I really would hope that I don't have to repeat it much more. I wish people would be more interested in discussing the actual point instead of trying to add something to my post that I never said or implied.
. Aside from straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically
You said that after the first post was made, I was going off of the f… moreirst post which if most people were to look at would conclude it to you actually meaning what you said in your hypothetical situation.
It isn't. If you didn't understand my post, I'm all for clarifying it to you... but that doesn't mean that I did a "terrible" job explaining myself simply because you failed to understand.
I don't think you actually understand what I'm talking about though. It's not a matter of me not understanding, it's a matter of how you said it. Just by looking at your first post, I quote "I shouldn't be able to just wake up one day and say "You know what.. I really feel like I identify as a woman today" " is 100% saying that Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things the opposite gender does out of nowhere. This is why clarification was n… [view original content]
It was though, again I'm just talking about his first post. The only way you'd be able to understand that it was a hypothetical situation he was talking about is by assuming.
You said that after the first post was made, I was going off of the first post which if most people were to look at would conclude it to you actually meaning what you said in your hypothetical situation.
Yeah, I had a couple of typos there. My bad. I know that I didn't straight up say that I was speaking hypothetically in my original post. Let me rephrase what I said. Aside from not straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically, I couldn't have been more clear.
It's not a matter of me not understanding, it's a matter of how you said it. Just by looking at your first post, I quote "I shouldn't be able to just wake up one day and say "You know what.. I really feel like I identify as a woman today" " is 100% saying that Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things the opposite gender does out of nowhere.
No, that is not "100%" saying that at all. There is absolutely no reason to infer that. I keep saying this, but you're trying to apply meaning to my post that need not be applied. You're pulling it out of nowhere. Furthermore, you're also now taking my statments out of context, which is even worse. Like I said above, if you actually read and understood the point of my post it would be very easy to understand that I was simply giving a basic hypothetical example.
. Aside from straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically
You said that after the first post was made, I was going off of the f… moreirst post which if most people were to look at would conclude it to you actually meaning what you said in your hypothetical situation.
It isn't. If you didn't understand my post, I'm all for clarifying it to you... but that doesn't mean that I did a "terrible" job explaining myself simply because you failed to understand.
I don't think you actually understand what I'm talking about though. It's not a matter of me not understanding, it's a matter of how you said it. Just by looking at your first post, I quote "I shouldn't be able to just wake up one day and say "You know what.. I really feel like I identify as a woman today" " is 100% saying that Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things the opposite gender does out of nowhere. This is why clarification was n… [view original content]
It wasn't his word choice, or presentation.
It was though, again I'm just talking about his first post. The only way you'd be able to understand that it was a hypothetical situation he was talking about is by assuming.
Aside from not straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically, I couldn't have been more clear.
That's the thing though, if you don't inform people that you're speaking hypothetically then you're anything but clear. It'd be like if I said "I hate gays" and didn't say a "Just kidding" afterwards or something, if you're not 100% clear about what you're saying then people are going to take it the wrong way.
There is absolutely no reason to infer that.
Yes, there is though. If you use "Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things" as an example of how things go for Transsexuals then it can be inferred that you actually believe that to be true.
You're pulling it out of nowhere
I'm not though, again, I'm pulling it from what you said.
Again, I don't think you understand what I'm saying. What you meant to say, and what you actually did say are 2 completely different things.
You said that after the first post was made, I was going off of the first post which if most people were to look at would conclude it to you… more actually meaning what you said in your hypothetical situation.
Yeah, I had a couple of typos there. My bad. I know that I didn't straight up say that I was speaking hypothetically in my original post. Let me rephrase what I said. Aside from not straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically, I couldn't have been more clear.
It's not a matter of me not understanding, it's a matter of how you said it. Just by looking at your first post, I quote "I shouldn't be able to just wake up one day and say "You know what.. I really feel like I identify as a woman today" " is 100% saying that Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things the opposite gender does out of nowhere.
No, that is not "100%" saying that at all. There is absolutely no reason to infer tha… [view original content]
Honestly, the main reason why I'm personally against it is because the majority of the harm is actually inflicted on the transgender individual. I think we would both agree that it can be very difficult for them to reintegrate into society as a member of the opposite sex. I don't think that they will ever truly feel like an accepted member of the sex that they think they belong to, and I think it is difficult for members of the actual sex to be comfortable with someone of the opposite sex just inviting themselves into their privacy. I think people with this "mentality", "distorder", or whatever you want to call it, should be helped through their delusion. Having the procedure readily available just enables them.
What harm does it do to "play along"? Even if you're correct and a transgender person is trying to live out something that could never possi… morebly be real, does it harm you in any way to make them feel happier by pretending? I can see if it was detrimental in some way that you would reject the notion, but them playing dress up doesn't effect you in any other way than a raised eyebrow.
