I wish I had that hint system for The Dig. I would have pulled out less hair playing it
Anywho, I believe it was said that the difficulty level was toned down for these games because they wanted you to enjoy the story without too much frustration of being stuck on puzzles. Which I can relate to that. I remeber playing scratches and really enjoying the story but then I got stuck on one puzzle for weeks which really got on my nerves. Had to use a guide to get the story moving again. But at the same time, there is a such thing as too easy.
A good BTTF game would have been a commercial success too.
yes, but it would also have taken more time and effort.
and as Sinaz20 declared:
they primarly want to earn money.
the comparison to the voluntary fire brigade gave me the feeling that they don't really care much about players or fans as long as their products are getting sold and keep the developers paid.
(and yes I am glad that there are people who run a voluntary fire brigade!
or work for the ambulance!)
but one thing is clear for me: I won't buy another game done by Telltale unless I've read a few reviews.
this strategy only worked for the first game & you got my money, yes.
and as Sinaz20 declared:
they primarly want to earn money.
the comparison to the voluntary fire brigade gave me the feeling that they don't really care much about players or fans as long as their products are getting sold and keep the developers paid.
That's not what he said.
He said that even if one does his job with passion, if there are no results in terms of economical revenue, it cannot last.
Because they've to pay bills, rent, food - they're not just living for free the rest of their lives because they work at Telltale Games.
So, nothing is possible if there's no revenue: working in a company is different than having an hobby.
And - seeing how they delayed JP to give a better game AND give customers a total refund AND give customer an additional free coupon to have a complete free game of their choice - it seems to me that they cares players much better than many other games company around does.
Did you imagine Valve giving refunds and a free game for every 6 months they delayed Half Life Episodes 1-2-3?
I think TT stands out from this point of view.:cool:
That thing with accessability is something I never had a problem with. When I play adventure games, I never play them for puzzles. I just want to enjoy the story and the atmosphere. In fact, puzzles just keep standing in my way when they are too hard, keeping me from progressing. Like waroftheworlds said, Scratches for example had hard puzzles where you had to think a lot, and it just frustrated me and breaked all the feel and immersion, forcing me to look it up in the internet.
For games like JP and BTTF, puzzles should be more like a way of playing a story, like a tool for being immersed by having to solve realistic problems that are part of the story rather than a challenge for itself. To me its way more important to having the feel that you are "doing" the story and a heavy emphasis on story and overall feel of the game than challenging puzzles, and lots of others feel the same, wich is the reason for the success.
With enough resources it may be possible to find a good compromise, but that would be very hard. Hint systems are ok but even using them or being stuck for a little while before using harms a bit of the immersion to me, so you would have to make brilliant puzzles wich makes it almost impossible to satisfy everyone. Maybe die-hard-adventure gamers should look elsewhere, its not like you didnt know what this game will be all about...
and as Sinaz20 declared:
they primarly want to earn money.
the comparison to the voluntary fire brigade gave me the feeling that they don't really care much about players or fans as long as their products are getting sold and keep the developers paid.
No-- we primarily need to earn money-- so we can continue to make games. What we want is to make great games within our means that appear to be beyond our means.
I mean, c'mon-- we apparently care so little about our audience that we can't even be bothered to come on to the forums and address their concerns and criticism. Oh wait...
Plus, one of my primary philosophies as a designer is a integrity of vision. But, so as to make sure a game is completed within the parameters of it's production, we make compromise. There are some things I will lose from my original designs, but there are many things that I fight to keep. BttF Ep3 had some of this give and take, and so does JP Ep4. Both games I am proud of, even though I am able to recognize the flaws in the games and the coulda-shoulda-wouldas that I will consider with the next game I make.
If a project needs to dial back some difficulty and complexity to reach the audience it is intended for, then so be it. We didn't want to make a game that would alienate fans of the film that were not adept adventure gamers. It is always important to make sure we expand our install base by appealing to a broad audience- we can teach them to be more sophisticated gamers later.
