Before I get slammed for this, I feel that I should let you know that Shenmue is one of my top 5 favorite games EVER. The thing is that it is hyped through the roof (I would like to point out that a good portion of those who are doing the hyping most likely have never even played either game). Sure Shenmue was good at the time (it could have used some more action though... especially considering that it was about a martial artist looking for his father's murderer & the that you learn a new move like every 30 minutes) but it hasn't exactly aged well.
Yakuza on the other hand has MUCH more action (to the point it can be annoying on occasion) & (to me at least) has a feeling very similar to Shenmue. Sure you can't interact with random citizen #1,874 to get such brilliant commentary as "I'm very busy" or
It depends on what you want in a game though, really. I've been replaying both Shenmue 1 and 2 recently, and in all honesty, they've aged better than most games. Despite having completed them many times before, I still find it extremely enjoyable to replay them over and over.
Personally I prefer Shenmue over Yakuza. Don't get me wrong, I love both games, and they're both amazing. But I actually like it that Shenmue wasn't all about fighting. It's a nice change just to go around a city and find out information regarding things, like a mystery of sorts. I mean every console game is all about the action these days, it's nice to see the occasional one that isn't, if you get what I mean. Also I thought it was awesome you could talk to everyone in Shenmue. Yeah, true, the majority of them say the same thing, more so in Shenmue 2, however I think it adds more immersion to the game, you actually feel a part of the world. I really hated it in Yakuza that you could only speak to around 10 people in the entire area. I really loved the environment in Shenmue 1. I loved how it would snow, and you could go round the town at christmas, and see Santa walking around. It was great how you could walk up to people and they would go "Hey, Ryo! How are you!?". Yeah, it was a slow paced game, especially during the bits you mentioned and you end up getting sick of Ryo saying such things as "Do you know any Chinese people?" or "Do you know a place where sailors hang out?". However, that was only largely due to the fact you had to wait for certain places to open, and stupid things like that, and that was actually improved in Shenmue 2.
That all said, I still found the Yakuza series to be an epic series. It's a shame it doesn't get the attention it deserves. I've still yet to finish Yakuza 3 due to time constraints, however I've enjoyed every second I have played of it.
Not really this forum, but many western gaming sites, on the boards, you see people praising Bioware like they can do no wrong, yet they slam JRPGs, because apparently they haven't evolved, they still contain the same old turn-based combat, they have emo characters, and so on. It's really tragic, considering how many great JRPGs there are out there, which most people haven't even heard of. The majority of which have an engorssing story, and amazing characters.
Oh, and by the way, I really do like WRPGs. They're also very enjoyable experiences too, although for a completely different reason from JRPGs. They allow you to be able to create your own adventure, unlike JRPGs which are linear.
The whole western vs japanese rpg thing is definitely taste by taste, and you see the both sides (which is equally as strong) slam each other just as much as each other. idk
The whole western vs japanese rpg thing is definitely taste by taste, and you see the both sides (which is equally as strong) slam each other just as much as each other. idk
Nah, it isn't equally as strong, not in the west. If we included Eastern gamers in the debate, which we can't due to language barriers, then it would, but otherwise it isn't.
The JRPG genre is still a niche genre in the western world, unfortunately. With the majority of them only selling around 300,000 in the west. Which isn't a lot, compared to the likes of WRPGs. Theres very few franchises which break the mold, such as Final Fantasy which sells very well in the west, but other than that.
I think the same debate could be used in the East, except with the roles reversed, with JRPGs being over-rated and WRPGs being under-rated. It's cultural differences I guess. It's still a shame, none the less.
I wouldn't call P3(FES)/[Portable] underrated atall. Infact the Persona series is the highest selling point for the SMT series for some reason. Persona series is usually seen as havethe worst stories in the SMT series as a whole by a lot of SMT orignal fans before P3 FES and 4 came out. While I agree with the SMT populas I'm also one of the ones who believes Persona should've stayed part of the Revelations/ Title alone series. Just like how Devil Summoner should've stayed part of Soul Hackers.
I'd say DDS would be under rated compared to the Persona series.