Dichotomy was in reference to your comparison to the black struggle. Sex and race are not the same thing (which is why I mentioned our dichotomic stance as a species, which is fact). It had absolutely nothing to do with my stance on the subject, only your incompatible comparison.
Why is my comparison incompatible? Originally you said that it was because race is not a dichotomy. But now you're saying that sex isn't a dichotomy either, so I'm confused.
Another bathroom is not that costly, it would be located next to the others so it would already have all of the plumbing necessities at hand and it wouldn't need to be large. Why is a third bathroom too much to ask for? Many places already have one for handicap accessibility.
What does a handicap bathroom have to do with anything? They can't turn the handicap bathroom into a trans bathroom. Then you wouldn't have a handicap bathroom anymore. Also, may places don't have handicap bathrooms, just handicap stalls. Have you ever renovated a room before? It's not cheap, and multiplying that cost across every business is ridiculous just to accommodate transphobic people.
They are saying that they are different, because they are. Inarguably so. As I said above, fostering overall acceptance is important, but no… moret where purposeful division of the sexes is implimented.
Dichotomy was in reference to your comparison to the black struggle. Sex and race are not the same thing (which is why I mentioned our dichotomic stance as a species, which is fact). It had absolutely nothing to do with my stance on the subject, only your incompatible comparison.
Another bathroom is not that costly, it would be located next to the others so it would already have all of the plumbing necessities at hand and it wouldn't need to be large. Why is a third bathroom too much to ask for? Many places already have one for handicap accessibility.
That's the thing though, if you don't inform people that you're speaking hypothetically then you're anything but clear.
That's overkill, and I think you know that. That would be akin to saying "in my opinion" after every opinion that you give. It was pretty much a given that I was giving a random example/ hypothetical based on the nature of my post. Did you even fully read what I said, or what I even responded to in the first place? Someone had said that gender identity is all that matters when looking at how any given person should interact between sexes, so I gave an example to show how flawed that line of thinking can be. What else is there to explain? It's pretty apparent that you missed the point, because if you had understood it, you would understand that I was by no means what so ever trying to define the process of someone becoming transexual. I wasn't speaking about that at all, which shows that you're taking my statement completely out of context.
Yes, there is though. If you use "Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things" as an example of how things go for Transsexuals then it can be inferred that you actually believe that to be true.
Except I didn't do that. Honestly, if you're still a little confused here, just go back and reread my original post, as well as reread the post of the person that I was responding to.
Aside from not straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically, I couldn't have been more clear.
That's the thing though, if you d… moreon't inform people that you're speaking hypothetically then you're anything but clear. It'd be like if I said "I hate gays" and didn't say a "Just kidding" afterwards or something, if you're not 100% clear about what you're saying then people are going to take it the wrong way.
There is absolutely no reason to infer that.
Yes, there is though. If you use "Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things" as an example of how things go for Transsexuals then it can be inferred that you actually believe that to be true.
You're pulling it out of nowhere
I'm not though, again, I'm pulling it from what you said.
Again, I don't think you understand what I'm saying. What you meant to say, and what you actually did say are 2 completely different things.
Do the differences in race and the dichotomic human sexes need to be spelled out for you? Is that the road we're going down?
Did I say they should renovate the bathrooms? Or was I suggesting that it obviously isn't that hard to accomplish because it's already happening with the implementation of similar scenarios in the form of handicap bathrooms?
It seems this entire conversation is missing its mark.
Dichotomy was in reference to your comparison to the black struggle. Sex and race are not the same thing (which is why I mentioned our dicho… moretomic stance as a species, which is fact). It had absolutely nothing to do with my stance on the subject, only your incompatible comparison.
Why is my comparison incompatible? Originally you said that it was because race is not a dichotomy. But now you're saying that sex isn't a dichotomy either, so I'm confused.
Another bathroom is not that costly, it would be located next to the others so it would already have all of the plumbing necessities at hand and it wouldn't need to be large. Why is a third bathroom too much to ask for? Many places already have one for handicap accessibility.
What does a handicap bathroom have to do with anything? They can't turn the handicap bathroom into a trans bathroom. Then you wouldn't have a handicap bathroom anymore. Also, may places don't have handi… [view original content]
It was pretty much a given that I was giving a random example/ hypothetical.
Oh my god, no it wasn't. And can you please stop accusing me of not actually reading your post? Because I think you've made it clear you aren't even reading fully through my posts, since you're basically just repeating yourself with things I've already addressed and countered with actual points. I've already said, your first post, gives me no actual reason to believe that you were talking about a hypothetical situation, NONE of your text (in the first post, the only one I've actually been talking about for the last hour or so) infers a hypothetical situation, it just doesn't, you can go ahead and read through it again if you need to.
just go back and reread my original post
Honestly, I'm really thinking you're the one who needs to do that.
