Shame TTG, but still, if this was advertised as an interactive story, it would be brilliant
Watch playing dead episode 1, it was advertised as such.
I believe they likened it to a couple different things: A long form story, and an interactive tv show.
There are several threads complaining about the choices, I think the people making the complaints should go (re)watch Playing Dead episode 1 and episode 2 which came out well before the first episode of the game.
Realistically, WD would probably be between 2 and 3, it is NOT as linear as shown, if it was that, there would be zero consequences for anything done at all.
I haven't seen any real consequence so far. You choose which character dies when. It's happened once. If I had the option to keep someone alive or kill someone then I'd be pretty much satisfied.
I keep mentioning that when I saw the bandits in the camp I fully expected to have to make a judgment call. There was a lot of walkers and lead flying. If I could have chosen st save someone then I would have been pretty much satisfied. Grated some other things about the game would have still frustrated me but I might be able to say that all in all I enjoyed it.
Here's what I really would have liked to happen: Larry doesn't get executed by the hand of fate. He continues to hate me and goes on and continues to sabotage me at every turn. He makes my life a living hell and then finally, I get the opportunity to let him die. If I want to I can justify it because he's a danger to Lee and his surrogate daughter. And if I dont I can justify that because I'm just better than that.
And then maybe he shoots Carly in the face, or throws me to the walkers 2 seconds before the game ends. Or maybe he saves my life, or someone else's. And I get to think about those possibilities until it happens.
But none of those things is going to happen. Whatever's SET to happen is going to happen. So why do I care? Oh there might be something tacked on for episode 5, some big decision you get to make, but it wont take you back more checkpoint to get all the possible endings.
I see this game branching....But in the last episode. I figure they will take one of two routes for the split...
1 They will simply have a number of decisions that split the game at that point regardless of what you have done previously.
2 They will pretend to make your choices matter by tallying up your choices and grading them. This will create branches for "you are a jerk", "you just let things happen around you", "you tried to play hero", and so on.
1) IS practically infeasible, especially for an indie dev house
2) THat branching out. Looks to me to appear to be two different games. That's jsut not doable
3)That's not an accurate depiction of the branching that happens in TWD
It's just not that simple
It's more like several small tangents come off off those little balls based of the choices you make, then come back and merge with the next major event.
Honestly, to the people complaining. Your logic is invalid. You're askin for an Open-World RPG not a graphic adventure game, which TWD has always been advertised as. It's choice system is pretty advanced for that genre.
Basically you're praying and hoping an apple is going to turn into an orange. And when it doesn't you get angry. TTG is an independent game studio that makes ADVENTURE games. With a fraction of the budget of the developers of most mainstream titles. Jesus Christ, your lack of appreciation is sickening!
why didn't he grab the saw or a woody thing to smash zombies' heads trying to get in the farm? When I firstly played ep 1, I was looking for the saw as a first thing ^^^ but :O
1) IS practically infeasible, especially for an indie dev house
2) THat branching out. Looks to me to appear to be two different games. That's jsut not doable
3)That's not an accurate depiction of the branching that happens in TWD
It's just not that simple
It's more like several small tangents come off off those little balls based of the choices you make, then come back and merge with the next major event.
Honestly, to the people complaining. Your logic is invalid. You're askin for an Open-World RPG not a graphic adventure game, which TWD has always been advertised as. It's choice system is pretty advanced for that genre.
Basically you're praying and hoping an apple is going to turn into an orange. And when it doesn't you get angry. TTG is an independent game studio that makes ADVENTURE games. With a fraction of the budget of the developers of most mainstream titles. Jesus Christ, your lack of appreciation is sickening!
I don't think many people are asking for decisions that will branch off at every episode into a situation where you have hundreds of scenarios. But when you end episode 3 and the situation is the same no matter how you played it, that seems like you're not really making a difference with your choices, because at the end of the day you're all in the same place.
I see this game branching....But in the last episode. I figure they will take one of two routes for the split...
1 They will simply have a number of decisions that split the game at that point regardless of what you have done previously.
2 They will pretend to make your choices matter by tallying up your choices and grading them. This will create branches for "you are a jerk", "you just let things happen around you", "you tried to play hero", and so on.
I think that the second scenario is likely.
I also think that this linear issue isn't one that will ever be resolved on this board to anyone's satisfaction. It cannot be disputed that the way this game was advertised was problematic. This is evidenced by the split amongst the community.
I have been on this board for about 4 days and have seen the point argued no less than 10 times in different threads with viewpoints from both sides. I stand by my original opinion and don't plan on restating it or arguing it again.
From where I sit, it is an incredibly bad choice on the part of TTG to not address their method of marketing, either in the form of modifying future sales pitches or by modifying the game itself.
There are too many people arguing both sides for the issue to not warrant any action.
Episode one wasn't as linear since we could have chosen different ppl ( Doug and Carley ) and saving Carley made Lee talk more about his past...etc....and after ep 3 everything went downhill...back to linear...hopefully things will change a bit in ep 4 like either leaving Omid to die...or choosing to save him...etc
You know, its possible they are aiming for multiple endings, based on your overall choices. Say depending on how well you treated Clem throughout would decide on her choice of staying with him, while middle road she saves him but leaves, third being she saves herself and runs for it.
