Shooting Ben would draw all nearby walkers to the alley, as well as the ones already on their way. Someone needed to distract them all, and draw them away from the alley so that the other could escape, which is exactly what Kenny did.
I think having walkers in the alley would be good like the bell tower situation.
I think having walkers in the alley would be good like the bell tower situation.
Well not if they're trapped in that alley. It was either leave Ben suffer and die, or put Ben out of his misery and bring every surrounding walker on top of them.
Well not if they're trapped in that alley. It was either leave Ben suffer and die, or put Ben out of his misery and bring every surrounding walker on top of them.
All walkers were coming towards them when they saw them and heard ben scream. If Kenny would shoot ben when they saw them coming, he'd have time to go with Lee. But TTG wanted Kenny to "die" so yeah.
Well not if they're trapped in that alley. It was either leave Ben suffer and die, or put Ben out of his misery and bring every surrounding walker on top of them.
Okay, let me lay it out. Shoot Ben out of misery, get in gate and climb on roof. Walkers can't climb. Nothing is on top of them.
'Everything that Kenny is' is exactly why so many of us hated him. Blinding pragmatism at the expense of a moral conscience. He needed to redeem himself, and preventing Ben from suffering his worst fear (something Kenny knows a thing about) was his act of redemption. He had nothing to live for any more, no more room or reason for pragmatism.
Kenny's journey is like the reverse of everyone else's. Most characters gain that guiltless pragmatism throughout the game, as they're hardened by the games events. Whereas Kenny manages to actually gain a conscience.
Well not if they're trapped in that alley. It was either leave Ben suffer and die, or put Ben out of his misery and bring every surrounding walker on top of them.
1) Give Ben the gun and have him do it himself.
2) Shoot Ben and lock the gate/climb ladder.
Kenny died to convenience the writers. Why is this so hard to believe?
1) Give Ben the gun and have him do it himself.
2) Shoot Ben and lock the gate/climb ladder.
Kenny died to convenience the writers. Why is this so hard to believe?
Convenience them how? They have no obligation to return to any of these characters, and probably won't. They could have just left Kenny on the rooftop with Omid and Christa when Lee makes his way to the hotel to save Clem.
I have to say, this was the most stupid, unnecessary, out of left field death in the entire game. Okay, maybe Carly/Doug's death came out of nowhere, but Lilly was losing it.
I don't mind that Kenny died, but he was such a major character that he deserved something better. I think what bothers me the most is the poor logic. He was RIGHT THERE. It would have taken two seconds for him to shot Ben and leave through the gate with Lee.
I can get on board with the whole 'redemption' aspect, I just think it could have been thought through a little better.
I haven't seen the Christa version yet - is it any better? I hope it makes more sense.
In the Christa version Kenny is more heroic. She jumps down into a dark room filled with walkers because Kenny acidently made Lee drop the radio in there. So when the walkers discover she's in there, Kenny jumps down and gives her a boost up so that Lee and Omid can reach her. He uses the last bullets in the gun (there's more than one in this version) to hold off the walkers while Omid and Lee pull Christa up. After she is saved, Lee looks down and sees that Kenny has been pushed back into the darkness by the walkers and attempts to find him again. Kenny yells at the group as the walkers close in on him that they should go on and leave him behind, echoing Chuck's last words of "I'll be fine" but gets cut off in the middle. You never actually see his body, and you even have a few dialogue choices that imply he could have made it away, but the group never sees him again.
Convenience them how? They have no obligation to return to any of these characters, and probably won't. They could have just left Kenny on the rooftop with Omid and Christa when Lee makes his way to the hotel to save Clem.
Kenny needed this to redeem his character.
Give me a break. You're just trying to defend poor writing. Kenny? Redeeming himself? At the most critical point in the story? How convenient. Almost as convenient as Lee getting bitten RIGHT after Clementine is kidnapped. Almost as convenient as the boat getting stolen by Vernon. I can go on and on.
