I agree. While it's not completely immersion-breaking, I really dislike that getting shot in the shoulder has become narrative shorthand for… more walking away from a gunshot. Infection and tissue damage, not to mention blood loss will still be potentially life threatening factors, especially in a post hospital world.
Not a huge deal, I guess, but it rubs me the wrong way.
I didn't specify the US, I just said in a nation's military. There is always surplus that goes around, and the weapon is very popular in Africa and the Middle East. I personally know a few people who have AK's, and ammo. The AK-47 uses 7.62x39mm rounds, which are fairly common. Modern Chinese and Russian Kalashnikov variant weaponry uses the cartridge, amongst others. You would be very surprised how many AK variant weapons can be found in the USA, as well as the ammo. You also make the point of them pinching US army weaponry and ammo, but mention them not finding AKs because of their camp location. If they can't find civilian weaponry because of their location they aren't finding military weaponry either. We've seen that they have 3, and you could find that in one house. I agree that if there was a mix of weapons it would make a bit more sense, but honestly finding an AK is probably not going to be an issue.
I don't think the US military uses AK'S though do they? i thought that was just for militias on a budget in some poor African country - afte… morer all some far more advanced guns have been developed since the AK'S time. http://usmilitary.about.com/od/armyweapons/l/aainfantry1.htm this page goes over some standard issues. America is full of guns, but i would amagine you'll only find AK'S in select gun shops and in the apocalypse (not to mention his camp is the middle of a woodland/national park area) i just don't find it reasonably they would be able to get that many AK'S AND the ammo for them. Now if they came out blasting M16'S - that would be a different story. It's very likely in the even of a apoc the army would have weapon stashes/air drops with crates of ammo, if (or rather when) they got overrun by zombies, it's reasonable to think carver and his ragtag band could stride in and pinch them. But AK's seriously?. WTF are you going to find lots… [view original content]
I didn't specify the US, I just said in a nation's military. There is always surplus that goes around, and the weapon is very popular in Afr… moreica and the Middle East. I personally know a few people who have AK's, and ammo. The AK-47 uses 7.62x39mm rounds, which are fairly common. Modern Chinese and Russian Kalashnikov variant weaponry uses the cartridge, amongst others. You would be very surprised how many AK variant weapons can be found in the USA, as well as the ammo. You also make the point of them pinching US army weaponry and ammo, but mention them not finding AKs because of their camp location. If they can't find civilian weaponry because of their location they aren't finding military weaponry either. We've seen that they have 3, and you could find that in one house. I agree that if there was a mix of weapons it would make a bit more sense, but honestly finding an AK is probably not going to be an issue.
I'm just nit picking with that, I know you didn't mean the interactions, but I still think that if they are going to use guns and such that … moreit should be realistic. The reason TWD is so relatable is because of its realism. It's our world thrown into chaos. As for the shot on Carver, I agree with Clem_Is_Awesome, "It's a caliber 22 that probably lost some power after going through a window and a very thick coat."
Given how they didn't even sweep the whole place before settling in with the hostages; I'd say the chances are pretty high. To say nothing of that one idiot pacing in front of that large ass window. I'd only give Troy and Carver the benefit of the doubt on that front.
I still think it's possible for him to have gotten out of there, but at this point that's just a matter of opinion. Hopefully we'll get a description from Kenny or something insightful as to just how he got out.
I respect your opinion But I think Criticizing a Video Game about Zombies because of lack of realism is being a bit nitpicky specially considering the little things you pointed out , I would support this argument if we were talking about Nba2k14 where your shots get blocked all the time...
Rick in the show hits the Governor there with a .44 and the Governor is fine, in fact he's probably better than ever afterwards. Completely ridiculous, but there's nothing I can do about it now except hope something like that doesn't happen again.
I respect your opinion But I think Criticizing a Video Game about Zombies because of lack of realism is being a bit nitpicky specially consi… moredering the little things you pointed out , I would support this argument if we were talking about Nba2k14 where your shots get blocked all the time...
How realistic are video games, movies, tv shows, books, comics, etc anyway?
Now, I don't know shit about guns, but I know you can get shot in the shoulder (and far more important places) and make it, sometime without much effort (it can even get ridiculous). If the bullet misses the axilar artery, you're supposedly out of any real danger. In fact, the bullet could've hit only muscle (not rare, considering there's a huge muscle in the shoulder called the deltoid). The problem lies on the kind of weapon you get shot with. If it's supposed to rip your arm off by just passing nearby then, well, I suppose Carver should be dead and there's no discussing it.