Personally, if the final episode can at least take all 4 episodes into consideration to have multiple endings, I think I will be fine. Least then it would give another reason to replay it.
i really don't think the game should be criticised , sorry but after just finishing the third episode I've been on the edge of my seat again and that to me is worth every penny . Yes the story is going in one direction but isn't it meant to be the choices we make on the way that matters ?? I mean ok its a valid point that no matter what you do Carly dies duck dies etc but its how we react to these situations in the dialogue that makes the game so good.
i for one love getting to the end and seeing who chose to do what and cant wait for the next one every time !, and for the money per episode i think were all winners. To have a truly 100% decision based game would take for ever to make and play and lets face it would cost a fortune to buy . I for one am a very happy customer
Is anybody disappointed with the game so far? The game not the story. I believe the story is very well written, and I'm thoroughly enjoying that part of the game, but the game itself is extremely frustrating.
I have played episode 1, 2 and 3 and my decisions don't seem to mean anything. When I first loaded the game I felt my decisions would make a difference, but apart from saving Carley or Doug I feel helpless. It's like going through a game supposedly giving you the freedom to make vital decisions and changes but the outcome still being the same, extremely disappointing.
I don't know if you guys ever had the chance to play Heavy Rain on the PS3, but that's a game Tell Tale should have been creating. A game where decisions count for something. A game where one wrong move and you can die and be written out of the game. A story that had like 5 possible endings and changes in the plot if you made bad choices. This is what I was hoping for when I bought The Walking Dead. I bought the game because I'm a fan of the TV series, but I was expecting more from the game.
I have been in several situations on the game where I have wanted to make a difference but couldn't as the game appears to be too linear and forcing your hand on many things. I would have loved to have made a difference without these silly "Appreciation hints" and the following person dying 10 seconds later unexpectedly.
Instead of just building up a strong relationship with some of the characters, you should be able to make sure they stay alive as well without the decision being made for you. If that means a slight change in the plot with the characters you like surviving so be it, I just feel Tell Tale have been lazy and created a very short gaming experience without you being able to do a thing to prevent character deaths.
Please don't get me wrong I am enjoying it as a whole to a certain extent but I was hoping for so much more hence the rant. I would have just loved to be able to make a valuable difference without feeling helpless.
I think telltale got their money and now just want to get this game over with.
The easy way out is to kill the main characters, that way the decisions you have made with each one wont matter and they dont have to make all kinds of different options.
Like the Carley/Doug issue. Making you choose who to save... This was a mistake. Because of that they had to make 2 games. One with Carley, another with Doug. The easy way out was to kill them both. Problem solved.
Now with the main crew gone and the decisions you made gone with them, creating the next episode will be easier.
Kenny will drop dead in ep4, or he will be a nobody without his familly.
The problem i have with the game is not the story, the world of WTD, the death of carley/doug, no, it's the fact that the game was advertised by "the story will be tailored by your choices".
At the end of the third episode (who i excellent, i think it's the better of the three in term of emotion and story) our saves are all the sames... how the story is tailored by my choices if all of them are without consequences ? Beside Doug/Carley choices, what other impact the story or "tailor" it ? None. Sequence, dialogue, changes a litlle but not the story herself...
This problem have nothing to do with "the world of TWD" or "Carley/doug death". You can do nothing, change nothing, or even influence in the smallest possible way the story, you can't save anybody (oh I already see "it's TWD world answers", you can keep it, i understand it and i agree but i don't speak of that now, i speak about choices and impact) or change anything (even in the smallest way in this chapter). So how can i tailor the story of a game if i can't change, influence or worsen things ?
this is my problem now.
I'd alreaffy buy the season and i think TWD game is a good interactive comic but not the game i see in advertising and the playing dead interviews...
I do understand what you mean. Originally I thought it would mean the choices would ultimately affect my outcome of each episode. Say episode 2 those who chose to stay deal with the brothers, while those who chose to leave end up in the RV with Kenny and his family for episode 2 followed by episode 3 being completely different than what we got this time around.
That was my initial though on "tailored to your choices"
I loved ep1 but now I am start thinking my love is only gold digger. Your choices matter? I yesterday tried to play ep1 withouch choice anything but game continued like normal even I let all dialoues pass so your choices definetly matter a lot:D I also started to play Fallout yesterday and I enjoyed it a way more than TWD...
@ unknowFox: well, i'd never expected such dramaticstics changes in the story line but at last i wished that i can alter it a little
@the wilcard: Yep ! This is why the ME fans gone wilds (i was one but hopefully after DA2 i waited for feedback before buy ME3). No, i'll not say "Tellatalle make the same mistake" but i'm not far for it. I will wait and see but so far what they have done in this episode (in matter of choices) is far to impress me...
The story is never tailored by any choices in the third chapter, take account please that i don't speak of little event or dialogue but the story herself.
I was advertised, like anyone here: the story will be tailored by the player's choices.
Now look at the game at the end of the chapter three...
What change between my saves, yours or anybody else, in term of story ?
Nothing... Tellatale got a lot of attention with this game, TWD was quoted numerous time, got a lot of positive critics (both professionnals and players), got awards. The cards are in their hand but i will play the two remaining chapters (only because i've a season pass) for what their are: a little interactive comic book and don't expect me to buy the second season...
@ unknowFox:
Nothing... Tellatale got a lot of attention with this game, TWD was quoted numerous time, got a lot of positive critics (both professionnals and players), got awards. The cards are in their hand but i will play the two remaining chapters (only because i've a season pass) for what their are: a little interactive comic book and don't expect me to buy the second season...
Lots of people will leave after season 1. I can not imagine people still paying them fot their lies..