I do have to admit that even in my first playthrough I knew there was a walker behind the wood and kept trying to find an option to kill it. Way to predictable and convenient.
I do have to admit that even in my first playthrough I knew there was a walker behind the wood and kept trying to find an option to kill it. Way to predictable and convenient.
God, finally! Someone who gets it. It's not the fact Lee got bit that I had a problem with, but the amateur way it happened pissed me off. I knew there was a fucking zombie behind that cardboard.
My thing is, if the radio was producing static, why wasn't the walker toying with it?
Also, he didn't have anything to lose (unlike Christa and Omid's baby). He probably would've aided Lee in the zombie fight to the Marsh House.
Again, he was killed to convenience the writers.
Now that would have been cool if Kenny died helping Lee get through that horde to make it to the Marsh House. You see Kenny taking on more Zombies just so that Lee could make it through, going out like a badass with a stash.
Give me a break. You're just trying to defend poor writing. Kenny? Redeeming himself? At the most critical point in the story? How convenient. Almost as convenient as Lee getting bitten RIGHT after Clementine is kidnapped. Almost as convenient as the boat getting stolen by Vernon. I can go on and on.
Episode 5 had terrible writing.
Reading your posts, I gather that you really dislike the conclusion of this game. This is weird for me to say, but you remind me of Final Fantasy or Silent Hill fans. It's weird for me to say because I AM a FF and SH fan, and I spend some time on their forums and such. People are never happy.
One faction gets what they want, everyone else is pissed off.
There were some definite flaws in this plot, but as a fan of fiction in general, I have come to accept that flaws are inevitable. Geez, how dare Telltale use contrived coincidences to move the plot forward, what assholes!
I know I'm in a minority here, but I judge games based on plot and characterisation over, say, gameplay or graphics or whatever. The overall plot here is great, and Telltale did a truly jaw-dropping job of making Lee and Clem likeable.
I dunno, I guess I'm the sort of person that focuses more on the positives than the negatives, but accepts the negatives anyway.
An abandoned train, that can still work, on a track going where we want, when we need it? Wow, there's a blow torch here? How convenient
If nothing was convenient for the story it wouldn't move on,or move in the direction intended
Lol, more trying to defend bad writing. I guess plotholes move the story along too? The train wasn't as convenient, at least it made you work for it to some extent and made plenty of sense in context. The blowtorch thing was stupid, though.
And you don't need convenience to move the story along.
You obviously do not understand how a story works, and have no idea how to determine what is good, or bad writing. You not liking something does not make it bad.
Reading your posts, I gather that you really dislike the conclusion of this game. This is weird for me to say, but you remind me of Final Fantasy or Silent Hill fans. It's weird for me to say because I AM a FF and SH fan, and I spend some time on their forums and such. People are never happy.
One faction gets what they want, everyone else is pissed off.
There were some definite flaws in this plot, but as a fan of fiction in general, I have come to accept that flaws are inevitable. Geez, how dare Telltale use contrived coincidences to move the plot forward, what assholes!
I know I'm in a minority here, but I judge games based on plot and characterisation over, say, gameplay or graphics or whatever. The overall plot here is great, and Telltale did a truly jaw-dropping job of making Lee and Clem likeable.
I dunno, I guess I'm the sort of person that focuses more on the positives than the negatives, but accepts the negatives anyway.
Dude, I joined this forum just to vent, lol. I know I'm being a bit too harsh, but I can't stand bad writing. And at the end of episode 4, I was afraid of what TellTale would do and they did it. They focused on that fucking campman storyline. If you had asked me to rate the game before episode 4, I would've said "A fucking masterpiece. One of the best games in the history of games." The story was just that good, but they tossed it away for this whackass, bitchass, stupid-ass, lame-ass, dumbass, whackass Campman arc.