But, mostly, why am I only hearing of this NOW? I mean, Bonnie got shot in the shoulder with Kenny's same exact generic riflle and Andy St. John got shot right in the chest and still managed to stand up and tell Lee to go fuck himself. Did anyone complain then? I think we need to accept the fact that writers do their best and we can't expect them to know everything. Frankly, Telltale has put more effort in being realistic than practically any other company (in videogaming or otherwise).
The thing about the show is, it's excellent at times, and at others it just feels pointless. I'd recommend watching it, just because it does have some really good episodes, and overall it's not too bad. It just has it's moments like the two I mentioned where I just want to stop watching.
Do not be naive. Kirkman made it abundantly clear at the outset of his comic series that the biggest suspension of disbelief he wanted for the series was what you have so astutely highlighted - the fact that corpses are up, walking around, and reacting to stimuli. Everything else about the series is supposed to be realistic, and I think TellTale and Kirkman have done that pretty well for the comic and the games. However, what we have here is just a technical goof - I doubt that many people have fired an AK-47 in the United States, and I have no idea if TellTale has anyone on staff to keep certain things in mind. The bullet grazing Carver is one thing, but his group lighting up a bunch of zombies with AK-47s while hip-firing and holding on the trigger is patently absurd. Even if it was super fun, the shotgun scene in the Crawford belltower is another example of "WTF were TellTale writers thinking?"
I disagree, this game prides itself on realism, on the human and ex - human front. When they stray from realism it's fine, when they stride, leap, and sprint over the line it is breaking a major role they follow. The above examples aren't terribly breaking, but they are pretty bad (especially firing from the hip).
When people start walking around with heads lopped off, then talk to me about realism.
Just go with it. Nit-picking the game only ruins the experience.
Cartoons sure, cartoons based on really people (existent or not). If it were as simple as "They aren't even real people," then I wouldn't have balled like a baby back bitch at the end of season one.
I imagined the windows of a big skii resort like that would be pretty thick, but I could be wrong. The coat wouldn't matter much at all, you're right, but going through a couple inches of glass might make a difference. Again, I don't know how thick the window was, but it being so large made me think it would also be quite thick.
Going through a window is going to take VERY little power away from it - IT'S 22 CALIBER!! going past the speed of sound at fairly close ra… morenge- and as for a thick coat lol don't make me laugh - that's like saying butter slows down a butchers knife..... by about 0.00000000001 seconds.
This is a reply I made to a similar question on page 1, but I'd like to add here that civilian Kalashnikov variant weapons in the US are semi, and not automatic.
I didn't specify the US, I just said in a nation's military. There is always surplus that goes around, and the weapon is very popular in Africa and the Middle East. I personally know a few people who have AK's, and ammo. The AK-47 uses 7.62x39mm rounds, which are fairly common. Modern Chinese and Russian Kalashnikov variant weaponry uses the cartridge, amongst others. You would be very surprised how many AK variant weapons can be found in the USA, as well as the ammo. You also make the point of them pinching US army weaponry and ammo, but mention them not finding AKs because of their camp location. If they can't find civilian weaponry because of their location they aren't finding military weaponry either. We've seen that they have 3, and you could find that in one house. I agree that if there was a mix of weapons it would make a bit more sense, but honestly finding an AK is probably not going to be an issue.
This. In the US, they should be using scoped M16s or AR-15s with single-shot or burst fire. It's not hard to imagine that they could find am… moremo- the US has so incredibly much of that lying around that they could shoot zombies for a hundred years and not run out.
But an AK? Why? By the way, 7.62 doesn't just go in, it COMES OUT. It doesn't make neat little holes. Those zombies should have been more or less cut to ribbons.
And no matter what Carver got hit with, even if he was able to get up right away, he would not be firing a gun from that arm. It's just ridiculous.
But do you really expect their bodies to react exactly the way you or I would? You have to make some allowances for how difficult some things might be to animate. But like I said, nitpicking just drives me crazy in general. I saw it all the time on the boards for the show. How come the lawn is mowed? How come that person didnt flinch enough when they got hit? It takes all the fun out of it.
