TWD isn't really a game. You don't really "play" it. You don't really have any true control over it. I'm not saying it's bad. I enjoyed it. If I wanted to play a game though, I wouldn't chose it. It's a pick-your-own adventure book. You have as much freedom as a multiple choice test. There is no real creative choice in the game. You do what it says you can do. It's fascist. I won't abide by your rules, Telltale! Stick it to the man! Fight for your freedom! Rock the institution! ROCK THE INSTITUTION!
Rock, Paper Scissors is a 'game'... There isn't many actions or choices to it though... Tic, Tac, Toe is a game... There isn't much to it though. Cups is a game... again there isn't much to it (some cheat on it by palming the pea/coin...).
Those probably aren't the best examples to back up your point, given that they are all pure 'gameplay', and everything you do decides the result of the game.
Choices in Walking Dead, also leads to different results (characters living or dieing), and differences in the ending.
Like rock, paper, and scissors you are only give two or three choices, and these result in changes throughout the game.
Like cups, a choice in Walking Dead may get you something, or it may get you nothing, or make it where there is no way to get the pea, since someone palmed the item you could have gotten if you made the right decision. That item simply vanishes, or perhaps it (the decision) comes back to haunt you later.
t's a pick-your-own adventure book. You have as much freedom as a multiple choice test. There is no real creative choice in the game. You do what it says you can do.
Choose your own adventure book as I pointed out is the trade name for the genre "gamebook". It is historically a form of 'game', for having an interaction a choice, even if the interaction is limited to 'turn to page' 259, if you do A, or page 100, if you do B, or occasionally turn to page 40 if you choose C, but you aren't always given three choices, and usually less. And many times those choices lead to "The End", usually death, or capture, or bad outcome. Only really one or two 'true' paths through the book that has a good outcome. But that is part of the 'game' in the "book" to find the right path.
It's kinda of more like how mad libs, is to word gaming (give a few input words of choice, and the narrator fills in the blanks and reads the story to you with your choices)...
It's just a low-res low-poly machinima movie that waits for you to press buttons to proceed, and tries to pretend you have a fraction of control over what happens. You don't. There's no thought or effort in any of the game, the "gameplay" consists of you repeatedly asking the "game" to continue showing you the story. This does not make it a game, this makes it a movie with busywork.
If you went to a theatre to see the new Evil Dead movie, and they handed you a 360 controller when you sat down, and every 5 minutes it popped up and said "PRESS A TO AVOID DEATH!" and if you failed, it just restarted the scene from 10 seconds ago over and over again until you succeed, would that be considered a game now?
I don't care in the slightest how good the story is, it's hardly a game if you aren't expected to provide any meaningful choices or actions, or even think a little bit.
And to be honest, a Choose Your Own Adventure book typically has more real interaction than these "games" do.
OMG! BTTF SUX IZ 2 EASY! TWD IS STUPID! IT'S JUST A MOVIE YOU CLICK.
It was amusing at first, and I'll admit, a bit fun to join in on. But now, the tantrum has worn out its humor, and is really just coming over as childish and bitter. Further, we've already heard this argument, and bringing it up again in this fashion as though the game just came out accomplishes nothing.
I'm not saying you have to like TTG or agree with their direction, but this attitude needs work before people start taking you seriously.
Being a game and being an experience are not mutually exclusive concepts.
An experience generally involves having some form of first person perspective (as in you control the character directly (it represents you, the player), rather than watching a character do its own actions on its own, non-playable characters. FIrst person perspective by literary terms, as opposed dramatic third person characters that are watched from a distance, as if you are an observer watching someone else make their own choices.
Note: I'm talking about more literary definitions of First Person, and Third Person, as opposed to video game perspectives of how you control your avatar on screen. Obviously in the latter Walking Dead is overall third person mode game.
Of course people probably have varying opinions on how much of an 'experience' something is, or how much you can 'experience' things directly or indirectly.
Do you experience through your own actions, or experience things through the action of others. A great writer can write a book in which you indirectly experience what they experienced or what they want you to experience through imaginations. You experience through the 'eyes' and 'thoughts' of the author. Even if you haven't physically experienced it. It's more of a metaphysical distinction.
People are gonna love things, people are gonna hate things. Those who out number the others win. Those who lose, voice their opinion and hope that they at least won't be forgotten the next time around.
Well it could be worse, Telltale could take the route of Sierra's Slater & Charlie Go Camping, a video game/interactive story for children... In which the actions are clicking on screen for various hidden pictures, and animations, and voiceovers to read the story. Then clicking on to the next page... It's more like an animated pop-up book.
No way to die, no bad choices, just secret things to discover. Advertised as an 'adventure' game, but was far less interactive than Sierra's normal fair.
It's a game by any definition of the word. Get over yourselves.