I just wanted a story of Lee surviving and caring for Clem. I could care less if he died at the end, but the Campman arc ruined it. It made TellTale rush in episode 5 in an effort to wrap things up. And because of that, plotholes galore. I HATE plotholes. It was better off sticking to what it originally was about.
I think he was prepared to die, but he wasn't committing suicide or anything,he's going to do his best. I hope we get to see him again, but if he died, he did it bravely.
You obviously do not understand how a story works, and have no idea how to determine what is good, or bad writing. You not liking something does not make it bad.
Congratulations! You're the billionth person to use the "You obvious do not understand [insert concept]" defense in an effort to save your terrible argument because you have nothing more substantial to add to the discussion.
Simply saying I don't know how something works doesn't make it so. So please, stop with the logical fallacies.
Doctanian: Please explain this whole bad writing concept to me?
-If you're talking about this whole convenience matter, then look at... say... every other game... ever...
Examples:
[Insert Shooter Here]: Oh, how convenient, I'm invincible!
[Insert Adventure Game Here]: Oh, how convenient, all these items somehow come together to combine and interact with the environment so that I can complete my objective!
[Insert Platformer Here]: Oh, how convenient, I can jump on peoples heads and destroy them!
I just wanted a story of Lee surviving and caring for Clem. I could care less if he died at the end, but the Campman arc ruined it.
I'm pretty sure Lee was trying to survive to save and care for Clem... and I really don't see how this Campman scene that took 10 minutes ruined it... If it was the storyline you didn't like, and not your supposed plotholes, then that's your opinion, but it's not bad writing...
Kenny? Redeeming himself? At the most critical point in the story? How convenient.
Yes... Kenny... Redeemed himself... At the most critical point of the story... and also after being finally shouted back at by Ben about how his family died and also realising that all he had cared about so far was his family...
It's not the fact Lee got bit that I had a problem with, but the amateur way it happened pissed me off. I knew there was a
fucking zombie behind that cardboard.
I can't argue that you knew there was a walker there, but did you know it'd bite you (Without looking at videos and forums beforehand)? I don't want an answer to this question because clearly even if you didn't know, at this point in the argument you'd lie.
Congratulations! You're the billionth person to use the "You obvious do not understand [insert concept]" defense in an effort to save your terrible argument because you have nothing more substantial to add to the discussion.
I know I'm being a bit too harsh, but I can't stand bad writing.
Take what you just said and add it into this context. You have nothing else to add to the discussion. You've stated your points and you can stop now. I know you're trying to vent, but now you're simply insulting the writers. Hold your breath and count to 10 or punch a wall or something...
You know what I hate Even more than people that complain about games over and over?
Dude, I joined this forum just to vent, lol. I know I'm being a bit too harsh, but I can't stand bad writing. And at the end of episode 4, I was afraid of what TellTale would do and they did it. They focused on that fucking campman storyline. If you had asked me to rate the game before episode 4, I would've said "A fucking masterpiece. One of the best games in the history of games." The story was just that good, but they tossed it away for this whackass, bitchass, stupid-ass, lame-ass, dumbass, whackass Campman arc.
I just wanted a story of Lee surviving and caring for Clem. I could care less if he died at the end, but the Campman arc ruined it. It made TellTale rush in episode 5 in an effort to wrap things up. And because of that, plotholes galore. I HATE plotholes. It was better off sticking to what it originally was about.
I don't really care about plotholes, as I tend to be everything that an artist wants - someone with an open and accepting mind. It may or may not be a bad thing, jury's still out on that
It's probably the main reason TV Tropes is my favourite website - they point out the flaws I miss because I'm so wrapped up the the story.
This game has hit me on a profound level. It made me question what it means to be a human being, a feeling I have only previously felt from Neon Genesis Evangelion and V For Vendetta. Difference is, this game affected me in a POSITIVE way.
