well the reason it isn't a flaw, is because i means you actually have a story, if the game was over at the first chance of dying, lee would have died in or after the car crash and there would have been no game.
the point of the game isn't to simply survive, the point is to engage with the story and make choices about the narrative based on your personal feeling towards the situation, the risk in this game is that you make choices that you dislike or regret, not the risk or dying at any time
Perhaps, but telltale isn't known for following trends. Right now movies and games are stagnant, story wise and mechanics wise.
What you… morer saying is even though it is a flaw (even if slight) (since you gave no reason to justify it isn't a flaw) that could be easily remedied, at least in this type of media, it shouldn't simply because it isn't done in other medias?
Also most other games are not completely dependent on choice as a game mechanic. Even other games which put emphasis on choice have other things to fall back on (ie combat is more prevalent and open worlded (less linear) in most other 'choice games' that come to mind which gives a better illusion of mortality).
I understand what you mean. When in my playthrough Carver had his gun pointing at Alvins and my Clem was being hostage, I decided to pick the "Carver, stop!" option. Alvin dies and you know what happen next. The day after I finished the game I decided to see other people playthrough to see diferent choices. Then, the moment came. Same as I was before, the guy picks [Protect Alvin], again, you know how things turns out.
Then I started thinking the same thing you did. Why care and protect Clem, if no matter how risky the situation is, I KNOW she will be alive. I reached to the same conclusion as you did. I thought it would be better if when you choose the [Protect Alvin] option, Bonnie/Troy quickly pushes you to the same place as before and you get to choose the other 3 remaining option. That would be pretty much realistic while still being able to protect Alvin.
Lol yeah what he means is that we should get more dialog options or choices like these where saying the wrong thing or doing something could… more lead to death not saying that we want to see Clementine die but that it would be more realistic and it will feel like Clem isn't always going to be safe and it'll make choices a bit harder and make you think twice before choosing.
well the reason it isn't a flaw, is because i means you actually have a story, if the game was over at the first chance of dying, lee would … morehave died in or after the car crash and there would have been no game.
the point of the game isn't to simply survive, the point is to engage with the story and make choices about the narrative based on your personal feeling towards the situation, the risk in this game is that you make choices that you dislike or regret, not the risk or dying at any time
Consistent no, but it should be there. You should never feel doing a heroic action or an obviously incorrect action will end all hunky dory for Clem. I am neither trying to Clem actively killed, but as far as I know there are no current choices that lead to this.
You're basing this purely off of dialogue choices? I dunno, I'm not actively trying to get Clem killed so I'm not aware about whether or not… more there are any dialogue options currently that lead her to die. But she's died a few times in action sequences throughout the two episodes. It certainly doesn't feel like you're 100% safe. Also consider that not everyone is gonna be a "Well I don't like what this 11 year old said, BLAM!" type person. Why expect a child to get murdered for not saying the right thing? That doesn't need to be a consistent option IMO.
That's another option that would have fit the situation better. Just seeing as I knew there was no possible way Clem would die there was no logical reason to not run into the fray all gungho. If I had even slightly feared the final outcome (as you did) then perhaps I may have come to a different train of thought, but there was really no reason to consider the idea a bad one (especially for Clem in and of herself).
I understand what you mean. When in my playthrough Carver had his gun pointing at Alvins and my Clem was being hostage, I decided to pick th… moree "Carver, stop!" option. Alvin dies and you know what happen next. The day after I finished the game I decided to see other people playthrough to see diferent choices. Then, the moment came. Same as I was before, the guy picks [Protect Alvin], again, you know how things turns out.
Then I started thinking the same thing you did. Why care and protect Clem, if no matter how risky the situation is, I KNOW she will be alive. I reached to the same conclusion as you did. I thought it would be better if when you choose the [Protect Alvin] option, Bonnie/Troy quickly pushes you to the same place as before and you get to choose the other 3 remaining option. That would be pretty much realistic while still being able to protect Alvin.