I still say that final judgement on this whole choice that are or are not real choices can only be given at the end of the story. If there is only one ending then sure, you have a fair reason to be upset. I personally believe that there will be more than one ending, though sometimes I wonder if I'm just hoping for hoping sake. Only time will tell.
lots of people already leave now... look at the % on the succes page on steam, the numbers speaks themselves
@corruptbiggins: tailoring the end is not the same that tailoring the STORY (yep, it's the important word here... and i use only the word used in the advertising and palying dead); the end can be different but if the story leading to the end is always the same, TWD will only be an interactive comic, nothing more and i think this will be the case, chapter 3 show us this...
I still say that final judgement on this whole choice that are or are not real choices can only be given at the end of the story. If there is only one ending then sure, you have a fair reason to be upset. I personally believe that there will be more than one ending, though sometimes I wonder if I'm just hoping for hoping sake. Only time will tell.
The story changes based on your actions. You get different dialogue, different cut scenes, different characters, different animations, different skins. You even get different endings. All of this with a game that is heavily animated.
The thing about the Fallout series? There are almost no cut scenes other than at the beginning and end of the games, and just like war, the cutscenes in the Fallout series never change. While you have different endings, all you get are brief paragraphs telling you what happened. And then the sequels all ignore your choices from other games and invent their own mythology. TWD has ENTIRE DIALOGUE ARCS recounting the choices you made at the end of each game. And subsequent games spontaneously start discussing choices you made in the first game.
Dragon Age never has new scenes at a location after you've made a significant decision. You can go back and people will recognize what you said, but only in dialogue boxes or floating words over their heads. Only two events are significantly altered within the story based on choices you make, and only one of those has any effect on subsequent games. As for the ending, it's pretty much just multiple choice/Batman gambit.
The only game with significantly altered and further recognized endings that also includes cutscenes within the game is the Mass Effect series, which is a unique and special game in the industry. It's the only game that surpasses TWD with regard to choice affecting the story, the cinematic nature, and subsequent stories within the series.
That's it. Only Mass Effect does what TWD does as well as TWD does it, and you can level the same complaints in Mass Effect against its strongest elements. ______ always dies no matter what you do. ______ always dies no matter what you do.
But that doesn't matter in the long run. The people complaining about why ME3 garnered such ire don't seem to know why that movement was started. People forget that the reason ME3 pissed most of us off isn't because it was sad, although there were people who were angry about that. It was because the game ignored what you did at the end. What you're doing now, by complaining about Carley getting shot and Lilly running away? That's moving the goalposts. That's raising the bar above its competitors. That's changing the rules so that your pet peeve sounds more justified.
But it's not. You're not complaining about lies you've been told. You're complaining that the game is paying out on the emotional capital you invested. You're complaining that the game is succeeding in what it set out to do.
The TWD is doing what it said it would do better than almost every other game in the industry. And if the end of the game is a series of cutscenes that reflects your choices from throughout the series, it will have done so better than the final chapter of the premiere interactive narrative in the industry.
I loved ep1 but now I am start thinking my love is only gold digger. Your choices matter? I yesterday tried to play ep1 withouch choice anything but game continued like normal even I let all dialoues pass so your choices definetly matter a lot:D I also started to play Fallout yesterday and I enjoyed it a way more than TWD...
Ok, well Fallout is a completely different series/genra of game than TWD, so I don't see why that matters.
@bazenji: events change yes, but look at the end of the third chapter, we all have the same results; it's a fact.
The STORY (again, it's the important word here) don't change, we are all at the same point, with the same characters (alive or dead), i don't say TWD is not a good game, their writers are excellent, but i'd don't buy the game to have an interactive book...
I'd buy a game with a story i can influence (even a litlle).
If you have a different character alive, if you have find different equipment or if you are in a different final point, tell me how i can reach this result. You will be alone in this case...
the STORY, not events or dialogue (yes i repeat myself alot because it seems necessary) don't change no matter what you do.
I will not speak of ME because it's not the place for and i don't really care now... ME is an average game with a dumb ending who was overhyped, nothing more.
And fallout is a different kind of game with a different budget, nothing to compare sorry
The story changes based on your actions. You get different dialogue, different cut scenes, different characters, different animations, different skins. You even get different endings. All of this with a game that is heavily animated.
The thing about the Fallout series? There are almost no cut scenes other than at the beginning and end of the games, and just like war, the cutscenes in the Fallout series never change. While you have different endings, all you get are brief paragraphs telling you what happened. And then the sequels all ignore your choices from other games and invent their own mythology. TWD has ENTIRE DIALOGUE ARCS recounting the choices you made at the end of each game. And subsequent games spontaneously start discussing choices you made in the first game.
Dragon Age never has new scenes at a location after you've made a significant decision. You can go back and people will recognize what you said, but only in dialogue boxes or floating words over their heads. Only two events are significantly altered within the story based on choices you make, and only one of those has any effect on subsequent games. As for the ending, it's pretty much just multiple choice/Batman gambit.
The only game with significantly altered and further recognized endings that also includes cutscenes within the game is the Mass Effect series, which is a unique and special game in the industry. It's the only game that surpasses TWD with regard to choice affecting the story, the cinematic nature, and subsequent stories within the series.
That's it. Only Mass Effect does what TWD does as well as TWD does it, and you can level the same complaints in Mass Effect against its strongest elements. ______ always dies no matter what you do. ______ always dies no matter what you do.