'Bad writing' affects, well, pretty much everything. The ending of this game may have been written poorly, but Telltale also pulled out all the stops to make both Lee and Clem possibly the most well-written characters in gaming history. To me, fiction is about the characters' journey, not the fine details.
As I said, I'd rather praise them for what they did brilliantly than complain it wasn't what I wanted.
I edited the title of your post. Please don't post spoilers in thread titles because people can see them in the index of the forum even if they don't visit The Walking Dead spoiler forum. Remember, there's still people who are waiting for the retail release before playing the game.
[Insert Shooter Here]: Oh, how convenient, I'm invincible!
[Insert Adventure Game Here]: Oh, how convenient, all these items somehow come together to combine and interact with the environment so that I can complete my objective!
[Insert Platformer Here]: Oh, how convenient, I can jump on peoples heads and destroy them!
Too broad and vague. And you're using strawmen. Nice. This is a storybasd game, it's not a run-and-gun shooter like Call of Duty where you can ignore has stupid the plot is.
I'm pretty sure Lee was trying to survive to save and care for Clem... and I really don't see how this Campman scene that took 10 minutes ruined it... If it was the storyline you didn't like, and not your supposed plotholes, then that's your opinion, but it's not bad writing...
If it's my opinion, then what's the big deal? Why did you even take the time to respond? If I say it's bad writing and you say "that your opinion", then that makes the story objective, right? If it's not bad writing then it's not necessarily good writing either.
3) Do what you think is morally right after what you put the kid through... Also to possibly see your family again.
Yes... Kenny... Redeemed himself... At the most critical point of the story... and also after being finally shouted back at by Ben about how his family died and also realising that all he had cared about so far was his family...
No, Kenny still dies at the exact same point. Whether Ben lives or not. So it was just to convenience the writers. Otherwise, they would've went out of their way to give him an alternate death. But no, it's him fighting off zombies in another ambiguous death scene.
I can't argue that you knew there was a walker there, but did you know it'd bite you (Without looking at videos and forums beforehand)? I don't want an answer to this question because clearly even if you didn't know, at this point in the argument you'd lie.
Kinda. The way Lee walked towards the radio made me thing "some bad shit's about to go down." I was 90% sure there was a walker behind the board, and I was 70% sure Lee might get bitten due to the tension it was building up.
Really? Take a look at this:
Take what you just said and add it into this context. You have nothing else to add to the discussion. You've stated your points and you can stop now. I know you're trying to vent, but now you're simply insulting the writers. Hold your breath and count to 10 or punch a wall or something...
You know what I hate Even more than people that complain about games over and over?
Broken records.
I've stated over and over and over again that I think the writers did a great job for most of the series. I've stated constantly that I adore the game. And everyone and their mom agrees. But when I call bullshit on Episode 5, all of a sudden, people jump on me like I'm disgracing the Lord. People will bend over backwards to defend everything about this game as if it's immune to flaws. Then people say "it has flaws, it's glitchy". Technical issues don't cut it. It's flawed storywise as well, there's plenty of valid plotholes to vindicate this. It's not a terrible thing. I think TellTale has something great in their hands, and I'm being so vocal because I don't want them to fuck up season 2. I want them to stick to the concept of survival like episodes 1-3 did. They dropped the ball with this "campman" business.
"Well, that's just your opinion." You say.
THAT'S RIGHT! THAT'S EXACTLY RIGHT!!!!! And I have a right to be vocal about it without people jumping down my throat like I'm just finding something to complain about. These are valid concerns to me, and while you don't have to agree, you can at least respect it. It's just bad writing to me, I'll say it and if people try to debate me on it, I'll do so.
People try excuse away any points I make as if the game is a masterpiece when it isn't. It could've been a masterpiece and I think that's what made me the most disappointed. This is a small company, they're going to cut corners and have story issues. If the comic and TV show have issues, then I know for a fact TellTale isn't immune.