Also, about that hint system... it's not there for the seasoned adventure gamers. If you felt it was spoiling the game for you, why on earth were you using it? It's intended for players like my dad, who called me one night and was like, "why do I have to keep starting from the beginning? Where's the stupid save feature?" (EDIT: I noticed the criticism is more about the resources put into it-- the feature is pretty much a part of our engine... hints and conditions are worked out near the end of production after the designer has solidified design and the artists, animators, and programmers are in full effect-- so there is little "waste" centered around the hint system-- it gives us designers something more to do after the director has taken ownership.)
I will say that fan reaction to the simplicity of Back to the Future has spurred ideas about how to make a gradient difficulty in puzzle solving. When we next encounter a project where this can be experimented on, you can bet we'll give it a try. Jurassic Park has a little of this under the hood with inputs that simplistically adapt to the player's apparent skill.
@anthoto1: BttF was and is continuing to be a commercial success... so I don't really know what point you are trying to make.
@anthoto1: BttF was and is continuing to be a commercial success... so I don't really know what point you are trying to make.
My point was that BttF was a bad adventure game due to its simplicity. If it had been a little bit more challenging, it would have been a commercial success too.
For games like JP and BTTF, puzzles should be more like a way of playing a story, like a tool for being immersed by having to solve realistic problems that are part of the story rather than a challenge for itself. To me its way more important to having the feel that you are "doing" the story and a heavy emphasis on story and overall feel of the game than challenging puzzles, and lots of others feel the same, wich is the reason for the success.
This is pretty spot on. During the production of Jurassic Park, we designed some more cerebral puzzles. When we sat down to play the results, what we found is that the surrounding game play sets up the expectation that there will be an ever moving cinematic pace. When we hit the puzzles, it felt like all the mystique and energy of what makes Jurassic Park awesome just fizzled away. So we had to go back and reconsider how puzzles would work.
When you play this game, there may be a small part of you that says "boy I wish I could manage an inventory, and steer my character everywhere, and shoot dinosaurs." But ultimately, we tried some of that version for you and discovered how it would have failed. Not to say such a game about dinosaurs couldn't have been made-- but it wouldn't have been a good Jurassic Park game.
My point was that BttF was a bad adventure game due to its simplicity. If it had been a little bit more challenging, it would have been a commercial success too.
What does "commercial success" mean to you?
Do you mean a "critical success?"
"I do not think it means what you think it means."
When you play this game, there may be a small part of you that says "boy I wish I could manage an inventory, and steer my character everywhere, and shoot dinosaurs." But ultimately, we tried some of that version for you and discovered how it would have failed. Not to say such a game about dinosaurs couldn't have been made-- but it wouldn't have been a good Jurassic Park game.
What most experienced players fear is the lack of freedom. According to what we understood, there will be no free exploration when every JP fan has always dreamt of being able to explore the islands. But the worst part of the gameplay is that all action scenes are prerendred QTE which leaves no room to players' creativity.
thanks for this answer.
i think i know how things run at least a bit since i am not too far away from what you are doing.
in our office of architecture we are often faced with the same things: ideas and creative mind at the beginning and project schedules and investment limits that follow. it is always about compromises...well or should I say optimization? although you have to reduce the costs it should not affect the general quality.
making great architecture does not necessarily mean using the most expensive materials.
i guess a game developing company is facing similar challenges.
concerning the accessability i just want developers to be honest.
they can simply declare from the very beginning whom they want to adress and what players can expect from the final product. of course you don't want to drive away any potential buyer but on the other hand people should know what they get: "BTTF:TG is especially designed for fans for the franchise and therefore not primarly adressed to experienced adventure-game players. it uses very similar objectives and gameplay routines like traditional adventure games but it's more aimed to a fluent story-telling and thus doesn't include very hard puzzles. BTTF:TG is trying to capture the atmosphere of the movies and expands well known characters, places and times."
