I do think it highly likely that Dr Norrington is not within the same reality/dimension as the other characters of the game (apart from the Narrator, who is in a plane that is aware of the player).
When you look at Anubis in the Pharoh exhibit, its face looks just like Sam's, and Sam even says "It's me, give or take 4,000 years". Plus, if you look at the skull display where it says that the creature it belonged to was heavyset, Sammun-Mak said that Anubis wouldn't be happy with it, speaking like he knew him personally.
Basically, I'm saying that Anubis & Sammun-Mak could be the same as Sam & Max. Sammun-Mak/Max get the psychic powers and position of honor (President, Pharoh), Sam/Anubis stands passively in the background and gets his weight made fun of.
...It's probably really unlikely, but food for thought.
Wait: If there's an actual Anubis which was friend of Sammun Mak AND it's actually Sam's Relative, that must mean the psychic powers are fault of Sam's Family OR Sam's bloodline is atracted to people with the Gift for whathever reason, probably for become a some sort of servant or best friend or right hand or something. OR Sam is Anubis, the god, reencarnation (Or relative) and he's in earth for something.
Ok, now I wonder: If there's an army of Sam's Clones, and "Sam" is ussually accompained by a person with the Gift (Max), where's the Max?
1) Who made the clones? My money is on Momma Bosco, who has perfected genetic engineering back in the 60s. Of course she could be working for someone else.
2) Why Sam clones? No idea, except that it is easy to collect drools (DNA) from big dogs.
3) What are the clones for? No idea. The "must get toys" future-vision suggests they are drones on a search mission, but then the Skunkape/Papierwaite/Norrington cabal already have a efficent way of toy collection -- to suck them into a quantum-arcana vortex.
One thing is for sure: Norrington is a villain, since Papierwaite got orders from him. I believe he only helped Max because Sammun-Mak ruined the Doctor's own plans.
When you look at Anubis in the Pharoh exhibit, its face looks just like Sam's, and Sam even says "It's me, give or take 4,000 years". Plus, if you look at the skull display where it says that the creature it belonged to was heavyset, Sammun-Mak said that Anubis wouldn't be happy with it, speaking like he knew him personally.
Basically, I'm saying that Anubis & Sammun-Mak could be the same as Sam & Max. Sammun-Mak/Max get the psychic powers and position of honor (President, Pharoh), Sam/Anubis stands passively in the background and gets his weight made fun of.
...It's probably really unlikely, but food for thought.
When I finished Max's Brain, I started daydreaming, and came up with something like a back story.
Naturally, Sammun-Mak was assassinated, possibly by Molemen, he was sent to the Egyptian Underworld to have his heart weighed. The late Pharaoh's reputation preceeded him, and Anubis knew that if he weighed the pharaoh's heart against the feather of Maat, he would be gulped up by Amet immediately. However, Anubis pitied Sammun-Mak, since he died so young, and cut him a deal: Sammun-Mak would be continually reincarnated until he could perform enough good deeds to purify his heart. Sammun-Mak agreed, if only to avoid death-by-alligator-monster.
Anubis didn't trust Sammun-Mak entirely, even without the Toys of Power, and knew Sammun-Mak would never stick to his promise if he found them again. Anubis had himself reincarnated alongside the pharaoh as a protector and moral guide, mostly to keep Sammun-Mak from doing something stupid again. Suspecting that having Sammun-Mak realize who Anubis was would prevent the pharaoh from learning from his past mistakes, Anubis would wipe both their memories before every new reincarnation. The two would naturally come across the Toys of Power, due to Sammun-Mak's latent gift, but as long as neither knew too much about their pasts, it didn't cause too much trouble.
And that is how Sam and Max, and Sameth and Maximus, came to be!
