I am asking what is revolutionary about upgrading the graphics. Please read my posts more carefully in the future.
Don't be an asshole and write my post off just because I responded to one part of yours, which I read just fine where you stated explicitly "its just a DS with better graphics". Nice try on making what I said completely irrelevant. I'll just go ahead and post it again.
A 3DS is a 3DS. Calling it a DS makes you wrong. Because its a 3DS. Not a DS. There is a 3 at the beginning at the title - but there is also plenty different about it. For one the graphical difference does make it a different system or else-
GCN = N64 SNES or NES with better graphics.
PS2 = PS1 with better graphics.
PS3 = PS2 and 1 with better graphics.
PS1 = N64 with better graphics.
N64 = SNES or NES with 3D graphics.
DS = GBA SP with 3D graphics.
SNES = NES with better graphics.
A 3DS is not a DS. It's a 3DS. Don't be an idiot. You're still JUST AS WRONG in your statement.
GCN = N64 SNES or NES with better graphics. (and disc based media and a weak attempt at netplay)
PS2 = PS1 with better graphics. (and analog sticks on the standard controller, a DVD player and a slightly better attempt at netplay than Gamecube)
PS3 = PS2 and 1 with better graphics. (and a Blu-ray player and great netplay and motion control)
PS1 = N64 with better graphics. (Uhhh... I think you mean worse? Also disc based media)
N64 = SNES or NES with 3D graphics. (and vastly improved sound card as well as more buttons and an analog stick)
DS = GBA SP with 3D graphics. (and a touch screen and more buttons)
SNES = NES with better graphics. (as well as more buttons and more advanced sound)
3DS = DS with better graphics (and a 3D gimmick and analog nub)
This is now more accurate, but primarily, a new system is typically mostly the same as another system with better graphics, good job stating the obvious. My post was entirely asking what makes a rather ordinary incremental upgrade to video processing power "revolutionary".
Don't be a pansy. Mindless rage is when someone is beating your face in with a shoe. I'm tame.
It's merely revolutionary for video games; not for anything else. But people say that about every upgrade; because every upgrade does change the way we play and experience these games. That's about it though; outside of that you're pretty much right. It's just an upgrade. I already know a few people who plan to turn the 3D off and keep it off so uh...not much I can say about that. It'll probably wow the easily pleased like me; but more critical people aren't going to find one thing to enjoy about it. 3D doesn't have a huge following; when the 300 price tag came up I began to kind of have a bad feeling about the handheld. It'll really have to be good or word of mouth will squish it like a bug at that price.
EDIT: The most exciting thing to me about the system isn't the system itself but the game listing.
Also, I guarantee this "feature" will look horrible and that almost every game will look better with it off. It's also a monumental waste of processing power.
What kind of guarantee are you offering? I've yet to read or hear any of the gaming press say it looks bad. Even Weekend Confirmed, who regularly rant about how awful 3D is for TVs, raved about how amazing the 3DS looked.
EDIT: Oh, let's not overlook the other big new feature of the 3DS: Always on wireless that will allow multiple games to be in "tag mode" at once.
I'm not even particularly impressed with any of the games they've announced.
BEFORE LAUNCH there's already a number of big name franchises, remakes of what are considered some of the best games ever, AND revivals of beloved franchises long thought to be dead and nothing impresses you? I know there's opinions and everything, but, sheesh, forgive me if it's kinda hard to believe.
EDIT: Oh, let's not overlook the other big new feature of the 3DS: Always on wireless that will allow multiple games to be in "tag mode" at once.
The alternate reality game thing with the cameras looked quite interesting too, could be quite fun if done properly.
They're doing plenty new. But I really would like to see a NEW Zelda game on the 3DS. And a NEW Starfox game. The only reason I'm really happy about Ocarina of Time even being on the handheld is that I lost my copy a long time ago and this is my chance to get the game again WITH graphical upgrades. To the other N64 remakes: I fart in your general direction.
If they're like Mario 64 DS they'll definitely be worth getting though, AND there's an analog now, so there should be no problem with controls this time. There's only what though, OoT, SF and Pilotwings?