I wouldn't call P3(FES)/[Portable] underrated atall. Infact the Persona series is the highest selling point for the SMT series for some reason. Persona series is usually seen as havethe worst stories in the SMT series as a whole by a lot of SMT orignal fans before P3 FES and 4 came out. While I agree with the SMT populas I'm also one of the ones who believes Persona should've stayed part of the Revelations/ Title alone series. Just like how Devil Summoner should've stayed part of Soul Hackers.
I'd say DDS would be under rated compared to the Persona series.
No, but if ask the majority of people, "Do you know what Persona 3 is?", they will say they don't know it. It is popular among those of us who enjoy JRPG's, however over all, it's not a popular brand at all. Same goes for the Tales of series. It is a very popular series among the JRPG fanbase, however, other than that, if you go up to someone and ask them whether they've heard a title in it, they'll probably say no.
Besides, if you read my post, I was saying that the JRPG genre in general is under-rated. I just happened to be playing Persona 3 Portable at the time, so I thought I'd choose that cover as the title cover for the JRPG genre as an whole.
It really does depend on where you look. I've been to Japanese culture festivals (pretty much an anime convention) where people violently rail against western rpgs. Personally, I don't care on the matter and think that both are okay for different reasons, but honestly I don't like either side all that well in the first place.
And I don't think Persona 3 is a good game to be using for the western vs japanese debate, because its not as popular (or representative) as mass effect is. If you were to compare properly, it would be against Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest. If you wanted to, you can just go ahead and say that Persona 3 is just underrated in general when it comes to rpgs.
It really does depend on where you look. I've been to Japanese culture festivals (pretty much an anime convention) where people violently rail against western rpgs. Personally, I don't care on the matter and think that both are okay for different reasons, but honestly I don't like either side all that well in the first place.
And I don't think Persona 3 is a good game to be using for the western vs japanese debate, because its not as popular (or representative) as mass effect is. If you were to compare properly, it would be against Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest. If you wanted to, you can just go ahead and say that Persona 3 is just underrated in general when it comes to rpgs.
I like persona 4 better anyways.
If you read my post above, you'd realise I wasn't using that as an example. :P I just decided to use that boxart as I happened to be playing the game at the moment.
A japanese cultural festival isn't a very good example though, really. You can get conventions for even the most nichest subjects.
Personally, I still think 3 is better than 4, despite the improvements in 4. Not quite sure why, but there you go. All preference though.
I'm far more a fan of the western style of RPG, but damn has the west been going down the shitter in terms of making compelling RPGs lately, especially the major studios.
No, but if ask the majority of people, "Do you know what Persona 3 is?", they will say they don't know it. It is popular among those of us who enjoy JRPG's, however over all, it's not a popular brand at all. Same goes for the Tales of series. It is a very popular series among the JRPG fanbase, however, other than that, if you go up to someone and ask them whether they've heard a title in it, they'll probably say no.
Besides, if you read my post, I was saying that the JRPG genre in general is under-rated. I just happened to be playing Persona 3 Portable at the time, so I thought I'd choose that cover as the title cover for the JRPG genre as an whole.
I can see where you're coming from but here I've not met many who don't know what the Persona series is (but don't know the rest even exist) and act like it's the best game ever. Which to point out, I stay clear of the anime crowd as I loathe anime (yet like the Persona series).
I don't dislike Muse, I actually like a high percentage of their material, but Dream Theater are a much superior band who truly rule over progressive music in general.
I don't dislike Muse, I actually like a high percentage of their material, but Dream Theater are a much superior band who truly rule over progressive music in general.
Dream Theater are in my opinion highly OVER RATED. Hell, you can't go on a rock or metal site without seeing a "news" article about them... & most of those articles have a high comment rate as well. Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike them (Hell... I liked them even before they got there sudden popularity a few years back), but there are other bands much Much MUCH more underrated. For example... Fates Warning. Don't know them? Look them up... You should like them considering that Dream Theater basically stole there sound.
it's underrated because people know jack about rap and only know the mainstream rap.
I agree 100%. I mean I can handle some mainstream shit... Like B.O.B. has a few halfway decent tracks.... but underground guys like Necro & Orion are the best things going right now (at least in the genre).
