I finished reading The Subtle Knife (by Philip Pullman) today, and I realised something quit... er... I don't know how to describe, just read:
Also, Spoiler Alert.
The protagonist is a 11 years old young girl, and she "goes missing" at the end of Northen Lights (the first book, The Subtle Knife is the second one). There are several chapters that don't follow her story, but a man's story who worked with her before, and is currently looking for her. He claims he loves her as a daughter, and that would do anything to keep her safe. He even says once that he want to adopt her. So, he goes around looking for the girl, ar near the end of the book comes the crazy part: some assholes show up and start shooting at him. He kills them all, but he gets shot in the shoulder and looses his arm (techically, he doesn't loose it, but it gets so damaged he can't use it anymore). He sacrifices himself to gain some time to a person who is supposed to keep this girl safe, and finally dies next to a rabbit whit bright golden eyes. Sounds familiar?
Where did you see that Larry was supposed to survive the heart attack?
Still trying to find it, but I swear an unused voice clip had Larry wake up from being resuscitated and call Kenny(I assume) out on trying to kill him.
Well, Lilly fully intends to murder Carley in one version and Ben in the other. Doug was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I feel a bit more sympathetic toward her trying to shoot Ben, since it came out later he was dealing with the bandits. Carley had been with them since the drugstore and had proved she could be trusted so I probably would have left Lilly in that situation. I kept Doug though. It's all about perception I guess and in hindsight, exiling Lilly was really the best option.
Hmm...I guess. Like I said, the fact that she shot Carley on a sudden impulse was bad enough but she had time to contemplate killing Ben on the spot without properly consulting the others or so much as a true confession, which is why Doug got killed. I just really couldn't deal with such flagrant disregard for human life, especially against those who should be able to trust you. Hell, I expect that kind of behavior from Kenny, but Lilly was supposed to be the leader. She was the person calling the shots, keeping the order, and making the rules, so the fact that she would just up and do something like that is disappointing. I do feel bad I had to leave her behind but she just pushed one of my buttons and I didn't have time to think things through.
Where did you see that Larry was supposed to survive the heart attack? Well, Lilly fully intends to murder Carley in one version and Ben in … morethe other. Doug was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I feel a bit more sympathetic toward her trying to shoot Ben, since it came out later he was dealing with the bandits. Carley had been with them since the drugstore and had proved she could be trusted so I probably would have left Lilly in that situation. I kept Doug though. It's all about perception I guess and in hindsight, exiling Lilly was really the best option.
Cutting her hand causes Sarita to experience a brutal and painful death; killing the walker instead provides her with a form of sickness that then leads to death.
Not to mention that, if the arm is chopped, Clementine is partly responsible for Sarita's death, whereas she is not involved in any way in the alternate outcome. This is just factual information.
All that I am saying is that, contrary to what you said, Clem is partly responsible for Sarita's death if you cut the hand.
I understand … moreshe was screwed either way, but if you cut the hand it causes her to not even make it out of the herd and it's seen as a "bad" decision.
I'm starting to think it's because we are playing as Clementine personally and because we're not playing as Lee or another playable character watching Kenny lash out at her, is one of the reasons why most is able to forgive him for his actions.
Because we're now essentially Clementine as of now and considering that most of us are most likely much older than her, we more able to tolerate Kenny's outburst. When Kenny's shouting at Clementine, he's really shouting at us, so the idea of an eleven year old girl being verbally abused doesn't stand out as much.
I'm pretty confident that had we been playing as someone else while Clementine continues being her own person and we saw how Kenny's treatment of her had affected her psyche afterwards, I'd imagine that we would have been far less willing to overlook how an adult blamed a child for something that was out of her control.
God, after watching this video, it's made me just hate Kenny. I don't care if he was going through a rough time losing Sarita, that's not t… morehe only time he made me fearful of hurting Clementine. He's like an abusive parent, you love them and they care about you, but then bam! They lash out and blame you like everything is your fault.
And we were supposed to test our loyalty to Kenny when he acts like this to a little girl? Clementine didn't even do anything wrong. If anything he should've been blaming himself for not being there, but no, he blames the 11 year old.
Dammit, now I'm depressed. I need some candy.
No. At least, not in this book (maybe he comes back to life in the third one? idk, his Ex went to save him before he died, and a few chapters before, she brought a rabbit back to life [Lee's daemon is a rabbit. Coincidence? I THINK NOT!], she's a witch, she can do this kind of things).
He was my favourite character... I cried when he died. R.I.P, Lee (again)
I just finished replay S1 and S2 (My body is ready for Season 3).
And noticed that, in S2E5 when Clem get shooting and see flashback with… more Lee. I see this, on he's left arm BITE.
You think it is just reused model from S1 4-5EP? NOPE, bite looks different, like it healed long time ago.