I don't like how nintendo keeps repackaging their old classics in order to avoid the fact that they really aren't doing anything new.
Yeah, Nintendo never comes out with new properties or ideas. All they ever do is Mario, Zelda and Metroid. Why can't they do innovative stuff like Pikmin, Professor Layton, WiiFit, PhotoDojo, BrainAge, ArtStyle, ElectroPlankton, WarioWare, Rhythm Heaven and Chibi-Robo?
Mindless rage is when someone is beating your face in with a shoe.
Reading this thread makes me want to mindless rage all of you. Seriously, you're all grouchy and nitpicking each others' arguments about a freaking toy. I'm all for debate, but you guys are just arguing in circles and not getting anywhere, and you're all doing it angrily and derisively.
Yeah, Nintendo never comes out with new properties or ideas. All they ever do is Mario, Zelda and Metroid. Why can't they do innovative stuff like Pikmin, Professor Layton, WiiFit, PhotoDojo, BrainAge, ArtStyle, ElectroPlankton, WarioWare, Rhythm Heaven and Chibi-Robo?
Pikmin: 2001, not "past five years"
Professor Layton: Developed by Level-5.
Chibi Robo, the last-gen platformer that just BARELY squeaks by and was mostly developed by Skip Ltd.
Leaving us with:
PhotoDojo
Wii Fit
Brain Age
ArtStyle
Electroplankton
Rhythm Heaven
Most of which are small experimental titles released by non-major Nintendo studios and few of which that can even be called "games" at all.
Also, all this "original IP is god" stuff pisses me off. Is there something wrong with creating more games in a series that's time-tested, successful, and beloved? You guys are talking as if a game is incapable of having originality just because "oh, it has that guy in the green skirt and he fights with a sword".
Yeah, I don't care. People were complaining about Nintendo never doing anything new way back then as well. It's an old argument, I gave an old retort before seeing a request for "past five years".
Even if you look at Nintendo's mainline titles, they're still doing pretty interesting things. They were brave enough to make the DS Zelda games stylus controlled. If they hadn't been Zelda themed people would have been oohing and ahhing over the innovation of a touch controlled action-adventure. Instead critics were complaining about "yet another Zelda".
Now, before I get labeled as a hopeless Nintendo fanboy. Their online everything sucks. I think they're morons for killing off the Player's Choice titles. I wont' buy anything on WiiWare, Vitual Console or DSiWare until they stop linking downloads to specific hardware (instead of to an account). Nintendo needs to stop being afraid of buttons. And, I'm not buying another Nintendo console until they have HDMI and multi-channel digital surround sound.
Yeah, Nintendo never comes out with new properties or ideas. All they ever do is Mario, Zelda and Metroid. Why can't they do innovative stuff like Pikmin, Professor Layton, WiiFit, PhotoDojo, BrainAge, ArtStyle, ElectroPlankton, WarioWare, Rhythm Heaven and Chibi-Robo?
Woah, no need to be snappy there buddy. First off, I wouldn't really count Professor Layton and ElectroPlankton as Nintendo games. Second off, I would discount Pikmin and Warioware as recent.
But sure, I'll give you the rest, with a maybe on Chibi-Robo. I haven't played any of the Art Style games, so I can't really say anything about them. However, with the exception of Rhythm Heaven and Chibi-Robo, none of the remaining games are particularly innovative or substantial.
Also, all this "original IP is god" stuff pisses me off. Is there something wrong with creating more games in a series that's time-tested, successful, and beloved? You guys are talking as if a game is incapable of having originality just because "oh, it has that guy in the green skirt and he fights with a sword".
Now hold on, I never said "original IP is god". I love the plumber, pokeymans, and all that jive, I just would like to see new stuff too. And what's annoying about it is that I know Nintendo can do it. Pikmin was a great example, but that was 10 years ago now.
also, the 3ds better not be as brain damaging as the vb. shit hurts man.
Reading this thread makes me want to mindless rage all of you. Seriously, you're all grouchy and nitpicking each others' arguments about a freaking toy. I'm all for debate, but you guys are just arguing in circles and not getting anywhere, and you're all doing it angrily and derisively.