That's the thing though, if you don't inform people that you're speaking hypothetically then you're anything but clear.
That's overk… moreill, and I think you know that. That would be akin to saying "in my opinion" after every opinion that you give. It was pretty much a given that I was giving a random example/ hypothetical based on the nature of my post. Did you even fully read what I said, or what I even responded to in the first place? Someone had said that gender identity is all that matters when looking at how any given person should interact between sexes, so I gave an example to show how flawed that line of thinking can be. What else is there to explain? It's pretty apparent that you missed the point, because if you had understood it, you would understand that I was by no means what so ever trying to define the process of someone becoming transexual. I wasn't speaking about that at all, which shows that you're taking my statement com… [view original content]
Interesting food for thought. I do agree with the problem of reintroduction into society as a functioning member of the opposite sex, but is that a problem with the transgender individual or a problem with the lack of acceptance on the societies part? (I don't think "they won't be accepted" is adequate reason when acceptance is what they are striving for. That's like saying "a person won't be accepted, so we shouldn't accept them," isn't it?) I think the same logic could have, at one time, been applied to an openly homosexual individual in that they would not be accepted by society and this would negatively affect them. Some may have even said that the homosexual individual wouldn't really feel like an accepted member in their relationships with men because they weren't "real". Which we know now is obviously untrue.
Honestly, the main reason why I'm personally against it is because the majority of the harm is actually inflicted on the transgender individ… moreual. I think we would both agree that it can be very difficult for them to reintegrate into society as a member of the opposite sex. I don't think that they will ever truly feel like an accepted member of the sex that they think they belong to, and I think it is difficult for members of the actual sex to be comfortable with someone of the opposite sex just inviting themselves into their privacy. I think people with this "mentality", "distorder", or whatever you want to call it, should be helped through their delusion. Having the procedure readily available just enables them.
"It's been several painful months now, but I wanted to share with you all that I've found my true identity. After several sessions at the tanning salon, daily doses of Budweiser, trading my car in for a Chevry Astro Van and driving 45mph in the fast lane, tearing up my social security card and stealing someone else's, pretending not to understand english, impregnating my new 4'6'' mohacon squaw, obtaining a goat and two chickens, I am now reborn and a genuine Mexican. I am Pedro. Now I'm off to the social services office to collect what I've been missing as a white man. It's a new day."
Oh my god, no it wasn't. And can you please stop accusing me of not actually reading your post?
I seriously don't think you did though, at least not the first time around, which is what sparked this conversation. I believe you singled out one single sentence, completely took it out of context, and then tried to apply your own meaning to it. Think about it. What was the intention of my post? I responded to someone who had said that gender identity is all that matters in regards to interaction between sexes. I did so by giving a random, made up example (or hypothetical situation) to illustrate why that line of thinking is flawed. Based on the nature of my comment, it's very obvious to tell that I was just giving an illustration of why the other poster's point of view was flawed. Why you think I was randomly talking about the process a transgender person goes through is beyond me, because there was absolutely no reason to infer that. Again, I was never talking about that.
It was pretty much a given that I was giving a random example/ hypothetical.
Oh my god, no it wasn't. And can you please stop accusi… moreng me of not actually reading your post? Because I think you've made it clear you aren't even reading fully through my posts, since you're basically just repeating yourself with things I've already addressed and countered with actual points. I've already said, your first post, gives me no actual reason to believe that you were talking about a hypothetical situation, NONE of your text (in the first post, the only one I've actually been talking about for the last hour or so) infers a hypothetical situation, it just doesn't, you can go ahead and read through it again if you need to.
just go back and reread my original post
Honestly, I'm really thinking you're the one who needs to do that.
I'm going to close this, as everything that could be said on this topic has been said here and in many other threads on these forums. This topic is just degrading into a jokes and meme thread now.
Comments
I've seen the picture from above, and he looks like a boy to me. In that case, I really don't see the problem.
PS I was interested in discussing the actual point, but you abandoned our conversation to bicker with Green...
Green... you misunderstood. I got it without him having to clarify. It wasn't his word choice, or presentation.
It was though, again I'm just talking about his first post. The only way you'd be able to understand that it was a hypothetical situation he was talking about is by assuming.
Yeah, I had a couple of typos there. My bad. I know that I didn't straight up say that I was speaking hypothetically in my original post. Let me rephrase what I said. Aside from not straight up saying that I speaking hypothetically, I couldn't have been more clear.
No, that is not "100%" saying that at all. There is absolutely no reason to infer that. I keep saying this, but you're trying to apply meaning to my post that need not be applied. You're pulling it out of nowhere. Furthermore, you're also now taking my statments out of context, which is even worse. Like I said above, if you actually read and understood the point of my post it would be very easy to understand that I was simply giving a basic hypothetical example.
