No. Abuse is traumatizing. Discipline teaches.
Abuse is uncontrolled. Discipline has a limit.
Abuse is out of anger. Discipline is… more out of love.
Abuse is usually senseless. Discipline creates sense.
Abuse is a horror. Discipline is bearable.
Abuse leaves a scar. Discipline leaves a lesson.
DO NOT mistake one another. Abuse is a horrible thing, and I wont stand people comparing a spanking to abuse when there are people out there going through REAL abuse.
People out there who are rejected by their parents, even called NAMES by their parents! People who would gladly go into a family that spanked them a few times over the family that beats them over the head. People who are happy to be away from their family because of how they are treated! People who think about suicide because they feel nobody loves them, and a certain someone (hint: ME) has to talk him out of it, prove that someone loves them, even if it's just that… [view original content]
Reading your comment, reminds me of my Dad.
He taught me the same things, regarding physical discipline.
And also taught me the difference between physical discipline, and physical abuse.
No. Abuse is traumatizing. Discipline teaches.
Abuse is uncontrolled. Discipline has a limit.
Abuse is out of anger. Discipline is… more out of love.
Abuse is usually senseless. Discipline creates sense.
Abuse is a horror. Discipline is bearable.
Abuse leaves a scar. Discipline leaves a lesson.
DO NOT mistake one another. Abuse is a horrible thing, and I wont stand people comparing a spanking to abuse when there are people out there going through REAL abuse.
People out there who are rejected by their parents, even called NAMES by their parents! People who would gladly go into a family that spanked them a few times over the family that beats them over the head. People who are happy to be away from their family because of how they are treated! People who think about suicide because they feel nobody loves them, and a certain someone (hint: ME) has to talk him out of it, prove that someone loves them, even if it's just that… [view original content]
I'd say it's unnecessary and frankly not their place. It's the parent's place, not a teachers.
Teachers can give you bad grades which can tear down your future, so don't mess with them.
And let me add this: I wouldn't see your child misbehaving and just go up to smack them. It's not my child. What you are suggesting, associating me with teacher discipline, assumes that I think people should have the right to smack other people's children as a form of discipline. I do not think that.
Last I checked, everyone (except for those without feeling) can feel pain, and although there are ranges that people can experience pain and experience it differently, it is all negative, rarely positive.
Sometimes there needs to be some threat of physical punsihment, As a kid if it was just a telling off I wouldnt be at all bothered, why should I ever listen if there is no consequence, a smack teaches you that there are real consequences, the majority of the time it wasnt needed as I knew when to stop after a warning etc and honestly so many kids with modern parenting are just terrors as they have no consequences. Also people comparing a slap on a leg to abuse are going over the top, its each individual parents decision on whether to do this or not
No. Abuse is traumatizing. Discipline teaches.
Abuse is uncontrolled. Discipline has a limit.
Abuse is out of anger. Discipline is… more out of love.
Abuse is usually senseless. Discipline creates sense.
Abuse is a horror. Discipline is bearable.
Abuse leaves a scar. Discipline leaves a lesson.
DO NOT mistake one another. Abuse is a horrible thing, and I wont stand people comparing a spanking to abuse when there are people out there going through REAL abuse.
People out there who are rejected by their parents, even called NAMES by their parents! People who would gladly go into a family that spanked them a few times over the family that beats them over the head. People who are happy to be away from their family because of how they are treated! People who think about suicide because they feel nobody loves them, and a certain someone (hint: ME) has to talk him out of it, prove that someone loves them, even if it's just that… [view original content]
One thing I will say since you mention the topic, is that teachers do need to be able to maintain order in their classrooms.
Right now, they're pretty much powerless to do anything.
Sure they can give a bad grade, but is that always gonna get the kid to respond?
Cause most kids don't even think about their long-term future.
Teachers should be allowed to enforce some type of discipline, because giving a bad grade doesn't seem to be cutting it, when you look at the drop-out rate in schools.
I'd say it's unnecessary and frankly not their place. It's the parent's place, not a teachers.
Teachers can give you bad grades which ca… moren tear down your future, so don't mess with them.