Glad to see I aint the only one to think about it
I see a lot of defensive posturing centered around a deep-seated lust for the blood of young girls, but only one unqualified "gee-gosh-golly juuuuuust not feeling it" statement concerning Clementine's vulnerability.This is despite continued emotional suffering, physical pain, and her being able to die in myriad ways over the course of the last two episodes.
The passive-aggression inherent in your critique is that you want Clem to die and have been creepily fixated on it for months.
I wasn't around for it. I wouldn't have moaned, sighed, or rolled my eyes. But I wouldn't have been so intensely blind as to not recognize h… moreis death as a possible outcome if that's what you are insinuating. I have no blood lust. I don't even read the comics because they are to distasteful to me. What I do have is an intense desire for the best story that this game could possibly give me, and since I have no fear for Clementine's life (in the slightest) in a world where life is always endagered I am simply just not getting the best.
Due to your obvious labeling of me even after giving sufficient reason to support my ideas and reasons which any reasonable person would see are clearly not creepy (even if they don't agree with my reasons) I feel the need to ask... are you a skilled troll or an oblivious intelligent?
I meant no disrespect, there have been many people who have confused the meaning of this thread. I am just not good at conveying in simple terms what I am thinking. Many people have understood it also so there are people who can follow my confusing train of thought and people, like you, who can't. My point holds validity, whether you agree it holds validity or not doesn't matter. But thanks for stopping in.
I see a lot of defensive posturing centered around a deep-seated lust for the blood of young girls, but only one unqualified "gee-gosh-golly… more juuuuuust not feeling it" statement concerning Clementine's vulnerability.This is despite continued emotional suffering, physical pain, and her being able to die in myriad ways over the course of the last two episodes.
The passive-aggression inherent in your critique is that you want Clem to die and have been creepily fixated on it for months.
I agree with wanting to see more options that can lead to player deaths. Clem getting hit with the bullet meant for Carver would've been the most effective outcome for the 'Protect Alvin' option, IMO. It would add to the tension going forward if people realized they can die by "friendly fire" as well. Though the above would require tweaking things so that Kenny moves into position on his own (which shouldn't be a big issue; don't know why he needed Clem to point that out, tbh).
No, trolling is constantly seeking out avenues to justify tween-snuff for months on end.
At least I hope it is, because if it isn't...yikes are you a creep.
Now that would have been a fantastic outcome to that situation! Thanks for sharing! Not only showing that clementine isn't invincible and that it is possible for her to die because if her actions but that it would have been a friend to do it would add a unique twist. That is the scene I truly had a problem with in this episode, well that and the wind turbine.
I agree with wanting to see more options that can lead to player deaths. Clem getting hit with the bullet meant for Carver would've been the… more most effective outcome for the 'Protect Alvin' option, IMO. It would add to the tension going forward if people realized they can die by "friendly fire" as well. Though the above would require tweaking things so that Kenny moves into position on his own (which shouldn't be a big issue; don't know why he needed Clem to point that out, tbh).
I meant no disrespect, there have been many people who have confused the meaning of this thread. I am just not good at conveying in simple … moreterms what I am thinking. Many people have understood it also so there are people who can follow my confusing train of thought and people, like you, who can't. My point holds validity, whether you agree it holds validity or not doesn't matter. But thanks for stopping in.
Again you don't understand the mechanic I am trying to explain. If you are interested I would be more than happy to try to explain it to you, but not until you stop with the passive aggressive attitude. I love conversing and would like to hear your input but not if it's just going to be you making hostile remarks.
so what is your point? that you don't like that the main character can't die in the game?
what do you want, a permanent game over screen?… more or a new story with a new main character every time the protagonist dies?
what could possibly alleviate your problem of the main character being "invincible" until the end of a story?
go play a permadeath roguelike if you want the protagonist to die, because your complaint isn't valid in a narrative game
I don't really see the point of this. I mean, if Clem dies... then you'd have to go back and pick a different option if you want to play the rest of the episodes. Negative impacts that are NOT the death of Clem would be better I think since the death of Clem just means going back and picking something else.