But that doesn't matter in the long run. The people complaining about why ME3 garnered such ire don't seem to know why that movement was started. People forget that the reason ME3 pissed most of us off isn't because it was sad, although there were people who were angry about that. It was because the game ignored what you did at the end. What you're doing now, by complaining about Carley getting shot and Lilly running away? That's moving the goalposts. That's raising the bar above its competitors. That's changing the rules so that your pet peeve sounds more justified.
But it's not. You're not complaining about lies you've been told. You're complaining that the game is paying out on the emotional capital you invested. You're complaining that the game is succeeding in what it set out to do.
The TWD is doing what it said it would do better than almost every other game in the industry. And if the end of the game is a series of cutscenes that reflects your choices from throughout the series, it will have done so better than the final chapter of the premiere interactive narrative in the industry.
Not bad for an indie developer.
Never played mass effect and not planning to... Next qestion: Does time of TWD gameplay worth 25$? Definitly not without replay! Also the most people not complaing about characters deaths but about your choices affect game so minor you probably dont notice they did something. I have no problem killing anyone in game. And you call making me upset is game succed? Eh, I am playing games exactly for opposite reasons. TWD could be great movie, but like game its presented in EP3 its suck.. Meybe you are feeling your choices affect game but for me not. I dont need thousands of outcome or sandbox freedom but at least some story develop depend on my choices.. As I already wrote in other thread TWD game has extreme potencial but if EP4,5 will not beed legendary the game will soon become forgotten..
I can expect an immature young gaming community to be persistent, inconsiderate, and downright rude when it comes to setting expectations on a game. You see, I remember the days when gaming companies didn't even have a direct line with their consumer base. From that perspective, my expectations on whether the game is on time or not is irrelevant---the proof is in the finished product, which I am interested in telling TellTale my feedback.
As a fan of quick-time event games from the early laserdisk games (Dragon's Lair, etc) I was looking forward to being immersed in a world where ambiguous moral decisions in a world gone to hell would have to be executed on the fly without much time to discern the long term implications.
What TellTale has done a remarkable job thus far is to immerse the player into a world and with outstanding scripts, voice acting and character development and direction have allowed me to LIVE in this world and care for the eventual outcome of the characters. It would not surprise me if the quality continues at the current pace that TellTale receives some type of industry recognition/award for this outstanding achievement.
Where I think TellTale has some opportunities to improve are the branching of the story based on decisions. Early on, it was stressed by TellTale that "Decision Matters". It does, but only in a superficial way. For example, I described some of the early quick-time events such as Dragon's Lair. In that game, decision matters because making the wrong decision ends your life, and in general there was ONLY one correct answer. In Walking Dead, there are many different possible answers, but the opposite is in fact true. There is no wrong answer. The decisions implicates dialog routes along the game but ultimately doesn't change the outcome of the plot/story, which I think is a shame.
For example, I recall wondering who would be the better ally when choosing Carly or Doug. Now, in Episode III, both are dead--SO IT DOESN'T MATTER. Remember wondering if Kenny wasn't going to take you to the coast based on how you treated his family. Well, he'll let you know that he wasn't happy with your decision, but IT DOESN'T MATTER--you all get to leave with him ANYWAY. There's many more but more of the standouts just to illustrate my point that CHOICE DOESN'T MATTER--at least not yet in this game.
The game is worth it's price of admission based on the story-telling alone but I'm hoping TellTale uses this feedback to improve a more vast and complex world/story based on YOUR choices--and to date that vision hasn't been realized.
I understand it would take 3-4 times that folks are already angry about with the delays. But I would LOVE to see a game that TRULY rewards and/or punishes you for your choices, especially if the writing can remain top notch. I'm willing to pay more for the re-playability. I now act with more reckless abandon since it doesn't appear like it matters.
I can expect an immature young gaming community to be persistent, inconsiderate, and downright rude when it comes to setting expectations on a game. You see, I remember the days when gaming companies didn't even have a direct line with their consumer base. From that perspective, my expectations on whether the game is on time or not is irrelevant---the proof is in the finished product, which I am interested in telling TellTale my feedback.
As a fan of quick-time event games from the early laserdisk games (Dragon's Lair, etc) I was looking forward to being immersed in a world where ambiguous moral decisions in a world gone to hell would have to be executed on the fly without much time to discern the long term implications.
What TellTale has done a remarkable job thus far is to immerse the player into a world and with outstanding scripts, voice acting and character development and direction have allowed me to LIVE in this world and care for the eventual outcome of the characters. It would not surprise me if the quality continues at the current pace that TellTale receives some type of industry recognition/award for this outstanding achievement.
Where I think TellTale has some opportunities to improve are the branching of the story based on decisions. Early on, it was stressed by TellTale that "Decision Matters". It does, but only in a superficial way. For example, I described some of the early quick-time events such as Dragon's Lair. In that game, decision matters because making the wrong decision ends your life, and in general there was ONLY one correct answer. In Walking Dead, there are many different possible answers, but the opposite is in fact true. There is no wrong answer. The decisions implicates dialog routes along the game but ultimately doesn't change the outcome of the plot/story, which I think is a shame.
For example, I recall wondering who would be the better ally when choosing Carly or Doug. Now, in Episode III, both are dead--SO IT DOESN'T MATTER. Remember wondering if Kenny wasn't going to take you to the coast based on how you treated his family. Well, he'll let you know that he wasn't happy with your decision, but IT DOESN'T MATTER--you all get to leave with him ANYWAY. There's many more but more of the standouts just to illustrate my point that CHOICE DOESN'T MATTER--at least not yet in this game. Yes we do get dialog SNIPPETS and slight variance of pathing but the plot continues to TellTale's design. I now act with more reckless abandon since it doesn't appear like it matters. I'm guessing TellTale will take certain relationships into account and present different "endings" and that will be it.