Marriam-Webster defines a game as an "activity engaged in for diversion or amusement." So yes. Technically, TWD is a game. I'm not trying to argue that it's not actually a game. Just that I don't subjectively see it as a game. Like I said before, if I wanted to play a game, I wouldn't choose TWD, but that doesn't mean I don't like it. I personally loved it. And boy, did you gotta be so hostile?
So what you are really saying is that there are some games or genres you like better than others. If you were given a choice there are those you would choose before choosing TWD?
So is it safe to assume you prefer more complicated offerings, more options more choices when playing a game, more direct interactivity? When choosing a game?
It's the worst game I have ever played. I'd finish the NES Dr. Jeykll and Mr. Hyde willingly and happily before playing beyond episode 2 of BTTF.
And I'll say it over and over until I am dead. You want me to shut up? Then kill me. Kill me and suck the juices from my eyeballs in revelry at the carnage you've unleashed upon the BTTF: The Game hater.
So what you are really saying is that there are some games or genres you like better than others. If you were given a choice there are those you would choose before choosing TWD?
So is it safe to assume you prefer more complicated offerings, more options more choices when playing a game, more direct interactivity? When choosing a game?
TWD is one of my favourite games. I loved the hell out of it. But I had to play it when I was in the mood for it. If I were like "Hmm. I wanna play a game" then TWD would not be what I chose solely for the lack of real interactivity. And having not played BttF, I have nothing to say about it.
Back to the Future was better than the NES Back to the Future games, LOL.
Though it played like a poor man's Lucasarts game... it had way too many overused clichéd adventure game puzzles (like ones I've seen in half a dozen old games), added nothing new... Half the conversation puzzles were variants of the if I hold up these fingers, how many am I holding up puzzle from Monkey Island 2... In which you had to figure out the pattern and translate it.
Almost everything else was a variant on adventure game standard inventory puzzles... I can't even remember the number of times I've seen the newspaper/key/door puzzle in an adventure game... It was already old when Hugo's House of Horrors used it...
Not to mention some of the concepts of 'game' being thrown around are archaic.
It's okay, DAISHI. Everyone agrees with you. Those of us who like it that way are few and far between, and will probably be convinced to kill ourselves sooner rather than later to cleanse the world of people who like difficult puzzles and old-school design.
Fawful, your hostility undermines anything you are arguing for...
I'm sincere. I want to leave this world anytime I see everyone arguing against what I like. Because that means I am completely alone in what I like and almost nothing I can enjoy will be produced eventually in the future. The things I admire in adventure games are UNIVERSALLY HATED NOW. All big name designers and intelligent people are in a consensus that puzzles are bad and should go in favor of story-only. And I don't care. Nobody would ever listen to me anyway, because everyone has their mind made up. I'll go mad if I don't say something. And frankly, everyone wants people like me to leave this world too so they don't have to listen to my bothersome opinions.
I don't even give a fuck about winning an argument, I'm gonna say whatever the fucking fuckity fuck fuck I fucking want.
The fact that you think the world is a shithole because people disagree with you is really depressing. Different opinions is what makes the world beautiful.
The fact that you think the world is a shithole because people disagree with you is really depressing. Different opinions is what makes the world beautiful.
Shithole for me. Just me. Paradise for them. I don't want their opinions to go away, I want a neutral world where all opinions regarding meaningless things like video games and film exist and they don't force something like puzzles to stop existing.
Could you imagine how shitty the world would be if everyone agreed and held exactly the same opinions? There'd be no individuality. You wouldn't matter, because your next door neighbor is exactly the same damn person. Nobody would care about you because you'd be just another of the 7 billion identical drones.
Could you imagine how shitty the world would be if everyone agreed and held exactly the same opinions? There'd be no individuality. You wouldn't matter, because your next door neighbor is exactly the same damn person. Nobody would care about you because you'd be just another of the 7 billion identical drones.
Yeah, but I wouldn't get shit on whenever I hold a differentiating opinion, because all opinions would be the same, and the things I love wouldn't be in the minority.
Yeah, but I wouldn't get shit on whenever I hold a differentiating opinion, because all opinions would be the same, and the things I love wouldn't be in the minority.
People are gonna be assholes. But just because you don't like when people do it to you, it doesn't mean you should shit on other peoples opinions.
BUT REGARDLESS. Way off topic. Keep calm are carry on, folks.
People are gonna be assholes. But just because you don't like when people do it to you, it doesn't mean you should shit on other peoples opinions.
Then I won't last a second. I'll be weak, and I'll be knocked over by more vocal, better spoken people in an instant. Being loud and extreme and angry is the only way I can say something that goes against the majority opinion without getting trampled on.
If I stay angry, I can keep from crawling away dejected from any discussion. If I stay calm, I'll just get wrecked or ignored.
