In any case, your point is that people have become increasingly easy to become bored, intolerant of difficulty, and nigh incapable of independently experimenting with more than basic gameplay and controls.
To such a degree that (re)introducing these expectations on them has become a novel idea.
And you contend that such as Telltale Games foster this attitude, rather than merely catering to it.
Not all people. But a lot of people, yeah. You summed it up better than I was able to. I'm bad at words and too eager to be a dick when I'm mad.
But I value critical thinking and problem solving skills very highly, and DAISHI tears that down as "archaic" every chance he gets. I'm completely fed up with it this time. I audibly started yelling in anger when I read his post. I've been struggling to think straight enough to write coherent responses ever since.
Pretty soon, gamers won't even know how to fucking jump in a Mario game, and DAISHI'll be right there to praise the removal of that archaic remnant of old platforming.
I think Daishi's point was that there are gameplay elements which we took for granted about games made back in the day, which wouldn't occur to a gamer who is now new to them.
This says nothing to whether or not he thinks those games are superior, or whether we ourselves are better gamers for not having to be mollycoddled by unskippable, persistent tutorials.
Not particularly hard, and quite short, but it was still a fun game. And great to figure everything out in.
But its a good example of games not always needing so much hand-handholding.
Control tutorials in almost every game? That should have stayed in the manual tbh.
Conflating my argument on the end of particular tropes and their replacement with new ones, with an argument for an end to critical thinking... Look, I'm trying not to be insulting. But don't replace my argument with one I didn't make.
Went back and played the beginning of Super Metroid last night. Turns out the issue is that most of these people had played long enough to survive a couple tough fights and make good use of the Morph Ball, then picked up the Ball Bomb and never bothered to figure out what their shiny new item was.
The next guy was just stuck at the Torizo fight and probably would've had an easier time if he'd opened the red door right after getting missiles and found the missile expansion behind it. I certainly had a tough time without a full 10 missiles.
Next, we have a couple guys who either didn't know missiles open red doors, or didn't know how to switch to missiles.
The last guy there is the best. He managed to get down to Brinstar, went right instead of left (a forgivable enough mistake if you've never played Metroid), managed to figure out that he needed to shoot down through the floor to get to where he is, but then never thought that maybe he needed to go back and go the other way if he didn't have what he needed to continue.
Oh, and all of these people managed to survive long enough to reach the end of the first Ridley fight and then escape the Ceres Space Colony in under a minute.
Conflating my argument on the end of particular tropes and their replacement with new ones, with an argument for an end to critical thinking... Look, I'm trying not to be insulting. But don't replace my argument with one I didn't make.
I wasn't replacing your argument with that one. They go hand in hand, and it's not the leap you're pretending it is. Dunno why we're talking about this archaic game anyway, though. It's not even relevant: nobody makes games like that anymore.
I wasn't replacing your argument with that one. They go hand in hand, and it's not the leap you're pretending it is. Dunno why we're talking about this archaic game anyway, though. It's not even relevant: nobody makes games like that anymore.
I gave SOMI:SE (with the fan-made background fixes) to my nephews, and they got stuck at buying a ship from Stan and haven't bothered to play past that point.
Something on my mind: A lot of the blogs in my RSS feed that had been idle for months and months, to the point that I thought they'd been abandoned, have been suddenly coming alive this week. All people unrelated to each other, and for different reasons. Is there something about Spring?
I gave SOMI:SE (with the fan-made background fixes) to my nephews, and they got stuck at buying a ship from Stan and haven't bothered to play past that point.
Understandable considering that most gamers don't finish games, across the board. I think the statistic is 20%, and I'd venture a guess that was true even back in the 1980s. But even more to the point, a much wider selection of games is available these days. You reach a point where something is too difficult, you're not having fun anymore, you play a new one. Most gamers don't play to play to completion.
I have gotten really dang good at animating. It's hard to animate someone going directly sideways for me, but at isometric angles, forward, backward, I seem to have a really good grasp of it.
See, when I got stuck, I went and found a walkthrough!
Yeah, I know. I suck. However, I did play through all of Tales without assistance, so I like to think that I've improved slightly. Of course, when I played it, there wasn't any assistance to be had...
I used to hate Vulcan Raven as a kid. For some reason that boss fight filled me with dread knowing I was gonna die 100 times. Now It's a peace of piss.
See, when I got stuck, I went and found a walkthrough!
That was the only way for me to solve MYST.
I still remember playing Secret of Monkey Island for the first time ... we didn't have broad internet access those days, so my friends and I talked about the games we played mostly during recess at school. We could always give each other some tips while avoiding spoilers and it was great to see how everybody seemed to have a slightly different approach to solving the puzzles.