You also have got to take into consideration the Old School shit like Coolio, NWA, 2Pac, Granmaster Flash & Ice-T. I mean it seems that today's Rap & Hip Hop has no real flow. They really need to take a look at those dude's works... They might learn something.
For example... Fates Warning. Don't know them? Look them up... You should like them considering that Dream Theater basically stole there sound.
I think I've heard people mention them before, I know I've heard the name, but I've never taken the time to check them out, but I certainly will. Thanks.
And when you say that Dream Theater basically stole their sound, do you mean that DT actually blatantly ripped off Fates Warning's sound, or are you just saying that Dream Theater share a very similar sound and style to Fates Warning? Because couldn't it just be coincidence that the two bands share a sound that is very much the same?
Classical music these days is pretty underrated by people in their 20s and younger. Then there are those who chauvinistically overrate it, so maybe that balances it out.
I think I've heard people mention them before, I know I've heard the name, but I've never taken the time to check them out, but I certainly will. Thanks.
And when you say that Dream Theater basically stole their sound, do you mean that DT actually blatantly ripped off Fates Warning's sound, or are you just saying that Dream Theater share a very similar sound and style to Fates Warning? Because couldn't it just be coincidence that the two bands share a sound that is very much the same?
Nope... they stole there sound. Fates has been around much longer playing in that style. James actually sang backup on a sound on Parallels in like 1990... I think that is where the first heard that kind of sound & just ran with it.
Nope... they stole there sound. Fates has been around much longer playing in that style. James actually sang backup on a sound on Parallels in like 1990... I think that is where the first heard that kind of sound & just ran with it.
It's ridiculous to claim that one band "stole another band's sound" in my opinion. Without influence, none of the music you hear today would exist. NONE of the music around today (with the exception of "noise music") is original.
I agree 100%. I mean I can handle some mainstream shit... Like B.O.B. has a few halfway decent tracks.... but underground guys like Necro & Orion are the best things going right now (at least in the genre).
You also have got to take into consideration the Old School shit like Coolio, NWA, 2Pac, Granmaster Flash & Ice-T. I mean it seems that today's Rap & Hip Hop has no real flow. They really need to take a look at those dude's works... They might learn something.
It's all down to taste. Even the non mainstream rapping I don't like, and consider it to be over-rated.
Eitherway, it is still clearly over-rated. If all of the rubbish stuff is mainstream. As obviously a lot of people seem to like it, for it even to become and stay mainstream in the first place.
I personally think the majority of mainstream music is over-rated really. I was scanning through this weeks UK's top 40 charts, and 90% of the music on it was abysmal to say the least. Hell, the top track was the same 30 seconds of song repeated over and over on a loop.
It's ridiculous to claim that one band "stole another band's sound" in my opinion. Without influence, none of the music you hear today would exist. NONE of the music around today (with the exception of "noise music") is original.
When one band blatantly copies another band's sound & add no distinguishing characteristics it is called ripping them off. When one band takes elements from another band's sound & adds there own touches, it is called being influenced. Learn the difference.
I don't care for Muse or Dream Theatre. Dream Theatre's just a showcase of technicality for music geeks to cream over at the cost of proper song-writing/pacing. Muse I feel are quite pretentious and I get the feeling talk down to a lot of their listeners (or at least that's the vibe I get from them)
Emerson, Lake & Palmer, now that's proper prog at its best (which still isn't great, I just don't dig the principles the genre's built on I guess)
I disagree, I feel that Don Bluth is way overrated. You're probably right about Disney, but I wouldn't say they're consistently overrated. Every once in a while they do put out something that lives up to the Disney hype, even if you don't count Pixar.
I don't care for Muse or Dream Theatre. Dream Theatre's just a showcase of technicality for music geeks to cream over at the cost of proper song-writing/pacing. Muse I feel are quite pretentious and I get the feeling talk down to a lot of their listeners (or at least that's the vibe I get from them)
Emerson, Lake & Palmer, now that's proper prog at its best (which still isn't great, I just don't dig the principles the genre's built on I guess)
Emerson, Lake & Palmer are brilliant. Yes are also a great progressive band.
