Kirkman on bites
I Decided to look it up this what i found not sure if its true but it says they quoting Kirkman on the bites and turning into a zombie.
Robert Kirkman wrote:
The rule is: WHATEVER it is that causes the zombies, is something everyone already has. If you stub your toe, get an infection and die, you turn into a zombie, UNLESS your brain is damaged. If someone shoots you in the head and you die, you're dead. A zombie bite kills you because of infection, or blood loss, not because of the zombie "virus."[3]
So if Lee does not get a fever or have lots of blood loss he wont become a zombie.
Robert Kirkman wrote:
The rule is: WHATEVER it is that causes the zombies, is something everyone already has. If you stub your toe, get an infection and die, you turn into a zombie, UNLESS your brain is damaged. If someone shoots you in the head and you die, you're dead. A zombie bite kills you because of infection, or blood loss, not because of the zombie "virus."[3]
So if Lee does not get a fever or have lots of blood loss he wont become a zombie.
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Comments
And these aren't healthy people doing the biting. Decaying bodies are bacteria factories.
Dr. Bergner said that Herring's Law of Cure was developed from observations made at a homeopathic hospital. It appears that smallpox went through one wing of the hospital and all the patients came down with the disease. When they got the smallpox, the symptoms of their original illness, mumps, fever, etc. disappeared. After successfully treating the patients homeopathically for smallpox, however, the original disease they had returned. What Dr. Herring hypothesized was this: When the body is fighting off one disease, and another more serious threat is presented to the body, the body will quit fighting off the first disease and tackle the more serious problem. Once the system has rid itself of the more serious threat, it will go back to work on the less serious illness. This is why Herring's law tells us that the body heals "in reverse order of symptoms suppressed." In his lecture, Paul Bergner, said that when people have infections they are manifesting good symptoms of a healing crisis, fever, inflammation, etc. Then, we introduce an antibiotic, a concentrated mold toxin, into the system. The body takes a look at the mold toxin and says, "Wo! We have a serious threat here." So, it quits fighting the infection and starts working to get rid of the mold toxin. Thus, the symptoms of infection disappear.
"successfully treated the patients homeopathically"
ya... you might want to check your source there
And what deadly infection can you get from a human bite? Komodo dragons, like regular house cats, have deadly saliva. Again, dead people don't salivate...
Is that right? haha
Its not the saliva of a komodo dragon that is so toxic, its the bacteria they've accumulated inside of the saliva, you can't tell me a human who is rotting like a zombie on the walking dead wouldn't pass just as much bacteria onto a wound by biting it, saliva or not, even though I am almost positive they do have saliva.
Bacteria don't breed well in dry places, which is why they thrive in saliva. A corpse dries out pretty quickly.
So, to answer your question, that's exactly what I'm telling you.
It's not like logic, biology or physics apply in the world so it's kind of a pointless debate.
It's never a pointless debate.
Well, since kirkman said that walkers Have got saliva, it IS a pointless debate.
There are viruses that can live on external surfaces for up to a year.
There are bacteria that can stand extreme temperatures.
The fact is we don't know what's in the average walkers mouth.
We can assume plenty of rotten flesh sense their mouths are rotting, aren't they?
What makes a human bite so dangerous is all the disease that people carry.
Human bites have been shown to transmit hepatitis B, hepatitis C, herpes simplex virus (HSV), syphilis, tuberculosis, actinomycosis, and tetanus. Evidence suggests that it is biologically possible to transmit the human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) through human bites, although this is quiteunlikely. (SeePathophysiology, Presentation, and Workup.)
But each one of these would develop different symptoms. Unlike when they are bitten on the show.
Unless a bite from a walker is like some sort of catalyst which kick-starts the virus that everyone carries.
I haven't read the comics so perhaps Kirkman has offered a plausible explanation for this in the books.
Although what Kirkman says here doesn't mesh: http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/Zombies#Reanimation
That would indicate that there should only be a 10-15% infection rate, and the symptoms won't always be the same. It also doesn't explain the super-high fevers that happen very quickly.
pretty much.
if someone cut lees entire arm off seconds after he was bitten, and he received a bunch of antibiotics -- then we'd have a discussion.
Check your source. The reptile you mentioned is in fact one of the few venomous lizards on our planet. Sure it is a scavenger and its saliva is full of germs, but it has in fact venom glands to make sure a bite is most likely going to end up lethal.
Zombies aren't venomous. Nevertheless, Lee is going to die. As much as I hate the railroaded, inevitable bite, Episode 5 is going to be Lee's final hours.
Great points.
