@GuybrushThreepwood
Hmm hard to say... For season 1 i think i would pick out either episode 5 or 6 whilst i still think that the scene before the theatre in e1 screamed after adventure and i thought i would have a chance getting to the black hole and i really loved the monkey at the entrance. e5 had a very nice gameplay, introduced the cops and great chip music whilst in e6 i loved beeing away from earth on the moon, i liked the shop, the lunar lander and the crystals.
For season 2 i would take out the first half of 201 (in contrast to 203 the phrase riddle (with the record) for instance was fun there) and the second part of 203. 202 mostly wasn't my thing beside of when you had to play sam&max as children.
@ShaggE
Nope, it's the same style like in the first half just with the difference that i liked the second half more which might be something that you like more. Anyway obviously i'm glad that i could enjoy the second half.
@GuybrushThreepwood
Hmm hard to say... For season 1 i think i would pick out either episode 5 or 6 whilst i still think that the scene before the theatre in e1 screamed after adventure and i thought i would have a chance getting to the black hole and i really loved the monkey at the entrance. e5 had a very nice gameplay, introduced the cops and great chip music whilst in e6 i loved beeing away from earth on the moon, i liked the shop, the lunar lander and the crystals.
For season 2 i would take out the first half of 201 (in contrast to 203 the phrase riddle (with the record) for instance was fun there) and the second part of 203. 202 mostly wasn't my thing beside of when you had to play sam&max as children.
Would you say that you enjoyed season 1 more than you are enjoying season 2?
Why are you asking? Looking around if there are any wires connected to a lie detector or hidden cameras around - mum?! *winking*
Also hard to say as s2 is not finishjed yet. From what is known already and if i would see the episodes not connected with each other i guess i would say s2 because the riddle difficulty is more my thing (i like a mix of easy ones and a few harder ones in between, s1 was only offering easy ones in my opinion) and max has improved a lot. They generally behaved too well in s1. And oh we mostly got rid of the poppers!
On the other side if i switch on my memory then the usual annoying things get more and more on my nerves (bull seeing red colour), like beeing in the streets, talking to the same people over and over again. This felt better in s1 as you were not so much used to it yet. I just dislike the repetitive stuff, may it be riddle recycling, the same characters again and again or pressing slightly different ideas into the car miniGames.
But if you think objective about it, s2 is the better one so far.
I just learned that the Rap Riddle is the same as the Sword Fighting sequences from CMI. Just out of curiousity, how do you feel about that repeat riddle format?
Wait, where have you seen that? If it was my comment on the 'we moved back the 203 release date' blog post, that was only because I hadn't bought the full season yet.
No, it's from other message boards & blogs. I'd never say you guys aren't playing the episodes fast enough; you guys are nuts!
I loved this episode! I admit I'm biased towards funny stuff involving zombies, but I thought it was really well done. I was only frustrated on a few puzzles, mostly involving getting cigs into the club, Jesse James hand, and finding out what the antenna was for.
I only have a few nitpicks to make, and most of them don't even have anything to do with the gameplay. First, I thought the zombie shooting sequence scrolled just a little too fast for me. If it were even a tiny bit slower, or maybe if the zombies were more easily distinguishable from the background and random objects whizzing by, it wouldn't be quite as annoying. Your mileage may vary.
Second, there were bolt cutters in this game. Bosco's is locked up from the outside. I believe the logic is obvious, but I was denied this option!
Third, maybe I haven't watched enough soap operas or angsty teenage sitcoms, but I thought Sybil was pretty harsh on Jurgen's monster. Sure, she was recently dumped and bitter, but she could at least have given the 'man of her dreams' a chance before running back to her ex?
Oh, and when you release the season disc, I expect any and all outtakes incurred during the recording of lines regarding how Sybil's contestants are good with their hands.
Nope, it's the same style like in the first half just with the difference that i liked the second half more which might be something that you like more. Anyway obviously i'm glad that i could enjoy the second half.