... Okay, that is an incredibly neat theoretical back story. And now I'm bummed that both Max and Sammun-Mak being able to reside on the same plane of existence seems to throw a wrench into it. (Unless someone can come up with some sort of metaphysical loophole that would make it work. Anyone, anyone?)
oh yeah gust got and idea Sam's bran is concreted to max the gift and the toys of power and works as a balancer in over words he stops max from over loading
... Okay, that is an incredibly neat theoretical back story. And now I'm bummed that both Max and Sammun-Mak being able to reside on the same plane of existence seems to throw a wrench into it. (Unless someone can come up with some sort of metaphysical loophole that would make it work. Anyone, anyone?)
Keep in mind Sammun-Mak's brain and Max's brain are entirely different organs. If we think of the brain as the seat of consciousness, it is entirely possible to see the two both existing at once. But then we're have issues of duality and the soul has any impact on how the brain works.
I thought the main issue would be Sammun-Mak's mummy and heiroglyphs not depicting him as a rabbity-thing, but he was the Forgotten Pharaoh. The tomb paintings could have been made after he was interred, and the body in the tomb could be a fake to fool tombs robbers (the real one having been put elsewhere).
The reason we thought that was the future visions of the newspaper saying "president max goes on rampage," and Sam calling out to Max, "No, Max! Not the Chrysler building!"
For those reasons I still think Max is going to get giant-sized. I suspect that being surrounded by those Sam clones will make Max panic and impulsively use the Toybox to do it. Alternatively it could be the result of hurriedly grabbing and using a random new Toy.
On another note, we shouldn't forget about Sal and Stinky just yet. That letter in The Penal Zone mentioned that S. and her are up to something, and whatever it is we haven't seen it yet.
I think Doctor Norrington is the "voice" of the Devil's Toybox/ Yog Soggoth. He wanted to stop Sammun-Mak and Skunkape because they were using the box for its power. He was helping Papierwaite (and using Max) in order for Yog Soggoth to be summoned. He kept Papierwaite alive. As for the dealeo with the clones, they were probably made by Momma Bosco or someone using them to protect the toybox. The narrator will probably be the main villian, and I think Superball is hiding something...
I thought the main issue would be Sammun-Mak's mummy and heiroglyphs not depicting him as a rabbity-thing, but he was the Forgotten Pharaoh. The tomb paintings could have been made after he was interred, and the body in the tomb could be a fake to fool tombs robbers (the real one having been put elsewhere).
Using your theory, Anubis would have to follow people with the gift, not any particular bloodline. As Papierwaite said, multiple psychics in one family is unheard of, so it actually makes perfect logical sense that Anubis would end up following people who are completely unrelated to one another. It's not who they are but whether they have the gift or not.
Also, don't forget the fact that consciousness transferal is completely possible in their universe! The first time we talk to Sammun-Mak he's been freshly plugged into Max's body, and in that very same conversation Sam offers him Skun-ka'pe's. It's not so hard to believe that people with the "gift" have swapped around bodies down the timeline, different species included.
Of course, this is all still hanging on the "those Sams are actually Anubis" theory, and how the hell that would even be pulled off
Using your theory, Anubis would have to follow people with the gift, not any particular bloodline. As Papierwaite said, multiple psychics in one family is unheard of, so it actually makes perfect logical sense that Anubis would end up following people who are completely unrelated to one another. It's not who they are but whether they have the gift or not.
True, but the most I said was that Anubis would follow Sammun-Mak's reincarnations, not Sammun-Mak's bloodline per se. Even if multiple psychics in the same family are rare, I'd think that Sameth and Maximus having EXACTLY the same relationship as descendants they would never meet is rarer, even with cartoon animals. The only reason I suggested that Maximus and Max were related to Sammun-Mak was because they were both protected by a Sam-like figure (theoretically Anubis in this case).
What I mean to say is, it's more important that Anubis follows Sammun-Mak's soul than just anyone with the Gift.
I was referring to the fact that you were trying to figure out whether or not Sammun-Mak was a lagomorph like Max. If Anubis had to follow him in every life, it wouldn't really matter what species he was reincarnated into, would it? Because the "soul" is what he's trying to monitor, not any particular body or bloodline.