I just finished replay S1 and S2 (My body is ready for Season 3).
And noticed that, in S2E5 when Clem get shooting and see flashback with… more Lee. I see this, on he's left arm BITE.
You think it is just reused model from S1 4-5EP? NOPE, bite looks different, like it healed long time ago.
I just finished replay S1 and S2 (My body is ready for Season 3).
And noticed that, in S2E5 when Clem get shooting and see flashback with… more Lee. I see this, on he's left arm BITE.
You think it is just reused model from S1 4-5EP? NOPE, bite looks different, like it healed long time ago.
Lee can say to Vernon Clem is daughter Lee. And after escaping from Crawford Vernon says: "I would not have this conversation if you really was her father" (or something like that). And if you say about Clem you daughter how did he know it was a lie? And if he dont know it was a lie, he still want take Clem from Lee?
The actions of their anger arent exactly the same, sure, but they both clearly stepped way over the line and so many people are so quick to defend Kenny unlike Lilly. Even if he did kill someone like Lilly did, people would still defend him.
I can see your point, but I can think one of the reasons some people would be more quick to defend Kenny is because, in the first few instances we get to know him, Kenny can determinedly become a friend fairly quickly and seemed quite good natured. Whilst Lilly's first appearance is where she's attached with the ever-so lovable Larry, who she tries to defend, and comes across as a bit of a bitch. First time appearances can sometimes determine what you'll think of a character throughout and how you feel about them, and if you didn't like them originally, you might just hold that against them.
There's also the facture that unlike Kenny, Lilly did technically kill a popular character (Carley, and maybe Doug??), so again, people would find it easier to defend him than they would towards her.
But yeah, I kinda agree with you. People are far too harsh on Lilly.
The actions of their anger arent exactly the same, sure, but they both clearly stepped way over the line and so many people are so quick to defend Kenny unlike Lilly. Even if he did kill someone like Lilly did, people would still defend him.
She mentions something about going to look for her parents to Lee when Vernon was around (he looks confused at that part), so he probably figured it out then.
Just wondering.
Lee can say to Vernon Clem is daughter Lee. And after escaping from Crawford Vernon says: "I would not have this conversa… moretion if you really was her father" (or something like that). And if you say about Clem you daughter how did he know it was a lie? And if he dont know it was a lie, he still want take Clem from Lee?
She mentions something about going to look for her parents to Lee when Vernon was around (he looks confused at that part), so he probably figured it out then.
Yeah, i remember that.
I made Clementine stay in the house and when we all came back, she asked "Did you find my parents?" and Vernon asks confused and angry "Her parents?"
The actions of their anger arent exactly the same, sure, but they both clearly stepped way over the line and so many people are so quick to … moredefend Kenny unlike Lilly. Even if he did kill someone like Lilly did, people would still defend him.
I can see your point, but I can think one of the reasons some people would be more quick to defend Kenny is because, in the first few instances we get to know him, Kenny can determinedly become a friend fairly quickly and seemed quite good natured. Whilst Lilly's first appearance is where she's attached with the ever-so lovable Larry, who she tries to defend, and comes across as a bit of a bitch. First time appearances can sometimes determine what you'll think of a character throughout and how you feel about them, and if you didn't like them originally, you might just hold that against them.
There's also the facture that unlike Kenny, Lilly did technically kill a popular character (Carley, and … [view original content]
See, everything you said was true. It's a double standard, really. Especially when she chooses to cut Sarita's arm off.
When Sarita die… mores, it's all clementines fault. He needs to be forgiven because he just lost someone who was close to him. Everything he does out of line is fine because he's dealing with emotions. Everyone forgive Kenny!
But, Kenny kills Larry in the meat locker. Lilly get's mad, lashes out at kenny for killing her father. She steals the RV and kills Carley/Doug. What do people do? They get mad at Lilly. Kenny was in the right, apparently. Lilly stepped out of line! She shouldn't have done that, loosing her father wasn't a good enough excuse!
Moral of the story: Kenny kills Larry and people forgive him easily. Lilly lashes out, since shes dealing with loss, but they hate Lilly cause of what she did.
Clementine Kills (And sometimes DOES NOT EVEN KILL Sarita) and Kenny lashes out at clementine. But, t… [view original content]
In the Michonne miniseries, if you keep Randall alive and make the trade, he tries to kill you, which leads to a QTE. He can die in two ways; either you succeed at the QTE, which leads to Michonne shooting him, or you fail the QTE, which leads to Sam shooting him instead.
There's an odd detail in the version where you fail the QTE, though. Just before he is shot, he raises his arm above Michonne like this:
It only happens in the version where you fail.
It looks like he's holding a knife over Michonne, ready to stab her. But the problem is, he doesn't have one in his hand during this scene. I'm guessing that Randall was supposed to be holding a knife during this scene, but someone goofed, and forgot to actually add the knife.