The game is worth it's price of admission based on the story-telling alone but I'm hoping TellTale uses this feedback to improve a more vast and complex world/story based on YOUR choices--and to date that vision hasn't been realized.
I understand it would take 3-4 times what it currently takes to complete an episode of branching was taken seriously. I work in IT so I understand the implications of my statements. But I would LOVE to see a game that TRULY rewards and/or punishes you for your choices, especially if the writing can remain top notch. I'm willing to pay more for the re-playability. First developer to take quality like this on a true multi-pathing route will be in the history books.
1) IS practically infeasible, especially for an indie dev house
2) THat branching out. Looks to me to appear to be two different games. That's jsut not doable
3)That's not an accurate depiction of the branching that happens in TWD
It's just not that simple
It's more like several small tangents come off off those little balls based of the choices you make, then come back and merge with the next major event.
Honestly, to the people complaining. Your logic is invalid. You're askin for an Open-World RPG not a graphic adventure game, which TWD has always been advertised as. It's choice system is pretty advanced for that genre.
Basically you're praying and hoping an apple is going to turn into an orange. And when it doesn't you get angry. TTG is an independent game studio that makes ADVENTURE games. With a fraction of the budget of the developers of most mainstream titles. Jesus Christ, your lack of appreciation is sickening!
I agree... I spent a lot of time yesterday trying to get through to people.
When it comes to picking and choosing my battles, I've just decided to let it go. lol
The problem is they didn't set up to many choices from the beginning. Other than Carley and Doug , You can't save anyone. Not Larry , Not Mark , Not Duck nor Katjaa , Lilly , Glenn will always leave and even the person you saved in the first episode bites the bullet. Still a great game nevertheless but the game was always an illusion of choice. I guess Carley/Doug's death is what's opening their eyes to it.
Honestly, to the people complaining. Your logic is invalid. You're askin for an Open-World RPG not a graphic adventure game, which TWD has always been advertised as. It's choice system is pretty advanced for that genre.
I love arguing like this, people would like to change game "little" and you making from it Open-World RPG...
The problem is they didn't set up to many choices from the beginning. Other than Carley and Doug , You can't save anyone. Not Larry , Not Mark , Not Duck nor Katjaa , Lilly , Glenn will always leave and even the person you saved in the first episode bites the bullet. Still a great game nevertheless but the game was always an illusion of choice. I guess Carley/Doug's death is what's opening their eyes to it.
Yeah, but they mostly kicked own balls with advert choices matter, because from their point of view you can advert every game in this way...
I can expect an immature young gaming community to be persistent, inconsiderate, and downright rude when it comes to setting expectations on a game. You see, I remember the days when gaming companies didn't even have a direct line with their consumer base. From that perspective, my expectations on whether the game is on time or not is irrelevant---the proof is in the finished product, which I am interested in telling TellTale my feedback.
As a fan of quick-time event games from the early laserdisk games (Dragon's Lair, etc) I was looking forward to being immersed in a world where ambiguous moral decisions in a world gone to hell would have to be executed on the fly without much time to discern the long term implications.
What TellTale has done a remarkable job thus far is to immerse the player into a world and with outstanding scripts, voice acting and character development and direction have allowed me to LIVE in this world and care for the eventual outcome of the characters. It would not surprise me if the quality continues at the current pace that TellTale receives some type of industry recognition/award for this outstanding achievement.
Where I think TellTale has some opportunities to improve are the branching of the story based on decisions. Early on, it was stressed by TellTale that "Decision Matters". It does, but only in a superficial way. For example, I described some of the early quick-time events such as Dragon's Lair. In that game, decision matters because making the wrong decision ends your life, and in general there was ONLY one correct answer. In Walking Dead, there are many different possible answers, but the opposite is in fact true. There is no wrong answer. The decisions implicates dialog routes along the game but ultimately doesn't change the outcome of the plot/story, which I think is a shame.
For example, I recall wondering who would be the better ally when choosing Carly or Doug. Now, in Episode III, both are dead--SO IT DOESN'T MATTER. Remember wondering if Kenny wasn't going to take you to the coast based on how you treated his family. Well, he'll let you know that he wasn't happy with your decision, but IT DOESN'T MATTER--you all get to leave with him ANYWAY. There's many more but more of the standouts just to illustrate my point that CHOICE DOESN'T MATTER--at least not yet in this game. Yes we do get dialog SNIPPETS and slight variance of pathing but the plot continues to TellTale's design. I now act with more reckless abandon since it doesn't appear like it matters. I'm guessing TellTale will take certain relationships into account and present different "endings" and that will be it.
The game is worth it's price of admission based on the story-telling alone but I'm hoping TellTale uses this feedback to improve a more vast and complex world/story based on YOUR choices--and to date that vision hasn't been realized.
I understand it would take 3-4 times what it currently takes to complete an episode of branching was taken seriously. I work in IT so I understand the implications of my statements. But I would LOVE to see a game that TRULY rewards and/or punishes you for your choices, especially if the writing can remain top notch. I'm willing to pay more for the re-playability. First developer to take quality like this on a true multi-pathing route will be in the history books.
What say you?