I beg to differ. You mentioned a couple of negatives in the second half, but they didn't come off as "abrasive" like the first half did. Either way, woot for proving my "trolling" comment wrong
@Zeek
Yep i's kind of equivalent but a) it's not integrated in a bigger concept like the swordfighting was, b) i find "You fight like a cow" a thousend times funnier than *can't remember a phrase* "Yoho blabla..." and c) the swordfighting is more interesting as you strike, the opponent strikes, one after each other and there was a graphical feedback too. Although i found the phrase stuff suited very well in Ice Station Santa.
someone should tell this guy what happens when sam and max bring a gun to a knife fight.... why sword fight when you can just shoot things, or no... even better, why bitch and moan about a game that is ment as light hearted entertainment for a few laughs and some nice puzzles for 8.95 each?
you can say you dont like something without digging at it...
how can i honestly respect your review when you came into the game already disappointed and pissy... you see nothing nice about it, all you see is things to complain about... and reading your posts, it almost seems like you find abratury things to say are "Nice" so that your posts seem like more than just outward complaing all the way through.... and now you are just trying to justify yourself and kissing up to everyone cause it turns out you actually LIKED the damn episode after you finished it....
next time, if you dont have anything nice to say or if you dont at least have the ability to say something in a nice way... dont say it
rewiewing is more than just saying "it sucks, you should have just remade this old game that i liked" you need to have a honest unbiased opinion, and rewiew the game as a whole, not in chunks... and my opinion is, yes... in some ways they could do better, and i believe they will, but for what they have to work with, and the time they have to do it... i am nothing more than impressed with this recent episode, and bottom line... i loved it
and as for the story... they are indeed conected, you are just to narrow minded to see the ongoing themes of the season... and most of the conections are far too out there to be guessed or noticed ahead of time, but i have the feeling that by the start of episode 5, you will have a very good idea of what is going on in the background this season
and you are also being completely condescending as well... how can they do a ongoing story, without a few re-occuring characters and character based locations, when you watch a tv show.. do you say "i hate these actors, lets get a completely new starring cast" or "i hate these sets and locations, lets find/make new ones" no.. you dont
but on some level, i agree with you tummel, if they reuse locations, they need to do more than add new things and dialoge each episode... they need to change things like camera angles (and other ambient things) to make the location feel fresh, and re occuring characters need to be freshened up as well... new wardroabe and whatnot, so each episode they give you something new to look at...
for example.. the new camera angle in stinkys during the shootout let us see some things on the wall we could not see before... and in some ways it made the location seem cool again... but sybils, was almost the same as it was in the begining of the first season... i really wish they did more with it, like have damage from being tossed a city block... move the furnature around, etc. and as for the street... change the time of day each episode, have the trash pile up more and more.. have the damage get worse and worse from each attack, add a few more clickables each episode, etc. i like how the office progresses each epsisode... now do the same for the street and stinkys
now.. see how i did that tummel, that is called "creative input" and ill be damed if someone dont listen to some of it cause i said it in a nice way, and actually gave some "ideas" not just saying, "it should have been like.."
@Zeek
Yep i's kind of equivalent but a) it's not integrated in a bigger concept like the swordfighting was, b) i find "You fight like a cow" a thousend times funnier than *can't remember a phrase* "Yoho blabla..." and c) the swordfighting is more interesting as you strike, the opponent strikes, one after each other and there was a graphical feedback too. Although i found the phrase stuff suited very well in Ice Station Santa.
What about the sneeking in of Holy Water, which is the same recycled riddle as shoplifting the snowglobe from 106?
Personally, I found it to be my second favourite episode so far! The look, the feel and the sheer inventiveness of the shifting game dynamics and bizarre (but logical) puzzles made me really excited to see what would happen in the next 'segment' of the episode.
I actually think that these 're-used locations' are a real boon and one major advantage of the episodic system. Each episode a new 'set' is created from scratch that allows the game-world to grow slightly each time, evolving as the series progresses.
Also, I really hope that TellTale WAS referencing Grim Fandango with the song contest. a)He stole our song lyrics! and b)I swear I heard those same beat-nik drums that used to follow all of the lines in the Blue Casket.
Man, I just loved this episode! Great gags, great locations and I love the fact that charachters (new and old) pop-up when you least expect them. And I do love the ending of this one, where I can't wait to find out what's going on!
A real episodic cliffhanger ending!
This episode, heck this season, feels more coherent for some reason and I could almost taste that sensation of playing one big game. I think it would be cool if for the season 2 dvd TT would present the games as not 5 seperate bits, but as one big-ass flowing chunk where you would flow from one episode into the other. I think that would be awesome!