And let me add this: I wouldn't see your child misbehaving and just go up to smack them. It's not my child. What you are suggesting, associating me with teacher discipline, assumes that I think people should have the right to smack other people's children as a form of discipline. I do not think that.
When you're a parent, you'll see things differently.
Ohyoupokedme stated the principle behind a spanking very eloquently.
Spanking is a fo… morerm of teaching, and there's a huge difference between physical discipline, and physical abuse.
Physical discipline is limited, and controlled.
Therefore, it will not traumamize the child, but rather learn right from wrong.
As a principle, if you discipline the kid; the consequences have gotta be such that he won't like them.
If he likes the consequences, then you're doing something wrong.
Because instead of teaching good behavior, you're actually re-enforcing bad behavior.
Do you know how old the lady is?
Plus, twerking, as far as I know about the stupid thing, is basically leaning up against a wall and shaking your butt at people. Sounds pretty sexual to me.
Expressing sexual things taught by your mom at four is NOT MORAL. It is sick! It is wrong! It's NOT NORMAL no matter how you try an justify it: a four year old should not be learning this, much like she shouldn't be learning swear words!
If you saw what I saw in him, you would know why I would say, "screw you" to people who turn abuse into a light smack on the bottom. Abuse is much more horrifying, and should be defined as a level of extreme harm, not any time you lay a finger on a kid.
I could never hurt a kid. Fuck that, I couldn't live with myself if I hit my kid.
My parents never hit me or my brothers and we all turne… mored out fine. It is unnecessary, we were punished in other ways that were completely effective.
And I am a guy Flog btw
Oh I'm a staunch supporter. I'm definitely against abuse, but discipline is a right of a parent. I don't think you should be like punching your kids, or beating them with a weapon or anything, but a few pops across the butt never permanently hurt anyone. I get tired of people who are trying to ban it, you don't want to spank your kid? Fine. But it's a right of a parent.
And think about kids who have never been disciplined.
Hasn't it been shown, time and again, that they grow thinking that they're a badass; who think they talk to people and do whatever they want and get away with it?
Those are the kind of people who end up in prison.
Oh I'm a staunch supporter. I'm definitely against abuse, but discipline is a right of a parent. I don't think you should be like punching y… moreour kids, or beating them with a weapon or anything, but a few pops across the butt never permanently hurt anyone. I get tired of people who are trying to ban it, you don't want to spank your kid? Fine. But it's a right of a parent.
You say, "preach much" now.
If you saw what I saw in him, you would know why I would say, "screw you" to people who turn abuse into a lig… moreht smack on the bottom. Abuse is much more horrifying, and should be defined as a level of extreme harm, not any time you lay a finger on a kid.
And think about kids who have never been disciplined.
Hasn't it been shown, time and again, that they grow thinking that they're a badass; … morewho think they talk to people and do whatever they want and get away with it?
Those are the kind of people who end up in prison.
There are many ways of disciplining a child without using violence. Personally, I would never harm my child. Teach them to use words to solve conflict and for discipline, not pain. I am pretty sensitive towards kids, since I babysat and worked with kids before. What we do sets an example for them.
Physical discipline most certainly does not work with all people. There are quite a few accounts in the other corporal punishment thread of people who said that their parent's physical discipline just made them more aggressive and tolerant of pain and violence.
Physical discipline most certainly does not work with all people. There are quite a few accounts in the other corporal punishment thread of … morepeople who said that their parent's physical discipline just made them more aggressive and tolerant of pain and violence.
I disagree with the idea of physical discipline but I can see how it works. when I was younger my dad used to slap me if I did something wrong, but later he stopped that all together because he knew how much that shit hurt :P After that if I did something wrong he would just give me a stern talk, and I would learn my lesson since those talks would last like 2 hours. The last thing I would want to do, is sit at the dining table listening to my dad give me a talk for hours on end that shit was annoying and boring.
A FOUR YEAR OLD DAUGHTER.
Expressing sexual things taught by your mom at four is NOT MORAL. It is sick! It is wrong! It's NOT NORMAL n… moreo matter how you try an justify it: a four year old should not be learning this, much like she shouldn't be learning swear words!
