Suggestions On How To Improve The Game
Hi there. While I enjoy your games and have been following each episode, I have been taking notes on how you could make these games even better. I know from your Wondercon panel you guys don't mind suggestions from whiny fans. So here I go:
THINGS TO IMPROVE ON
1. The one thing I have the biggest problem with is that everytime Max speaks, he speaks like he's delivering a pun. It sounds as if he's aware that it's a pun - it's like being proud to tell a joke or attracting attention to the fact you're telling a joke. That really puts me out of the story. It would be better if Max was more sarcastic, rather than a standup comedian.
2. Max speaks after ANYTHING Sam says. That gets really annoying. I hold the old sarcastic Max from "Hit the Road" and the comics dear within my heart.
THINGS TO MAKE MORE OF::)
1. Each episode is better than the previous. The Abe Lincoln episode is the best so far because it is targeted at a slightly more mature audience.
2. Music is getting better too. My favourite track is the end of episode 4. I suggest you guys make more Jazzy/Detectivey type music. It really adds to the sarcastic mood. Because Sam & Max taught me all the sarcasm I needed when I was a kid.
3. I noticed nice little animation that adds to the overall gameplay. I have to say, far out for the little stride max does with his arms behind his back when he's walking into the War Room in episode 4.
Also, It would be great if, from episode to episode, you guys would change some wardrobe, like for example, Whizzer, Peepers and Specs should've been wearing suits if they're governors.
If you're gonna whine about the fact that doing that would be outside your target audience, don't bother. "Hit the Road" was as sarcastic as it gets and didn't draw any attention to jokes. God knows what the target audience was, marketingwise, but it hasn't been dubbed "One of the best Adventure Games of all Time" for nothing.
Thanks
Mish
THINGS TO IMPROVE ON
1. The one thing I have the biggest problem with is that everytime Max speaks, he speaks like he's delivering a pun. It sounds as if he's aware that it's a pun - it's like being proud to tell a joke or attracting attention to the fact you're telling a joke. That really puts me out of the story. It would be better if Max was more sarcastic, rather than a standup comedian.
2. Max speaks after ANYTHING Sam says. That gets really annoying. I hold the old sarcastic Max from "Hit the Road" and the comics dear within my heart.
THINGS TO MAKE MORE OF::)
1. Each episode is better than the previous. The Abe Lincoln episode is the best so far because it is targeted at a slightly more mature audience.
2. Music is getting better too. My favourite track is the end of episode 4. I suggest you guys make more Jazzy/Detectivey type music. It really adds to the sarcastic mood. Because Sam & Max taught me all the sarcasm I needed when I was a kid.
3. I noticed nice little animation that adds to the overall gameplay. I have to say, far out for the little stride max does with his arms behind his back when he's walking into the War Room in episode 4.
Also, It would be great if, from episode to episode, you guys would change some wardrobe, like for example, Whizzer, Peepers and Specs should've been wearing suits if they're governors.
If you're gonna whine about the fact that doing that would be outside your target audience, don't bother. "Hit the Road" was as sarcastic as it gets and didn't draw any attention to jokes. God knows what the target audience was, marketingwise, but it hasn't been dubbed "One of the best Adventure Games of all Time" for nothing.
Thanks
Mish
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Comments
if a game is too hard, it will start to frustrate most players and distract them from most of the humor and overall experience of the game
sam and max is technicly not a "puzzle" adventure game, it is a mesh between a comedy and a role playing adventure game, the fact that it has above average puzzles is only a bonus
if you are looking for some challenging games, then it is a better bet for you to play a homebrew internet flash based game, a common watering hole where 90% of these games eventually turn up is over at The-Geek Forums each thread of the thousands over there contains a link to a different game, are doozies bacause some of these people have no life other than making others fry their brains on a puzzle
This actually sounds like it would've been funny, maybe if they kept their soda popper hats and/or had to wear oversized suits? Even normal suits would have been interesting.
That shouldn't be too much to ask for.
Fifteen years later, it is. Put any gamer on NES games, you'll se them play about five minutes then quit. Look at the landscape of games... look at the history... Wii's easier than Gamecube which is easier than Nintendo64 which is easier than Super Nintendo, which is easier than NES, which is easier than say... Amiga...
The matter is to entertain people, not boring them
But I dont expect things to be a lot harder than episode 4. Why not just a bit, but not much.