Oh well, I think this episodic gaming is fun, but I also think a full scale Sam & Max adventure game by TT should be an option.
@Nerdlinger
That's interesting as i'm still waiting to see the benefit of episodic gaming for the gamer. I see plenty of pros for the developer but not this many for the gamer.
One thing which might look as a benefit is that a game is cut into smaller chunks which are kept away from you and you so get the impression of that there is more to play as you can't play through it in less but longer gaming sessions you decide the length of. Another pro might be that you can pick out certain episodes but i wonder how many really do this as i would suspect that either people stay away from it or play it completely but maybe i'm wrong on this one. What i don't see as such a benefit is that you can influence the coming up episodes as the number has decresed from 6 to 5 and when i read things right they are alread producing more or less with something like two epsiodes in advance which narrows that.
For the content i don't see the benefit. Everything could be done in one complete game as well as in a game which is cut into episodes if you design the game according to this. On the contrary in practice this isn't happening. We have all the recycling and it also includes repetitive riddle design already in one episode, like do thing a for x times like convincing Jurgen of something, then do thing b for x times like getting the phrases for the song contest, doing thing c for x times like pressing the right buttons and then doing thing d for x times like getting all the parts for the monster in order to get him through with sybil. On top of this you have this in all episodes, taking Ice Stantion Santa as an example again: providing four horses, getting x phrases right and going through three portals. I don't mind if something like this shows up from time to time but when you're looking at the episodes released in s2 so far then this happens quite often and i doubt that you would bring it up this often if you would be doing a game which people can play in a row.
As written before it's a matter of taste if you prefer more the ongoing road movie or the a return to your base approach. I think the first leads to a better, more interesting and unique gaming experience but is also harder to do. Obvioulsy you also could do it in an episodic format.
Another point i don't understand is the argumentation that you can't expect more as you're only paying $9 for an episode. In the end it counts what a season is worth. For me that's what do i get for the money i've payed when i'm holding the season DVD in my hands. If i sum it up then sam&max is a little bit cheaper than other full price game i bought in retail i was interested in like Jack Keane for instance (but the gaming experience is much less repetitive in Jack Keane) but this is due to the $-€ conversion rate and that you can buy the game via the webstore. So also a game with full length would benefit from this.
TTG is very good at marketing and getting their games to the customers. They are really doing a great job here and selling through a lot of channels like:
1) Selling it to gametap, also with the one day exclusive.
2) Selling the game through their website.
3) Also getting the customers which aren't so fond of web stuff only by offering the DVD after the season is done.
4) Offering the game via Steam.
5) Publishing the game for normal retail via another DVD.
6) Offering the game for the local retail market by working together with local publishers which also do the localisation for them.
7) In the future porting the game to other systems like consoles as well (hopfully mac someday too).
8) Selling all the merchandise stuff around and offering things like the soundtrack.
I really don't grudge them their success and after all it seems that TTG is really getting something out of their work. I suspect it's much more than other delevopers do so i also assume there is a solid finance base for working on the games which also should include making some of the things true which are missing yet.
Anyway after all the only thing that counts is the game. Now if you get asked by someone who is new to adventures of what to play best. I'm sorry but i still recommend playing the old LucasArts pearls first and only after that some of the new adventures. And that is a measurment of how good an adventure really is.
tamuel, I think your problem is that you're stuck in that mindset where nothing can beat the original LucasArts adventures, and you need to get out of that rut. If you put those up there as the pinnacle, then nothing will ever go above your nostalgia. The old LucasArts is gone, you have to move on and not be in the 'this is perfect, so you should be like this' mindset you have.
Also, please note that I'm not putting down the LucasArts adventures, they're great games.
Isn't there an article floating around somewhere where someone from TTG (I want to say Dave, but who knows who really wrote it) explains the benifits of episodic games for the casual gamer?
I think that's the key difference there. Some people like to sit in front of a game for 60 hours and get the full experiance (a la Final Fantasy). Others just don't feel like spending that much time as it would suck the enjoyment out of them. Personally, I like both formats if the story is engaging enough.
I understand how one could complain about the repetitive aspects of these episodes, but that's definetely part of episodes. I mean TV shows all take place in similar environments, and in Sam and Max, TellTale is simply doing that same sort of thing and keeping things familiar to the gamer, yet also adding new environments to go to. It's really the best of both worlds.