I'm not justifying my own actions but that happens a lot around here; where have you been?
Reading this thread makes me want to mindless rage all of you. Seriously, you're all grouchy and nitpicking each others' arguments about a freaking toy. I'm all for debate, but you guys are just arguing in circles and not getting anywhere, and you're all doing it angrily and derisively.
youre mad?
oh
i wasn't mad. just speakin my mind.
when i went to pax for the first time last month, i realized that at this point, we've developed a gaming culture (whether its a good thing or not is not important in context), so i really dont see a problem about people talkin about game companies and hardware specs and stuff.
Like I told SHODAN, I wasn't really mad. That was tame. I too was just speaking my mind. Maybe I'm just too used to confrontational debates in forums, I dunno.
$300 is pretty expensive, especially considering console prices in the UK usually just have the dollar sign replaced with a pound sign, rather than making the actually conversion. Therefore it'll probably be £300, which is approximately $470.
Glasses-less 3D *is* just "improved graphics". I mean what changes the device, um, significantly. Other than railroading a significant chunk of processing power that can be used to run better games and using it for a parlor trick that makes things pretty. I mean, not to be rude about it, but there's really nothing there that has value in terms of better games.
What do you want it to do differently? I expect if they'd done anything else, you'd be writing it off as a tacky gimmick. It looks, from what I've seen, to be more powerful than any other handheld system and if the 3D aspect is popular, Sony and Apple will certainly be trying to replicate it and Microsoft may even have a go. Sounds potentially revolutionary to me.
Like I told SHODAN, I wasn't really mad. That was tame. I too was just speaking my mind. Maybe I'm just too used to confrontational debates in forums, I dunno.
Glasses-less 3D *is* just "improved graphics". I mean what changes the device, um, significantly. Other than railroading a significant chunk of processing power that can be used to run better games and using it for a parlor trick that makes things pretty. I mean, not to be rude about it, but there's really nothing there that has value in terms of better games.
The glaseless 3D can be used for gameplay enhancements as well i'm sure. The one example I hear is better depth perception. Like when you line yourself up to hit a box in a 3D Mario game and clean miss and feel like a moron, that kind of thing'll be a fixture of the past
It's up to designers to make it worthwhile, I wouldn't write it off just yet
I'm all for new series too. And while I get why they're doing remakes at launch (costs them less and they're more sure to sell them) I hope there will be more new games soon (whether in a new series or an existing one). I probably won't buy the 3DS at launch, as it is I'm only interested in Paper Mario 3, and I'm not buying a console for just one game. Oh, and also, I'm broke. Remember that laptop I've been saving for for months? Still only 50 bucks down for that, and it has to come first.
So I probably won't get the 3DS for a year or two after launch. On the bright side, it probably will be cheaper and with more games I'm interested in available for it, by then.
With the way Nintendo comes out with revised hardware for their portable systems, I'm probably going to wait for a 3DS XL, or the 3DS Extra or whatever refinement they make.
With the way Nintendo comes out with revised hardware for their portable systems, I'm probably going to wait for a 3DS XL, or the 3DS Extra or whatever refinement they make.
Where as I will buy the original, a game, and then ignore the new 3ds that will come out the next year because I'll be broke for a while. Now which game to buy... Its a tie between mario kart and paper mario 3d
I really don't get the "It's a DS with better graphics" arguement. By extension, we may as well call the PS3 an Atari 2600 with better graphics.
You don't understand the argument because you have no idea what it's arguing against.
The argument is made that the 3DS is actually something "revolutionary". This is something that, at best, can't be determined yet, and to assume it now is to be falling into fanboy logic and marketing speak. Nobody said the PS3 was revolutionary compared to all of its predecessors.
The 3DS is to the DS what every video game system has been to its predecessors, plus the gimmick that is at best unlikely to affect the gameplay of the vast majority of the system's software releases(in a positive sense, at least, considering its drain on processing power).
There is nothing WRONG with being an incremental upgrade. There is just nothing inherently revolutionary about it. Maybe EVOLUTIONARY, along the expected lines, with an odd mutation that is slightly beneficial and slightly detrimental, time being what will tell how much benefit and drawback we'll have.