I completely agree. When Alvin was about to be shot by Carver I ran at him. When Carver put a gun to my Clem's head I just knew he wouldn't shoot Clem. So this really broke the mood for me
He wasn't going to shoot Clem because he knew that Kenny wouldn't take a shot with him using a child as a human shield. IMO he was simply trying to lure the sniper (Kenny) out.
But it shows she isn't a god and can be killed for saying the wrong thing like everyone else. I'm not saying enough times to break immersion, but enough to make the point.
I don't really see the point of this. I mean, if Clem dies... then you'd have to go back and pick a different option if you want to play the… more rest of the episodes. Negative impacts that are NOT the death of Clem would be better I think since the death of Clem just means going back and picking something else.
But it shows she isn't a god and can be killed for saying the wrong thing like everyone else. I'm not saying enough times to break immersion, but enough to make the point.
Basically, the OP is saying, doing certain things in non-quicktime events can't get you killed, it can get others killed, but not you. Like what he said, would you really jump between somebody you barely know, and somebody trying to execute them? No, because it would get your ass CAPPED. Even if you can just respawn, I would HATE to see Clementine get shot in the head.
so what is your point? that you don't like that the main character can't die in the game?
what do you want, a permanent game over screen?… more or a new story with a new main character every time the protagonist dies?
what could possibly alleviate your problem of the main character being "invincible" until the end of a story?
go play a permadeath roguelike if you want the protagonist to die, because your complaint isn't valid in a narrative game
And the mods banned you? Wonder why that happened. I'll just say enjoy your next ban now incase it happens so quick that I don't get to say it.
EDIT: PS why we're you and shandi always fighting? You would have made a perfect troll couple
Aye you are correct I was in an angered state of mind when I wrote that, and I won't do it again. You are still an extremely annoying and skilled troll. Bye
It doesn't need to even show it, a gun shot and a shot of Kenny looking away in disgust would be more than explicit enough. In fact showing Kenny reacting to his action would probably be even more expressive than showing the receiving end.
Basically, the OP is saying, doing certain things in non-quicktime events can't get you killed, it can get others killed, but not you. Like… more what he said, would you really jump between somebody you barely know, and somebody trying to execute them? No, because it would get your ass CAPPED. Even if you can just respawn, I would HATE to see Clementine get shot in the head.
To be honest i didn't know what "Saving Alivn" Choice or whatever would do, i thought she would try and do something like trying to get her bounds off her hands or somethng i dunno. the non verbal options occasionally aren't blunt enough XD
so that's it? they just wanted to die by saying the wrong thing?? well it's only episode 2 so it may happen, but the problem with that is that it basically makes one of the conversation choices the wrong choice, because if you just die after saying something it won't save what you said, you are just magically teleported back in time so you didn't say it, at least if you say something really mean and don't die they will remember that.
it's like this scene with brenda in season 1:
although it is funny to say "put the gun down bitch" and then die, it is pointless to actually do, because you die and have to make a different choice, that isn't a consequence, however if when you said that she shot katjaa and the game continued that would have been a consequence because it wouldn't have reset the game and invalidated your choice
Basically, the OP is saying, doing certain things in non-quicktime events can't get you killed, it can get others killed, but not you. Like… more what he said, would you really jump between somebody you barely know, and somebody trying to execute them? No, because it would get your ass CAPPED. Even if you can just respawn, I would HATE to see Clementine get shot in the head.