As a side, how can one complain about the same old thing in these episodes, when season one, by those same standards (not that I agree as I'm loving the Sam and Max episodes coming out, they get better and better), has the same, if not even more repeting.
Why buy season two, when you must've thought after 6 episodes that this is what you would get?
I'm sorry but i still recommend playing the old LucasArts pearls first and only after that some of the new adventures.
Oh, I completely agree. I mean these episodes aren't up to the quality of Hit the Road or the other classic Lucasarts (or Sierra) adventures - but they're still good fun, and until fully-fledged adventures get big sales numbers again I'm reasonably happy to be fed these tasty little morsels every month. Let's see how A Vampyre Story pans out; maybe it will satisfy my adventure-game lust for a while longer (and might suit your taste more).
Either way, any fan of the classic adventure series of yesteryear is okay in my book.
Yep i agree they are enjoyable (sometimes more sometimes less) but they don't play in the same league as the old ones but why does it have to be this way?
In my opinion one part of the problem is how they use the episodic format. What confuses me is that adventures seem to be the only game genre which experiences this. If you're looking at other genres then you'll most likely find better games which showed up time after time and replaced each other.
There are better games for role playing than Ultima 2 or the Bard's Tale nowadays. [By the way there is a nice old skool indie rpg at http://www.basiliskgames.com/book1.htm .] Same for fps or racing games, ... No one would recommend the original Doom anymore or PitStop because they have been replaced by better games already more than once.
But adventures? There it hasn't happened yet. We have nice 3d gfx (sometimes they could use a little bit better texturing), nice sfx where you only could wish less compression, the engine is smooth and working but the core the story, the riddles, the characters (by the way the monster is a great new character, i wonder if it has been influenced by AVS) and these things have not improved, they are still behind of what we once had. I don't see a logic reason see why it has to be this way. I really hope that they aren't just satisfied with the games done so far and we'll at some point see again games of such a quality so that you don't have to dig out one of those old adventures anymore if beeing asked after great adventures.
Oh man you can't imagine how great it would be if someone would come up asking for a great adventure and you could just say: "You're looking for a great adventure? Run fast and try to get one of the last copies of Marooned on Planet Zombie. It's about two weeks old but i'm not sure as i haven't slept a long since i've played it."
Hi Taumel!
I just wanted to tell you that i'm not able to understand what you are bitching about. I really like the episodes. I also like the old school adventures. They are all great in their own special way.
You also mentioned that old games were replaced by newer ones. But i still play games like settlers II, dungeon keeper 1, warcraft II and so on. i dont think that newer games are necessarily better.
now about full price adventures. i recentliy played overclocked (will be released in the US in March i think - i am from austria thats why i was able to buy and play it - it is already released in germany and austria). it is quite a nice game but it is more repetetive than any of the sam and max episodes. you play for about 25 hours you have 3 locations and i think a total of 15 npcs. puzzzles are hardly existing and noone says anything to hint you what to do next. so you see full prize games are not always good. the only good thing about this game was that it had a cool story. but now the point of this whole story: i think i like it better to pay around 25€ for 5 episodes with a playtime of circa 3-4 hours each instead of playing a 25 hour game with gameplay flaws for around 30-40 €.
as i said before you begin bitching about something really good play something not as good.
thats my two cents
Agreed! Anyway, I WOULD recommend the original DOOM... with DOOM Legacy, of course!
Also, keep in mind that I still LOVE old Adventure games like Quest for Glory, King's Quest, Monkey Island, Maniac Mansion, and, of course, Hit the Road!
One thing I like about episodes that you don't get from more long-form games is the community and discussion that builds up between episodes. You get that sort of thing between sequels, but I very much enjoy that there are monthly impression/discussion threads, as well as multiple ongoing threads about the developing story, which everyone gets to participate in together as it unfolds (instead of everyone going home and sitting alone for 30 hours and then maybe finding some other people to discuss it with, and then maybe the conversation picks up two years later when sequel rumors start). That may not be a positive for you (it might actually be a negative, who knows), but it's something I've been surprised by, and am really enjoying, and it's definitely not an experience you get with other formats of games. (with the exception, maybe, of some MMOs)
In my opinion one part of the problem is how they use the episodic format. What confuses me is that adventures seem to be the only game genre which experiences this. If you're looking at other genres then you'll most likely find better games which showed up time after time and replaced each other.
