I dont like emily either but I'd take her over ashley whos dumb decisions just cause problems, shes also the one person who cant ever survive on her own, everyone else has to deal with a wendingo at some point, the one optional time she does she instantly dies. I find the group all equally sympathetic, they all pull dumb pranks but are in a life/death situation so its other factors that affect how I feel about them. Ashleys annoying and she does in my opinion the most morally wrong things in the game possibly.
Define worst. Do you mean most useless (which I can agree with) or the least sympathisable or that she is simply the least likable in your m… moreind? Also, what exactly did Emily do to help the group, or anyone aside from herself for that matter? Correct me if I am wrong, but I remember her actions as always concerned with herself and hardly, if at all, ever with someone else.
You misunderstand my use of the quote. I do not mean it as a magical get-out-of-jail-free pass (after all, that would trivialise many bad things done in history). The circumstances vary on which this quote may be applied (i.e. Trying to kill someone out of fear vs being literally unable to save them through the effects of a trauma-induced hyperarousal freeze response and panicking).
EDIT: after some thinking, I do believe my use of the quote was poor, as it covered too many things to be coherent and consistant with Ashley's situation. Yet, I will say thusly: she never … [view original content]
Morals are subjective. I can see how you mean that Ashley is the worst from an OBJECTIVE and SURVIVALIST point of view and agree upon that. What we cannot agree on is the moral merits of anxiety disorders and trauma-induced panic attacks. I have seen what anxiety disorders and panic attacks can do to psycological trauma victims first hand, and I can tell you that their reactions are not rational nor are they of any fault in this. Here is a small bit of information of what a panic attack does here. Panic attacks reduce cognitive capabilities considerably, thus affecting Ashley's acumen through no fault of her own. I personally, if she was not suffering from a trauma induced panic attack, would be more critical of her thinking. Alas, the panic attack happened, and knowing what I know about these, I feel that she should be cut some slack.
But, hey. Morals are subjective, as I said. No matter how much I try to convince you of the moral merit (or a lack thereof) in relation to her decision making and capabilities in regards to self relience, it is ultimately your way of thinking that will determine how you view this, and I respect that. I think my way, and you yours.
I dont like emily either but I'd take her over ashley whos dumb decisions just cause problems, shes also the one person who cant ever surviv… moree on her own, everyone else has to deal with a wendingo at some point, the one optional time she does she instantly dies. I find the group all equally sympathetic, they all pull dumb pranks but are in a life/death situation so its other factors that affect how I feel about them. Ashleys annoying and she does in my opinion the most morally wrong things in the game possibly.
I dissuade Farfromsubtle. Fraser was a dick again. Some game characters may be annoying but still I'd keep them alive. Fras let Wendigo catch Emily, murder her, and was super happy about it. That went too far.
I never said otherwise, feel free to like ashley. I dont.
What we cannot agree on is the moral merits of anxiety disorders and trauma-induced panic attacks. I have seen what anxiety disorders and panic attacks can do to psycological trauma victims first hand, and I can tell you that their reactions are not rational nor are they of any fault in this. Here is a small bit of information of what a panic attack does here. Panic attacks reduce cognitive capabilities considerably, thus affecting Ashley's acumen through no fault of her own. I personally, if she was not suffering from a trauma induced panic attack, would be more critical of her thinking. Alas, the panic attack happened, and knowing what I know about these, I feel that she should be cut some slack.
Can I ever discuss a game without it turning into characters mental heath and how that excuses all their behavior, ashley having (possible) panic attacks doesn't excuse everything she does, shes not having a panic attack when she leaves chris to die and to be honest ashley shows panic and terror in horrible situations thats not necessarily panic attacks its just run of the mill fear, ashley never acts out of how many people would react in that situation. Ashley is based around that girl in horror films who makes dumb decisions and acts hysterical, they give her more depth than that obviously over time but every character starts at least as a base trope.
Morals are subjective. I can see how you mean that Ashley is the worst from an OBJECTIVE and SURVIVALIST point of view and agree upon that. … moreWhat we cannot agree on is the moral merits of anxiety disorders and trauma-induced panic attacks. I have seen what anxiety disorders and panic attacks can do to psycological trauma victims first hand, and I can tell you that their reactions are not rational nor are they of any fault in this. Here is a small bit of information of what a panic attack does here. Panic attacks reduce cognitive capabilities considerably, thus affecting Ashley's acumen through no fault of her own. I personally, if she was not suffering from a trauma induced panic attack, would be more critical of her thinking. Alas, the panic attack happened, and knowing what I know about these, I feel that she should be cut some slack.