And your quotes are really cherrypicking to the point where it's intellectually disgusting. You didn't quote what I said after I made those statements. I said it was bad writing, but I think I did a pretty good job at explaining why. If not on this thread than plenty of others.
Majority of these threads, I state my opinion. Others confront me on it. Not the other way around.
I edited the title of your post. Please don't post spoilers in thread titles because people can see them in the index of the forum even if they don't visit The Walking Dead spoiler forum. Remember, there's still people who are waiting for the retail release before playing the game.
But it's in the spoilers section of the forums... how does that even work?
That's because you're presenting your opinion as fact. You may think it's bad writing, because you don't like it - that doesn't make it fact. People who think differently aren't wrong, that's their opinion, not 'poor defense of bad writing' etc.. Respect is a two way street.
But it's in the spoilers section of the forums... how does that even work?
The contents of the posts having spoilers in them are fine of course, but not the titles. You can still see the thread titles even if you never visit the spoilers section of the forums. To see what I mean, check the new posts (viewable by clicking "New Posts" at the top of the forums). As you can see, you can see thread titles even if you never visit the spoilers section of the forums.
The contents of the posts having spoilers in them are fine of course, but not the titles. You can still see the thread titles even if you never visit the spoilers section of the forums. To see what I mean, check the new posts (viewable by clicking "New Posts" at the top of the forums). As you can see, you can see thread titles even if you never visit the spoilers section of the forums.
That's because you're presenting your opinion as fact. You may think it's bad writing, because you don't like it - that doesn't make it fact. People who think differently aren't wrong, that's their opinion, not 'poor defense of bad writing' etc.. Respect is a two way street.
Internet beef is overrated.
I'm not presenting my opinion as fact, as least, I'm not trying to. Those "poor defense of bad writing" things were rebuttals to people that confronted me on my opinion.
So yeah, I can get a little defensive. That, and I love debating people. I truly apologize if I offended anyone.
I'm not presenting my opinion as fact, as least, I'm not trying to. Those "poor defense of bad writing" things were rebuttals to people that confronted me on my opinion.
So yeah, I can get a little defensive. That, and I love debating people. I truly apologize if I offended anyone.
I think just about everyone is guilty of getting defensive of their opinion ^-^ I love debating too, though I'm not that good at it xD. I'll probably think of better and/or great points, as I'm trying to get to sleep or something xd
People trying to defend poor writing makes me lol.
It's just sentences like these that made me think you were deliberately trying to fight people. If this was not your intention, then I was extremely mislead .
To be honest, to me, it was as if you were jumping down everyone else's throats, as some people simply wanted to state their opinion and you replied with these sort of comments.
It's just sentences like these that made me think you were deliberately trying to fight people. If this was not your intention, then I was extremely mislead .
To be honest, to me, it was as if you were jumping down everyone else's throats, as some people simply wanted to state their opinion and you replied with these sort of comments.
Yeah, I can be a dick sometimes, but I'm serious, most people respond to me and I just responded back. Granted, it's harsher than needed, but I'm sorry for it, lol. Saying sorry makes everything better.
Exactly, the way Kenny died in my scenario, which was the Ben scenario was utterly ridiculous. He had enough time to shoot Ben in the head, and go back through the gate Lee was in and climbed up. It was absolute rubbish the way that played out.
I could understand him dieing in the Christa situation which I have only read about, but not seen as yet.
It's just terrible plot induced stupidity, which is not surprising because the same guy that wrote the travesty that was Episode 3 wrote the final chapter, please correct me if I am wrong.
I think just about everyone is guilty of getting defensive of their opinion ^-^ I love debating too, though I'm not that good at it xD. I'll probably think of better and/or great points, as I'm trying to get to sleep or something xd
Yeah, I'm certainly guilty. People loved the end. And I'm happy they loved it, but I'm a story buff, and I want to be a writer, so maybe that's why I saw so many problems with the story. That said, the game impressed me. It certainly was a fantastic journey for episodes 1-4, though I honestly feel episode 5 was lackluster, who am I to rain on people's parades, lol?