Cartoons sure, cartoons based on really people (existent or not). If it were as simple as "They aren't even real people," then I wouldn't have balled like a baby back bitch at the end of season one.
Yeah, that AK shooting part was hard on my eyes. You would think that someone taught them how to shoot properly right? Even small kids know how to shoot with all them military movies/games/videos around. Shooting from the hip is not only unrealistic, it's also a big waste of ammo.
Exactly how you or I would react? Well, exactly is a strong word, but the closer the better. It wasn't that it was harder or easier to animate, it's that they obviously didn't even try. There have been plenty of times someone has held a gun up to their eye and fired in this game, so what purpose did it serve to unrealistically have them shoot from the hip? A shout out to the cod boys perhaps?
I don't usually nit pick, me and my friends would laugh about the little slips in the show, but nothing that would be taken seriously. I have higher standards for the game, the show is there to make money and while the end goal for the game is the same it has proven much more a piece of art than a trivial milking. I'd rather expect the best from the game than sit back and laugh at it (like the show).
While I don't feel these problems were bad enough to put any merit into them, I still think the more you show you are paying attention and that you care the more likely telltale is to pay attention and care.
But do you really expect their bodies to react exactly the way you or I would? You have to make some allowances for how difficult some thing… mores might be to animate. But like I said, nitpicking just drives me crazy in general. I saw it all the time on the boards for the show. How come the lawn is mowed? How come that person didnt flinch enough when they got hit? It takes all the fun out of it.
I have only just had the opportunity to play episode two, as I have been unavoidably away for a few days. I agree that it was vastly superior to episode one, but I do have a couple of gripes.
Firstly the whole character of Carver, for me is totally unrealistic. In my opinion the longer he goes on, the worse the game will get. From what I have read on here from others, I take it there is a very similar character in the series and comics. Having not seen those, it came as quite a surprise.
Yes I know certain people can be nutters in an apocalypse situation, but this was going too far even for a game. Especially one that supposedly prides itself on realism, albeit a game with zombies walking around.
Plus to me it seems telltale are repeating themselves too much. We have had similar fight sequences and now we had the compulsory weirdo stalking them. Sound familiar?
Whats next? Is Kenny going to get bitten, chop his arm off and go looking for Clementine? Wouldn't surprise me.
Finally we have the Bonnie character. Shes seen wandering around the house, looking through the windows. These are supposed to be hardened people, distrustful of everyone. So what do they do? Yes, let's give her some food and let her on her merry way when they knew people were chasing Clementines group. I have heard of gullible, but that's ridiculous. Of all the characters telltale could have brought back, they had to bring back Bonnie. I never trusted her in 400 days, so if I had my way, I would have shot her on sight.
All that being said I did enjoy episode two, but telltale need to tone down the Carver character a bit or get rid of him entirely. Have Clementine shoot the b*stard in episode three or something, as they don't need to have a master villain. Get enough of that in run of the mill games, like Resident Evil etc. He might be okay for some of the kids that play this, or even some unimaginative adults, but I thought telltale were more original than that.
Still lets see how the rest of season two plays out. I hope it continues to improve.
The only two points at which I really had to scratch my head were letting Bonnie just walk away and Carlos telling Clem that Carver has a camp nearby.
If Carver has a camp nearby, why on earth would the group settle down at the cabin? I thought they were terrified of the guy. I can understand spending a night there, but making a home of it?
Comments
I'll be pleased if we get the chance to "clean" Carver's wound with stagnant water.
I wouldn't turn down that opportunity, no.
I didn't specify the US, I just said in a nation's military. There is always surplus that goes around, and the weapon is very popular in Africa and the Middle East. I personally know a few people who have AK's, and ammo. The AK-47 uses 7.62x39mm rounds, which are fairly common. Modern Chinese and Russian Kalashnikov variant weaponry uses the cartridge, amongst others. You would be very surprised how many AK variant weapons can be found in the USA, as well as the ammo. You also make the point of them pinching US army weaponry and ammo, but mention them not finding AKs because of their camp location. If they can't find civilian weaponry because of their location they aren't finding military weaponry either. We've seen that they have 3, and you could find that in one house. I agree that if there was a mix of weapons it would make a bit more sense, but honestly finding an AK is probably not going to be an issue.
Ok. fair enough i see your point
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Carver had some of the Michael Madsen bad-ass sauce before assaulting the ski lodge.
Never leave home in the zambie apocalypse without a trusty batch of Madsen's kickass hot sauce.