I don't agree that Muse can really be called progressive. They're often called post progressive but I don't really understand why... they don't share many elements with progressive music at all in my opinion.
Emerson, Lake & Palmer are brilliant. Yes are also a great progressive band.
I don't agree that Muse can really be called progressive. They're often called post progressive but I don't really understand why... they don't share many elements with progressive music at all in my opinion.
True, they dabble in a lot of different styles whilst keeping their own sound as well, I don't think anyone could deny that Starlight's pretty much a pop song. I saw them live once, there was a great light show surrounding a band that bar the drummer just didn't want to seem to have anything to do with the people watching them. They played all their songs well, but there was no interaction and not a hint of the band enjoying themselves, which is really really important because it shows and can make or break a show
Comments
I liked Tape-leg
Personally I prefer Shenmue over Yakuza. Don't get me wrong, I love both games, and they're both amazing. But I actually like it that Shenmue wasn't all about fighting. It's a nice change just to go around a city and find out information regarding things, like a mystery of sorts. I mean every console game is all about the action these days, it's nice to see the occasional one that isn't, if you get what I mean. Also I thought it was awesome you could talk to everyone in Shenmue. Yeah, true, the majority of them say the same thing, more so in Shenmue 2, however I think it adds more immersion to the game, you actually feel a part of the world. I really hated it in Yakuza that you could only speak to around 10 people in the entire area. I really loved the environment in Shenmue 1. I loved how it would snow, and you could go round the town at christmas, and see Santa walking around. It was great how you could walk up to people and they would go "Hey, Ryo! How are you!?". Yeah, it was a slow paced game, especially during the bits you mentioned and you end up getting sick of Ryo saying such things as "Do you know any Chinese people?" or "Do you know a place where sailors hang out?". However, that was only largely due to the fact you had to wait for certain places to open, and stupid things like that, and that was actually improved in Shenmue 2.
That all said, I still found the Yakuza series to be an epic series. It's a shame it doesn't get the attention it deserves. I've still yet to finish Yakuza 3 due to time constraints, however I've enjoyed every second I have played of it.
boom!
Well the entire point is FOR them to be related
Over-Rated
WRPGs
Under-Rated
JRPGs
Not really this forum, but many western gaming sites, on the boards, you see people praising Bioware like they can do no wrong, yet they slam JRPGs, because apparently they haven't evolved, they still contain the same old turn-based combat, they have emo characters, and so on. It's really tragic, considering how many great JRPGs there are out there, which most people haven't even heard of. The majority of which have an engorssing story, and amazing characters.
Oh, and by the way, I really do like WRPGs. They're also very enjoyable experiences too, although for a completely different reason from JRPGs. They allow you to be able to create your own adventure, unlike JRPGs which are linear.
I know, but I felt I had something to get off my chest about these two things in particular I guess
JedExodus: he bends the rules untill they break :cool:
The JRPG genre is still a niche genre in the western world, unfortunately. With the majority of them only selling around 300,000 in the west. Which isn't a lot, compared to the likes of WRPGs. Theres very few franchises which break the mold, such as Final Fantasy which sells very well in the west, but other than that.
I think the same debate could be used in the East, except with the roles reversed, with JRPGs being over-rated and WRPGs being under-rated. It's cultural differences I guess. It's still a shame, none the less.
I'd say DDS would be under rated compared to the Persona series.
Over-rated: James Patterson
Underrated: Charles Willeford, one of the best writers I've come across.
Besides, if you read my post, I was saying that the JRPG genre in general is under-rated. I just happened to be playing Persona 3 Portable at the time, so I thought I'd choose that cover as the title cover for the JRPG genre as an whole.
Man I suck like that
And I don't think Persona 3 is a good game to be using for the western vs japanese debate, because its not as popular (or representative) as mass effect is. If you were to compare properly, it would be against Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest. If you wanted to, you can just go ahead and say that Persona 3 is just underrated in general when it comes to rpgs.
I like persona 4 better anyways.
Haven't beaten it yet, but I'm sure that it's over rated.