Maybe him charging at Michonne wasn't as stupid as it might have seemed.
If Randall was meant to have a knife on him during the trade-off, I'm surprised that both Michonne and Sam had completely missed the item Randall was carrying on him while they were taking him hostage.
In the Michonne miniseries, if you keep Randall alive and make the trade, he tries to kill you, which leads to a QTE. He can die in two ways… more; either you succeed at the QTE, which leads to Michonne shooting him, or you fail the QTE, which leads to Sam shooting him instead.
There's an odd detail in the version where you fail the QTE, though. Just before he is shot, he raises his arm above Michonne like this:
It only happens in the version where you fail.
It looks like he's holding a knife over Michonne, ready to stab her. But the problem is, he doesn't have one in his hand during this scene. I'm guessing that Randall was supposed to be holding a knife during this scene, but someone goofed, and forgot to actually add the knife.
Maybe him charging at Michonne wasn't as stupid as it might have seemed.
If Randall was meant to have a knife on him during the trade-off, I'm surprised that both Michonne and Sam had completely missed the item Randall was carrying on him while they were taking him hostage.
If Bonnie dies in the frozen lake with Luke in No Going Back, Bonnie only gets mentioned once by Mike the second you get in the half-built house: "Luke and Bonnie...they're just fucking gone.", and no other time after that. Only Luke gets mentioned after that.
Like no one except Mike gives a shit about Bonnie lol.
Well, he did seem to have an attraction to her. Also, Kenny, Arvo, and Jane didn't have much of a connection to her, so its not surprising that they didn't give much of a shit.
Clementine is an unavoidable case in that she's not really allowed to express her feelings in certain scenes, for some reason.
If Bonnie dies in the frozen lake with Luke in No Going Back, Bonnie only gets mentioned once by Mike the second you get in the half-built h… moreouse: "Luke and Bonnie...they're just fucking gone.", and no other time after that. Only Luke gets mentioned after that.
Like no one except Mike gives a shit about Bonnie lol.
Comments
Originally, it was Katjaa who was suspicious about the St. John's locked door.
I finished reading The Subtle Knife (by Philip Pullman) today, and I realised something quit... er... I don't know how to describe, just read:
Also, Spoiler Alert.
The protagonist is a 11 years old young girl, and she "goes missing" at the end of Northen Lights (the first book, The Subtle Knife is the second one). There are several chapters that don't follow her story, but a man's story who worked with her before, and is currently looking for her. He claims he loves her as a daughter, and that would do anything to keep her safe. He even says once that he want to adopt her. So, he goes around looking for the girl, ar near the end of the book comes the crazy part: some assholes show up and start shooting at him. He kills them all, but he gets shot in the shoulder and looses his arm (techically, he doesn't loose it, but it gets so damaged he can't use it anymore). He sacrifices himself to gain some time to a person who is supposed to keep this girl safe, and finally dies next to a rabbit whit bright golden eyes. Sounds familiar?
The craziest part of all? the guy's name was Lee.
Still trying to find it, but I swear an unused voice clip had Larry wake up from being resuscitated and call Kenny(I assume) out on trying to kill him.
Hmm...I guess. Like I said, the fact that she shot Carley on a sudden impulse was bad enough but she had time to contemplate killing Ben on the spot without properly consulting the others or so much as a true confession, which is why Doug got killed. I just really couldn't deal with such flagrant disregard for human life, especially against those who should be able to trust you. Hell, I expect that kind of behavior from Kenny, but Lilly was supposed to be the leader. She was the person calling the shots, keeping the order, and making the rules, so the fact that she would just up and do something like that is disappointing. I do feel bad I had to leave her behind but she just pushed one of my buttons and I didn't have time to think things through.
What year were these written? Either way, fire up your lawyers TellTale!
Well, The Subtle Knife was published in 1997, so TTG ain't got any luck for a lawsuit.
Oh.
Well, uh…
Fire your lawyers, writer of The Subtle Knife!
Surprisingly perhaps, I agree.
Cutting her hand causes Sarita to experience a brutal and painful death; killing the walker instead provides her with a form of sickness that then leads to death.
Not to mention that, if the arm is chopped, Clementine is partly responsible for Sarita's death, whereas she is not involved in any way in the alternate outcome. This is just factual information.
I'm starting to think it's because we are playing as Clementine personally and because we're not playing as Lee or another playable character watching Kenny lash out at her, is one of the reasons why most is able to forgive him for his actions.
Because we're now essentially Clementine as of now and considering that most of us are most likely much older than her, we more able to tolerate Kenny's outburst. When Kenny's shouting at Clementine, he's really shouting at us, so the idea of an eleven year old girl being verbally abused doesn't stand out as much.