It still showed the pc (Lee) wasn't capable of getting away with saying anything he wanted simply because he was the pc. He could die just like every other person in twd in this scene. Also the point of it wasting a valid option would only be a viable argument if it did it in any level which could be considered repetitive, immersion breaking, etc. 1 option per episode (roughly) is hardly that.
so that's it? they just wanted to die by saying the wrong thing?? well it's only episode 2 so it may happen, but the problem with that is th… moreat it basically makes one of the conversation choices the wrong choice, because if you just die after saying something it won't save what you said, you are just magically teleported back in time so you didn't say it, at least if you say something really mean and don't die they will remember that.
it's like this scene with brenda in season 1:
although it is funny to say "put the gun down bitch" and then die, it is pointless to actually do, because you die and have to make a different choice, that isn't a consequence, however if when you said that she shot katjaa and the game continued that would have been a consequence because it wouldn't have reset the game and invalidated your choice
Comments
well the reason it isn't a flaw, is because i means you actually have a story, if the game was over at the first chance of dying, lee would have died in or after the car crash and there would have been no game.
the point of the game isn't to simply survive, the point is to engage with the story and make choices about the narrative based on your personal feeling towards the situation, the risk in this game is that you make choices that you dislike or regret, not the risk or dying at any time
I understand what you mean. When in my playthrough Carver had his gun pointing at Alvins and my Clem was being hostage, I decided to pick the "Carver, stop!" option. Alvin dies and you know what happen next. The day after I finished the game I decided to see other people playthrough to see diferent choices. Then, the moment came. Same as I was before, the guy picks [Protect Alvin], again, you know how things turns out.
Then I started thinking the same thing you did. Why care and protect Clem, if no matter how risky the situation is, I KNOW she will be alive. I reached to the same conclusion as you did. I thought it would be better if when you choose the [Protect Alvin] option, Bonnie/Troy quickly pushes you to the same place as before and you get to choose the other 3 remaining option. That would be pretty much realistic while still being able to protect Alvin.
Glad to see I aint the only one to think about it
Yep!
Oh you are another person who misunderstood the op. Sorry I am terrible at explaining what I'm thinking.
Consistent no, but it should be there. You should never feel doing a heroic action or an obviously incorrect action will end all hunky dory for Clem. I am neither trying to Clem actively killed, but as far as I know there are no current choices that lead to this.
That's another option that would have fit the situation better. Just seeing as I knew there was no possible way Clem would die there was no logical reason to not run into the fray all gungho. If I had even slightly feared the final outcome (as you did) then perhaps I may have come to a different train of thought, but there was really no reason to consider the idea a bad one (especially for Clem in and of herself).
i don't think you have any point except complaining
I see a lot of defensive posturing centered around a deep-seated lust for the blood of young girls, but only one unqualified "gee-gosh-golly juuuuuust not feeling it" statement concerning Clementine's vulnerability.This is despite continued emotional suffering, physical pain, and her being able to die in myriad ways over the course of the last two episodes.
The passive-aggression inherent in your critique is that you want Clem to die and have been creepily fixated on it for months.
It makes me sad that a lot of your comments are downvoted by trolls and kids Viva La Lee
I meant no disrespect, there have been many people who have confused the meaning of this thread. I am just not good at conveying in simple terms what I am thinking. Many people have understood it also so there are people who can follow my confusing train of thought and people, like you, who can't. My point holds validity, whether you agree it holds validity or not doesn't matter. But thanks for stopping in.
Troll. Thanks for clearing that up.
That and it's a pretty controversial topic. Thanks for the nice sentiment
)
I agree with wanting to see more options that can lead to player deaths. Clem getting hit with the bullet meant for Carver would've been the most effective outcome for the 'Protect Alvin' option, IMO. It would add to the tension going forward if people realized they can die by "friendly fire" as well. Though the above would require tweaking things so that Kenny moves into position on his own (which shouldn't be a big issue; don't know why he needed Clem to point that out, tbh).
No, trolling is constantly seeking out avenues to justify tween-snuff for months on end.
At least I hope it is, because if it isn't...yikes are you a creep.
And the mods banned you? Wonder why that happened. I'll just say enjoy your next ban now incase it happens so quick that I don't get to say it.