By using the same logic that you just used, I would come to the conclusion that you defend pedophilia as well and the illegal creation of child pornography.
So spanking a misbehaving child to you is "abuse" but manipulating a child into saying insults and preforming a sexual dance move is completely OK? A person using a method of discipline is somehow in your mindset, in what I just read, more despicable than a person actually teaching their son/daughter things that are rude, violent, sexual, and disgusting?
It's not OK morally because a child has no understanding of these implications. It's like if I told a child to walk up to a black man and say, "You're a dirty n---er" or go to a gay person and say, "You're a filthy fa---t".
Oh wow.
Firstly, saying something 'is wrong' doesn't make it wrong. Secondly, something not being normal ALSO doesn't make it morally wro… moreng.
Can you specifically tell me why saying swear words and learning a dance move which has sexual implications is specifically wrong for any age group?
For example, why is a 7 year old learning to swear morally reprehensible, but a 27 year old swearing not?
Why do morals change based on age on a non-consent related issue?
Your (bolded) use of the word manipulating is odd.
Do you view telling a child not to steal as manipulation?
A child doesn't have understanding of most implications. The best thing to do with moves and words which are taboo is to normalise them.
There's also a difference between spreading language which targets a specific group and spreading words which have no specific discrimination based on false reasoning. I never said it's okay to teach children how to call black women or men niggers, but it is okay to not be concerned about saying words such as 'dick' around them, as negative words hold no immoral value, unlike discriminatory words.
You're actually defending this?
By using the same logic that you just used, I would come to the conclusion that you defend pedophilia as … morewell and the illegal creation of child pornography.
So spanking a misbehaving child to you is "abuse" but manipulating a child into saying insults and preforming a sexual dance move is completely OK? A person using a method of discipline is somehow in your mindset, in what I just read, more despicable than a person actually teaching their son/daughter things that are rude, violent, sexual, and disgusting?
It's not OK morally because a child has no understanding of these implications. It's like if I told a child to walk up to a black man and say, "You're a dirty n---er" or go to a gay person and say, "You're a filthy fa---t".
I disagree with the idea of physical discipline but I can see how it works. when I was younger my dad used to slap me if I did something wro… moreng, but later he stopped that all together because he knew how much that shit hurt :P After that if I did something wrong he would just give me a stern talk, and I would learn my lesson since those talks would last like 2 hours. The last thing I would want to do, is sit at the dining table listening to my dad give me a talk for hours on end that shit was annoying and boring.
No respect man. I remember when i came home from Iraq, if i went out somewhere. Some stupid guy would want to start a fight with me other than the fact that i was a soldier.
Example. I'm not in my 30s however I'm getting slowly closer, and i had a deal with the "younger generation", a lot of them young dogs like to act like old dogs. I understand this is like the whole finding your identity part, and bullshit or whatever, but get over yourself. No one thinks your tough kid, just sit down and have a Shirley Temple.
People have to earn respect, you don't just get it handed to you at 21 or whatever. I think its so cute when other guys will come come down acting all hard to me, until you seen the light leave someones eyes you aint shit.
I think it's okay. I've been "disciplined" before and I'm glad my parents did. But nowadays it's usually unacceptable,. and it might be the … morereason why our generation is like this, but it might not be. In my opinion, discipline sometimes should be used as long as the reason is valid, and there is no other way. I wouldn't want to discipline my child if I had one but if I thought I needed to I would. Discipline has shaped me as a person, and I feel like it's made me a better person. Just my opinion though.
What do you mean 'like this'
No respect man. I remember when i came home from Iraq, if i went out somewhere. Some stupid guy would … morewant to start a fight with me other than the fact that i was a soldier.
Example. I'm not in my 30s however I'm getting slowly closer, and i had a deal with the "younger generation", a lot of them young dogs like to act like old dogs. I understand this is like the whole finding your identity part, and bullshit or whatever, but get over yourself. No one thinks your tough kid, just sit down and have a Shirley Temple.