I guess that Jurassic Park is treated the same way but the main focus is on a cinematic presentation which isn't only used in cut-scenes but throughout the whole game. therefore the puzzle and exploration parts are developed in a different way than in traditional point&click adventures: it follows typical camera angles from movies and is in general designed for a controller-interface allthough for PC users a special keyboard and mouse-control is included.
new for a TTG adventure are thrilling action parts, which are based on QTE gameplay routines. if the player fails he can actually die and is reset to a predefined save point. for every further fail at the same QTE-sequence the chances to win rise because more and more wrong pressed buttons are allowed. this is to ensure that people doesn't get too frustrated at certain points.
dialogue parts are also included and can either be useful to gain background information or to continue the story by talking about the necessary topics in a scene.
.......
What most experienced players fear is the lack of freedom. According to what we understood, there will be no free exploration when every JP fan has always dreamt of being able to explore the islands. But the worst part of the gameplay is that all action scenes are prerendred QTE which leaves no room to players' creativity.
Ok, granted... on some points.
We do allow you to explore many of the spaces you are in without limiting you against a timer. We don't let you go free-roaming because A- we simply can't build an entire island for you to explore, B- it would break the story telling, and C- there are certain movie canon geography points that would be impossible to keep contiguous if we tried to rebuild the island... and as we can see... JP fans are finicky (endearingly... endearingly )
Also, just to clarify... the QTE's aren't pre-rendered. They are completely in engine. But I do understand your concern that the action is directed. True, the action in this game is more about player reflexes and responsiveness -- we didn't build a 3rd person platforming system to accommodate such play. But what I think you are really misunderstanding here is that we give you action scenes that we feel are in the cinematic spirit of a Spielberg movie-- whether you realize it or not, you lose a huge amount of visual impact to an action sequence when you limit it to a 3rd person over the shoulder camera. We even have a few action sequences where we allow the player to control the camera during key moments, but we still restrict it into a visually striking range. It stays within the spirit of the scene, and it's a mechanic we are excited about.
Additionally, you have to realize that we put a lot of consideration into the game's QTE and mini-game like input. Part of the problem with trying to allow "player creativity" during QTE's is that they are always specific to the scene at hand, and rarely, if ever telegraph the results of one decision over another.
The action sequences tend to be a blend-- there may be parts that are fast and frantic, and are mostly reflexive QTE's... but the tempo of a scene varies, and when an action scene takes a rest, the player has a more granular level of decisions... go left or go right (before the dinosaur eats you)... use another character to distract or unlock a path (before the dinosaur eats you)... even when these rests occur, we manage to still keep a sense of tension and peril.
I mean it could have been more complex and it would still be a commercial success, as it is now.
So you wanted a game that catered to your needs of more complex puzzles? BttF is a success which means Telltale did everything right. Maybe they didn't meet your expectations which happens with every game and company. You continously bring up why Jurrassic Park the game is not up to your standards yet you've ordered the game. So you're purchasing something you don't like, just because it has the name Jurassic Park? Now you say that your ordered the game to give it a chanse despite the fact that you think it looks bad? So go ahead and practice that idea and GIVE THE GAME A CHANSE!
I myself wish for a free-roam Jurassic Park game, but this isn't that game!!! This is a different type of game. The only thing for sure is that you're really not helping your case much given the fact that you try to pass off you're highly critical and insulting "remarks" as anything other than what they are.
Not only that but your spending so much time on these forums it also contradicts your case. You're here for a reason? If that reason is that you really want to let your negative opinion be well known around these forums then you my friend are probably a Troll. If you're here because you really like Jurassic Park the game, then you wouldn't be bringing so much negativity and pessimism.
How about you tell us what we miss out on after the release of the game? Cause right now it would be much more painful. Hopefully no dinosaurs were cut just extra sequences that didn't contribute much to the story....
we apparently care so little about our audience that we can't even be bothered to come on to the forums and address their concerns and criticism. Oh wait...
Sinaz, I really appreciate what you're doing in this thread.
I was among those "puzzled" by the direction Jurassic Park is going, but I guess the real reason some of us original Telltale fans don't fully trust the team any longer is Back to the Future.
Before BTTF, I mainly complained about rushed testing and coding, but I still thought the "meat" was there. Heck, The Devil's Playhouse blew me out. Puzzle Agent was a Layton clone, but the atmosphere was peculiar. Unfortunately, I found BTTF very boring. The easy puzzles weren't the real problem. I don't feel to be the masoch Chuck was talking about. I think all gamers who've been following Telltale since Out From Boneville and Sam & Max Season One know why they are doing it: originality, a smoother approach to the genre, creativity, intelligent stories. I know Telltale games don't aim to offer extrahard puzzles.