EDIT: PS why we're you and shandi always fighting? You would have made a perfect troll couple
Now that would have been a fantastic outcome to that situation! Thanks for sharing! Not only showing that clementine isn't invincible and that it is possible for her to die because if her actions but that it would have been a friend to do it would add a unique twist. That is the scene I truly had a problem with in this episode, well that and the wind turbine.
No problem man
A troll you say...?
slowly begins to grin
Uh oh. Time to prepare for battle.
so what is your point? that you don't like that the main character can't die in the game?
what do you want, a permanent game over screen? or a new story with a new main character every time the protagonist dies?
what could possibly alleviate your problem of the main character being "invincible" until the end of a story?
go play a permadeath roguelike if you want the protagonist to die, because your complaint isn't valid in a narrative game
Wait till he gets a load of us.
The protical child returns!!
Again you don't understand the mechanic I am trying to explain. If you are interested I would be more than happy to try to explain it to you, but not until you stop with the passive aggressive attitude. I love conversing and would like to hear your input but not if it's just going to be you making hostile remarks.
I don't really see the point of this. I mean, if Clem dies... then you'd have to go back and pick a different option if you want to play the rest of the episodes. Negative impacts that are NOT the death of Clem would be better I think since the death of Clem just means going back and picking something else.
I completely agree. When Alvin was about to be shot by Carver I ran at him. When Carver put a gun to my Clem's head I just knew he wouldn't shoot Clem. So this really broke the mood for me
He wasn't going to shoot Clem because he knew that Kenny wouldn't take a shot with him using a child as a human shield. IMO he was simply trying to lure the sniper (Kenny) out.
But it shows she isn't a god and can be killed for saying the wrong thing like everyone else. I'm not saying enough times to break immersion, but enough to make the point.
Same here. All I was thinking was "how long is this standoff going to last? It's wasting my time." Because the outcome was known to me already.
Yeah but it would use up one of the four dialogue slots, so we'd end up with less "valid" options that don't lead to a game over.
I thing seeing a little girl shot in the head with a revolver would be disheartening enough...
Basically, the OP is saying, doing certain things in non-quicktime events can't get you killed, it can get others killed, but not you. Like what he said, would you really jump between somebody you barely know, and somebody trying to execute them? No, because it would get your ass CAPPED. Even if you can just respawn, I would HATE to see Clementine get shot in the head.
Careful, you're not allowed to talk about mod action or permabanned users, no matter how mad you get for being called out on your perversions.
Aye you are correct I was in an angered state of mind when I wrote that, and I won't do it again. You are still an extremely annoying and skilled troll. Bye
One option per episode? That is a small price.
It doesn't need to even show it, a gun shot and a shot of Kenny looking away in disgust would be more than explicit enough. In fact showing Kenny reacting to his action would probably be even more expressive than showing the receiving end.
To be honest i didn't know what "Saving Alivn" Choice or whatever would do, i thought she would try and do something like trying to get her bounds off her hands or somethng i dunno. the non verbal options occasionally aren't blunt enough XD
Fair enough. We've had a few of those in the past, wouldn't mind some more (although I don't care if they're absent either).
Understandable.
so that's it? they just wanted to die by saying the wrong thing?? well it's only episode 2 so it may happen, but the problem with that is that it basically makes one of the conversation choices the wrong choice, because if you just die after saying something it won't save what you said, you are just magically teleported back in time so you didn't say it, at least if you say something really mean and don't die they will remember that.
it's like this scene with brenda in season 1:
although it is funny to say "put the gun down bitch" and then die, it is pointless to actually do, because you die and have to make a different choice, that isn't a consequence, however if when you said that she shot katjaa and the game continued that would have been a consequence because it wouldn't have reset the game and invalidated your choice
It still showed the pc (Lee) wasn't capable of getting away with saying anything he wanted simply because he was the pc. He could die just like every other person in twd in this scene. Also the point of it wasting a valid option would only be a viable argument if it did it in any level which could be considered repetitive, immersion breaking, etc. 1 option per episode (roughly) is hardly that.