Rubbing a rotten chicken breast on an open wound would most likely cause an infection and could well lead to death if no proper treatment was taken. This idea doesn't cover a bite by a "newly raised" Walker of course.
I'm sorry jokieman, I don't see the relation the Kirkman's response you hinted at. The reality through the series and all other zombie genre's is that a bite one causes an infection that kills you. Amputation has been hinted at and has showed in some books/movies that it can work if done soon enough. However I think the debate is less about that then why the virus accelerates when introduced into a human body by a bite.
Why are we trying to debate the cannon of books and movies? If that is what you want to do, write your own book and change the virus. I don't want to sound like a jerk but damn, it is what it is....it won't change
Unless it is a an infection caused by a virus, bitten people could be easily cured by treating them with antibiotics.
Not all non-viruses can be cured by a simple dose of meds...ever hear of the super-infections in hospitals that can't be stopped with antibiotics?
http://www.heuhof.de/en/pferde.html
I understand where you're coming from. I suppose though if I was going to nitpick I would say we're not talking about human bites here. We're talking about reanimated corpses.
Many of which are eating animals as well as people, bits and pieces of their meals stuck between their teeth and everything else. It's a bit more than just a human bite.
I'd imagine if you took a bunch of rotting flesh/dna from various animals and humans, threw it in a blender and threw that concoction into a wound.....see where I'm going with this?
Very well possible that everyone would have different reactions, but in a world with little/no antibiotics I could see that causing some problems.
While I mention antibiotics.. I don't think between game/comics/tv show have I seen anyone try to treat the bites with those..?
Bites and Zombification are separate. This is a very simple conecpt few people around here can wrap their heads around. So let me make it simple:
Bites = death
Any death besides brain damage = zombification
So, if a person gets bitten, they die. Then they zombify. But they also zombify if they get shot, stabbed, old age, starvation, or bleeding out. A bite is 100% lethal. If you all in this thread still don't understand, then you all must be zombies.
Yeah I already knew this. In fact you just reiterated what I said in the quote. The only reason were calling it into question is because of Kirkman's quote. So I'm just trying to understand where hes comming from.
LOL! Ok, which song do dead horses prefer??
Sox,
I hope I understand what you mean because I'm going to try and explain it again in this thread. We all have the "virus" in Kirkman's world. We will all die eventually and reanimate unless someone gives us a "dome" shot prior to death.
The virus seems (in my opinion based on the tv show, I haven't read the comic yet) to be accelerated when bitten by an infected walker, that's it. Yes, amputation is an option depending on the bite, how long after and what you have to treat the wound but the fact of the matter is we are all infected, it is going to happen anyway unless we find some futuristic alien who can sequence DNA and cure us.
I don't see that happening.....
Lol Micheal Jackson...
Too soon?
But in all seriousness, I've heard people compare zombie bites to komodo dragon bites. They don't actually have venom, just a lot of gross stuff in their mouths/saliva. I know that there are ways to survive a komodo dragon bite, if you have a ton of antibiotics and immediate medical attention, but I don't know if Lee will get that...
Komodo dragons do have venom: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Komodo_dragon#Saliva
In kirkman's world zombies have saliva. In real life a living zombie IS possible, but not a undead one like in kirkman's world. In real life bodies will decay within only a few months if exposed to the elements, especially in georgia heat. They will lose all water. A dead body is exactly that, a dead body. It has no way to create ATP for the energy to move. It wouldn't have saliva or any liquids left after a few days.
But it kirman's universe they DO have saliva. They CAN move, even against real life physics. And they even seem to decay a lot slower than real life. In the comics they have been around for over a year now, so by then every single walker from the start of the outbreak should be fully decomposed and be only skeletons or damn near it from being constantly exposed to all the elements. (it actually would only take a few months for a walker to decompose fully). Yet in macon at the inn you still had a ton of zombies running around when it's been 3 months since the outbreak, and that all should be mostly decomposed.
Heck, in the comics all the survivors now know that if you will die, you need your brain destroyed, so every single survivor has since been made sure to be stabbed or shot through the head, meaning no new zombies are introduced anymore for the most part. The outbreak *should* thus be over after a year or more in the comics, with being shot/stabbed in the head becoming essentially a new pre-burial practice, but i have a strong feeling somehow kirkman is going to overlook that small fact from real life physics too.
It's these things which are WHY kirkman tells you how the specific date, how the virus started, etc shouldn't matter. It's because the point of the ZA is simply supposed to be symbolic, and the characters, their drama, and all the moral tests and lessons they create just make a good story and show you how fragile life is.
...keep goin