But Sam and Max was well presented. They made it look like the comic books, and that's what fans wanted rather than 3-D. Presentation is very important. When it comes to adventure games it can be used to create a atmosphere. Doom 3d had gameplay that didn't have much story, but compare it to the original Doom and it's overflowing with story. Doom 3-D didn't need story, but they threw some in for good measure. People buy FPS like Doom for the action, and presentation is important there.
I'm going to go with 2-D because i had a lot of trouble with the Escape from Monkey Island ranging from crashes, trying to angle my character jsut right to activate an action and the difficulty of finding objects (coffee cup in the window, glue next to stan's shop)
I don't know why everyone is convinced 2d adventure games don't have a future.
Partly because GFX card manufacturers are supposidly pushing games companies to only release 3-d games. A cool 2d game with whizzy SFX is less like to sell cards compared to a 3d game.
In the future there will be only 3D games, but will there be still adventures? Will there be story-telling games? We all know the answer.
I don't think there will only be 3D games. As production costs continue to go up in game development I think there is going to be a continuing trend of garage start-ups emerging again like it did in the 80's.
To me the interface is more important than the 2D vs. 3D argument. I may have said this before, but I hated having to use the arrow keys to spin guybrush around and move him in EMI. I would have been fine with the 3D if I could have just clicked with the mouse to move him. 3D or 2D as long as it is point and click - which I know is what Telltale has said they will do.
But Sam and Max was well presented. They made it look like the comic books, and that's what fans wanted rather than 3-D.
Absolutely. It was incredibly rich in story, amination, humor, puzzle challenges, and so forth. The fact that it was not pseudo-3D does not diminish the game one iota. I'm only saying that I'm not impressed with how a lot of people that I have had this discussion with over my 20 years of gaming somehow come to think that 2D != quality and 3D == fantastic!
Uh, yeah, okay. Is that why the ASCII-based Nethack and the totally 2D Ultima VII are still very popular? B-)
So, is this game 3D on 2D backgrounds? It looks that way but I haven't read a single comment in an interview that says so. They all simply say 3D, and it's hard to tell if it's 2.5D or really nice realtime 3D.
3D does not necessarily mean any difference regarding the mouse interface. You can have the same beautiful still screens and a point-and-click mouse interface like the old Monkey Island games, and at the same time it's all rendered in 3D. And if the graphics are done well, you can enjoy the game just as any classic 2D game.
But with 3D you can also unleash the camera all of a sudden, and the whole scene begins to move, or you can change the camera position in dialogs and make close-ups of characters. You have many possibilities in 3D, and if the game is done right, it can still have the spirit of the 2D classics.
Have a look at Ankh to see what I mean
In the the newsarama interview, it says the game features 3D characters and environments, which I would take to mean real-time 3D.
But hey, if you don't buy that dig around some of the old interviews and I'm sure you'll find where they say it point-blank - it's there somewhere. Maybe one of the team members will even confirm it for you.
All that says is lovingly rendered in 3D. That could very well mean a constructed 3D world displayed via prerenders. I'm sure it does mean realtime, but it is ambiguous.
The same goes for the Newsrama interview. It says 3D characters and environments. Again, we know the environments are constructed in 3D, but that quote doesn't mean they're displayed in realtime in the game.
This is beginning to remind me of the debate over whether or not Sam & Max 2 (sorry) was pre-rendered or in realtime 3D based on some not-so-clear screenshots from a magazine scan. Suffice to say a game can look pre-rendered when it's not.
Oh, that was cruel - reminding us of the game that never came to be. (Damn you to hell, Lucas!!!!)
Thank you so much for bringing up such a painful subject. While you're at it, why don't you give me a nice paper cut and pour lemon juice on it? -- Miracle Max (No, not that Max)
Would it be possible for someone to add mouse-driven interface to Monkey Island 4, and Grim Fandango? Like add it to the SCUMM emulator?
I would think that SCUMM emulator developers could add this option. Add an interupt in the emulator, that intercepts the controls. So where you point with mouse, gets converted.
I would think that SCUMM emulator developers could add this option. Add an interupt in the emulator, that intercepts the controls. So where you point with mouse, gets converted.
That's impossible.
Grim and Monkey 4 are not programmed in SCUMM.
Dom
I enjoy 2d adventure games far more then 3d. In terms of techonology, I think Curse of Monkey Island was the greatest. It had beautiful art and animation yet was still 2d. If they made a game like that now, using modern rendering techniques, it would be stunning.
yeah, that would be so cool! curse was my favorite because of those same reasons. we need more games like that
Well, I'm nowadays starting to accept the 3D even in adventure games, but the thing that bothers me greatly is the user interface.
I love point 'n click -adventure, when it is real point 'n click, which means you control the game with a mouse and not with your keyboard like in Grim Fandango (otherwise that game is brilliant). I find the moving and doing stuff as a pain in my butt if I can't do it simply by clicking the target with my mouse.
Good thing these new Sam 'n Max -episodes do it traditionally.
Comments
2d rocks
and 3d in S&M2 screens reaaly looked good
Partly because GFX card manufacturers are supposidly pushing games companies to only release 3-d games. A cool 2d game with whizzy SFX is less like to sell cards compared to a 3d game.
I don't think there will only be 3D games. As production costs continue to go up in game development I think there is going to be a continuing trend of garage start-ups emerging again like it did in the 80's.
Therefore I am happy.
Uh, yeah, okay. Is that why the ASCII-based Nethack and the totally 2D Ultima VII are still very popular? B-)
But with 3D you can also unleash the camera all of a sudden, and the whole scene begins to move, or you can change the camera position in dialogs and make close-ups of characters. You have many possibilities in 3D, and if the game is done right, it can still have the spirit of the 2D classics.
Have a look at Ankh to see what I mean
But hey, if you don't buy that dig around some of the old interviews and I'm sure you'll find where they say it point-blank - it's there somewhere. Maybe one of the team members will even confirm it for you.
http://www.telltalegames.com/bone_the_game?action=bone_game&sub=game
All that says is lovingly rendered in 3D. That could very well mean a constructed 3D world displayed via prerenders. I'm sure it does mean realtime, but it is ambiguous.
The same goes for the Newsrama interview. It says 3D characters and environments. Again, we know the environments are constructed in 3D, but that quote doesn't mean they're displayed in realtime in the game.
Thank you so much for bringing up such a painful subject. While you're at it, why don't you give me a nice paper cut and pour lemon juice on it? -- Miracle Max (No, not that Max)
I would think that SCUMM emulator developers could add this option. Add an interupt in the emulator, that intercepts the controls. So where you point with mouse, gets converted.
That's impossible.
Grim and Monkey 4 are not programmed in SCUMM.
Dom
I second that!
I love those old fashion 2D games.
Runaway. Beautiful looking game, but horrible plot, characters & puzzles.
I love point 'n click -adventure, when it is real point 'n click, which means you control the game with a mouse and not with your keyboard like in Grim Fandango (otherwise that game is brilliant). I find the moving and doing stuff as a pain in my butt if I can't do it simply by clicking the target with my mouse.
Good thing these new Sam 'n Max -episodes do it traditionally.