But, hey. Morals are subjective, as I said. No matter how much I try to convince you of the moral merit (… [view original content]
I never said otherwise, feel free to like ashley. I don't.
Alright then.
Can I ever discuss a game without it turning into characters mental heath and how that excuses all their behavior, ashley having (possible) panic attacks doesn't excuse everything she does
I never said her mental health was a get-out-of-jail-free card. I am saying, that she should be cut some slack since it is beyond her control. Sure, she must garner some responsibility for her actions (she is not insane, after all) but only that she is not completely at fault and that the blame should not be as thick as some are layering it.
shes not having a panic attack when she leaves chris to die
Did you read the link I provided in the previous comment? The symptoms and effects of a panic attack can include irrational thinking (think Emily's bite) and detachment from reality as well as immobility (think when she disallowed Chris entry). As for other certain possible physical symptoms, I cannot speak on that since we cannot determine them at all.
to be honest ashley shows panic and terror in horrible situations thats not necessarily panic attacks its just run of the mill fear
You say "run for the hills fear", Implying a flight or fight response. I only remember her actually running out of fear following Josh's supposed death (before she snaps i.e. panic attack) and during the games wendigo three way battle at the lodge (when the panic attack could very well have subsided, given that a panic attack can range from a handful of minutes to an hour, as explained in that link I provided in the previous comment).
ashley never acts out of how many people would react in that situation
I would actually expect similar responses from most people in her situations (granted, not as extreme).
Ashley is based around that girl in horror films who makes dumb decisions and acts hysterical, they give her more depth than that obviously over time but every character starts at least as a base trope.
What is your point there? Of course that is the case; that is how every character in Until Dawn is founded: upon a trope. I am explaining WHY it could be so.
EDIT: Alright, I have done some more research into this subject and have come to the conclusion that you were correct, in that her reactions are NOT in relation to panic attacks. As much as she displays the symptoms of such, they are not severe enough to classify as a panic attack, but simply as a hyperarousal freeze reaction. Disregard everything I have said in regards to panic attacks. I do still believe that she has some sort of anxiety disorder, but not as severe as I may have made it seem.
I can agree still that she is useless (objectively) and that her decisions are poor. However, I was trying to say that she is NOT a bad person, hypocrite, or a bitch, as some have said. That was the original point of my original rant, but we seem to have diverted from it.
You see, her reaction to Emily's bite was questionable, but to be expected from someone with an anxiety disorder experiencing a traumatic event. Again, this is not a get-out-of-jail-free card, but I simply wish that people would stop treating her as if she is an inherently bad person as a character because of honest mistakes influenced by trauma and anxiety. Same with her failure to let Chris in. She had literally no control of her body; a freeze response actually leaves the victim unable to think clearly out of shock and inhibits ones ability to move, as the name implies.
However, this argument has become pointless now. We are mostly repeating our previous points in paraphrases (e.g. what I am saying above in this edit) and that this arguement is mostly a moral one, and thus subjective. I think we have reached the point where we should agree to disagree.
I think my way, and you yours.
I never said otherwise, feel free to like ashley. I dont.
What we cannot agree on is the moral … moremerits of anxiety disorders and trauma-induced panic attacks. I have seen what anxiety disorders and panic attacks can do to psycological trauma victims first hand, and I can tell you that their reactions are not rational nor are they of any fault in this. Here is a small bit of information of what a panic attack does here. Panic attacks reduce cognitive capabilities considerably, thus affecting Ashley's acumen through no fault of her own. I personally, if she was not suffering from a trauma induced panic attack, would be more critical of her thinking. Alas, the panic attack happened, and knowing what I know about these, I feel that she should be cut some slack.
Can I ever discuss a game without it turning into characters mental heath and how that excuses all their behavior, ashley having (possibl… [view original content]
I dissuade Farfromsubtle. Fraser was a dick again. Some game characters may be annoying but still I'd keep them alive. Fras let Wendigo catch Emily, murder her, and was super happy about it. That went too far.
