Molly was the one character where Telltale stumbled

2

Comments

  • edited January 2013
    double_u wrote: »
    One part I never found believable was when kenny and lee went to ambush molly at the new stand. We had her in our line of sight during the approach, but by the time lee got up there, she vanished and was behind lee. Parkour or not it seems a bit far fetched.

    It's very believable. You need to take some art classes, and and study perception. It's easy for her to have just walked around in the time Lee looked down, front and center.

    The italicized words are a hint. ;)
  • edited January 2013
    It's very believable. You need to take some art classes, and and study perception. It's easy for her to have just walked around in the time Lee looked down, front and center.

    The italicized words are a hint. ;)

    Do you mean perspective?
  • edited January 2013
    Too bad we never saw if she's dead or not after the horde.

    Perhaps a season 2 cameo? :D
  • edited January 2013
    In an interview on of the developers said she was meant to bring hope to the player. i.e. Everything starts going right when she appears, e.e. finding the boat and so forth; and when she leaves, Clem gets kidnapped and lee gets bit.
  • edited January 2013
    Demopan wrote: »
    If you were rehearsing it, it would be in a particular location in a specific sequence. Not wherever you please. Learn your words and stop making forum accounts just to agree with you.

    I'm glad someone understood what I meant by 'rehearsed.'

    double_u wrote: »
    One part I never found believable was when kenny and lee went to ambush molly at the new stand. We had her in our line of sight during the approach, but by the time lee got up there, she vanished and was behind lee. Parkour or not it seems a bit far fetched.

    That was probably Molly's most over-the-top scene. She was cornered in a newstand from which she had no where to go without either Lee or Kenny observing her movements. Yet she somehow vanishes and reappears behind Lee.
  • edited January 2013
    Since no one has brought it up yet and quite a few people seem to think what Molly does is unrealistic:

    Parkour and freerunning in general:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX7QNWEGcNI
    Mostly simple moves in this one but it has it's moments.

    John Morrison (former WWE star):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NR4iiunIZGs
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1-JaBBI2vc
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x3K9NkUlEs
    First two vids are Morrison training/practicing. Third video is him actually using basic parkour as well as capoeira in his matches.

    Casino Royale parkour chase:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJubOZLpp4A
    Here's the opening chase scene from Casino Royale. The stuntman/actor that Bond is chasing is one of the actual creators of the sport and does a good job at showing off a few pretty risky moves during this chase.

    Honestly if anything I'd say Molly was LESS over the top compared to typical parkour stunts. Granted I'll give you guys the scene when we first meet her where she seemingly disappears and gets the drop on Lee. Everything else however that involved parkour and her climbing axe could be done if you had the training, strength and reflexes for it.
  • edited January 2013
    Like gymnastics, parkour is rehearsed.

    If you took a parkour athlete into an unfamiliar urban enviroment, and told them 'go,' the chances of them getting injured are rather high.
  • edited January 2013
    Scaeva wrote: »
    Like gymnastics, parkour is rehearsed.

    If you took a parkour athlete into an unfamiliar urban enviroment, and told them 'go,' the chances of them getting injured are rather high.

    We discussed this on the previous page, and again, rehearsed is just another word for practice.
    Do you mean perspective?

    Of course.
  • edited January 2013
    We discussed this on the previous page, and again, rehearsed is just another word for practice.

    Parkour is rehearsed in a static location.

    A person who is into parkour couldn't just drop blind into any location and run through a routine without running a great risk of injury.

    There is a reason why parkour has only gotten limited attention from militaries. The practicable applications of parkour beyong physical fitness, are just as limited.
  • edited January 2013
    Well, Molly's had three and a half months to learn her way around the rooftops of Savannah. She even says that she's pretty much stuck in the city, so she really doesn't have anything else to do. Sides, I thought the parkour was kinda neat. The one thing I don't like is how she goes to take on the entire horde that Ben lets into Crawford. Sure she gets royally fucked, and gets left behind if Clem isn't there and Lee sucks at shooting, but she took on those initial walkers like it was zero problem.
  • edited January 2013
    Scaeva wrote: »
    Parkour is rehearsed in a static location.

