and just because someone doesn't like conflict doesn't mean they won't get their hands dirty if they have to: Kenny and Sarita are proof of that. Jane and Sarah are very different on the surface and even then, Jane was comparing Sarah now to Jaime back then purely based on her own emotional/psychological hangups, so while there were similarities that made her say those two were the same, it doens't mean she couldn't be(and ultimately was) wrong.
And even without that, you're also forgetting an important distinction: Jaime had been lethargic for months, requiring Jane to barter with and even force her to keep moving on many occasions; all it took was slap to bring Sarah back to reality, after which she just did what she was told to do and even somewhat went out of her way to help everyone get away from the incoming herd. So while she may have indeed showed some of the same symptoms Jaime might've when things first went bad, she clearly showed signs of eventually recovering from that by the end of the day.
(Okay dude, no offense, but your grammar/spelling/whatever needs a teeny bit of work.)
I tryed but i never get any better at english
(But that's part of the point of her character: to show what Clementine would be like if Lee didn't stop treating her like something for him to protect and teach her what she'd need to know to survive should he die.)
She's an 8 years old girl you know not like a 15 years teenager she need to be protected and learn protecting her self if she was a teenager she not gonna need someone to tell her how to do in her live all the teen start Building their own life at this time of thier lifes but there is one thing they still need from parents the wrong\the bad way or the right\the good way of life as an example of a teenager gone in the wrong why of life in the walking dead is that girl in your avatar the one who killed omid she is a teen isn't it she did know how the world is bad and she know that if she she can't be weak and need to survive that why she becomes strong but she acted the wrong way of her life she robed the ppl to survive with out thinking of outcomes and that what get her killed.
Yeah maybe sarah was 12\13 years old when every thing started but in season two she's 15 ,she should start understandig the life around her even if her father don't want her cus she's no longer a young kid she's a teen who should start opning his eyes about the wourld around him, and he have a good guide around him the cabin group. She is not gonna stay her father baby girl forever.
(Was there a scene that explicitly showed she didn't want to help out the group?)
That what i mean by saying she didn't even try cus she didn't even try to change or help ppl after when her father died after i said to her (grow up)more and more after i asked her to change (just try can you do that) but she Literally didn't try she only set down and huged her knees.
(Jane doesn't actually know what happened to Jaime that day)
Wait a sec is that mean that jamie maybe still alive i mean is she the new (I got lucky real lucky) nightmare, pls no not againkenny is enough i want him to be the only lucky one in TWD, how jamie will survive and she's lost the life hope at that time when jane left her.
(That's a pretty black and white way of looking at it. Just because a character is "strong" doesn't mean they don't have moments of weakness and just because someone doesn't like conflict doesn't mean they won't get their hands dirty if they have to: Kenny and Sarita are proof of that. Jane and Sarah are very different on the surface and even then, Jane was comparing Sarah now to Jaime back then purely based on her own emotional/psychological hangups, so while there were similarities that made her say those two were the same, it doens't mean she couldn't be(and ultimately was) wrong.
And even without that, you're also forgetting an important distinction: Jaime had been lethargic for months, requiring Jane to barter with and even force her to keep moving on many occasions; all it took was slap to bring Sarah back to reality, after which she just did what she was told to do and even somewhat went out of her way to help everyone get away from the incoming herd. So while she may have indeed showed some of the same symptoms Jaime might've when things first went bad, she clearly showed signs of eventually recovering from that by the end of the day.)
So true
Great. Now I feel like an asshole.
True.
Ah yes, Michelle. She definitely came across as a bit of nihilist for exactly that reason, casually robbing and taking advantage of people to get by since the world is messed up for everyone. She's a character I wish had stuck around to add some variety to the cast/rogues gallery, as well as provide a personal antagonist for Clementine and potentially Sarah as well.
Yeah, that seemed to be the direction they were setting up at first. I am very very curious as to what half of their original plans were.
To be fair, what exactly was she gonna do at that point? Luke simply told her to stay with Kenny and Rebecca, who just let her chill out to think things over. Aside from maybe accompanying Clementine on the trip over to the observation deck or even taking back up her gun training lessons now that Carlos is gone, there wasn't much for her to do anyway. I think the main problem with her(and to a lesser degree, Nick and Alvin) determinant status is that they give her nothing much to do
after she's save, right up to not having participate in the defense of the observation deck after warning everyone about the herd even though they kill her off in the same scene. Really, aside from maybe giving Luke's character development in the final episode more weight, there was no real reason to kill her off beyond not having to include her anymore.
Totally! I have said the same thing @VengefulKenny
I hope the haters who say such vile things about Kenny or any other character aren't like that in real life because the things some of them say makes me question if they would treat people in real life the same way
(Great. Now I feel like an asshole. )
No need for that, wasn't your mistake that i all most missed every english class
Putting a new born in a car in the freezing cold an could have eaisly died
Lol XD
,,,,,,,,as if kenny is a better guardian
I gotta call Jane defenders out on this. She was able to take care of them for the least amount of time throughout any of the flashbacks. This is evident by AJ's character model, which appears to be newborn in her flashback, the others seem to have had AJ grow to 2 years old. I just keep thinking about how people said going with Jane was the best option and just end up laughing seeing as her death was out of selfishness and ENTIRELY preventable.
This thread is about saying how shit a guardian Jane is and yet STILL you bring Kenny up in the convo even though this has nothing to do with him hahaha jeez these Kenny haters...i guess they have to make themselves feel better some way lol
plus it makes a better story