And the fact I even went this far arguing with people says how much I love the game, lol.
Exactly, the way Kenny died in my scenario, which was the Ben scenario was utterly ridiculous. He had enough time to shoot Ben in the head, and go back through the gate Lee was in and climbed up. It was absolute rubbish the way that played out.
I could understand him dieing in the Christa situation which I have only read about, but not seen as yet.
It's just terrible plot induced stupidity, which is not surprising because the same guy that wrote the travesty that was Episode 3 wrote the final chapter, please correct me if I am wrong.
I think so. Though, episode 3 was great until the whole Chrisa/Omid thing and the fact they found a blowtorch in a trainstation.
The guys that wrote Episode 2 and 4 should be brought back to do season 2 all the way. Episode 1 was really good, but 2 was just incredible.
Comments
I think having walkers in the alley would be good like the bell tower situation.
Well not if they're trapped in that alley. It was either leave Ben suffer and die, or put Ben out of his misery and bring every surrounding walker on top of them.
All walkers were coming towards them when they saw them and heard ben scream. If Kenny would shoot ben when they saw them coming, he'd have time to go with Lee. But TTG wanted Kenny to "die" so yeah.
Okay, let me lay it out. Shoot Ben out of misery, get in gate and climb on roof. Walkers can't climb. Nothing is on top of them.
Well said.
1) Give Ben the gun and have him do it himself.
2) Shoot Ben and lock the gate/climb ladder.
Kenny died to convenience the writers. Why is this so hard to believe?
And if that wasn't the way he left for you, he knew the walkers would be to much. So he sacrificed himself.
Convenience them how? They have no obligation to return to any of these characters, and probably won't. They could have just left Kenny on the rooftop with Omid and Christa when Lee makes his way to the hotel to save Clem.
Kenny needed this to redeem his character.
I don't mind that Kenny died, but he was such a major character that he deserved something better. I think what bothers me the most is the poor logic. He was RIGHT THERE. It would have taken two seconds for him to shot Ben and leave through the gate with Lee.
I can get on board with the whole 'redemption' aspect, I just think it could have been thought through a little better.
I haven't seen the Christa version yet - is it any better? I hope it makes more sense.
Give me a break. You're just trying to defend poor writing. Kenny? Redeeming himself? At the most critical point in the story? How convenient. Almost as convenient as Lee getting bitten RIGHT after Clementine is kidnapped. Almost as convenient as the boat getting stolen by Vernon. I can go on and on.
Episode 5 had terrible writing.
If nothing was convenient for the story it wouldn't move on,or move in the direction intended
God, finally! Someone who gets it. It's not the fact Lee got bit that I had a problem with, but the amateur way it happened pissed me off. I knew there was a fucking zombie behind that cardboard.
My thing is, if the radio was producing static, why wasn't the walker toying with it?
Now that would have been cool if Kenny died helping Lee get through that horde to make it to the Marsh House. You see Kenny taking on more Zombies just so that Lee could make it through, going out like a badass with a stash.
Reading your posts, I gather that you really dislike the conclusion of this game. This is weird for me to say, but you remind me of Final Fantasy or Silent Hill fans. It's weird for me to say because I AM a FF and SH fan, and I spend some time on their forums and such. People are never happy.
One faction gets what they want, everyone else is pissed off.
There were some definite flaws in this plot, but as a fan of fiction in general, I have come to accept that flaws are inevitable. Geez, how dare Telltale use contrived coincidences to move the plot forward, what assholes!
I know I'm in a minority here, but I judge games based on plot and characterisation over, say, gameplay or graphics or whatever. The overall plot here is great, and Telltale did a truly jaw-dropping job of making Lee and Clem likeable.
I dunno, I guess I'm the sort of person that focuses more on the positives than the negatives, but accepts the negatives anyway.