I agree with what you're saying. I enjoy the story element and was just as shocked when Carley/Duck and Katjaa were knocked off. For that I can give Telltale praise, it's the choice element that irks me for reasons that you described. I would be willing to pay the price of a full game (ie ME3 or whatever) if they had branching choices that made a difference and lasted.
Comments
Watch playing dead episode 1, it was advertised as such.
I believe they likened it to a couple different things: A long form story, and an interactive tv show.
There are several threads complaining about the choices, I think the people making the complaints should go (re)watch Playing Dead episode 1 and episode 2 which came out well before the first episode of the game.
I haven't seen any real consequence so far. You choose which character dies when. It's happened once. If I had the option to keep someone alive or kill someone then I'd be pretty much satisfied.
I keep mentioning that when I saw the bandits in the camp I fully expected to have to make a judgment call. There was a lot of walkers and lead flying. If I could have chosen st save someone then I would have been pretty much satisfied. Grated some other things about the game would have still frustrated me but I might be able to say that all in all I enjoyed it.
Here's what I really would have liked to happen: Larry doesn't get executed by the hand of fate. He continues to hate me and goes on and continues to sabotage me at every turn. He makes my life a living hell and then finally, I get the opportunity to let him die. If I want to I can justify it because he's a danger to Lee and his surrogate daughter. And if I dont I can justify that because I'm just better than that.
And then maybe he shoots Carly in the face, or throws me to the walkers 2 seconds before the game ends. Or maybe he saves my life, or someone else's. And I get to think about those possibilities until it happens.
But none of those things is going to happen. Whatever's SET to happen is going to happen. So why do I care? Oh there might be something tacked on for episode 5, some big decision you get to make, but it wont take you back more checkpoint to get all the possible endings.
1 They will simply have a number of decisions that split the game at that point regardless of what you have done previously.
2 They will pretend to make your choices matter by tallying up your choices and grading them. This will create branches for "you are a jerk", "you just let things happen around you", "you tried to play hero", and so on.
agreed. After Carley died, and episode 3, i might as well be watching a movie, seeing as nothing i do means crap.
1) IS practically infeasible, especially for an indie dev house
2) THat branching out. Looks to me to appear to be two different games. That's jsut not doable
3)That's not an accurate depiction of the branching that happens in TWD
It's just not that simple
It's more like several small tangents come off off those little balls based of the choices you make, then come back and merge with the next major event.
Honestly, to the people complaining. Your logic is invalid. You're askin for an Open-World RPG not a graphic adventure game, which TWD has always been advertised as. It's choice system is pretty advanced for that genre.
Basically you're praying and hoping an apple is going to turn into an orange. And when it doesn't you get angry. TTG is an independent game studio that makes ADVENTURE games. With a fraction of the budget of the developers of most mainstream titles. Jesus Christ, your lack of appreciation is sickening!
I don't think many people are asking for decisions that will branch off at every episode into a situation where you have hundreds of scenarios. But when you end episode 3 and the situation is the same no matter how you played it, that seems like you're not really making a difference with your choices, because at the end of the day you're all in the same place.
We all have different stories. Which means our choices mattered.
I think that the second scenario is likely.
I also think that this linear issue isn't one that will ever be resolved on this board to anyone's satisfaction. It cannot be disputed that the way this game was advertised was problematic. This is evidenced by the split amongst the community.
I have been on this board for about 4 days and have seen the point argued no less than 10 times in different threads with viewpoints from both sides. I stand by my original opinion and don't plan on restating it or arguing it again.
From where I sit, it is an incredibly bad choice on the part of TTG to not address their method of marketing, either in the form of modifying future sales pitches or by modifying the game itself.
There are too many people arguing both sides for the issue to not warrant any action.
Personally, if the final episode can at least take all 4 episodes into consideration to have multiple endings, I think I will be fine. Least then it would give another reason to replay it.
i for one love getting to the end and seeing who chose to do what and cant wait for the next one every time !, and for the money per episode i think were all winners. To have a truly 100% decision based game would take for ever to make and play and lets face it would cost a fortune to buy . I for one am a very happy customer
I have played episode 1, 2 and 3 and my decisions don't seem to mean anything. When I first loaded the game I felt my decisions would make a difference, but apart from saving Carley or Doug I feel helpless. It's like going through a game supposedly giving you the freedom to make vital decisions and changes but the outcome still being the same, extremely disappointing.
I don't know if you guys ever had the chance to play Heavy Rain on the PS3, but that's a game Tell Tale should have been creating. A game where decisions count for something. A game where one wrong move and you can die and be written out of the game. A story that had like 5 possible endings and changes in the plot if you made bad choices. This is what I was hoping for when I bought The Walking Dead. I bought the game because I'm a fan of the TV series, but I was expecting more from the game.
I have been in several situations on the game where I have wanted to make a difference but couldn't as the game appears to be too linear and forcing your hand on many things. I would have loved to have made a difference without these silly "Appreciation hints" and the following person dying 10 seconds later unexpectedly.
Instead of just building up a strong relationship with some of the characters, you should be able to make sure they stay alive as well without the decision being made for you. If that means a slight change in the plot with the characters you like surviving so be it, I just feel Tell Tale have been lazy and created a very short gaming experience without you being able to do a thing to prevent character deaths.
Please don't get me wrong I am enjoying it as a whole to a certain extent but I was hoping for so much more hence the rant. I would have just loved to be able to make a valuable difference without feeling helpless.
The easy way out is to kill the main characters, that way the decisions you have made with each one wont matter and they dont have to make all kinds of different options.