    A person who is into parkour couldn't just drop blind into any location and run through a routine without running a great risk of injury.

    There is a reason why parkour has only gotten limited attention from militaries. The practicable applications of parkour beyong physical fitness, are just as limited.

    Look, I didn't say anything about Parkour itself. I didn't even know what it was until this thread, but my point is practice makes perfect, and that it isn't beyond the realm of possibility for one character to actually be more active than the others. As for military, with my point of practice, you still have to go through the motions with a firearm, practical or not. If you can imagine, try relating it some are going to be good shots with the gun, but others are going to severely risk missing their targets...it's the same concept no matter how you look at it. Everything is a rehearsal when it comes to practice.

    You guys believe what you want, but Molly isn't outside the realm of Lee surviving a car crash, zombie horde by himself with only a knife and broken glass, or when Lee and Omid jump from a bridge to a moving train, or when Lee himself jumps from building-to-building, and the ladder bit with one arm.

    In fact that makes Molly seem like the amateur.
    Rock114 wrote: »
    Well, Molly's had three and a half months to learn her way around the rooftops of Savannah. She even says that she's pretty much stuck in the city, so she really doesn't have anything else to do. Sides, I thought the parkour was kinda neat. The one thing I don't like is how she goes to take on the entire horde that Ben lets into Crawford. Sure she gets royally fucked, and gets left behind if Clem isn't there and Lee sucks at shooting, but she took on those initial walkers like it was zero problem.

    The reason why it might not be a big deal for her is that she might be a bit suicidal, which goes back to her bleak words, "In the end, the dead always win." Which I do believe I pointed out somewhere. Also good job on pointing out that she does indeed know the area, and considering how she talked, yes, she very much did.
  • edited January 2013
    double_u wrote: »
    One part I never found believable was when kenny and lee went to ambush molly at the new stand. We had her in our line of sight during the approach, but by the time lee got up there, she vanished and was behind lee. Parkour or not it seems a bit far fetched.

    I see this scene quoted a lot, but I have a very different view because the "disappearing act" was entirely possible and can be done by anyone in this forum had we been in Molly's position.

    Did everyone forget the newsstand had an OPEN ENTRANCE??? It's really simple:

    1) Molly sensed someone creeping up from behind, she goes down.

    2) Lee crept up to the newsstand and stopped at the front.

    3) Contrary to what's believed, Molly didn't go POOF! and appear right behind Lee. She crawled out from where she got in and while Lee was peeping into the newsstand, she crept from his right and to behind him.

    Lee did not see her because he was up and trying to peek into the newsstand and because she's dead silent. What's so difficult to understand how this was done? :confused:

    The only question that should be asked but wasn't is why and how Kenny missed out all these and did not come out even after Lee was knocked down flat and was nearly going to have his brains ice-picked.
  • edited January 2013
    Molly was a great character. She gives the player information about Crawford and introduced it before Molly you had no idea, And the story feels right about why see left. She needed to be a smart and strong character! Otherwise se didn’t make it out alive alone. Without Molly the episode didn’t make sense. So I know the reason why she made an appearance inside the Walking Dead!
  • edited January 2013
    The way I looked at it Molly is kinna like Michonne from the graphic novels. She just pure badassery! But she isnt as loyal to Lee as Michonne is to Rick. But she was a different type of character than the others. While the other characters have more limitations, she rose above them in that sense, but at the end o the day she is human and she cannot take on 10 walkers by herself, so she still needed the group, but does better as lone wolf as well.
  • edited January 2013
    mollyclam.jpg
  • edited January 2013
    ^pic above^ I would really enjoy that scenario if those two were to link up in the next one!