It still went inside his body. He still shouldn't be able to use his arm again for a while.
I agree he should have been wounded a bit more significantly, but it wasn't necessarily a definite kill shot was why I agreed with Clem.
Oh yeah, I'm not saying that. If realism was the case, then Kenny would be dead as a fucking doorknob.
It's a game.... who needs realism in a game when you live a real life.
Given how they didn't even sweep the whole place before settling in with the hostages; I'd say the chances are pretty high. To say nothing of that one idiot pacing in front of that large ass window. I'd only give Troy and Carver the benefit of the doubt on that front.
I still think it's possible for him to have gotten out of there, but at this point that's just a matter of opinion. Hopefully we'll get a description from Kenny or something insightful as to just how he got out.
I respect your opinion But I think Criticizing a Video Game about Zombies because of lack of realism is being a bit nitpicky specially considering the little things you pointed out , I would support this argument if we were talking about Nba2k14 where your shots get blocked all the time...
The show isn't known for it's realism.
He could have been wearing a bulletproof vest which would have at least cushioned the blow a bit.
I see the game as pretty realistic apart form the zombies. The people are the most realistic thing in this game, they are all believable characters.
It definitely has some highly unrealistic parts, but that one really got to me. That and Merle's death.
I don't watch the show, I just hear it's unrealistic. From what's said about it I'm not bothered to start watching it.
How realistic are video games, movies, tv shows, books, comics, etc anyway?
Now, I don't know shit about guns, but I know you can get shot in the shoulder (and far more important places) and make it, sometime without much effort (it can even get ridiculous). If the bullet misses the axilar artery, you're supposedly out of any real danger. In fact, the bullet could've hit only muscle (not rare, considering there's a huge muscle in the shoulder called the deltoid). The problem lies on the kind of weapon you get shot with. If it's supposed to rip your arm off by just passing nearby then, well, I suppose Carver should be dead and there's no discussing it.
But, mostly, why am I only hearing of this NOW? I mean, Bonnie got shot in the shoulder with Kenny's same exact generic riflle and Andy St. John got shot right in the chest and still managed to stand up and tell Lee to go fuck himself. Did anyone complain then? I think we need to accept the fact that writers do their best and we can't expect them to know everything. Frankly, Telltale has put more effort in being realistic than practically any other company (in videogaming or otherwise).
The thing about the show is, it's excellent at times, and at others it just feels pointless. I'd recommend watching it, just because it does have some really good episodes, and overall it's not too bad. It just has it's moments like the two I mentioned where I just want to stop watching.
Do not be naive. Kirkman made it abundantly clear at the outset of his comic series that the biggest suspension of disbelief he wanted for the series was what you have so astutely highlighted - the fact that corpses are up, walking around, and reacting to stimuli. Everything else about the series is supposed to be realistic, and I think TellTale and Kirkman have done that pretty well for the comic and the games. However, what we have here is just a technical goof - I doubt that many people have fired an AK-47 in the United States, and I have no idea if TellTale has anyone on staff to keep certain things in mind. The bullet grazing Carver is one thing, but his group lighting up a bunch of zombies with AK-47s while hip-firing and holding on the trigger is patently absurd. Even if it was super fun, the shotgun scene in the Crawford belltower is another example of "WTF were TellTale writers thinking?"
Carver is a sentient walker. Ever seen him run?
I disagree, this game prides itself on realism, on the human and ex - human front. When they stray from realism it's fine, when they stride, leap, and sprint over the line it is breaking a major role they follow. The above examples aren't terribly breaking, but they are pretty bad (especially firing from the hip).
Cartoons sure, cartoons based on really people (existent or not). If it were as simple as "They aren't even real people," then I wouldn't have balled like a baby back bitch at the end of season one.
I imagined the windows of a big skii resort like that would be pretty thick, but I could be wrong. The coat wouldn't matter much at all, you're right, but going through a couple inches of glass might make a difference. Again, I don't know how thick the window was, but it being so large made me think it would also be quite thick.
Actually the zombie apocalipse is possible maybe not like reanimated corpses but imagine a rabies virus mutation
This is a reply I made to a similar question on page 1, but I'd like to add here that civilian Kalashnikov variant weapons in the US are semi, and not automatic.