I wish they had left the DLC bonus section in the game. It rounds Matt and Emily out more as characters, strengthens their arc, and makes Em… moreily a bit more likeable and their relationship more believable. It also helps make up for their long absence early in the game. I'm assuming the only reason they took it out and used it, was because it's the only section that could be removed without altering the story.
enter link description here
I must say, Emily is very "horny". The scan is real. Tower is falling, both are in danger, maybe their last moments and she demands...
Is this an easter egg?
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
Yea I shipped it too, I was really hoping that Josh and Sam would get together but nope!
It wouldn't have happened anyways since Josh knocked her out with gas or an injection/the whole entire "game". Which one sounds better? Sosh or Jam (lmfao)
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
Yea I shipped it too, I was really hoping that Josh and Sam would get together but nope!
It wouldn't have happened anyways since Josh knocked her out with gas or an injection/the whole entire "game". Which one sounds better? Sosh or Jam (lmfao)
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
I watched it from Pewdiepie and IZUNIY but I mostly watch playthroughs with no commentary so I can enjoy watching the game like it's a horror movie ^-^
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
I know! If Josh made it out okay then maybe there could've been a chance. In fact, I think it's kinda played with in some of Josh's dialog that he may have had a crush on Sam.
Yea I shipped it too, I was really hoping that Josh and Sam would get together but nope!
It wouldn't have happened anyways since Josh knocked her out with gas or an injection/the whole entire "game". Which one sounds better? Sosh or Jam (lmfao)
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
Heavy Rain's quick time events don't work? With every button that comes up alternates a new outcome and can make or break the fate of a character unlike this game which doesn't have that effect as good as HR did.
Comments
That's utterly adorable.
For those interested, Galadriel Stineman (Ashley) did a Q&A -
enter link description here
It is sir!
Then let us captain our ships - the (insert christening of your ship here) and the Crishly - towards the horizon and what may lay beyond it!
I know, rite?
Who doesn't, amirite?
I dont like emily either but I'd take her over ashley whos dumb decisions just cause problems, shes also the one person who cant ever survive on her own, everyone else has to deal with a wendingo at some point, the one optional time she does she instantly dies. I find the group all equally sympathetic, they all pull dumb pranks but are in a life/death situation so its other factors that affect how I feel about them. Ashleys annoying and she does in my opinion the most morally wrong things in the game possibly.
Morals are subjective. I can see how you mean that Ashley is the worst from an OBJECTIVE and SURVIVALIST point of view and agree upon that. What we cannot agree on is the moral merits of anxiety disorders and trauma-induced panic attacks. I have seen what anxiety disorders and panic attacks can do to psycological trauma victims first hand, and I can tell you that their reactions are not rational nor are they of any fault in this. Here is a small bit of information of what a panic attack does here. Panic attacks reduce cognitive capabilities considerably, thus affecting Ashley's acumen through no fault of her own. I personally, if she was not suffering from a trauma induced panic attack, would be more critical of her thinking. Alas, the panic attack happened, and knowing what I know about these, I feel that she should be cut some slack.
But, hey. Morals are subjective, as I said. No matter how much I try to convince you of the moral merit (or a lack thereof) in relation to her decision making and capabilities in regards to self relience, it is ultimately your way of thinking that will determine how you view this, and I respect that. I think my way, and you yours.
I dissuade Farfromsubtle. Fraser was a dick again. Some game characters may be annoying but still I'd keep them alive. Fras let Wendigo catch Emily, murder her, and was super happy about it. That went too far.
I never said otherwise, feel free to like ashley. I dont.
Can I ever discuss a game without it turning into characters mental heath and how that excuses all their behavior, ashley having (possible) panic attacks doesn't excuse everything she does, shes not having a panic attack when she leaves chris to die and to be honest ashley shows panic and terror in horrible situations thats not necessarily panic attacks its just run of the mill fear, ashley never acts out of how many people would react in that situation. Ashley is based around that girl in horror films who makes dumb decisions and acts hysterical, they give her more depth than that obviously over time but every character starts at least as a base trope.
This is insightful.
Alright then.
I never said her mental health was a get-out-of-jail-free card. I am saying, that she should be cut some slack since it is beyond her control. Sure, she must garner some responsibility for her actions (she is not insane, after all) but only that she is not completely at fault and that the blame should not be as thick as some are layering it.