    I u look at it and think about it only reason Molly saved Kenny and Lee was b/c of lil' Clem
  • edited January 2013
    kevinStark wrote: »
    mollyclam.jpg

    I support that!
  • edited January 2013
    When Molly leaves, She tells Lee to take care of clam. She leaves because she don’t want to take away an space on the boat, Because she can take care for herself without the boat so she leaves. (If you / clam shoot the zombies of her back inside Crawford) Will she comes back for clam when she knows Lee’s dead / the boat idea is of? TOTALLY!!!!
  • edited January 2013
    kevinStark wrote: »
    mollyclam.jpg

    No. Just no. I really don't like Molly. She may be cool and all, but I don't really like her. She is out of place in the story because all the survivors have believable traits and flaws, while she's just a badass zombie-killing chick.
  • edited January 2013
    Kaserkin wrote: »
    No. Just no. I really don't like Molly. She may be cool and all, but I don't really like her. She is out of place in the story because all the survivors have believable traits and flaws, while she's just a badass zombie-killing chick.

    What people do you think survive the longest inside the world like the walking dead? :confused:
  • edited January 2013
    Its called natural selection, she was living in a city infested with the living dead. If she wasn't able to pull that kind of stuff off(all possible) then she'd be among the walking dead.

    Regardless if she was previously involved in parkour or not, you develop skills that are necessary. Especially when your life is on the line. Either you get good at moving around the city and getting out of dodge, or you're dead.
  • edited January 2013
    Lee's group and Vernon's make-a-wish invalids survived for over 3 months without being like Molly. She's like the video game version of Michonne, another character I really don't like, along with many of the current comic survivors.
  • edited January 2013
    Jeenyus wrote: »
    Its called natural selection, she was living in a city infested with the living dead. If she wasn't able to pull that kind of stuff off(all possible) then she'd be among the walking dead.

    Regardless if she was previously involved in parkour or not, you develop skills that are necessary. Especially when your life is on the line. Either you get good at moving around the city and getting out of dodge, or you're dead.

    If you have other people looking out for you, you don't need to get good at anything. Look at the girl in the beginning of episode 3. She fumbles around like a buffoon and gets devoured. I think it's highly likely she had a group protecting her and they all fell to the walkers or some other hazard, leaving her to survive on her own(which she failed).

    There's also a sort of luck involved, like with Vernon's group. They found a hidden underground base pre-loaded with months worth of supplies, thus they don't need to develop the natural survival skills most others do, hence why they have one gun and can barely use it.

    Regardless, Molly is in no way an unbelievable character(potentially barring the mega jump with car battery bit, but still).
  • edited January 2013
    Molly was all alone. But she didn’t fight the zombies she moved the zombies around town with the church bells, The only time we saw here kill a lot of zombies was inside Crawford and she fails after killing 3 zombies… So how do you people know she’s a killing zombie chick??? She just smarted them out.! Molly = believable!
  • edited January 2013
    Lee is a professor convicted of murder that tries to protect a little girl.
    Kenny is a family man stuck in situations where he has to make difficult choices.
    Ben is a teenager that feels useless in a group of people that don't support him.
    They are believable multi-dimensional characters. Molly isn't.
  • edited January 2013
    Molly was inside the group from Crawford she was at Crawford at the begin of the apocalypse. She had a diabetic 14-year-old sister! along with hundreds of other followers, Later on, the safe sanctuary of Crawford tightened it's security, eliminating any liabilities such as children, the elderly, and the sick. Unfortunately, her sister was stricken with diabetes, thus targeting her for banishment/execution. To retrieve medicine for this disease, Molly made a deal with Crawford's doctor, Walter Ashe, and she committed to having sexual intercourse with him in exchange for medicine. Unfortunately, Oberson began sending an inspector down to take inventory of the medicine, and would've discovered their secret. To hide it, Ashe cut off their deal, frustrating Molly. Before Molly knew it, her sister's symptoms began to show, and Crawford's men captured her and presumably killed her.
    Unable to stay at Crawford, she left, beginning the life of a scavenger, scouring houses and cars for supplies. She devised a tactic in which she would ring bells to distract walkers, and would then move to search the cleared areas.
  • edited January 2013
    Kaserkin wrote: »
    Lee is a professor convicted of murder that tries to protect a little girl.
    Kenny is a family man stuck in situations where he has to make difficult choices.
    Ben is a teenager that feels useless in a group of people that don't support him.
    They are believable multi-dimensional characters. Molly isn't.