What I'm saying is that it was perfectly possible for Sammun-Mak to have been human upon opening the toybox, and then reincarnated into Maximus/Max. But since Anubis is a god and technically is a soul, he...well, he stays a dog.
Am I misreading your intentions? I...tend to do that sometimes. >>;
Ok, I'm still pretty confused. I'm pretty sure the Brains of the people with the Gift don't die (The explanation of why Sammun Mak was still alive inside the jar), so, Maximus must be the only dissapearing brain with the gift at the moment (and Gordon), I think. Also, supposenly, you can see Maximus spirit in Max's mode in the Penal Zone, which already debunk the whole Rencarnation thingie for Max's (And Sammun Mak) side. According to Papierwaite, the people with the gift share certain characteristics, which mean for Sammun Mak and Max to have a similar personality is not something unexpected.
NOW, Anubis apparently looks exactly like Sam, and, when Papierwaite entered the planetarium screaming, he was talking in singular about an army of smiling clones (Plural), so, I guess he was refering to the leader when he was screaming.
Just freshen up the facts a bit
(I love the story of Queen of Lobsters by the way, the only thing which make me sad it's probably the sole idea of Sammun Mak already knowing Anubis before dying and debunking the story already when I finished the last word. Oh, well...)
Stinky's relationship didn't emerge in this episode dissapointingly - we'll see it in the next episode along with most likely Charlie Hotep and Dr. Norrington (unless those two are the same??!)
Remember, if they survive the fight with the clones, they're in the same room as the freshly filled Devil's Toybox, with access to all the toys, including Charlie Ho-Tep and the can of nuts. They'll probably have access to every toy at least by the last episode.
I've already posted this in the TSM'sB Discussion thread and I'm aware of that, but I'll apply it here as well, because I consider it to be properly related to the topic, and also of a potentially series-vital importance. (Here goes...) What if Sal still isn't Stinky's boyfriend? Some guy around this forum much earlier said that his money's on Satan, so that could be a possibility too, right? Notice also that Satan and the Narrator have pretty similar voices? At least they do in my opinion. On the other hand, the voices of the Narrator and Dr Norrington are pretty similar too, aren't they? They even speak in a similar manner! Also, what if Dr Norrington' first name begins with S? We don't even know who he is or how can he manifest as a walking-talking being. And does anyone except me notice that Charlie Ho-tep, the ventriloquist dummy, looks like a caricature of the Narrator? If he's from the Devil's Toybox, then I suppose he could've been made in the Devil's image? Oh, and one last thing: I'm really looking forward to seeing Gordon the Brain again. He said something like "Donut button, until we meet again!", and I feel that is an incredibly important sentence.
I was referring to the fact that you were trying to figure out whether or not Sammun-Mak was a lagomorph like Max. If Anubis had to follow him in every life, it wouldn't really matter what species he was reincarnated into, would it? Because the "soul" is what he's trying to monitor, not any particular body or bloodline.
I can see the logic in that response. I guess I was stuck on "Sammun-Mak looks so adorable in Max's body, dressed as a pharaoh" mode there.
I'm pretty sure the Brains of the people with the Gift don't die (The explanation of why Sammun Mak was still alive inside the jar), so, Maximus must be the only dissapearing brain with the gift at the moment (and Gordon), I think. Also, supposenly, you can see Maximus spirit in Max's mode in the Penal Zone, which already debunk the whole Rencarnation thingie for Max's (And Sammun Mak) side.
Keep in mind that Gordon, Max, and Sammun-Mak all had functioning brains when floating inside a liquid solution. Brains run on blood and sugar, and I imagine the brains of people with the Gift are no exception. Also, Gordon's brain couldn't do anything without the demon broth, so I believe the liquid solution is essential to preserving brains with the Gift, despite Sammun-Mak's comment in the museum.
Also, where can you find Maximus in the Penal Zone?
(I love the story of Queen of Lobsters by the way, the only thing which make me sad it's probably the sole idea of Sammun Mak already knowing Anubis before dying and debunking the story already when I finished the last word. Oh, well...)