I've finished all the Myst games and I really love the Amiga.. I want difficulty levels like that
But I guess you're right, todays gamers are pussies!
EDIT - but the Telltale games are even easier than a lot of other new games though.
In Monkey Island 2 you had maybe 15 objects in your inventory and 10 or so locations to visit at any one time. This in itself made some puzzles difficult, something (thankfully) Telltale's games don't suffer from as the episodic nature keeps the scope and narrative much tighter.
Pacing is all important in comedic games, and getting stuck for too long totally ruins the comic timing of the situations.
If the rest of the games this series are on a par with Abe Lincoln, I'll be a very happy gamer.
Personally, I think ep4 was perfect for the style of game they're going for. And if I'm a pussy for having to use a walkthrough to get through the old Lucas and Sierra adventures, then so be it. Call me what you will. As for Myst.. *waves his hand in a dismissing fashion*.. us pussies (note: I) want nothing to do with that lameness.
To point out that Telltales games so far are TOO EASY is *not* nitpicking or whining so stuff a sock in it.
Thank you.
I agree. For example,there is some igorant game reviewer on myspace and youtube who reviews old games. In one of his podcast, he reviews castlevania II, giving it a bad review. He claims that the constant dialogue of day turning to night and the lack of tips within the game dialgoue hurts the game. Of course, this is the same game that is considered to be one of the best CV games.
After looking at it, the castlevania games became easier and easier after each platform.
In my opinion, games became easier over the years because of avilibility, experience, and preference. Back then, in the 80's, video games were a relatively a new form of entertainment. As such, not a lot of video game designers knew what was fun and what isn't; their creativity was limited to real life games such as Pong. That is why Pong is quite popular at the time.
Furthermore, games really didn't have an age specific demographics. I mean, teens and up wouldn't be ridiculed playing video games that were aimed for kids like Mario and Sonic. This still hold true with these characters. From what I have seen, one can't really say the same thing in regards to games like Spyro.
Also, one of the biggest problems with adventure games were that they were too difficult and their puzzles are at best, non logical. If you think about it, most difficult puzzles in adventure games during its prime, ignores real world logic. I mean, for example, to let larry swin in the pool in lsl6, one has to use dental floss and a small piece of cloth to make a bathing suit. Even though, Larry is in a cartoon world, it is just bizzare.
I think puzzles in adventure games follow the logic of Mcguyver where anything can be used to help a person escape a trap. As such, I think ppl who have been playing adventure games for 10 years, will have a different way of thinking to someone who just started playing adventure games. For instance, a puzzle such as combining hair spray, a lighter, and a rubberband to defeat a serial killer(police quest4) and using a file, soap, and a key to make a dupilicate is easy for an experience gamer.(lsl6) However, I can imagine a newbie will be stuck on this puzzle for weeks.
As Yohmi said, gamers do not want to be stuck on a single puzzle for a week, especially at this day in age. Unlike the 80's, gamers can be easily turn off by a puzzle and as a result, pay something else. Games can be seen as sports, whereas sports that has been around for centuries are long, "boring", and slow. Sports made this century are short, "exciting," and fast. I am sure telltale doesn't want to make their games mind numbingly hard, resulting in lost of customers.
What happened? :eek:
I was cleaning my keyboard while I was typing. It seems that I didn't editing time for you guys to see that.
It seems that telltale is getting there, but give them time since they are trying to get new players; I am quite suprised that the first puzzle in ep 4, though easy when compared to old adventure games, is present. Even though it is easy for you and me, this is a step up in difficulty imo since it isn't flat out given like the puzzles in previous games.
I have had an absolute blast with every episode thus far, and I can not see the remaining two being any different.
I know I could sit here and make some nit-picking comments about things in the games, but that would not be fair to anyone, and just make myself look like a jerk. My only real complaints are length and difficulty.
Length, I know, is a tricky subject with episodic games like this. Something released on a monthly schedule does not allow for a game of epic proportions that takes days to complete. In a way I really enjoy the ability to fire up a new episode and spend a few hours on a lazy Sunday playing through. But going right back to the beginning of my post, myself and many others have waited for over a decade, and it is hard to not want more! Please take this as much as a compliment as a gripe, and understand that I know you can not push out longer episodes without impacting quality, which I am sure we all appreciate you balancing.