Well, they tried to do that with Half-Life, and we all know what happened with that as far as getting the product out to customers. But then again, I'm not a fan of shooters. I don't mind the occational shooting sequence (Freddy Farques comes to mind), but I just don't like FPS since the multiplayer games got so overtly serious. Whatever happened to multiplayer games you play with your friends for fun? Oh wait, that's what Mario Party is for?
I think HL2 is better than HL. As for the HL-episodes, well good for them but a real HL3 for sure would have been the better game if you're looking at the two episodes released so far.
I remember the most multiplayer-like fun with games which worked on a split screen or playing such games as Decathlon one after each other, so i'm not a Multiplayer gamer at all but you can't deny that WoW improved quite some things.
@Jake
Yep the community is a plus of epsiodes but the focus should be on the game and not on the fuzz around it.
@Gresman
I also don't think that newer games are automatically better but other genres have brought up good successors whilst the adventure genre wasn't really able to.
i'm quite fond of the hl episodes. they are really nice. each episode is about the size of half of half life 2 which is nice.
i think there are good successors to adventuregames. i think about titles like black mirror or moment of silence these were really good and intense.
Well, they tried to do that with Half-Life, and we all know what happened with that as far as getting the product out to customers. But then again, I'm not a fan of shooters. I don't mind the occational shooting sequence (Freddy Farques comes to mind), but I just don't like FPS since the multiplayer games got so overtly serious. Whatever happened to multiplayer games you play with your friends for fun? Oh wait, that's what Mario Party is for?
I have to agree with the sentiment here. Personally, I don't really play online multiplayer too much, although this may have to do with the fact that the biggest online games all seem to be shooters, which I don't like very much.
One thing I like about episodes that you don't get from more long-form games is the community and discussion that builds up between episodes.
That's an interesting point, Jake. Never thought about that aspect.
What I like most of all, is that you TTGers are active on these forums too.
It's making you very accessable. Something I find seriously lacking in some other companies around the globe.
ps
Hey, this is my 40th post!
Woohoo, after one year!
I think it's A Vampyre Story. Could be wrong though. =x
203 is (to me) the best episode so far. It was juuuuust long enough, and the intro (and outro, too!) was great, probably the best since A.L. Must Die. Characters were great, Superball was back, Flint shot stuff.
Also, the controlling-Sam-as-Max ending = so gud. So very gud.
Yeah i know that it is possible that im wrong and yes i know i can reference games that are not released yet. DNF is a good example. But i still dont get what AVS is.
Do you play video games for enjoyment? Because it seems like you don't enjoy these games. Why do you keep buying them?
By the way, people were BEGGING for the chance to re-visit locations from previous episodes, since it makes it more like an old-school adventure game where there's a big backlog of locations to explore. And now that they finally do it, people complain that they're being lazy.
Do you play video games for enjoyment? Because it seems like you don't enjoy these games. Why do you keep buying them?
By the way, people were BEGGING for the chance to re-visit locations from previous episodes, since it makes it more like an old-school adventure game where there's a big backlog of locations to explore. And now that they finally do it, people complain that they're being lazy.
Comments
Hmm hard to say... For season 1 i think i would pick out either episode 5 or 6 whilst i still think that the scene before the theatre in e1 screamed after adventure and i thought i would have a chance getting to the black hole and i really loved the monkey at the entrance. e5 had a very nice gameplay, introduced the cops and great chip music whilst in e6 i loved beeing away from earth on the moon, i liked the shop, the lunar lander and the crystals.
For season 2 i would take out the first half of 201 (in contrast to 203 the phrase riddle (with the record) for instance was fun there) and the second part of 203. 202 mostly wasn't my thing beside of when you had to play sam&max as children.
@ShaggE
Nope, it's the same style like in the first half just with the difference that i liked the second half more which might be something that you like more. Anyway obviously i'm glad that i could enjoy the second half.
Would you say that you enjoyed season 1 more than you are enjoying season 2?
Also hard to say as s2 is not finishjed yet. From what is known already and if i would see the episodes not connected with each other i guess i would say s2 because the riddle difficulty is more my thing (i like a mix of easy ones and a few harder ones in between, s1 was only offering easy ones in my opinion) and max has improved a lot. They generally behaved too well in s1. And oh we mostly got rid of the poppers!