People have to earn respect, you don't just get it handed to you at 21 or whatever. I think its so cute when other guys will come come down acting all hard to me, until you seen the light leave someones eyes you aint shit.
A child doesn't have understanding of most implications. The best thing to do with moves and words which are taboo is to normalise them.
What the heck is wrong with you? You know why things like words are taboo? Because they are rude, insulting, discriminating, hateful, inappropriate!
OK, bystanders, listen to what Flog is saying: he wants a society where it is the norm for people to express violent vocabulary. He wants it to be okay for children to tell other children at elementary school to "shut the f--k up!". He wants a society where kids should be allowed to pass a person down the hall and cry out, "look at that fat ass!", and that certain person goes home the next day to hang themselves. He wants a society where it's okay to yell insults or teach insults, because apparently, "it doesn't hurt anybody". Tell that to the next person who is verbally bullied and hangs themselves. He wants this normalized, people. He wants it normalized with children.
Yet when it comes to punishing misbehavior it's abuse... how about you stop giving people permission to verbally abuse others! No immoral value... tell that to the ones who attempt suicide because people call them negative names and words.
And I suppose next taboo to be normalized is cutting yourself!
Your (bolded) use of the word manipulating is odd.
Do you view telling a child not to steal as manipulation?
A child doesn't have unde… morerstanding of most implications. The best thing to do with moves and words which are taboo is to normalise them.
There's also a difference between spreading language which targets a specific group and spreading words which have no specific discrimination based on false reasoning. I never said it's okay to teach children how to call black women or men niggers, but it is okay to not be concerned about saying words such as 'dick' around them, as negative words hold no immoral value, unlike discriminatory words.
and I would learn my lesson since those talks would last like 2 hours.
My dad did the same thing to me, those talks that last for an eternity. I learned my lessons quick, or he would bore me to death.
Discipline is very nuance thing. I personally think physical discipline should be a last resort of unwanted behavior. But the reaction to it depends on how you communicate and interact with the child. Good parental/child relations may never have to resort to physical beatings, but if it does the child will know its coming from a good place. If the parental/child relationship is not personal or is nonexistent then how physical discipline is interpreted by the child is much different and can lead to resentment or other unintentional behaviors. Parents sometimes don't understand that nuance.
As I read this more and more, I have to say, Flog? WTF man? You take an argument way too far. Examples you say? okay!
but it is okay to not be concerned about saying words such as 'dick' around them, as negative words hold no immoral value, unlike discriminatory words.
Negative words hold no immoral value? so... motherfu^^er holds no immoral value? bi*ch holds no immoral value? co**sucker holds no immoral value? You really believe that?
why is a 7 year old learning to swear morally reprehensible, but a 27 year old swearing not
because a 7 year old has no understanding of the implications of swearing, while a 27 year old does.
Since when is expression of fully consensual sexuality linked to morality?
when that "expression of fully consensual sexuality" is being practiced by a four year old girl. Four year old girls shouldn't be expressing "fully consensual sexuality" because it isn't consensual at all because it is being practiced by a four year old.
Our generation is the most liberal there's ever been in modern western society.
A child doesn't have understanding of most implications. The best thing to do with moves and words which are taboo is to normalise them.
… more
What the heck is wrong with you? You know why things like words are taboo? Because they are rude, insulting, discriminating, hateful, inappropriate!
OK, bystanders, listen to what Flog is saying: he wants a society where it is the norm for people to express violent vocabulary. He wants it to be okay for children to tell other children at elementary school to "shut the f--k up!". He wants a society where kids should be allowed to pass a person down the hall and cry out, "look at that fat ass!", and that certain person goes home the next day to hang themselves. He wants a society where it's okay to yell insults or teach insults, because apparently, "it doesn't hurt anybody". Tell that to the next person who is verbally bullied and hangs themselves. He wants this normalized, people. He wants … [view original content]
Comments
Wow, preach much. So a teacher in a school hitting a pupil is discipline and therefore allowed in your mindset.
Reading your comment, reminds me of my Dad.
He taught me the same things, regarding physical discipline.
And also taught me the difference between physical discipline, and physical abuse.