What do you want it to do differently? I expect if they'd done anything else, you'd be writing it off as a tacky gimmick. It looks, from what I've seen, to be more powerful than any other handheld system and if the 3D aspect is popular, Sony and Apple will certainly be trying to replicate it and Microsoft may even have a go. Sounds potentially revolutionary to me.
If they did what they're doing NOW I'm going to write it off as a tacky gimmick. Because it is. It's cashing in on a fad that has faded in and out of style with only minor steps forward in technology over th past 70 years, using the same trick that 3D in cinema has used since it first came out, packaged in a more pocket-friendly package.
What would I do differently? Create a handheld game machine. 3D is not something that is important enough to gameplay to eat up that much development time, and considering viewing angle issues it's probably best to leave it out of the handheld space. That processing power can be used to run bigger and better games, too. Robust online play, a solid set of controls(maybe including a touchscreen and movement controls, but certainly not focusing on them completely in press materials). I'd ditch the two screens, because the one on the bottom for the last system rarely worked out and its few successes(which, granted, are very good when they work) aren't really worth all the "pause menu/generic map on bottom, game on top" scenarios. Creating games for the machine like they did with Super Mario 64 on the N64, and not porting games for one of the worst controllers for ports in history that only ever worked for games made specifically for the hardware, because yes the N64 controller was bad(or at least exclusionary). Nintendogs PLUS Cats does very little to assuage my concerns that the casual market will be mined for the first couple years with a couple scraps tossed our way(in the form of a new Kid Icarus game and direct ports of older titles) until the casual market gets fickle again as it always does.
tl;dr version: Make hardware while only considering what is good for games and for portability, then make great games that showcase the best the hardware can do for the hardcore audience. I'm obviously not Nintendo. At all.
Why, the 3ds is said to rival the PS3 in graphics, so telltale can use that. You can use the control pad for the WASD control, instead of click and drag. And tap the screen to click.
Uh no, it's not even close to PS3. It may look like it, but that's just because of the screen size. Still, if it got done on the iPad I don't see why it couldn't be done here.
Why, the 3ds is said to rival the PS3 in graphics, so telltale can use that. You can use the control pad for the WASD control, instead of click and drag. And tap the screen to click.
the 3ds graphics are a little better from the wii's graphics, so no
Comments
Don't be an asshole and write my post off just because I responded to one part of yours, which I read just fine where you stated explicitly "its just a DS with better graphics". Nice try on making what I said completely irrelevant. I'll just go ahead and post it again.
A 3DS is a 3DS. Calling it a DS makes you wrong. Because its a 3DS. Not a DS. There is a 3 at the beginning at the title - but there is also plenty different about it. For one the graphical difference does make it a different system or else-
GCN = N64 SNES or NES with better graphics.
PS2 = PS1 with better graphics.
PS3 = PS2 and 1 with better graphics.
PS1 = N64 with better graphics.
N64 = SNES or NES with 3D graphics.
DS = GBA SP with 3D graphics.
SNES = NES with better graphics.
A 3DS is not a DS. It's a 3DS. Don't be an idiot. You're still JUST AS WRONG in your statement.
GCN = N64 SNES or NES with better graphics. (and disc based media and a weak attempt at netplay)
PS2 = PS1 with better graphics. (and analog sticks on the standard controller, a DVD player and a slightly better attempt at netplay than Gamecube)
PS3 = PS2 and 1 with better graphics. (and a Blu-ray player and great netplay and motion control)
PS1 = N64 with better graphics. (Uhhh... I think you mean worse? Also disc based media)
N64 = SNES or NES with 3D graphics. (and vastly improved sound card as well as more buttons and an analog stick)
DS = GBA SP with 3D graphics. (and a touch screen and more buttons)
SNES = NES with better graphics. (as well as more buttons and more advanced sound)
3DS = DS with better graphics (and a 3D gimmick and analog nub)
This is now more accurate, but primarily, a new system is typically mostly the same as another system with better graphics, good job stating the obvious. My post was entirely asking what makes a rather ordinary incremental upgrade to video processing power "revolutionary".