On the other side if i switch on my memory then the usual annoying things get more and more on my nerves (bull seeing red colour), like beeing in the streets, talking to the same people over and over again. This felt better in s1 as you were not so much used to it yet. I just dislike the repetitive stuff, may it be riddle recycling, the same characters again and again or pressing slightly different ideas into the car miniGames.
But if you think objective about it, s2 is the better one so far.
Where are these boards and blogs?
I only have a few nitpicks to make, and most of them don't even have anything to do with the gameplay. First, I thought the zombie shooting sequence scrolled just a little too fast for me. If it were even a tiny bit slower, or maybe if the zombies were more easily distinguishable from the background and random objects whizzing by, it wouldn't be quite as annoying. Your mileage may vary.
Second, there were bolt cutters in this game. Bosco's is locked up from the outside. I believe the logic is obvious, but I was denied this option!
Third, maybe I haven't watched enough soap operas or angsty teenage sitcoms, but I thought Sybil was pretty harsh on Jurgen's monster. Sure, she was recently dumped and bitter, but she could at least have given the 'man of her dreams' a chance before running back to her ex?
Oh, and when you release the season disc, I expect any and all outtakes incurred during the recording of lines regarding how Sybil's contestants are good with their hands.
I beg to differ. You mentioned a couple of negatives in the second half, but they didn't come off as "abrasive" like the first half did. Either way, woot for proving my "trolling" comment wrong
Yep i's kind of equivalent but a) it's not integrated in a bigger concept like the swordfighting was, b) i find "You fight like a cow" a thousend times funnier than *can't remember a phrase* "Yoho blabla..." and c) the swordfighting is more interesting as you strike, the opponent strikes, one after each other and there was a graphical feedback too. Although i found the phrase stuff suited very well in Ice Station Santa.
someone should tell this guy what happens when sam and max bring a gun to a knife fight.... why sword fight when you can just shoot things, or no... even better, why bitch and moan about a game that is ment as light hearted entertainment for a few laughs and some nice puzzles for 8.95 each?
you can say you dont like something without digging at it...
how can i honestly respect your review when you came into the game already disappointed and pissy... you see nothing nice about it, all you see is things to complain about... and reading your posts, it almost seems like you find abratury things to say are "Nice" so that your posts seem like more than just outward complaing all the way through.... and now you are just trying to justify yourself and kissing up to everyone cause it turns out you actually LIKED the damn episode after you finished it....
next time, if you dont have anything nice to say or if you dont at least have the ability to say something in a nice way... dont say it
rewiewing is more than just saying "it sucks, you should have just remade this old game that i liked" you need to have a honest unbiased opinion, and rewiew the game as a whole, not in chunks... and my opinion is, yes... in some ways they could do better, and i believe they will, but for what they have to work with, and the time they have to do it... i am nothing more than impressed with this recent episode, and bottom line... i loved it
and as for the story... they are indeed conected, you are just to narrow minded to see the ongoing themes of the season... and most of the conections are far too out there to be guessed or noticed ahead of time, but i have the feeling that by the start of episode 5, you will have a very good idea of what is going on in the background this season
and you are also being completely condescending as well... how can they do a ongoing story, without a few re-occuring characters and character based locations, when you watch a tv show.. do you say "i hate these actors, lets get a completely new starring cast" or "i hate these sets and locations, lets find/make new ones" no.. you dont
but on some level, i agree with you tummel, if they reuse locations, they need to do more than add new things and dialoge each episode... they need to change things like camera angles (and other ambient things) to make the location feel fresh, and re occuring characters need to be freshened up as well... new wardroabe and whatnot, so each episode they give you something new to look at...
for example.. the new camera angle in stinkys during the shootout let us see some things on the wall we could not see before... and in some ways it made the location seem cool again... but sybils, was almost the same as it was in the begining of the first season... i really wish they did more with it, like have damage from being tossed a city block... move the furnature around, etc. and as for the street... change the time of day each episode, have the trash pile up more and more.. have the damage get worse and worse from each attack, add a few more clickables each episode, etc. i like how the office progresses each epsisode... now do the same for the street and stinkys
now.. see how i did that tummel, that is called "creative input" and ill be damed if someone dont listen to some of it cause i said it in a nice way, and actually gave some "ideas" not just saying, "it should have been like.."