I didn't specify the US, I just said in a nation's military. There is always surplus that goes around, and the weapon is very popular in Africa and the Middle East. I personally know a few people who have AK's, and ammo. The AK-47 uses 7.62x39mm rounds, which are fairly common. Modern Chinese and Russian Kalashnikov variant weaponry uses the cartridge, amongst others. You would be very surprised how many AK variant weapons can be found in the USA, as well as the ammo. You also make the point of them pinching US army weaponry and ammo, but mention them not finding AKs because of their camp location. If they can't find civilian weaponry because of their location they aren't finding military weaponry either. We've seen that they have 3, and you could find that in one house. I agree that if there was a mix of weapons it would make a bit more sense, but honestly finding an AK is probably not going to be an issue.
At least is not infinite ammo
But do you really expect their bodies to react exactly the way you or I would? You have to make some allowances for how difficult some things might be to animate. But like I said, nitpicking just drives me crazy in general. I saw it all the time on the boards for the show. How come the lawn is mowed? How come that person didnt flinch enough when they got hit? It takes all the fun out of it.
How do you know its a .22?
Yeah, that AK shooting part was hard on my eyes. You would think that someone taught them how to shoot properly right? Even small kids know how to shoot with all them military movies/games/videos around. Shooting from the hip is not only unrealistic, it's also a big waste of ammo.
About your debate in huge recoil, some AK-47s come in small calibers such as .22, just saying.
Anyway I think we're all thinking to much about this. Let's just enjoy the game (:
I cannot believe some of you guys are THIS upset over some assholes hipfiring their AK's.
Carver is immortal.
What if Carver was smart and wearing a bullet resistant vest under his coat?
EDIT: It would certainly explain how he is able to be so casual about being shot at right up until he got shot.
Exactly how you or I would react? Well, exactly is a strong word, but the closer the better. It wasn't that it was harder or easier to animate, it's that they obviously didn't even try. There have been plenty of times someone has held a gun up to their eye and fired in this game, so what purpose did it serve to unrealistically have them shoot from the hip? A shout out to the cod boys perhaps?
I don't usually nit pick, me and my friends would laugh about the little slips in the show, but nothing that would be taken seriously. I have higher standards for the game, the show is there to make money and while the end goal for the game is the same it has proven much more a piece of art than a trivial milking. I'd rather expect the best from the game than sit back and laugh at it (like the show).
While I don't feel these problems were bad enough to put any merit into them, I still think the more you show you are paying attention and that you care the more likely telltale is to pay attention and care.
Quarantine
I have only just had the opportunity to play episode two, as I have been unavoidably away for a few days. I agree that it was vastly superior to episode one, but I do have a couple of gripes.
Firstly the whole character of Carver, for me is totally unrealistic. In my opinion the longer he goes on, the worse the game will get. From what I have read on here from others, I take it there is a very similar character in the series and comics. Having not seen those, it came as quite a surprise.
Yes I know certain people can be nutters in an apocalypse situation, but this was going too far even for a game. Especially one that supposedly prides itself on realism, albeit a game with zombies walking around.
Plus to me it seems telltale are repeating themselves too much. We have had similar fight sequences and now we had the compulsory weirdo stalking them. Sound familiar?
Whats next? Is Kenny going to get bitten, chop his arm off and go looking for Clementine? Wouldn't surprise me.
Finally we have the Bonnie character. Shes seen wandering around the house, looking through the windows. These are supposed to be hardened people, distrustful of everyone. So what do they do? Yes, let's give her some food and let her on her merry way when they knew people were chasing Clementines group. I have heard of gullible, but that's ridiculous. Of all the characters telltale could have brought back, they had to bring back Bonnie. I never trusted her in 400 days, so if I had my way, I would have shot her on sight.
All that being said I did enjoy episode two, but telltale need to tone down the Carver character a bit or get rid of him entirely. Have Clementine shoot the b*stard in episode three or something, as they don't need to have a master villain. Get enough of that in run of the mill games, like Resident Evil etc. He might be okay for some of the kids that play this, or even some unimaginative adults, but I thought telltale were more original than that.
Still lets see how the rest of season two plays out. I hope it continues to improve.
The only two points at which I really had to scratch my head were letting Bonnie just walk away and Carlos telling Clem that Carver has a camp nearby.
If Carver has a camp nearby, why on earth would the group settle down at the cabin? I thought they were terrified of the guy. I can understand spending a night there, but making a home of it?