What do you mean by "knowing Anubis before dying and debunking the story already when I finished the last word?" I'm having trouble parsing the phrase. Could you elaborate on it when you have the time?
Keep in mind that Gordon, Max, and Sammun-Mak all had functioning brains when floating inside a liquid solution. Brains run on blood and sugar, and I imagine the brains of people with the Gift are no exception. Also, Gordon's brain couldn't do anything without the demon broth, so I believe the liquid solution is essential to preserving brains with the Gift, despite Sammun-Mak's comment in the museum.
Probably, but the liquid wasn't there in the urn when Sam pick up Sammun Mak brain. They cannot be functional without the liquid, but, while they aren't with liquid they are in some sort of extasis or something, waiting for been re activated again for some reason. Or least that it's what I think about it.
What do you mean by "knowing Anubis before dying and debunking the story already when I finished the last word?" I'm having trouble parsing the phrase. Could you elaborate on it when you have the time?
My Poirot Speak strikes again. Basically, I was trying to say I loved the story, but, in the moment I finished it, I remembered Sammun Mak knew Anubis before dying, or else the brain wouldn't confuse Sam with Anubis, therefore debunking the story as a plausible theory.
Probably, but the liquid wasn't there in the urn when Sam pick up Sammun Mak brain. They cannot be functional without the liquid, but, while they aren't with liquid they are in some sort of extasis or something, waiting for been re activated again for some reason. Or least that it's what I think about it.
Weird. I thought there was liquid in the urn, which would be why the brain was in an urn in the first place instead of being in a glass case or something. I remember Sammun-Mak mentioning having his brain preserved in crocodile tears and something else.
Also, thanks for the other information. Now I really have to play through again to get all the Anubis references!
Originally Posted by Falanca
It IS weird that there are a lot of Sams as since this point, Max had all the importance and anomaly. I mean, if one could make clones -or dolls- and wanted to use them, they'd do Max clones instead. I wonder what makes Sam so special right now. Is it his bodily strength? If so, why not making Skunkape clones? I'm not bitching about it, instead I REALLY want the writers to give something more special to Sam, and I feel like I'm about to get what I want.
Well, I think it is Sam clones/dolls so that they could get Max. Remember, Max has a bad memory (its just a joke sometimes though) so maybe, if they dress like Sam, Max may get confused, and forget which one is real. So whoever made them (I suspect Norrington) wants Max and his gift plus the Devil's Toybox.
Also:
Originally posted by Strongsadioware
Could Doctor Norrington have created them? No, he's on Max's side, unless he needs the toybox and turns out to be using Max for his own needs.
I believe Norrington is evil. He helped Max because he wanted the toybox. Remember, he wanted Papierwaite to summon Yog-Soggoth. However, Sammun-Mak interfered, and thus Papierwaite was could no longer help. So Norrington created them, as a plan B to get Yog-Soggoth!
Well, just less than a month to go now to find out!
Oh, while we're talking about clones/dolls - anyone else think this would be the perfect opportunity to bring back mind-reading as a power?
It doesn't seem like much is going on in the heads of those Sam clones/dolls, so there could be some very strange/clever uses of those mind-reading cards...
Everyone is assuming that they are clones. With the running egyptian theme, aren't they wearing the same stuff as the slaves did and do in the egyptian exhibit? Also, WHAT IF THE CLONES HELP SAM AND MAX?
Comments
When you look at Anubis in the Pharoh exhibit, its face looks just like Sam's, and Sam even says "It's me, give or take 4,000 years". Plus, if you look at the skull display where it says that the creature it belonged to was heavyset, Sammun-Mak said that Anubis wouldn't be happy with it, speaking like he knew him personally.
Basically, I'm saying that Anubis & Sammun-Mak could be the same as Sam & Max. Sammun-Mak/Max get the psychic powers and position of honor (President, Pharoh), Sam/Anubis stands passively in the background and gets his weight made fun of.