    More we don’t know from her yet. So how do you know she has no other backstory? :confused: It looks like she lost everyone she loved, And take care for herself now. Its Believable. Deal with it....
  • edited January 2013
    Bla bla bla :D
    More seriously, having to do "favours" to a doctor to get medecine doesn't make you multi-dimensional. Nearly every other character in the game has doubts, fears and breakdowns. That's what makes them "human".
  • edited January 2013
    Kaserkin wrote: »
    Bla bla bla :D
    More seriously, having to do "favours" to a doctor to get medecine doesn't make you multi-dimensional. Nearly every other character in the game has doubts, fears and breakdowns. That's what makes them "human".

    Breakdowns she lost her sister, She carries a picture with her from her sister, She has nothing left to care about but survival. She knows what she’s doing she want to join the group of lee but she looked at the fight between Kenny and ben, and she knows it’s possible she gets no spot on the boat. She leaves because it was the best thing to do… And there are strong people inside the real world how don’t show emotions to other people. To look strong but inside are broke an don’t show it right away. Its Human to... And we don’t know molly yet. She was never been part of the group to notice her deal. Just Give up your hate to molly. :)

    mollyclam.jpg
  • edited January 2013
    Kaserkin wrote: »
    No. Just no. I really don't like Molly. She may be cool and all, but I don't really like her. She is out of place in the story because all the survivors have believable traits and flaws, while she's just a badass zombie-killing chick.

    We dont know if she has any big flaws or weaknesses, we were only with her a little while.

    And for everyone who says her stunts are unrealistic... One name for you all. Jackie Chan. That guy can run up a flat wall do a back flip, spin three times while punching people on the second floor and kicking another upon landing. Ok so exaggerating a little bit, but really the things she does is not impossible. And you would be surprised what your body can do in a time of crisis...

    The disappearing was however a bit odd.
  • edited January 2013
    Kaserkin wrote: »
    Lee's group and Vernon's make-a-wish invalids survived for over 3 months without being like Molly. She's like the video game version of Michonne, another character I really don't like, along with many of the current comic survivors.

    And, as I and others pointed out, Molly was relatively safe and secure behind the walls of Crawford up until a few days before it fell. Hell, as far as we can tell, Vernon's group actually survived longer outside the walls (apart from the poor folks that probably became part of the barricade by Molly's account) than Molly did... considering the cancer patients evidently lacked the option to trade sexual favors to get favors from Dr. Logan.

    The fact that Crawford was pretty much packed with undead is a pretty big clue they didn't spend much time risking their asses outside of camp. Likewise for the fact that the only living residents we see are those who were forced out of the community.
    kevinStark wrote: »
    What people do you think survive the longest inside the world like the walking dead? :confused:

    As the old saying goes "90% of survival is mental". This has held true pretty much since the dawn of man; being a "badass" doesn't matter anywhere near as much in that regard. For the most part, it's a thinking person's game. Our ancestors didn't survive and climb to the top of the food chain by beating Sabre Toothed Tigers and Mammoths to death with their bare hands.
  • edited January 2013
    Why wouldn't people that can jump and do stuff like that be most probable to survive? have you seen the street jumping stuff people post on youtube?
  • edited January 2013
    Just pulled this from where I posted it in another thread based on speculation of the protagonist for Season Two, but I believe it's very relevant here:
    BlackBoxx wrote: »
    But that kills the mood the game series is supposed to set. Molly is extremely competent, which makes it hard to believe anything could actually happen to her without the situation being incredibly "gamed up". She wouldn't allow for tension the way Lee did with the encounter with Sandra, or the police officer who was escorting him to Macon.
    Well that's just the thing: That's not true. Although Molly seems fairly capable, and acts like she's the toughest one in the room, she is only used to working alone. She doesn't work with anyone else and that is her greatest weakness, no matter how strong of a fighter she is, she is inexperienced when it comes to interaction with other survivors. Which is why I think having her as the playable character of Season Two would be so interesting, dealing with the isolated state of mind she has placed herself in since her sister's death crumbling as she becomes part of a group. She is also largely undefined excluding her backstory, while she has a bit of a fiery personality, her moral outlook is still largely ambiguous and able to be molded to the player's choices. And I think that given what happens in Episode Five with the horde shambling into Savannah, she probably will leave the city and run into Clementine, Christa, and Omid no matter what. And I believe that her previous interaction with them is a much stronger starting point for a second season than having to be someone entirely new with no experience whatsoever with the characters we've come to know and love from the first season. The fact remains, the players know exactly who these people are, they are going to make choices based upon that. Thusly, Molly's relative familiarity with them would greatly add some connectivity to the series and would in my opinion prevent any chance of The Walking Dead: Season Two: Some Random Person Comes Along Spends About Two Episodes Getting To Know The Characters We Already Know And Gets Into Shenanigans With The Group Alongside New Characters That Our New Character Apparently Knows That We As The Player Don't. I really hope she is the protagonist simply because she's a very interesting character with a defined background (much like Lee was at the beginning of the game) and yet still not one person can with much sense of accuracy say what she's going to do. In this, she has a great potential for player input to define who she is and what she will do when faced with the choices and responsibilities of working with a group and caring about more than just survival. I feel as though up until she meets Lee in Episode Four, Molly has been surviving for the sake of survival, for her sister. And when she sees the few glimpses of humanity in the group, and finds her sister's picture/ultimately gets her "revenge" on Crawford, she really is at a loss as to where she is supposed to go and what she is supposed to do. And I believe she leaves because she is afraid to face that humanity that she previously felt was lost in the world, she is scared of hope because she is afraid that she will lose it, and that is a character conflict that would be very powerful if they use her as a protagonist. I'm really hoping for Molly, but if she isn't I won't be too disappointed, because whatever Telltale decides I am sure it will be a story to remember...
    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQD4sFQJmXLdo_0nw2_JlZyXWl5FKS0b6TUtYqObdBramiqaw79Ag
    BUT PLEASE LET IT BE MOLLY!
    Molly was by far my favorite character, and I actually felt more connected to her emotionally than I was to Lee, even for the short time we see her. She acts so strong and cold, but behind that there's a lot more to her, a lot of pain and a lot of confusion.
  • edited January 2013
    Why wouldn't people that can jump and do stuff like that be most probable to survive? have you seen the street jumping stuff people post on youtube?

    See above to the post above yours. In actual survival situations, running and jumping everywhere like Molly does isn't all that conducive to actually staying alive (and it's hardly necessary given how slowly Walkers move). It's actually detrimental since it expends more energy and fluids (which means needing more food and water) when they need to be conserved. The people that do so just open themselves up to dying from pretty much every other cause: dehydration, starvation, injury/infection resulting from one of their stunts, etc. This is especially true in warmer climates like a desert or say, Georgia.
  • edited January 2013
    I keep seeing references to Michonne being an unbelievable character, and I am so surprised. I don't know if it's because she's a woman, black, or American that everyone finds her so unbelievable. Her back story is that she had a neighbor who collected swords. While she was in college she took fencing (and it's hinted pretty heavily that she was good at it). So when shit hit the fan, she got a sword from the neighbor's house and used it because it was natural and easy for her.
    Would it be more believable that she could use a sword if she was an Asian transfer student from Japan that just happened to bring swords with her/him just in case?

    Having said all that -

    I find Molly to be believable enough. I didn't like her, but it was more a personality thing. But the parkour she does, the "disappearing acts" and whatnot - are all entirely believable. ESPECIALLY when you consider she's been surviving more or less on her own most of the ZA in a highly infested city. If she wasn't good at sneaking quietly and pulling herself out of tight situations (quite literally), I'm pretty sure she'd be dead.
    I even understand her bailing on the group. She didn't strike me as a family/group sort of person. And that's the main reason I don't think her and Clem will be the main focus of season 2. At least not together as a duo or group.
    Molly isn't the mothering type. I think the only reason she would keep Clem around is because Clem would represent the last of her humanity. But I don't think she'd want to change for Clem and I do think that, at her base nature, she'd be inclined to leave Clem behind if it might cause her own death not to.
  • edited January 2013
    Desmodus87 wrote: »
    I keep seeing references to Michonne being an unbelievable character, and I am so surprised. I don't know if it's because she's a woman, black, or American that everyone finds her so unbelievable. Her back story is that she had a neighbor who collected swords. While she was in college she took fencing (and it's hinted pretty heavily that she was good at it). So when shit hit the fan, she got a sword from the neighbor's house and used it because it was natural and easy for her.
    Would it be more believable that she could use a sword if she was an Asian transfer student from Japan that just happened to bring swords with her/him just in case?