Sure.
That's the thing though, if you don't inform people that you're speaking hypothetically then you're anything but clear. It'd be like if I said "I hate gays" and didn't say a "Just kidding" afterwards or something, if you're not 100% clear about what you're saying then people are going to take it the wrong way.
Yes, there is though. If you use "Transsexuals just wake up one day and call themselves/ proceed to do things" as an example of how things go for Transsexuals then it can be inferred that you actually believe that to be true.
I'm not though, again, I'm pulling it from what you said.
Again, I don't think you understand what I'm saying. What you meant to say, and what you actually did say are 2 completely different things.
Am I wrong? Tell me, looking at his first post, could you actually 100% prove that he didn't mean it in the way I initially thought he did?
Honestly, the main reason why I'm personally against it is because the majority of the harm is actually inflicted on the transgender individual. I think we would both agree that it can be very difficult for them to reintegrate into society as a member of the opposite sex. I don't think that they will ever truly feel like an accepted member of the sex that they think they belong to, and I think it is difficult for members of the actual sex to be comfortable with someone of the opposite sex just inviting themselves into their privacy. I think people with this "mentality", "distorder", or whatever you want to call it, should be helped through their delusion. Having the procedure readily available just enables them.
Why is my comparison incompatible? Originally you said that it was because race is not a dichotomy. But now you're saying that sex isn't a dichotomy either, so I'm confused.
What does a handicap bathroom have to do with anything? They can't turn the handicap bathroom into a trans bathroom. Then you wouldn't have a handicap bathroom anymore. Also, may places don't have handicap bathrooms, just handicap stalls. Have you ever renovated a room before? It's not cheap, and multiplying that cost across every business is ridiculous just to accommodate transphobic people.
That's overkill, and I think you know that. That would be akin to saying "in my opinion" after every opinion that you give. It was pretty much a given that I was giving a random example/ hypothetical based on the nature of my post. Did you even fully read what I said, or what I even responded to in the first place? Someone had said that gender identity is all that matters when looking at how any given person should interact between sexes, so I gave an example to show how flawed that line of thinking can be. What else is there to explain? It's pretty apparent that you missed the point, because if you had understood it, you would understand that I was by no means what so ever trying to define the process of someone becoming transexual. I wasn't speaking about that at all, which shows that you're taking my statement completely out of context.
Except I didn't do that. Honestly, if you're still a little confused here, just go back and reread my original post, as well as reread the post of the person that I was responding to.
Do the differences in race and the dichotomic human sexes need to be spelled out for you? Is that the road we're going down?
Did I say they should renovate the bathrooms? Or was I suggesting that it obviously isn't that hard to accomplish because it's already happening with the implementation of similar scenarios in the form of handicap bathrooms?
It seems this entire conversation is missing its mark.
Oh my god, no it wasn't. And can you please stop accusing me of not actually reading your post? Because I think you've made it clear you aren't even reading fully through my posts, since you're basically just repeating yourself with things I've already addressed and countered with actual points. I've already said, your first post, gives me no actual reason to believe that you were talking about a hypothetical situation, NONE of your text (in the first post, the only one I've actually been talking about for the last hour or so) infers a hypothetical situation, it just doesn't, you can go ahead and read through it again if you need to.
Honestly, I'm really thinking you're the one who needs to do that.
Interesting food for thought. I do agree with the problem of reintroduction into society as a functioning member of the opposite sex, but is that a problem with the transgender individual or a problem with the lack of acceptance on the societies part? (I don't think "they won't be accepted" is adequate reason when acceptance is what they are striving for. That's like saying "a person won't be accepted, so we shouldn't accept them," isn't it?) I think the same logic could have, at one time, been applied to an openly homosexual individual in that they would not be accepted by society and this would negatively affect them. Some may have even said that the homosexual individual wouldn't really feel like an accepted member in their relationships with men because they weren't "real". Which we know now is obviously untrue.
LMAO one of the comments:
I seriously don't think you did though, at least not the first time around, which is what sparked this conversation. I believe you singled out one single sentence, completely took it out of context, and then tried to apply your own meaning to it. Think about it. What was the intention of my post? I responded to someone who had said that gender identity is all that matters in regards to interaction between sexes. I did so by giving a random, made up example (or hypothetical situation) to illustrate why that line of thinking is flawed. Based on the nature of my comment, it's very obvious to tell that I was just giving an illustration of why the other poster's point of view was flawed. Why you think I was randomly talking about the process a transgender person goes through is beyond me, because there was absolutely no reason to infer that. Again, I was never talking about that.
I'm going to close this, as everything that could be said on this topic has been said here and in many other threads on these forums. This topic is just degrading into a jokes and meme thread now.