Like the Carley/Doug issue. Making you choose who to save... This was a mistake. Because of that they had to make 2 games. One with Carley, another with Doug. The easy way out was to kill them both. Problem solved.
Now with the main crew gone and the decisions you made gone with them, creating the next episode will be easier.
Kenny will drop dead in ep4, or he will be a nobody without his familly.
At the end of the third episode (who i excellent, i think it's the better of the three in term of emotion and story) our saves are all the sames... how the story is tailored by my choices if all of them are without consequences ? Beside Doug/Carley choices, what other impact the story or "tailor" it ? None. Sequence, dialogue, changes a litlle but not the story herself...
This problem have nothing to do with "the world of TWD" or "Carley/doug death". You can do nothing, change nothing, or even influence in the smallest possible way the story, you can't save anybody (oh I already see "it's TWD world answers", you can keep it, i understand it and i agree but i don't speak of that now, i speak about choices and impact) or change anything (even in the smallest way in this chapter). So how can i tailor the story of a game if i can't change, influence or worsen things ?
this is my problem now.
I'd alreaffy buy the season and i think TWD game is a good interactive comic but not the game i see in advertising and the playing dead interviews...
That was my initial though on "tailored to your choices"
@the wilcard: Yep ! This is why the ME fans gone wilds (i was one but hopefully after DA2 i waited for feedback before buy ME3). No, i'll not say "Tellatalle make the same mistake" but i'm not far for it. I will wait and see but so far what they have done in this episode (in matter of choices) is far to impress me...
The story is never tailored by any choices in the third chapter, take account please that i don't speak of little event or dialogue but the story herself.
I was advertised, like anyone here: the story will be tailored by the player's choices.
Now look at the game at the end of the chapter three...
What change between my saves, yours or anybody else, in term of story ?
Nothing... Tellatale got a lot of attention with this game, TWD was quoted numerous time, got a lot of positive critics (both professionnals and players), got awards. The cards are in their hand but i will play the two remaining chapters (only because i've a season pass) for what their are: a little interactive comic book and don't expect me to buy the second season...
Lots of people will leave after season 1. I can not imagine people still paying them fot their lies..
@corruptbiggins: tailoring the end is not the same that tailoring the STORY (yep, it's the important word here... and i use only the word used in the advertising and palying dead); the end can be different but if the story leading to the end is always the same, TWD will only be an interactive comic, nothing more and i think this will be the case, chapter 3 show us this...
I more hope in patch..
The thing about the Fallout series? There are almost no cut scenes other than at the beginning and end of the games, and just like war, the cutscenes in the Fallout series never change. While you have different endings, all you get are brief paragraphs telling you what happened. And then the sequels all ignore your choices from other games and invent their own mythology. TWD has ENTIRE DIALOGUE ARCS recounting the choices you made at the end of each game. And subsequent games spontaneously start discussing choices you made in the first game.
Dragon Age never has new scenes at a location after you've made a significant decision. You can go back and people will recognize what you said, but only in dialogue boxes or floating words over their heads. Only two events are significantly altered within the story based on choices you make, and only one of those has any effect on subsequent games. As for the ending, it's pretty much just multiple choice/Batman gambit.
The only game with significantly altered and further recognized endings that also includes cutscenes within the game is the Mass Effect series, which is a unique and special game in the industry. It's the only game that surpasses TWD with regard to choice affecting the story, the cinematic nature, and subsequent stories within the series.
That's it. Only Mass Effect does what TWD does as well as TWD does it, and you can level the same complaints in Mass Effect against its strongest elements. ______ always dies no matter what you do. ______ always dies no matter what you do.
But that doesn't matter in the long run. The people complaining about why ME3 garnered such ire don't seem to know why that movement was started. People forget that the reason ME3 pissed most of us off isn't because it was sad, although there were people who were angry about that. It was because the game ignored what you did at the end. What you're doing now, by complaining about Carley getting shot and Lilly running away? That's moving the goalposts. That's raising the bar above its competitors. That's changing the rules so that your pet peeve sounds more justified.
But it's not. You're not complaining about lies you've been told. You're complaining that the game is paying out on the emotional capital you invested. You're complaining that the game is succeeding in what it set out to do.
The TWD is doing what it said it would do better than almost every other game in the industry. And if the end of the game is a series of cutscenes that reflects your choices from throughout the series, it will have done so better than the final chapter of the premiere interactive narrative in the industry.
Not bad for an indie developer.
Ok, well Fallout is a completely different series/genra of game than TWD, so I don't see why that matters.
The STORY (again, it's the important word here) don't change, we are all at the same point, with the same characters (alive or dead), i don't say TWD is not a good game, their writers are excellent, but i'd don't buy the game to have an interactive book...
I'd buy a game with a story i can influence (even a litlle).
If you have a different character alive, if you have find different equipment or if you are in a different final point, tell me how i can reach this result. You will be alone in this case...
the STORY, not events or dialogue (yes i repeat myself alot because it seems necessary) don't change no matter what you do.
I will not speak of ME because it's not the place for and i don't really care now... ME is an average game with a dumb ending who was overhyped, nothing more.
And fallout is a different kind of game with a different budget, nothing to compare sorry
I am not racist so I dont chose games by gendre. I just need have fun playing it...