I liked those moments where we went "Wait ... in MY game I did that, but it didn't work." "Did you use the [...] with the [...] first?" "There's a [...]???".
There were lots of those.
Oh great, now my body is shivering with nostalgia.
So, Eurovision. Yeah. Going to watch it now. Mostly for entry number 13. Because 13 is a former lucky number of mine.
2013 so far has been great for the Netherlands as a whole. I mean, a lot of festivities around the coronation of our current king, and now actually being in Eurovision this year.
Comments
But those are such shitty games. Games like that and Super Metroid shouldn't even exist. They're archaic.
Nobody does that anymore....
2.3 million players? They should die and make way for the non-archaic design master race. After all, that's academic. Rails are good.
To such a degree that (re)introducing these expectations on them has become a novel idea.
And you contend that such as Telltale Games foster this attitude, rather than merely catering to it.
But I value critical thinking and problem solving skills very highly, and DAISHI tears that down as "archaic" every chance he gets. I'm completely fed up with it this time. I audibly started yelling in anger when I read his post. I've been struggling to think straight enough to write coherent responses ever since.
Pretty soon, gamers won't even know how to fucking jump in a Mario game, and DAISHI'll be right there to praise the removal of that archaic remnant of old platforming.
This says nothing to whether or not he thinks those games are superior, or whether we ourselves are better gamers for not having to be mollycoddled by unskippable, persistent tutorials.
Happy bir
*dies mid sentence*
Not particularly hard, and quite short, but it was still a fun game. And great to figure everything out in.
But its a good example of games not always needing so much hand-handholding.
Control tutorials in almost every game? That should have stayed in the manual tbh.
Went back and played the beginning of Super Metroid last night. Turns out the issue is that most of these people had played long enough to survive a couple tough fights and make good use of the Morph Ball, then picked up the Ball Bomb and never bothered to figure out what their shiny new item was.
The next guy was just stuck at the Torizo fight and probably would've had an easier time if he'd opened the red door right after getting missiles and found the missile expansion behind it. I certainly had a tough time without a full 10 missiles.
Next, we have a couple guys who either didn't know missiles open red doors, or didn't know how to switch to missiles.
The last guy there is the best. He managed to get down to Brinstar, went right instead of left (a forgivable enough mistake if you've never played Metroid), managed to figure out that he needed to shoot down through the floor to get to where he is, but then never thought that maybe he needed to go back and go the other way if he didn't have what he needed to continue.
Oh, and all of these people managed to survive long enough to reach the end of the first Ridley fight and then escape the Ceres Space Colony in under a minute.
Whoah! We're going to Ibiza!
You're so 90s.
C'est La vie!
Because they didn't have the memory for the animation cycles in the 1980s.
Selling a bunch of Assassins' Creed games on eBay. Hope they go for more than they're currently at!
I wasn't replacing your argument with that one. They go hand in hand, and it's not the leap you're pretending it is. Dunno why we're talking about this archaic game anyway, though. It's not even relevant: nobody makes games like that anymore.
Ok Señor Butthurt.
I gave SOMI:SE (with the fan-made background fixes) to my nephews, and they got stuck at buying a ship from Stan and haven't bothered to play past that point.
I wana for CMI!..since I didn't pay for it and the price has inflated on ebay.
Something on my mind: A lot of the blogs in my RSS feed that had been idle for months and months, to the point that I thought they'd been abandoned, have been suddenly coming alive this week. All people unrelated to each other, and for different reasons. Is there something about Spring?
Understandable considering that most gamers don't finish games, across the board. I think the statistic is 20%, and I'd venture a guess that was true even back in the 1980s. But even more to the point, a much wider selection of games is available these days. You reach a point where something is too difficult, you're not having fun anymore, you play a new one. Most gamers don't play to play to completion.
Yeah, I know. I suck. However, I did play through all of Tales without assistance, so I like to think that I've improved slightly. Of course, when I played it, there wasn't any assistance to be had...
Forward walking animation cycle in progress.
Good a time as any to tell people to buy my game when it comes out DECEMBER 2013 PEOPLE.
That was the only way for me to solve MYST.
I still remember playing Secret of Monkey Island for the first time ... we didn't have broad internet access those days, so my friends and I talked about the games we played mostly during recess at school. We could always give each other some tips while avoiding spoilers and it was great to see how everybody seemed to have a slightly different approach to solving the puzzles.
I liked those moments where we went "Wait ... in MY game I did that, but it didn't work." "Did you use the [...] with the [...] first?" "There's a [...]???".
There were lots of those.
Oh great, now my body is shivering with nostalgia.
2013 so far has been great for the Netherlands as a whole. I mean, a lot of festivities around the coronation of our current king, and now actually being in Eurovision this year.