It's merely revolutionary for video games; not for anything else. But people say that about every upgrade; because every upgrade does change the way we play and experience these games. That's about it though; outside of that you're pretty much right. It's just an upgrade. I already know a few people who plan to turn the 3D off and keep it off so uh...not much I can say about that. It'll probably wow the easily pleased like me; but more critical people aren't going to find one thing to enjoy about it. 3D doesn't have a huge following; when the 300 price tag came up I began to kind of have a bad feeling about the handheld. It'll really have to be good or word of mouth will squish it like a bug at that price.
EDIT: The most exciting thing to me about the system isn't the system itself but the game listing.
I'm not even particularly impressed with any of the games they've announced.
What kind of guarantee are you offering? I've yet to read or hear any of the gaming press say it looks bad. Even Weekend Confirmed, who regularly rant about how awful 3D is for TVs, raved about how amazing the 3DS looked.
EDIT: Oh, let's not overlook the other big new feature of the 3DS: Always on wireless that will allow multiple games to be in "tag mode" at once.
BEFORE LAUNCH there's already a number of big name franchises, remakes of what are considered some of the best games ever, AND revivals of beloved franchises long thought to be dead and nothing impresses you? I know there's opinions and everything, but, sheesh, forgive me if it's kinda hard to believe.
The alternate reality game thing with the cameras looked quite interesting too, could be quite fun if done properly.
Name all the new series they've done in the past 5 years.
Yeah, Nintendo never comes out with new properties or ideas. All they ever do is Mario, Zelda and Metroid. Why can't they do innovative stuff like Pikmin, Professor Layton, WiiFit, PhotoDojo, BrainAge, ArtStyle, ElectroPlankton, WarioWare, Rhythm Heaven and Chibi-Robo?
Wii Sports
Wii Fit
Wii Music
Art Style
Nintendogs
Flipnote Studio
Steel Diver
Forgive me if I forgot one.
Reading this thread makes me want to mindless rage all of you. Seriously, you're all grouchy and nitpicking each others' arguments about a freaking toy. I'm all for debate, but you guys are just arguing in circles and not getting anywhere, and you're all doing it angrily and derisively.
Professor Layton: Developed by Level-5.
Chibi Robo, the last-gen platformer that just BARELY squeaks by and was mostly developed by Skip Ltd.
Leaving us with:
PhotoDojo
Wii Fit
Brain Age
ArtStyle
Electroplankton
Rhythm Heaven
Most of which are small experimental titles released by non-major Nintendo studios and few of which that can even be called "games" at all.
Yeah, I don't care. People were complaining about Nintendo never doing anything new way back then as well. It's an old argument, I gave an old retort before seeing a request for "past five years".
Even if you look at Nintendo's mainline titles, they're still doing pretty interesting things. They were brave enough to make the DS Zelda games stylus controlled. If they hadn't been Zelda themed people would have been oohing and ahhing over the innovation of a touch controlled action-adventure. Instead critics were complaining about "yet another Zelda".
Now, before I get labeled as a hopeless Nintendo fanboy. Their online everything sucks. I think they're morons for killing off the Player's Choice titles. I wont' buy anything on WiiWare, Vitual Console or DSiWare until they stop linking downloads to specific hardware (instead of to an account). Nintendo needs to stop being afraid of buttons. And, I'm not buying another Nintendo console until they have HDMI and multi-channel digital surround sound.
Woah, no need to be snappy there buddy. First off, I wouldn't really count Professor Layton and ElectroPlankton as Nintendo games. Second off, I would discount Pikmin and Warioware as recent.
But sure, I'll give you the rest, with a maybe on Chibi-Robo. I haven't played any of the Art Style games, so I can't really say anything about them. However, with the exception of Rhythm Heaven and Chibi-Robo, none of the remaining games are particularly innovative or substantial.
Now hold on, I never said "original IP is god". I love the plumber, pokeymans, and all that jive, I just would like to see new stuff too. And what's annoying about it is that I know Nintendo can do it. Pikmin was a great example, but that was 10 years ago now.
also, the 3ds better not be as brain damaging as the vb. shit hurts man.