The fact that you think the world is a shithole because people disagree with you is really depressing. Different opinions is what makes the world beautiful.
Yes.
We don't have to agree. But at least we ought to be mature about it (for the most part).
No one is saying you should go jump in a lake, Fawful. I, myself, wish TTG would make old-school adventure games. The truth, though, is that they're not going to. But that doesn't mean that the games that they do make all suck.
Then I won't last a second. I'll be weak, and I'll be knocked over by more vocal, better spoken people in an instant. Being loud and extreme and angry is the only way I can say something that goes against the majority opinion without getting trampled on.
People will hear what you say and think "Well, just ignore him. He's an asshole." The only way to be heard is to be calm and collected. Might take longer, but it's really the only way people will give you the respect to hear and actually listen to what you say.
But we're still off topic and I keep going with it but we should probably stop. Activision. Still grrr. Go back to making... Ummm. Other games?
People will hear what you say and think "Well, just ignore him. He's an asshole." The only way to be heard is to be calm and collected. Might take longer, but it's really the only way people will give you the respect to hear and actually listen to what you say.
All I have ever gotten my entire life for being calm and collected is shit. "Oh, he's quiet and BORING. Let's ignore him." So then I switched it around. "God, he's so loud and ANNOYING. Let's ignore him."
All I have ever gotten my entire life for being calm and collected is shit. "Oh, he's quiet and BORING. Let's ignore him." So then I switched it around. "God, he's so loud and ANNOYING. Let's ignore him."
Crochet and knitting both require the use of yarn or thread, so I don't know why after all these years there is still a look of horror on some knitters' faces when they find out you're a crocheter!
Even some yarn shop owners refuse to sell to crocheter. The shop owner is losing out on sales by not selling yarn to ANYONE who wants to buy it, no matter what you're going to do with it.
...
I will say this, though. If I don't see anything regarding crochet in a yarn shop, I don't even MENTION crochet because I know the owner is not crochet friendly.
Thank goodness the shop I go to has yarns that will work with knitting or crochet, even though they may a bit more expensive than the yarns you get at a big box store.
Comments
Those probably aren't the best examples to back up your point, given that they are all pure 'gameplay', and everything you do decides the result of the game.
Like rock, paper, and scissors you are only give two or three choices, and these result in changes throughout the game.
Like cups, a choice in Walking Dead may get you something, or it may get you nothing, or make it where there is no way to get the pea, since someone palmed the item you could have gotten if you made the right decision. That item simply vanishes, or perhaps it (the decision) comes back to haunt you later.
Choose your own adventure book as I pointed out is the trade name for the genre "gamebook". It is historically a form of 'game', for having an interaction a choice, even if the interaction is limited to 'turn to page' 259, if you do A, or page 100, if you do B, or occasionally turn to page 40 if you choose C, but you aren't always given three choices, and usually less. And many times those choices lead to "The End", usually death, or capture, or bad outcome. Only really one or two 'true' paths through the book that has a good outcome. But that is part of the 'game' in the "book" to find the right path.
It's kinda of more like how mad libs, is to word gaming (give a few input words of choice, and the narrator fills in the blanks and reads the story to you with your choices)...
It was amusing at first, and I'll admit, a bit fun to join in on. But now, the tantrum has worn out its humor, and is really just coming over as childish and bitter. Further, we've already heard this argument, and bringing it up again in this fashion as though the game just came out accomplishes nothing.
I'm not saying you have to like TTG or agree with their direction, but this attitude needs work before people start taking you seriously.
An experience generally involves having some form of first person perspective (as in you control the character directly (it represents you, the player), rather than watching a character do its own actions on its own, non-playable characters. FIrst person perspective by literary terms, as opposed dramatic third person characters that are watched from a distance, as if you are an observer watching someone else make their own choices.
Note: I'm talking about more literary definitions of First Person, and Third Person, as opposed to video game perspectives of how you control your avatar on screen. Obviously in the latter Walking Dead is overall third person mode game.
Of course people probably have varying opinions on how much of an 'experience' something is, or how much you can 'experience' things directly or indirectly.
Do you experience through your own actions, or experience things through the action of others. A great writer can write a book in which you indirectly experience what they experienced or what they want you to experience through imaginations. You experience through the 'eyes' and 'thoughts' of the author. Even if you haven't physically experienced it. It's more of a metaphysical distinction.
http://wiki.scummvm.org/index.php/Slater_%26_Charlie_Go_Camping
No way to die, no bad choices, just secret things to discover. Advertised as an 'adventure' game, but was far less interactive than Sierra's normal fair.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FDH4cXBrpI
Even less interactive than Mixed-Up Mothergoose, which really was just a series of fetch quests. Pick up one item, give it to corresponding character.