Lol, more trying to defend bad writing. I guess plotholes move the story along too? The train wasn't as convenient, at least it made you work for it to some extent and made plenty of sense in context. The blowtorch thing was stupid, though.
And you don't need convenience to move the story along.
Dude, I joined this forum just to vent, lol. I know I'm being a bit too harsh, but I can't stand bad writing. And at the end of episode 4, I was afraid of what TellTale would do and they did it. They focused on that fucking campman storyline. If you had asked me to rate the game before episode 4, I would've said "A fucking masterpiece. One of the best games in the history of games." The story was just that good, but they tossed it away for this whackass, bitchass, stupid-ass, lame-ass, dumbass, whackass Campman arc.
I just wanted a story of Lee surviving and caring for Clem. I could care less if he died at the end, but the Campman arc ruined it. It made TellTale rush in episode 5 in an effort to wrap things up. And because of that, plotholes galore. I HATE plotholes. It was better off sticking to what it originally was about.
Congratulations! You're the billionth person to use the "You obvious do not understand [insert concept]" defense in an effort to save your terrible argument because you have nothing more substantial to add to the discussion.
Simply saying I don't know how something works doesn't make it so. So please, stop with the logical fallacies.
-If you're talking about this whole convenience matter, then look at... say... every other game... ever...
Examples:
[Insert Shooter Here]: Oh, how convenient, I'm invincible!
[Insert Adventure Game Here]: Oh, how convenient, all these items somehow come together to combine and interact with the environment so that I can complete my objective!
[Insert Platformer Here]: Oh, how convenient, I can jump on peoples heads and destroy them!
I'm pretty sure Lee was trying to survive to save and care for Clem... and I really don't see how this Campman scene that took 10 minutes ruined it... If it was the storyline you didn't like, and not your supposed plotholes, then that's your opinion, but it's not bad writing...
3) Do what you think is morally right after what you put the kid through... Also to possibly see your family again.
Yes... Kenny... Redeemed himself... At the most critical point of the story... and also after being finally shouted back at by Ben about how his family died and also realising that all he had cared about so far was his family...
I can't argue that you knew there was a walker there, but did you know it'd bite you (Without looking at videos and forums beforehand)? I don't want an answer to this question because clearly even if you didn't know, at this point in the argument you'd lie.
Really? Take a look at this:
Take what you just said and add it into this context. You have nothing else to add to the discussion. You've stated your points and you can stop now. I know you're trying to vent, but now you're simply insulting the writers. Hold your breath and count to 10 or punch a wall or something...
You know what I hate Even more than people that complain about games over and over?
Broken records.
I don't really care about plotholes, as I tend to be everything that an artist wants - someone with an open and accepting mind. It may or may not be a bad thing, jury's still out on that
It's probably the main reason TV Tropes is my favourite website - they point out the flaws I miss because I'm so wrapped up the the story.
This game has hit me on a profound level. It made me question what it means to be a human being, a feeling I have only previously felt from Neon Genesis Evangelion and V For Vendetta. Difference is, this game affected me in a POSITIVE way.
'Bad writing' affects, well, pretty much everything. The ending of this game may have been written poorly, but Telltale also pulled out all the stops to make both Lee and Clem possibly the most well-written characters in gaming history. To me, fiction is about the characters' journey, not the fine details.
As I said, I'd rather praise them for what they did brilliantly than complain it wasn't what I wanted.
Numerous plotholes. Poor villain motivation. No closure. Painfully obvious plot convenience.
Too broad and vague. And you're using strawmen. Nice. This is a storybasd game, it's not a run-and-gun shooter like Call of Duty where you can ignore has stupid the plot is.
If it's my opinion, then what's the big deal? Why did you even take the time to respond? If I say it's bad writing and you say "that your opinion", then that makes the story objective, right? If it's not bad writing then it's not necessarily good writing either.