I'd say it's unnecessary and frankly not their place. It's the parent's place, not a teachers.
Teachers can give you bad grades which can tear down your future, so don't mess with them.
And let me add this: I wouldn't see your child misbehaving and just go up to smack them. It's not my child. What you are suggesting, associating me with teacher discipline, assumes that I think people should have the right to smack other people's children as a form of discipline. I do not think that.
Then you aren't kinky... :P
Sometimes there needs to be some threat of physical punsihment, As a kid if it was just a telling off I wouldnt be at all bothered, why should I ever listen if there is no consequence, a smack teaches you that there are real consequences, the majority of the time it wasnt needed as I knew when to stop after a warning etc and honestly so many kids with modern parenting are just terrors as they have no consequences. Also people comparing a slap on a leg to abuse are going over the top, its each individual parents decision on whether to do this or not
:c
One thing I will say since you mention the topic, is that teachers do need to be able to maintain order in their classrooms.
Right now, they're pretty much powerless to do anything.
Sure they can give a bad grade, but is that always gonna get the kid to respond?
Cause most kids don't even think about their long-term future.
Teachers should be allowed to enforce some type of discipline, because giving a bad grade doesn't seem to be cutting it, when you look at the drop-out rate in schools.
I could never hurt a kid. Fuck that, I couldn't live with myself if I hit my kid.
My parents never hit me or my brothers and we all turned out fine. It is unnecessary, we were punished in other ways that were completely effective.
And I am a guy Flog btw
Good for him
Since when is expression of fully consensual sexuality linked to morality?
A FOUR YEAR OLD DAUGHTER.
Expressing sexual things taught by your mom at four is NOT MORAL. It is sick! It is wrong! It's NOT NORMAL no matter how you try an justify it: a four year old should not be learning this, much like she shouldn't be learning swear words!
You say, "preach much" now.
If you saw what I saw in him, you would know why I would say, "screw you" to people who turn abuse into a light smack on the bottom. Abuse is much more horrifying, and should be defined as a level of extreme harm, not any time you lay a finger on a kid.
I don't believe in physical punishment, so there's that.
The point I'm making is that physical discipline works with all people. Alternate forms do not always work with people.
Oh I'm a staunch supporter. I'm definitely against abuse, but discipline is a right of a parent. I don't think you should be like punching your kids, or beating them with a weapon or anything, but a few pops across the butt never permanently hurt anyone. I get tired of people who are trying to ban it, you don't want to spank your kid? Fine. But it's a right of a parent.
And think about kids who have never been disciplined.
Hasn't it been shown, time and again, that they grow thinking that they're a badass; who think they talk to people and do whatever they want and get away with it?
Those are the kind of people who end up in prison.
Amen!
Amen!
Exactly, and that's the problem these days, people don't respect each other.
There are many ways of disciplining a child without using violence. Personally, I would never harm my child. Teach them to use words to solve conflict and for discipline, not pain. I am pretty sensitive towards kids, since I babysat and worked with kids before. What we do sets an example for them.
Physical discipline most certainly does not work with all people. There are quite a few accounts in the other corporal punishment thread of people who said that their parent's physical discipline just made them more aggressive and tolerant of pain and violence.
How were they disciplined?
Did their parents not show them affection after the fact and use explanation? Or did they just spank them and leave?
Because things are bound to turn sour if there isn't a balance of affection and physical discipline.
I disagree with the idea of physical discipline but I can see how it works. when I was younger my dad used to slap me if I did something wrong, but later he stopped that all together because he knew how much that shit hurt :P After that if I did something wrong he would just give me a stern talk, and I would learn my lesson since those talks would last like 2 hours. The last thing I would want to do, is sit at the dining table listening to my dad give me a talk for hours on end
that shit was annoying and boring.
Oh wow.
Firstly, saying something 'is wrong' doesn't make it wrong. Secondly, something not being normal ALSO doesn't make it morally wrong.
Can you specifically tell me why saying swear words and learning a dance move which has sexual implications is specifically wrong for any age group?
For example, why is a 7 year old learning to swear morally reprehensible, but a 27 year old swearing not?