Difficulty falls into the episodic nature of the games as well, I assume. How do you plan out these brain twisting puzzles a lot of us want, in the short development time you have to give yourselves. I can not say I have not been stumped by a few of the puzzles in the games, be it something obvious I have missed or just a truly well designed puzzle that made me sit back and think. I am something of a veteran to this genre, as many playing these games are, so it is all to easy for this to be a common complaint.
I make a few assumptions here about the development process on these episodes. The only suggestion I can make that is fair to Tell Tale and the fans is to keep up the good work. I have more than enjoyed these games, and I will continue to buy them as long as you guys keep the quality you have shown to us up. I have enjoyed Tell Tale games in the past, and I love the community spirit this company puts out there. The fact that I can come here to your forums and read responses by developers and employees in many of the threads says worlds for what you guys and gals think of your customers. I am very glad that Sam & Max was put in your hands.
The only problem I have with them is the difficulty level.. I don't mind the lenght as I was prepared for that seeing as they're episodes.
Why some people would consider pointing out that the games are too easy is nitpicking and whining is beyond me.
Seeing the abundance of 100+ viewed posts in the Sam and Max hints forum just makes me worried about how many players would be alienated if the difficulty were increased dramatically above the level of Episode 4 (I wouldn't mind a little bit more difficulty above Episode 4, but not exponentially more...).
I think the most common nitpick now (from reviewers and users) is about the re-use of locations, but hopefully Telltale will have this addressed in Episode 5-6 (and probably moreso in Season Two, since they'll have the couple months headstart to draw more environments)--they appear to have acknowledged in their GDC talk that reusing locations has been something commonly criticized.
However, you can't deny the existence of all those hundreds-viewed posts in the hints forum...
EDIT:
Offtopic: I've just realized that sorting by views on the hints forum gives you a rough idea about which puzzles are considered the hardest (The all-inclusive posts such as "Episode 4 Hint FAQ" ruins this somewhat though--though I guess if there were one for each episode, you could still somewhat roughly estimate what people consider as the hardest episodes, though this is less informative towards specific puzzle designs).
But while we would all mostly like the episodes to be even harder and more convoluted, the market tends to like quick and simple games. From my own personal standpoint, we have a good middle-ground in Episode 4.
A difficulty option is always a good idea for a game. Almost every game has difficulty settings, why not an adventure game? The entire game wouldn't neccessarily have to be changed, just add a few difficult puzzles to the mix when the harder difficulty option is selected.
A difficulty setting would help players and also help satisfy the hard-core adventure gamers. It would also make playing through the game again much more appealing, since there would be new content. It sounds like a win-win situation to me, and a good job for a couple new coders.
Didn't some Sierra games had difficult settings? However, I don't think it did anything unless the only ones I think had them were Quest for Glory; I can see how the setting can adjust how many hitpoints you can take and such, but I could have sworn I seen the difficulty bar on other Sierra games like Leisure suit Larry?
Larry did certainly not have that at least.
Monkey Island 2 also had difficulty levels.
It shouldn't be too hard to add some difficult puzzles for a hard setting because they don't even need to tie into the story. It would be a good idea if they did though because if they didn't it might seem kind of... Tacky.
Double the Max content. Sam, Max, & Max!
That might be too confusing, however. So, rename that second Max to something exciting, catchy, and still evocative of crazy rabbit. Something like, just off the top of my head... Tale.
Or how about "And"?
"Sam, And, Max"...
There is nothing whatsoever that could be confusing about that :P
I have enjoyed them like crazy, and they brings back many wonderful memories of my favorite Adventure games of old, including the original Sam & Max game.
On topic: I think the only thing that I would have added to the game is a status counter that kept track of the percentage of all dialogue you have heard. On multiple play-throughs you could attempt to get 100% and then it would unlock a cool wallpaper, screensaver or something. I know that the "collectible" concept of video games has gotten a bit out of hand, but this would add more replayability to the game and also encourage people to hear all the wonderful dialogue
Interesting idea, I was just thinking about something like that. Ability to unlock machinima shorts maybe? The thing with the PS3 and Xbox 360 is that they create achievement/trophy levels in games for people to strive for, even if it doesn't really mean much in regards to the story of the game. It makes people feel like they're getting more gameplay out of their purchase if given extra goals and trophies (however meaningless they are to the actual story) to strive for. Bone Episode 2 got me to do this by making you win 20 (25?) stuffed animals to get the big doll and a kiss from Thorn.