I'm not justifying my own actions but that happens a lot around here; where have you been?
youre mad?
oh
i wasn't mad. just speakin my mind.
when i went to pax for the first time last month, i realized that at this point, we've developed a gaming culture (whether its a good thing or not is not important in context), so i really dont see a problem about people talkin about game companies and hardware specs and stuff.
In the happy threads, apparently.
What do you want it to do differently? I expect if they'd done anything else, you'd be writing it off as a tacky gimmick. It looks, from what I've seen, to be more powerful than any other handheld system and if the 3D aspect is popular, Sony and Apple will certainly be trying to replicate it and Microsoft may even have a go. Sounds potentially revolutionary to me.
Oh. Well. Glad we cleared that up.
So...do we group hug now or something?
Yeah um cough cough. This shows all the features the 3ds which proves, it is not a DS with better graphics.
The glaseless 3D can be used for gameplay enhancements as well i'm sure. The one example I hear is better depth perception. Like when you line yourself up to hit a box in a 3D Mario game and clean miss and feel like a moron, that kind of thing'll be a fixture of the past
It's up to designers to make it worthwhile, I wouldn't write it off just yet
I never saw that. Totally pre-ordering Day one with one day shipping from Amazon.
What's the deal with taking skip games away from Nintendo? They work basically hand in hand with Nintendo and all their games are Nintendo only.
Also how could people forget Xenoblade, or Disaster Day of Crisis? You know games made by Nintendo's First Party studio.
So I probably won't get the 3DS for a year or two after launch. On the bright side, it probably will be cheaper and with more games I'm interested in available for it, by then.
Where as I will buy the original, a game, and then ignore the new 3ds that will come out the next year because I'll be broke for a while. Now which game to buy... Its a tie between mario kart and paper mario 3d
The argument is made that the 3DS is actually something "revolutionary". This is something that, at best, can't be determined yet, and to assume it now is to be falling into fanboy logic and marketing speak. Nobody said the PS3 was revolutionary compared to all of its predecessors.
The 3DS is to the DS what every video game system has been to its predecessors, plus the gimmick that is at best unlikely to affect the gameplay of the vast majority of the system's software releases(in a positive sense, at least, considering its drain on processing power).
There is nothing WRONG with being an incremental upgrade. There is just nothing inherently revolutionary about it. Maybe EVOLUTIONARY, along the expected lines, with an odd mutation that is slightly beneficial and slightly detrimental, time being what will tell how much benefit and drawback we'll have.
If they did what they're doing NOW I'm going to write it off as a tacky gimmick. Because it is. It's cashing in on a fad that has faded in and out of style with only minor steps forward in technology over th past 70 years, using the same trick that 3D in cinema has used since it first came out, packaged in a more pocket-friendly package.
What would I do differently? Create a handheld game machine. 3D is not something that is important enough to gameplay to eat up that much development time, and considering viewing angle issues it's probably best to leave it out of the handheld space. That processing power can be used to run bigger and better games, too. Robust online play, a solid set of controls(maybe including a touchscreen and movement controls, but certainly not focusing on them completely in press materials). I'd ditch the two screens, because the one on the bottom for the last system rarely worked out and its few successes(which, granted, are very good when they work) aren't really worth all the "pause menu/generic map on bottom, game on top" scenarios. Creating games for the machine like they did with Super Mario 64 on the N64, and not porting games for one of the worst controllers for ports in history that only ever worked for games made specifically for the hardware, because yes the N64 controller was bad(or at least exclusionary). Nintendogs PLUS Cats does very little to assuage my concerns that the casual market will be mined for the first couple years with a couple scraps tossed our way(in the form of a new Kid Icarus game and direct ports of older titles) until the casual market gets fickle again as it always does.
tl;dr version: Make hardware while only considering what is good for games and for portability, then make great games that showcase the best the hardware can do for the hardcore audience. I'm obviously not Nintendo. At all.
Thats a terrible idea.
Guys I have a good idea. Sam and Max all 3 seasons 3D
S3 wouldn't work.
Why, the 3ds is said to rival the PS3 in graphics, so telltale can use that. You can use the control pad for the WASD control, instead of click and drag. And tap the screen to click.