    1. Fine. She has a neighbor who collects swords. She's still a fucking LAWYER. Maybe if she was an actor, or a fencing teacher it would be fine. However...
    2. Fencing doesn't teach you how to use katanas. It teaches you to use rapiers and similar weapons. Generally stabbing weapons, not slashing weapons like katanas.

    I personally don't like her because along with the highly improbable skills, she's also a Mary-Sue personality wise. (I haven't read all of the comics, so I'm mostly going off the TV show and what little bits of the comics I've read.)
    1. She was nice enough to pick up Andrea in the middle of the forest, but then she was suspicious of the Governor without any provocation and no reason to think that the Governor was evil.
    2. She figured out to cut off the arms and jaws of her boyfriend and his best friend, and then later killed them with no remorse.
    3. She seduced Tyreese almost instantly. Tyreese gave almost no struggle against her. Which makes no sense considering everything before that.

    And also, don't just start randomly calling people racist because they don't agree with you. That's a surefire way of being identified as an asshole.
  • edited January 2013
    ^I did find it weird how Kenny never manages to lift Lee off the ground yet a girl could easily.

    Kenny is a lot older than Molly. Plus, she seems to be able to pull herself up easily using the hook. So I assume with more effort, she could pull up Lee.
  • edited January 2013
    Toasty wrote: »
    Kenny is a lot older than Molly. Plus, she seems to be able to pull herself up easily using the hook. So I assume with more effort, she could pull up Lee.

    + He was shot in the chest.
  • edited February 2013
    Well, okay, here's my stand on this. If you're going to survive in a Zombie Apocolypse, you can't be the fat guy who sits in his basement and plays WoW all day. (Probably not, anyway. Maybe you'll fight them off with that golden Lord of The Rings dagger. Who knows.)

    But really, the fact that she WAS able to do those things, explains COMPLETELY why she was there, and why she was surviving easily. If you're a cripple, I don't expect you to be alive in this world. I think Molly is actually far more believable, due to the fact that she proves she knows how to survive. Someone like Omid or Christa? How are they doing it? I don't really understand.

    Overall, Molly being a badass is why she's alive. So, yeah.
  • edited February 2013
    goodguy211 wrote: »
    Well, okay, here's my stand on this. If you're going to survive in a Zombie Apocolypse, you can't be the fat guy who sits in his basement and plays WoW all day. (Probably not, anyway. Maybe you'll fight them off with that golden Lord of The Rings dagger. Who knows.)

    If it has +20 strength and +20 agility, you will survive anything! :D
    goodguy211 wrote: »
    But really, the fact that she WAS able to do those things, explains COMPLETELY why she was there, and why she was surviving easily. If you're a cripple, I don't expect you to be alive in this world. I think Molly is actually far more believable, due to the fact that she proves she knows how to survive. Someone like Omid or Christa? How are they doing it? I don't really understand.

    Ok, let's say she can do all the stunts, but what makes her unbelievable is that she can do it consistently without getting hurt. Someone compared her to Jackie Chan earlier in the thread, but Jackie Chan being a professional stunt performer all his life had suffered numerous injuries within the somewhat controlled setting of a movie set and receiving immediate first class medical treatment.

    Heck, I sprained a calf muscle last week on a jog, and I was limping all week with a minor injury.

    Now imagine the stuff Molly does in a dangerous city with no medical services. She's pretty much guaranteed minor injuries at the very least and probably some serious ones like Jackie Chan has suffered. And I am pretty sure anyone with a limp is pretty much a walker happy meal in a ZA.
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