Marriam-Webster defines a game as an "activity engaged in for diversion or amusement." So yes. Technically, TWD is a game. I'm not trying to argue that it's not actually a game. Just that I don't subjectively see it as a game. Like I said before, if I wanted to play a game, I wouldn't choose TWD, but that doesn't mean I don't like it. I personally loved it. And boy, did you gotta be so hostile?
So is it safe to assume you prefer more complicated offerings, more options more choices when playing a game, more direct interactivity? When choosing a game?
You're right.
It's the worst game I have ever played. I'd finish the NES Dr. Jeykll and Mr. Hyde willingly and happily before playing beyond episode 2 of BTTF.
And I'll say it over and over until I am dead. You want me to shut up? Then kill me. Kill me and suck the juices from my eyeballs in revelry at the carnage you've unleashed upon the BTTF: The Game hater.
TWD is one of my favourite games. I loved the hell out of it. But I had to play it when I was in the mood for it. If I were like "Hmm. I wanna play a game" then TWD would not be what I chose solely for the lack of real interactivity. And having not played BttF, I have nothing to say about it.
Though it played like a poor man's Lucasarts game... it had way too many overused clichéd adventure game puzzles (like ones I've seen in half a dozen old games), added nothing new... Half the conversation puzzles were variants of the if I hold up these fingers, how many am I holding up puzzle from Monkey Island 2... In which you had to figure out the pattern and translate it.
Almost everything else was a variant on adventure game standard inventory puzzles... I can't even remember the number of times I've seen the newspaper/key/door puzzle in an adventure game... It was already old when Hugo's House of Horrors used it...
It's okay, DAISHI. Everyone agrees with you. Those of us who like it that way are few and far between, and will probably be convinced to kill ourselves sooner rather than later to cleanse the world of people who like difficult puzzles and old-school design.
I'm sincere. I want to leave this world anytime I see everyone arguing against what I like. Because that means I am completely alone in what I like and almost nothing I can enjoy will be produced eventually in the future. The things I admire in adventure games are UNIVERSALLY HATED NOW. All big name designers and intelligent people are in a consensus that puzzles are bad and should go in favor of story-only. And I don't care. Nobody would ever listen to me anyway, because everyone has their mind made up. I'll go mad if I don't say something. And frankly, everyone wants people like me to leave this world too so they don't have to listen to my bothersome opinions.
I don't even give a fuck about winning an argument, I'm gonna say whatever the fucking fuckity fuck fuck I fucking want.
Shithole for me. Just me. Paradise for them. I don't want their opinions to go away, I want a neutral world where all opinions regarding meaningless things like video games and film exist and they don't force something like puzzles to stop existing.
Could you imagine how shitty the world would be if everyone agreed and held exactly the same opinions? There'd be no individuality. You wouldn't matter, because your next door neighbor is exactly the same damn person. Nobody would care about you because you'd be just another of the 7 billion identical drones.
Yeah, but I wouldn't get shit on whenever I hold a differentiating opinion, because all opinions would be the same, and the things I love wouldn't be in the minority.
Fuck off.
People are gonna be assholes. But just because you don't like when people do it to you, it doesn't mean you should shit on other peoples opinions.
BUT REGARDLESS. Way off topic. Keep calm are carry on, folks.
Then I won't last a second. I'll be weak, and I'll be knocked over by more vocal, better spoken people in an instant. Being loud and extreme and angry is the only way I can say something that goes against the majority opinion without getting trampled on.
If I stay angry, I can keep from crawling away dejected from any discussion. If I stay calm, I'll just get wrecked or ignored.
We don't have to agree. But at least we ought to be mature about it (for the most part).
No one is saying you should go jump in a lake, Fawful. I, myself, wish TTG would make old-school adventure games. The truth, though, is that they're not going to. But that doesn't mean that the games that they do make all suck.
People will hear what you say and think "Well, just ignore him. He's an asshole." The only way to be heard is to be calm and collected. Might take longer, but it's really the only way people will give you the respect to hear and actually listen to what you say.
But we're still off topic and I keep going with it but we should probably stop. Activision. Still grrr. Go back to making... Ummm. Other games?
All I have ever gotten my entire life for being calm and collected is shit. "Oh, he's quiet and BORING. Let's ignore him." So then I switched it around. "God, he's so loud and ANNOYING. Let's ignore him."
What I see is a very sad man.
I think I'll be fine. Maybe I should find a new hobby that nobody has an opinion about, like crocheting.
Pssh! You call that a sweater? It lacks STORY!
Brace yourself for the knitting fanboys.
http://labeelady.blogspot.ca/2009/03/crochet-vs-knitting.html
No, seriously guys. I'm kinda freaking out right now.
It's a little of both.