I don't know how you approached BTTF, but I know what it seemed to me: an interactive movie presented as an extra-lite (mandatory?) adventure game with too many been-there-done-that puzzles. This interactive movie was too dialogue-heavy and slow to be bearable, while the adventure game was too limited and rigid to be challenging and interesting. The worst of two worlds.
There was no sign of peculiar interaction in BTTF: no Strong Bad minigames, no Max powers, just an "ok" story which could've been stronger if told with a much faster pace.
All considering, Jurassic Park sounds better than BTTF, because it's clearly NOT trying to be an adventure game AND an interactive movie. As long as Telltale doesn't forget their original audience (Hector and King's Quest are reassuring) and as long as your "new" things are REALLY new (not flat hybrids such as BTTF), I have no reason to dump you.
Just don't think the evolution of adventure games means denying them. I may like an interactive movie, I don't like an adventure game which tries not to be one (BTTF).
I wonder what story elements went missing by cutting it down to four episodes.
Quite possibly none. The TTG five-part "season" has become an expectation, but not because a good story arc necessarily has exactly four cliffhangers. Also, not because the Greek drama has five acts. Maybe this was because roughly four months are needed to finish the game once the first episode is released. So, four episodes instead of five could have nothing to do with game length, but instead with the pacing. Cliffhangers placed less arbitrarily. Same book, different chapter distribution. A reflection of more freedom for the game designers.
That's my positive note here. Unfortunately, when Sinaz compared the gameplay to a "modern Dragon's Lair", I made a dash for the door out. Sorry about that. Just not my cup of tea.
How about you tell us what we miss out on after the release of the game? Cause right now it would be much more painful. Hopefully no dinosaurs were cut just extra sequences that didn't contribute much to the story....
[redacted]
*Have we officially announced our last big "dinosaur?" I don't know-- I see references on google... so I'll let the fans tell me whether or not Marketing has revealed her.
That's my positive note here. Unfortunately, when Sinaz compared the gameplay to a "modern Dragon's Lair", I made a dash for the door out. Sorry about that. Just not my cup of tea.
I'm sorry that notion doesn't appeal to you-- I hope after reading some reviews, maybe you'll give it a try during a sale or something, because pure philosophy of mechanics aside, the game is fun and entertaining.
@Diduz: I have some talk back for you, too-- but I also have work to do (so bear with me.)
And look what IGN did, "GAME SUX DONT BUY ALRIGHT" - IGN.
Now the community falls for their antics, IGN is full of crap, IGN can be the Fox News of gaming. and finally, IGN gives CoD a 100% every time. I think thats enough to call them biased.
Sinaz20, I'm so stoked for this game to come put! I've been waiting for a JP game like this for 18 years, thanks for being a part of those who making it happen!
Sinaz20, I'm so stoked for this game to come put! I've been waiting for a JP game like this for 18 years, thanks for being a part of those who making it happen!
yea i agree thank you tell tale for being epic, i havent heard a single company that takes suggestions like you guys.
*Have we officially announced our last big "dinosaur?" I don't know-- I see references on google... so I'll let the fans tell me whether or not Marketing has revealed her.
"Dinosaur"? with quotation marks? so its either the mososaur that youre talking about... or a pterosaur or prehistoric bird..? Good to know...
Anywho, don't let us pressure you into making you spill too many beans, Sinaz20. I do like surprises in my games. lol If there is still a dinosaur that has not been announced then by all means keep it in the dark. I'm looking forward to some moments where I say, "Wow!!! I did not expect that!" Something that I haven't said during a game in a long while. (Since Metal Gear Solid maybe?)
Hoping and praying here Sinaz20! Pteranodons... there's no good reason not to have them. They're the only logical choice... Please..
Either that or they may stick with that scene in the novel that really gives off the feeling of a Jurassic Ecosystem, so if they were really thinking about the public and the true Jurassic Park fans out there, they might've went with a group of BIG, red...