Never played mass effect and not planning to... Next qestion: Does time of TWD gameplay worth 25$? Definitly not without replay! Also the most people not complaing about characters deaths but about your choices affect game so minor you probably dont notice they did something. I have no problem killing anyone in game. And you call making me upset is game succed? Eh, I am playing games exactly for opposite reasons. TWD could be great movie, but like game its presented in EP3 its suck.. Meybe you are feeling your choices affect game but for me not. I dont need thousands of outcome or sandbox freedom but at least some story develop depend on my choices.. As I already wrote in other thread TWD game has extreme potencial but if EP4,5 will not beed legendary the game will soon become forgotten..
As a fan of quick-time event games from the early laserdisk games (Dragon's Lair, etc) I was looking forward to being immersed in a world where ambiguous moral decisions in a world gone to hell would have to be executed on the fly without much time to discern the long term implications.
What TellTale has done a remarkable job thus far is to immerse the player into a world and with outstanding scripts, voice acting and character development and direction have allowed me to LIVE in this world and care for the eventual outcome of the characters. It would not surprise me if the quality continues at the current pace that TellTale receives some type of industry recognition/award for this outstanding achievement.
Where I think TellTale has some opportunities to improve are the branching of the story based on decisions. Early on, it was stressed by TellTale that "Decision Matters". It does, but only in a superficial way. For example, I described some of the early quick-time events such as Dragon's Lair. In that game, decision matters because making the wrong decision ends your life, and in general there was ONLY one correct answer. In Walking Dead, there are many different possible answers, but the opposite is in fact true. There is no wrong answer. The decisions implicates dialog routes along the game but ultimately doesn't change the outcome of the plot/story, which I think is a shame.
For example, I recall wondering who would be the better ally when choosing Carly or Doug. Now, in Episode III, both are dead--SO IT DOESN'T MATTER. Remember wondering if Kenny wasn't going to take you to the coast based on how you treated his family. Well, he'll let you know that he wasn't happy with your decision, but IT DOESN'T MATTER--you all get to leave with him ANYWAY. There's many more but more of the standouts just to illustrate my point that CHOICE DOESN'T MATTER--at least not yet in this game.
The game is worth it's price of admission based on the story-telling alone but I'm hoping TellTale uses this feedback to improve a more vast and complex world/story based on YOUR choices--and to date that vision hasn't been realized.
I understand it would take 3-4 times that folks are already angry about with the delays. But I would LOVE to see a game that TRULY rewards and/or punishes you for your choices, especially if the writing can remain top notch. I'm willing to pay more for the re-playability. I now act with more reckless abandon since it doesn't appear like it matters.
What say you?
As a fan of quick-time event games from the early laserdisk games (Dragon's Lair, etc) I was looking forward to being immersed in a world where ambiguous moral decisions in a world gone to hell would have to be executed on the fly without much time to discern the long term implications.
What TellTale has done a remarkable job thus far is to immerse the player into a world and with outstanding scripts, voice acting and character development and direction have allowed me to LIVE in this world and care for the eventual outcome of the characters. It would not surprise me if the quality continues at the current pace that TellTale receives some type of industry recognition/award for this outstanding achievement.
Where I think TellTale has some opportunities to improve are the branching of the story based on decisions. Early on, it was stressed by TellTale that "Decision Matters". It does, but only in a superficial way. For example, I described some of the early quick-time events such as Dragon's Lair. In that game, decision matters because making the wrong decision ends your life, and in general there was ONLY one correct answer. In Walking Dead, there are many different possible answers, but the opposite is in fact true. There is no wrong answer. The decisions implicates dialog routes along the game but ultimately doesn't change the outcome of the plot/story, which I think is a shame.
For example, I recall wondering who would be the better ally when choosing Carly or Doug. Now, in Episode III, both are dead--SO IT DOESN'T MATTER. Remember wondering if Kenny wasn't going to take you to the coast based on how you treated his family. Well, he'll let you know that he wasn't happy with your decision, but IT DOESN'T MATTER--you all get to leave with him ANYWAY. There's many more but more of the standouts just to illustrate my point that CHOICE DOESN'T MATTER--at least not yet in this game. Yes we do get dialog SNIPPETS and slight variance of pathing but the plot continues to TellTale's design. I now act with more reckless abandon since it doesn't appear like it matters. I'm guessing TellTale will take certain relationships into account and present different "endings" and that will be it.
The game is worth it's price of admission based on the story-telling alone but I'm hoping TellTale uses this feedback to improve a more vast and complex world/story based on YOUR choices--and to date that vision hasn't been realized.
I understand it would take 3-4 times what it currently takes to complete an episode of branching was taken seriously. I work in IT so I understand the implications of my statements. But I would LOVE to see a game that TRULY rewards and/or punishes you for your choices, especially if the writing can remain top notch. I'm willing to pay more for the re-playability. First developer to take quality like this on a true multi-pathing route will be in the history books.
What say you?
I agree... I spent a lot of time yesterday trying to get through to people.
When it comes to picking and choosing my battles, I've just decided to let it go. lol
I love arguing like this, people would like to change game "little" and you making from it Open-World RPG...
Yeah, but they mostly kicked own balls with advert choices matter, because from their point of view you can advert every game in this way...
*scratches head* How did Loki's comment get quoted with my name there? haha
I agree with what you're saying. I enjoy the story element and was just as shocked when Carley/Duck and Katjaa were knocked off. For that I can give Telltale praise, it's the choice element that irks me for reasons that you described. I would be willing to pay the price of a full game (ie ME3 or whatever) if they had branching choices that made a difference and lasted.
sry man:D I was just lazy so copied:D