What about the sneeking in of Holy Water, which is the same recycled riddle as shoplifting the snowglobe from 106?
I actually think that these 're-used locations' are a real boon and one major advantage of the episodic system. Each episode a new 'set' is created from scratch that allows the game-world to grow slightly each time, evolving as the series progresses.
Also, I really hope that TellTale WAS referencing Grim Fandango with the song contest. a)He stole our song lyrics! and b)I swear I heard those same beat-nik drums that used to follow all of the lines in the Blue Casket.
Ahh well.
I admit, it is incredibly similar, and as soon as Superball told me that I couldn't
A real episodic cliffhanger ending!
This episode, heck this season, feels more coherent for some reason and I could almost taste that sensation of playing one big game. I think it would be cool if for the season 2 dvd TT would present the games as not 5 seperate bits, but as one big-ass flowing chunk where you would flow from one episode into the other. I think that would be awesome!
Oh well, I think this episodic gaming is fun, but I also think a full scale Sam & Max adventure game by TT should be an option.
Keep up the good work, people!:rolleyes:
That's interesting as i'm still waiting to see the benefit of episodic gaming for the gamer. I see plenty of pros for the developer but not this many for the gamer.
One thing which might look as a benefit is that a game is cut into smaller chunks which are kept away from you and you so get the impression of that there is more to play as you can't play through it in less but longer gaming sessions you decide the length of. Another pro might be that you can pick out certain episodes but i wonder how many really do this as i would suspect that either people stay away from it or play it completely but maybe i'm wrong on this one. What i don't see as such a benefit is that you can influence the coming up episodes as the number has decresed from 6 to 5 and when i read things right they are alread producing more or less with something like two epsiodes in advance which narrows that.
As written before it's a matter of taste if you prefer more the ongoing road movie or the a return to your base approach. I think the first leads to a better, more interesting and unique gaming experience but is also harder to do. Obvioulsy you also could do it in an episodic format.
Another point i don't understand is the argumentation that you can't expect more as you're only paying $9 for an episode. In the end it counts what a season is worth. For me that's what do i get for the money i've payed when i'm holding the season DVD in my hands. If i sum it up then sam&max is a little bit cheaper than other full price game i bought in retail i was interested in like Jack Keane for instance (but the gaming experience is much less repetitive in Jack Keane) but this is due to the $-€ conversion rate and that you can buy the game via the webstore. So also a game with full length would benefit from this.
TTG is very good at marketing and getting their games to the customers. They are really doing a great job here and selling through a lot of channels like:
1) Selling it to gametap, also with the one day exclusive.
2) Selling the game through their website.
3) Also getting the customers which aren't so fond of web stuff only by offering the DVD after the season is done.
4) Offering the game via Steam.
5) Publishing the game for normal retail via another DVD.
6) Offering the game for the local retail market by working together with local publishers which also do the localisation for them.
7) In the future porting the game to other systems like consoles as well (hopfully mac someday too).
8) Selling all the merchandise stuff around and offering things like the soundtrack.
I really don't grudge them their success and after all it seems that TTG is really getting something out of their work. I suspect it's much more than other delevopers do so i also assume there is a solid finance base for working on the games which also should include making some of the things true which are missing yet.
Anyway after all the only thing that counts is the game. Now if you get asked by someone who is new to adventures of what to play best. I'm sorry but i still recommend playing the old LucasArts pearls first and only after that some of the new adventures. And that is a measurment of how good an adventure really is.
Also, please note that I'm not putting down the LucasArts adventures, they're great games.
I think that's the key difference there. Some people like to sit in front of a game for 60 hours and get the full experiance (a la Final Fantasy). Others just don't feel like spending that much time as it would suck the enjoyment out of them. Personally, I like both formats if the story is engaging enough.
As a side, how can one complain about the same old thing in these episodes, when season one, by those same standards (not that I agree as I'm loving the Sam and Max episodes coming out, they get better and better), has the same, if not even more repeting.
Why buy season two, when you must've thought after 6 episodes that this is what you would get?