...It's probably really unlikely, but food for thought.
I mean, if Sam was somehow in relation to a GOD that must mean something interesting, right?
Ok, now I wonder: If there's an army of Sam's Clones, and "Sam" is ussually accompained by a person with the Gift (Max), where's the Max?
Don't worry I kid!
1) Who made the clones? My money is on Momma Bosco, who has perfected genetic engineering back in the 60s. Of course she could be working for someone else.
2) Why Sam clones? No idea, except that it is easy to collect drools (DNA) from big dogs.
3) What are the clones for? No idea. The "must get toys" future-vision suggests they are drones on a search mission, but then the Skunkape/Papierwaite/Norrington cabal already have a efficent way of toy collection -- to suck them into a quantum-arcana vortex.
When I finished Max's Brain, I started daydreaming, and came up with something like a back story.
Naturally, Sammun-Mak was assassinated, possibly by Molemen, he was sent to the Egyptian Underworld to have his heart weighed. The late Pharaoh's reputation preceeded him, and Anubis knew that if he weighed the pharaoh's heart against the feather of Maat, he would be gulped up by Amet immediately. However, Anubis pitied Sammun-Mak, since he died so young, and cut him a deal: Sammun-Mak would be continually reincarnated until he could perform enough good deeds to purify his heart. Sammun-Mak agreed, if only to avoid death-by-alligator-monster.
Anubis didn't trust Sammun-Mak entirely, even without the Toys of Power, and knew Sammun-Mak would never stick to his promise if he found them again. Anubis had himself reincarnated alongside the pharaoh as a protector and moral guide, mostly to keep Sammun-Mak from doing something stupid again. Suspecting that having Sammun-Mak realize who Anubis was would prevent the pharaoh from learning from his past mistakes, Anubis would wipe both their memories before every new reincarnation. The two would naturally come across the Toys of Power, due to Sammun-Mak's latent gift, but as long as neither knew too much about their pasts, it didn't cause too much trouble.
And that is how Sam and Max, and Sameth and Maximus, came to be!
... Okay, that is an incredibly neat theoretical back story. And now I'm bummed that both Max and Sammun-Mak being able to reside on the same plane of existence seems to throw a wrench into it.
Keep in mind Sammun-Mak's brain and Max's brain are entirely different organs. If we think of the brain as the seat of consciousness, it is entirely possible to see the two both existing at once. But then we're have issues of duality and the soul has any impact on how the brain works.
I thought the main issue would be Sammun-Mak's mummy and heiroglyphs not depicting him as a rabbity-thing, but he was the Forgotten Pharaoh. The tomb paintings could have been made after he was interred, and the body in the tomb could be a fake to fool tombs robbers (the real one having been put elsewhere).
That comment made my day! Thank you! Good luck on that unremembered night in Cairo!
On another note, we shouldn't forget about Sal and Stinky just yet. That letter in The Penal Zone mentioned that S. and her are up to something, and whatever it is we haven't seen it yet.
The Lobster Queen's theory about that is pretty cool. I don't think it would even need to be that much detailed, but still.
Wait and see :eek:
Using your theory, Anubis would have to follow people with the gift, not any particular bloodline. As Papierwaite said, multiple psychics in one family is unheard of, so it actually makes perfect logical sense that Anubis would end up following people who are completely unrelated to one another. It's not who they are but whether they have the gift or not.
Also, don't forget the fact that consciousness transferal is completely possible in their universe! The first time we talk to Sammun-Mak he's been freshly plugged into Max's body, and in that very same conversation Sam offers him Skun-ka'pe's. It's not so hard to believe that people with the "gift" have swapped around bodies down the timeline, different species included.
Of course, this is all still hanging on the "those Sams are actually Anubis" theory, and how the hell that would even be pulled off
True, but the most I said was that Anubis would follow Sammun-Mak's reincarnations, not Sammun-Mak's bloodline per se. Even if multiple psychics in the same family are rare, I'd think that Sameth and Maximus having EXACTLY the same relationship as descendants they would never meet is rarer, even with cartoon animals. The only reason I suggested that Maximus and Max were related to Sammun-Mak was because they were both protected by a Sam-like figure (theoretically Anubis in this case).