I'm pretty confident that had we been playing as someone else while Clementine continues being her own person and we saw how Kenny's treatment of her had affected her psyche afterwards, I'd imagine that we would have been far less willing to overlook how an adult blamed a child for something that was out of her control.
What happened? Did he ever see the girl again that he wanted to adopt?
No. At least, not in this book (maybe he comes back to life in the third one? idk, his Ex went to save him before he died, and a few chapters before, she brought a rabbit back to life [Lee's daemon is a rabbit. Coincidence? I THINK NOT!], she's a witch, she can do this kind of things).
He was my favourite character... I cried when he died. R.I.P, Lee (again)
I just finished replay S1 and S2 (My body is ready for Season 3).
And noticed that, in S2E5 when Clem get shooting and see flashback with Lee. I see this, on he's left arm BITE.
You think it is just reused model from S1 4-5EP? NOPE, bite looks different, like it healed long time ago.
...Why would he be bit in the RV if he got bit after the RV got stolen?
It's a reused model from Episode 3 of Season 1. Lee had those marks then too, so it's probably just a scuff or something.
Damn, You're right. There really is something there
I had to watch the walkthrough of episode 3 and wait for Lee show this side of the hand. :d
Lee's arm texture in S1 EP3:
Lee's arm texture in the S2 flashback:
Not the bite, just dirt.
Just wondering.
Lee can say to Vernon Clem is daughter Lee. And after escaping from Crawford Vernon says: "I would not have this conversation if you really was her father" (or something like that). And if you say about Clem you daughter how did he know it was a lie? And if he dont know it was a lie, he still want take Clem from Lee?
I can see your point, but I can think one of the reasons some people would be more quick to defend Kenny is because, in the first few instances we get to know him, Kenny can determinedly become a friend fairly quickly and seemed quite good natured. Whilst Lilly's first appearance is where she's attached with the ever-so lovable Larry, who she tries to defend, and comes across as a bit of a bitch. First time appearances can sometimes determine what you'll think of a character throughout and how you feel about them, and if you didn't like them originally, you might just hold that against them.
There's also the facture that unlike Kenny, Lilly did technically kill a popular character (Carley, and maybe Doug??), so again, people would find it easier to defend him than they would towards her.
But yeah, I kinda agree with you. People are far too harsh on Lilly.
She mentions something about going to look for her parents to Lee when Vernon was around (he looks confused at that part), so he probably figured it out then.
Yeah, i remember that.
I made Clementine stay in the house and when we all came back, she asked "Did you find my parents?" and Vernon asks confused and angry "Her parents?"
Yeah, that's the scene I'm talking about
I just noticed that Wyatt can shoot out either the right or left headlight of Nate's truck
Agreed. And this is coming from the guy who left Lilly behind for getting Doug killed.
I didn't know, i'll try
I think thats how people knew it was him in both stories.
100% agree with It.
nvm
You don't say...
It was?
Yes. Unused dialogue reveals that. She starts talking around @1:32 Guess Kenny is something of a composite character.
nvm
I just occurred to me that Sarah's "canon" death could've been a serious callback to Shawn's.
In the Michonne miniseries, if you keep Randall alive and make the trade, he tries to kill you, which leads to a QTE. He can die in two ways; either you succeed at the QTE, which leads to Michonne shooting him, or you fail the QTE, which leads to Sam shooting him instead.
There's an odd detail in the version where you fail the QTE, though. Just before he is shot, he raises his arm above Michonne like this:
It only happens in the version where you fail.
It looks like he's holding a knife over Michonne, ready to stab her. But the problem is, he doesn't have one in his hand during this scene. I'm guessing that Randall was supposed to be holding a knife during this scene, but someone goofed, and forgot to actually add the knife.
Maybe him charging at Michonne wasn't as stupid as it might have seemed.
If Randall was meant to have a knife on him during the trade-off, I'm surprised that both Michonne and Sam had completely missed the item Randall was carrying on him while they were taking him hostage.
Maybe Michonne had her own back-up knife that Randall snatched off of her?
There's always that too. Randall could have snatched one of her knives during the struggle.
If Bonnie dies in the frozen lake with Luke in No Going Back, Bonnie only gets mentioned once by Mike the second you get in the half-built house: "Luke and Bonnie...they're just fucking gone.", and no other time after that. Only Luke gets mentioned after that.
Like no one except Mike gives a shit about Bonnie lol.
Well, he did seem to have an attraction to her. Also, Kenny, Arvo, and Jane didn't have much of a connection to her, so its not surprising that they didn't give much of a shit.
Clementine is an unavoidable case in that she's not really allowed to express her feelings in certain scenes, for some reason.
Oh, fun fact, if you listen really closely in both final episodes for season 1 and 2, you can hear my heart shattering into a million pieces.
It's possible I traveled via Wonka vision, though I cannot say for certain.
Also I am slightly drunk right now so sorry lol