No, Kenny still dies at the exact same point. Whether Ben lives or not. So it was just to convenience the writers. Otherwise, they would've went out of their way to give him an alternate death. But no, it's him fighting off zombies in another ambiguous death scene.
Kinda. The way Lee walked towards the radio made me thing "some bad shit's about to go down." I was 90% sure there was a walker behind the board, and I was 70% sure Lee might get bitten due to the tension it was building up.
I've stated over and over and over again that I think the writers did a great job for most of the series. I've stated constantly that I adore the game. And everyone and their mom agrees. But when I call bullshit on Episode 5, all of a sudden, people jump on me like I'm disgracing the Lord. People will bend over backwards to defend everything about this game as if it's immune to flaws. Then people say "it has flaws, it's glitchy". Technical issues don't cut it. It's flawed storywise as well, there's plenty of valid plotholes to vindicate this. It's not a terrible thing. I think TellTale has something great in their hands, and I'm being so vocal because I don't want them to fuck up season 2. I want them to stick to the concept of survival like episodes 1-3 did. They dropped the ball with this "campman" business.
"Well, that's just your opinion." You say.
THAT'S RIGHT! THAT'S EXACTLY RIGHT!!!!! And I have a right to be vocal about it without people jumping down my throat like I'm just finding something to complain about. These are valid concerns to me, and while you don't have to agree, you can at least respect it. It's just bad writing to me, I'll say it and if people try to debate me on it, I'll do so.
People try excuse away any points I make as if the game is a masterpiece when it isn't. It could've been a masterpiece and I think that's what made me the most disappointed. This is a small company, they're going to cut corners and have story issues. If the comic and TV show have issues, then I know for a fact TellTale isn't immune.
And your quotes are really cherrypicking to the point where it's intellectually disgusting. You didn't quote what I said after I made those statements. I said it was bad writing, but I think I did a pretty good job at explaining why. If not on this thread than plenty of others.
Majority of these threads, I state my opinion. Others confront me on it. Not the other way around.
But it's in the spoilers section of the forums... how does that even work?
Whatever.
Ah, gotcha, thanks for clarifying.
Internet beef is overrated.
I'm not presenting my opinion as fact, as least, I'm not trying to. Those "poor defense of bad writing" things were rebuttals to people that confronted me on my opinion.
So yeah, I can get a little defensive. That, and I love debating people. I truly apologize if I offended anyone.
I think just about everyone is guilty of getting defensive of their opinion ^-^ I love debating too, though I'm not that good at it xD. I'll probably think of better and/or great points, as I'm trying to get to sleep or something xd
It's just sentences like these that made me think you were deliberately trying to fight people. If this was not your intention, then I was extremely mislead
To be honest, to me, it was as if you were jumping down everyone else's throats, as some people simply wanted to state their opinion and you replied with these sort of comments.
Yeah, I can be a dick sometimes, but I'm serious, most people respond to me and I just responded back. Granted, it's harsher than needed, but I'm sorry for it, lol. Saying sorry makes everything better.
I could understand him dieing in the Christa situation which I have only read about, but not seen as yet.
It's just terrible plot induced stupidity, which is not surprising because the same guy that wrote the travesty that was Episode 3 wrote the final chapter, please correct me if I am wrong.
Yeah, I'm certainly guilty. People loved the end. And I'm happy they loved it, but I'm a story buff, and I want to be a writer, so maybe that's why I saw so many problems with the story. That said, the game impressed me. It certainly was a fantastic journey for episodes 1-4, though I honestly feel episode 5 was lackluster, who am I to rain on people's parades, lol?
And the fact I even went this far arguing with people says how much I love the game, lol.
I think so. Though, episode 3 was great until the whole Chrisa/Omid thing and the fact they found a blowtorch in a trainstation.
The guys that wrote Episode 2 and 4 should be brought back to do season 2 all the way. Episode 1 was really good, but 2 was just incredible.
Never thought I'd quote myself