What I mean to say is, it's more important that Anubis follows Sammun-Mak's soul than just anyone with the Gift.
What I'm saying is that it was perfectly possible for Sammun-Mak to have been human upon opening the toybox, and then reincarnated into Maximus/Max. But since Anubis is a god and technically is a soul, he...well, he stays a dog.
Am I misreading your intentions? I...tend to do that sometimes. >>;
NOW, Anubis apparently looks exactly like Sam, and, when Papierwaite entered the planetarium screaming, he was talking in singular about an army of smiling clones (Plural), so, I guess he was refering to the leader when he was screaming.
Just freshen up the facts a bit
(I love the story of Queen of Lobsters by the way, the only thing which make me sad it's probably the sole idea of Sammun Mak already knowing Anubis before dying and debunking the story already when I finished the last word. Oh, well...)
i miss it because it wont feel like sam & max if we dont go into the office for the whole season: since 205
Could Doctor Norrington have created them? No, he's on Max's side, unless he needs the toybox and turns out to be using Max for his own needs.
Maybe he gave Paperwaite his ability for immortality, and Norrington could've created Yog Soggoth!
Or, in BTAOD (beyond the alley of dolls) could we be going inside the toybox, where the dolls control it?
PZTSMTSMBBAD so far then...
I know, they SEEM different, but take a good look at each of them again, you'll be surprised.
I can see the logic in that response. I guess I was stuck on "Sammun-Mak looks so adorable in Max's body, dressed as a pharaoh" mode there.
Keep in mind that Gordon, Max, and Sammun-Mak all had functioning brains when floating inside a liquid solution. Brains run on blood and sugar, and I imagine the brains of people with the Gift are no exception. Also, Gordon's brain couldn't do anything without the demon broth, so I believe the liquid solution is essential to preserving brains with the Gift, despite Sammun-Mak's comment in the museum.
Also, where can you find Maximus in the Penal Zone?
What do you mean by "knowing Anubis before dying and debunking the story already when I finished the last word?" I'm having trouble parsing the phrase. Could you elaborate on it when you have the time?
Probably, but the liquid wasn't there in the urn when Sam pick up Sammun Mak brain. They cannot be functional without the liquid, but, while they aren't with liquid they are in some sort of extasis or something, waiting for been re activated again for some reason. Or least that it's what I think about it.
Jake said in the Cultist Room, if you wait long enough in Max's Mode. Now, I haven't see it, but, for some reason, I believe in what Jake told us.
My Poirot Speak strikes again. Basically, I was trying to say I loved the story, but, in the moment I finished it, I remembered Sammun Mak knew Anubis before dying, or else the brain wouldn't confuse Sam with Anubis, therefore debunking the story as a plausible theory.
Weird. I thought there was liquid in the urn, which would be why the brain was in an urn in the first place instead of being in a glass case or something. I remember Sammun-Mak mentioning having his brain preserved in crocodile tears and something else.
Also, thanks for the other information. Now I really have to play through again to get all the Anubis references!
Well, I think it is Sam clones/dolls so that they could get Max. Remember, Max has a bad memory (its just a joke sometimes though) so maybe, if they dress like Sam, Max may get confused, and forget which one is real. So whoever made them (I suspect Norrington) wants Max and his gift plus the Devil's Toybox.
Also:
I believe Norrington is evil. He helped Max because he wanted the toybox. Remember, he wanted Papierwaite to summon Yog-Soggoth. However, Sammun-Mak interfered, and thus Papierwaite was could no longer help. So Norrington created them, as a plan B to get Yog-Soggoth!
Well, just less than a month to go now to find out!
It doesn't seem like much is going on in the heads of those Sam clones/dolls, so there could be some very strange/clever uses of those mind-reading cards...