Oh, I completely agree. I mean these episodes aren't up to the quality of Hit the Road or the other classic Lucasarts (or Sierra) adventures - but they're still good fun, and until fully-fledged adventures get big sales numbers again I'm reasonably happy to be fed these tasty little morsels every month. Let's see how A Vampyre Story pans out; maybe it will satisfy my adventure-game lust for a while longer (and might suit your taste more).
Either way, any fan of the classic adventure series of yesteryear is okay in my book.
In my opinion one part of the problem is how they use the episodic format. What confuses me is that adventures seem to be the only game genre which experiences this. If you're looking at other genres then you'll most likely find better games which showed up time after time and replaced each other.
There are better games for role playing than Ultima 2 or the Bard's Tale nowadays. [By the way there is a nice old skool indie rpg at http://www.basiliskgames.com/book1.htm .] Same for fps or racing games, ... No one would recommend the original Doom anymore or PitStop because they have been replaced by better games already more than once.
But adventures? There it hasn't happened yet. We have nice 3d gfx (sometimes they could use a little bit better texturing), nice sfx where you only could wish less compression, the engine is smooth and working but the core the story, the riddles, the characters (by the way the monster is a great new character, i wonder if it has been influenced by AVS) and these things have not improved, they are still behind of what we once had. I don't see a logic reason see why it has to be this way. I really hope that they aren't just satisfied with the games done so far and we'll at some point see again games of such a quality so that you don't have to dig out one of those old adventures anymore if beeing asked after great adventures.
Oh man you can't imagine how great it would be if someone would come up asking for a great adventure and you could just say: "You're looking for a great adventure? Run fast and try to get one of the last copies of Marooned on Planet Zombie. It's about two weeks old but i'm not sure as i haven't slept a long since i've played it."
I just wanted to tell you that i'm not able to understand what you are bitching about. I really like the episodes. I also like the old school adventures. They are all great in their own special way.
You also mentioned that old games were replaced by newer ones. But i still play games like settlers II, dungeon keeper 1, warcraft II and so on. i dont think that newer games are necessarily better.
now about full price adventures. i recentliy played overclocked (will be released in the US in March i think - i am from austria thats why i was able to buy and play it - it is already released in germany and austria). it is quite a nice game but it is more repetetive than any of the sam and max episodes. you play for about 25 hours you have 3 locations and i think a total of 15 npcs. puzzzles are hardly existing and noone says anything to hint you what to do next. so you see full prize games are not always good. the only good thing about this game was that it had a cool story. but now the point of this whole story: i think i like it better to pay around 25€ for 5 episodes with a playtime of circa 3-4 hours each instead of playing a 25 hour game with gameplay flaws for around 30-40 €.
as i said before you begin bitching about something really good play something not as good.
thats my two cents
by the way: what is AVS?
i hate abbreviations!
Also, keep in mind that I still LOVE old Adventure games like Quest for Glory, King's Quest, Monkey Island, Maniac Mansion, and, of course, Hit the Road!
I remember the most multiplayer-like fun with games which worked on a split screen or playing such games as Decathlon one after each other, so i'm not a Multiplayer gamer at all but you can't deny that WoW improved quite some things.
@Jake
Yep the community is a plus of epsiodes but the focus should be on the game and not on the fuzz around it.
@Gresman
I also don't think that newer games are automatically better but other genres have brought up good successors whilst the adventure genre wasn't really able to.
i think there are good successors to adventuregames. i think about titles like black mirror or moment of silence these were really good and intense.
That's an interesting point, Jake. Never thought about that aspect.
What I like most of all, is that you TTGers are active on these forums too.
It's making you very accessable. Something I find seriously lacking in some other companies around the globe.
ps
Hey, this is my 40th post!
Woohoo, after one year!
I think it's A Vampyre Story. Could be wrong though. =x
203 is (to me) the best episode so far. It was juuuuust long enough, and the intro (and outro, too!) was great, probably the best since A.L. Must Die. Characters were great, Superball was back, Flint shot stuff.
Can't wait for 204, more episodic gaming please.
I have to say that i could be wrong in this point.
If my research into Monkey Island as proved anything, it's that yes, you can... even if the game will never be released.
By the way, people were BEGGING for the chance to re-visit locations from previous episodes, since it makes it more like an old-school adventure game where there's a big backlog of locations to explore. And now that they finally do it, people complain that they're being lazy.
*This can and should be interpreted as 'all'