It might not be the best game ever but it's really a good game from what I've played. Even if I haven't been inspired to go back and beat it.
OOOOH...Under-RATED
A japanese cultural festival isn't a very good example though, really. You can get conventions for even the most nichest subjects.
Personally, I still think 3 is better than 4, despite the improvements in 4. Not quite sure why, but there you go. All preference though.
I can see where you're coming from but here I've not met many who don't know what the Persona series is (but don't know the rest even exist) and act like it's the best game ever. Which to point out, I stay clear of the anime crowd as I loathe anime (yet like the Persona series).
Underrated: The Saboteur
Underrated: Dream Theater
I don't dislike Muse, I actually like a high percentage of their material, but Dream Theater are a much superior band who truly rule over progressive music in general.
As an Irishman I can't possibly agree with that. it doesn't help that I have Saboteur on PC where it's a buggy pile o' crap
Dream Theater are in my opinion highly OVER RATED. Hell, you can't go on a rock or metal site without seeing a "news" article about them... & most of those articles have a high comment rate as well. Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike them (Hell... I liked them even before they got there sudden popularity a few years back), but there are other bands much Much MUCH more underrated. For example... Fates Warning. Don't know them? Look them up... You should like them considering that Dream Theater basically stole there sound.
Overrated: Rap.
Underrated: Electronic music.
Also, it's underrated because people know jack about rap and only know the mainstream rap.
I agree 100%. I mean I can handle some mainstream shit... Like B.O.B. has a few halfway decent tracks.... but underground guys like Necro & Orion are the best things going right now (at least in the genre).
You also have got to take into consideration the Old School shit like Coolio, NWA, 2Pac, Granmaster Flash & Ice-T. I mean it seems that today's Rap & Hip Hop has no real flow. They really need to take a look at those dude's works... They might learn something.
I think I've heard people mention them before, I know I've heard the name, but I've never taken the time to check them out, but I certainly will. Thanks.
And when you say that Dream Theater basically stole their sound, do you mean that DT actually blatantly ripped off Fates Warning's sound, or are you just saying that Dream Theater share a very similar sound and style to Fates Warning? Because couldn't it just be coincidence that the two bands share a sound that is very much the same?
Weird Al Yankovic
Underratted:
Jonathan Coulton
Nope... they stole there sound. Fates has been around much longer playing in that style. James actually sang backup on a sound on Parallels in like 1990... I think that is where the first heard that kind of sound & just ran with it.
It's ridiculous to claim that one band "stole another band's sound" in my opinion. Without influence, none of the music you hear today would exist. NONE of the music around today (with the exception of "noise music") is original.
Eitherway, it is still clearly over-rated. If all of the rubbish stuff is mainstream. As obviously a lot of people seem to like it, for it even to become and stay mainstream in the first place.
I personally think the majority of mainstream music is over-rated really. I was scanning through this weeks UK's top 40 charts, and 90% of the music on it was abysmal to say the least. Hell, the top track was the same 30 seconds of song repeated over and over on a loop.
When one band blatantly copies another band's sound & add no distinguishing characteristics it is called ripping them off. When one band takes elements from another band's sound & adds there own touches, it is called being influenced. Learn the difference.
Emerson, Lake & Palmer, now that's proper prog at its best (which still isn't great, I just don't dig the principles the genre's built on I guess)
King's Quest V
Underrated:
King's Quest IV
As good as everyone says:
King's Quest VI
As terrible as everyone says:
King's Quest II
Overrated-
Everything by Disney
Underrated-
An American Tail and the Secret of NIMH
Emerson, Lake & Palmer are brilliant. Yes are also a great progressive band.
I don't agree that Muse can really be called progressive. They're often called post progressive but I don't really understand why... they don't share many elements with progressive music at all in my opinion.
True, they dabble in a lot of different styles whilst keeping their own sound as well, I don't think anyone could deny that Starlight's pretty much a pop song. I saw them live once, there was a great light show surrounding a band that bar the drummer just didn't want to seem to have anything to do with the people watching them. They played all their songs well, but there was no interaction and not a hint of the band enjoying themselves, which is really really important because it shows and can make or break a show