Did you read the link I provided in the previous comment? The symptoms and effects of a panic attack can include irrational thinking (think Emily's bite) and detachment from reality as well as immobility (think when she disallowed Chris entry). As for other certain possible physical symptoms, I cannot speak on that since we cannot determine them at all.
You say "run for the hills fear", Implying a flight or fight response. I only remember her actually running out of fear following Josh's supposed death (before she snaps i.e. panic attack) and during the games wendigo three way battle at the lodge (when the panic attack could very well have subsided, given that a panic attack can range from a handful of minutes to an hour, as explained in that link I provided in the previous comment).
I would actually expect similar responses from most people in her situations (granted, not as extreme).
What is your point there? Of course that is the case; that is how every character in Until Dawn is founded: upon a trope. I am explaining WHY it could be so.
EDIT: Alright, I have done some more research into this subject and have come to the conclusion that you were correct, in that her reactions are NOT in relation to panic attacks. As much as she displays the symptoms of such, they are not severe enough to classify as a panic attack, but simply as a hyperarousal freeze reaction. Disregard everything I have said in regards to panic attacks. I do still believe that she has some sort of anxiety disorder, but not as severe as I may have made it seem.
I can agree still that she is useless (objectively) and that her decisions are poor. However, I was trying to say that she is NOT a bad person, hypocrite, or a bitch, as some have said. That was the original point of my original rant, but we seem to have diverted from it.
You see, her reaction to Emily's bite was questionable, but to be expected from someone with an anxiety disorder experiencing a traumatic event. Again, this is not a get-out-of-jail-free card, but I simply wish that people would stop treating her as if she is an inherently bad person as a character because of honest mistakes influenced by trauma and anxiety. Same with her failure to let Chris in. She had literally no control of her body; a freeze response actually leaves the victim unable to think clearly out of shock and inhibits ones ability to move, as the name implies.
However, this argument has become pointless now. We are mostly repeating our previous points in paraphrases (e.g. what I am saying above in this edit) and that this arguement is mostly a moral one, and thus subjective. I think we have reached the point where we should agree to disagree.
I laughed a bit, I wanted you to know that x)
Ouch, welcome to the club!
I'm no fan of Ashley, but it seems Ms. Galadriel Stineman is a cool gal. Nice Q+A!
Nova shot Emily in the face, funny shit.
I must say, Emily is very "horny". The scan is real. Tower is falling, both are in danger, maybe their last moments and she demands...
Is this an easter egg?
Ghostrobo and Syndicate
Name? you know for science
I've already watched several people play this game because I love it that much. I do own a PS4, but don't have the money to buy it right now.
But yeah, Until Dawn is great. I've come to ship Josh and Sam.
I ship Josh and Sam too!
Yea I shipped it too, I was really hoping that Josh and Sam would get together but nope!
It wouldn't have happened anyways since Josh knocked her out with gas or an injection/the whole entire "game". Which one sounds better? Sosh or Jam (lmfao)
c:
How about..........................Josham Samington?
(Cricket chirps)
EDIT: Hold up! I just realised the irony in my choice of image......................now I am sad.
I won't tell you my name.
That actually made me laugh x)
I ship those two too.
I watched it from Pewdiepie and IZUNIY but I mostly watch playthroughs with no commentary so I can enjoy watching the game like it's a horror movie ^-^
Haha, I ship those two.
I know! If Josh made it out okay then maybe there could've been a chance. In fact, I think it's kinda played with in some of Josh's dialog that he may have had a crush on Sam.
Some people call the ship "Bathing Bird."
That is my favorite ship.
I also ship:
Chris x Sam
Chris x Ashley
Chris x Josh
Matt x Jess
Mike x Jess
Emily x Matt
Hannah x Sam
Kelly is the reason I bought the game.
Heavy Rain's quick time events don't work? With every button that comes up alternates a new outcome and can make or break the fate of a character unlike this game which doesn't have that effect as good as HR did.
AW THAT'S SO CUTE
Thanks for making it!
Edit: Just to clarify, I meant the thread. I don't think you made the game, lol.
One minute in: Sam didn't go along with the prank. I think she tried to warn Hannah. (They're best friends, so why wouldn't she?)