Why do morals change based on age on a non-consent related issue?
lol no. I wouldn't hit a child.
Thank god!
obvious joke is obvious
You're actually defending this?
By using the same logic that you just used, I would come to the conclusion that you defend pedophilia as well and the illegal creation of child pornography.
So spanking a misbehaving child to you is "abuse" but manipulating a child into saying insults and preforming a sexual dance move is completely OK? A person using a method of discipline is somehow in your mindset, in what I just read, more despicable than a person actually teaching their son/daughter things that are rude, violent, sexual, and disgusting?
It's not OK morally because a child has no understanding of these implications. It's like if I told a child to walk up to a black man and say, "You're a dirty n---er" or go to a gay person and say, "You're a filthy fa---t".
Your (bolded) use of the word manipulating is odd.
Do you view telling a child not to steal as manipulation?
A child doesn't have understanding of most implications. The best thing to do with moves and words which are taboo is to normalise them.
There's also a difference between spreading language which targets a specific group and spreading words which have no specific discrimination based on false reasoning. I never said it's okay to teach children how to call black women or men niggers, but it is okay to not be concerned about saying words such as 'dick' around them, as negative words hold no immoral value, unlike discriminatory words.
My dad did the same thing to me, those talks that last for an eternity. I learned my lessons quick, or he would bore me to death.
No respect man. I remember when i came home from Iraq, if i went out somewhere. Some stupid guy would want to start a fight with me other than the fact that i was a soldier.
Example. I'm not in my 30s however I'm getting slowly closer, and i had a deal with the "younger generation", a lot of them young dogs like to act like old dogs. I understand this is like the whole finding your identity part, and bullshit or whatever, but get over yourself. No one thinks your tough kid, just sit down and have a Shirley Temple.
People have to earn respect, you don't just get it handed to you at 21 or whatever. I think its so cute when other guys will come come down acting all hard to me, until you seen the light leave someones eyes you aint shit.
As I said. It's only my opinion. Thanks for the reply.
What the heck is wrong with you? You know why things like words are taboo? Because they are rude, insulting, discriminating, hateful, inappropriate!
OK, bystanders, listen to what Flog is saying: he wants a society where it is the norm for people to express violent vocabulary. He wants it to be okay for children to tell other children at elementary school to "shut the f--k up!". He wants a society where kids should be allowed to pass a person down the hall and cry out, "look at that fat ass!", and that certain person goes home the next day to hang themselves. He wants a society where it's okay to yell insults or teach insults, because apparently, "it doesn't hurt anybody". Tell that to the next person who is verbally bullied and hangs themselves. He wants this normalized, people. He wants it normalized with children.
Yet when it comes to punishing misbehavior it's abuse... how about you stop giving people permission to verbally abuse others! No immoral value... tell that to the ones who attempt suicide because people call them negative names and words.
And I suppose next taboo to be normalized is cutting yourself!
I agree with you. I was beat the shit out of, and look at how well i turned out.
Oops I misread your comment but thanks for the support.
UGH exactly! Lol :P
We have to be able to post what we feel is truth and not be afraid of being ridiculed for sharing our unpopular opinions.
Discipline is very nuance thing. I personally think physical discipline should be a last resort of unwanted behavior. But the reaction to it depends on how you communicate and interact with the child. Good parental/child relations may never have to resort to physical beatings, but if it does the child will know its coming from a good place. If the parental/child relationship is not personal or is nonexistent then how physical discipline is interpreted by the child is much different and can lead to resentment or other unintentional behaviors. Parents sometimes don't understand that nuance.
As I read this more and more, I have to say, Flog? WTF man? You take an argument way too far. Examples you say? okay!
Negative words hold no immoral value? so... motherfu^^er holds no immoral value? bi*ch holds no immoral value? co**sucker holds no immoral value? You really believe that?
because a 7 year old has no understanding of the implications of swearing, while a 27 year old does.
when that "expression of fully consensual sexuality" is being practiced by a four year old girl. Four year old girls shouldn't be expressing "fully consensual sexuality" because it isn't consensual at all because it is being practiced by a four year old.
And look how that one is working out for us.