"I see references on google"....what exactly can he be referring too...
Dunno, I'm assuming that its some kinda pterosaur, because the most referred to thing about a "dinosaur" (with the quotations) related to this game are the Mososaur, and the river adventure through the aviary like in the novel and movie. I'm pretty sure its a pterosaur!:D
Dunno, I'm assuming that its some kinda pterosaur, because the most referred to thing about a "dinosaur" (with the quotations) related to this game are the Mososaur, and the river adventure through the aviary like in the novel and movie. I'm pretty sure its a pterosaur!:D
If this is so I really hope its the Pteranodon. I also really hope it looks like TLW Pteranodon and not the one seen in JP3, if this theory is in fact true.
If this is so I really hope its the Pteranodon. I also really hope it looks like TLW Pteranodon and not the one seen in JP3, if this theory is in fact true.
Yes, I could always be wrong, but it seems reasonable. And I also agree, I would either want the Cearadactyls from the novel or the TLW Pteranodons. THere is no way that I would accept this game if they put those JP/// monsters in for what should be there.
Yes, I could always be wrong, but it seems reasonable. And I also agree, I would either want the Cearadactyls from the novel or the TLW Pteranodons. THere is no way that I would accept this game if they put those JP/// monsters in for what should be there.
Agreed, Cearadactyls or TLW Pteranodon. Also if they decide to put in a meganeura that would be okay with me really. It's a bigger stretch for the mosasaur to be in the park than meganeura.
"Well he said our last big 'dinosaur' "....i really doubt that would be a large dragonfly. It could easily be the Mosasaur or just a dinosaur not mentioned yet. If it is a pterasaur, I doubt Cearadactylus...its from the book so telltales doesn't have rigths to the book.
I'm starting to lean more towards the answer being a Mosasaur. For these reasons.
1. The quotations around the word dinosaur could potentially mean its not a dinosaur just a prehistoric creature
2. he mentions marketing might have already revealed the "dinosaur" and the mosasaur was revealed at comic con
3. when he says "revealed her" it kinda hints that there is only one of these dinosaurs on the island....a female. I doubt Pteranodon would be it because if they exist on the island there is probably more than one
4. IF there is only one of these "dinosaurs" on the island. It could mean its a huge, potentially dangerous dinosaur that might fight or kill others of its species hence why there is only one...
"Well he said our last big 'dinosaur' "....i really doubt that would be a large dragonfly. It could easily be the Mosasaur or just a dinosaur not mentioned yet. If it is a pterasaur, I doubt Cearadactylus...its from the book so telltales doesn't have rigths to the book.
I'm starting to lean more towards the answer being a Mosasaur. For these reasons.
1. The quotations around the word dinosaur could potentially mean its not a dinosaur just a prehistoric creature
2. he mentions marketing might have already revealed the "dinosaur" and the mosasaur was revealed at comic con
3. when he says "revealed her" it kinda hints that there is only one of these dinosaurs on the island....a female. I doubt Pteranodon would be it because if they exist on the island there is probably more than one
4. IF there is only one of these "dinosaurs" on the island. It could mean its a huge, potentially dangerous dinosaur that might fight or kill others of its species hence why there is only one...
....but who knows....
Good observations. But just because cearadactylus is in the books doesn't mean they don't have the rights to use it. They could use any pterosaur, assuming there is a pterosaur.
But if it is the mosasaur... what's the big reveal? What's the secret? I doubt that there's some major plot point behind it. Other than, We get to escape from Mosasaurs 0_0!!!
Also I don't really believe there would be a meganeura, just a fun thought though I honestly would be a tad bit upset if they used up that awesome space for a bug the size of a seagull.
Edit: They have announced Mosasaurus.... In game interviews at least. I mean if you're not counting that then that's a little strange. I'll try to find the link.
Here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDfILTVwF5A He says it's not mosasaurus it's tylosaurus and it might use echolocation to find it's food. So idk if that mean's it's officially announced but it's good enough for me.
Agreed, Cearadactyls or TLW Pteranodon. Also if they decide to put in a meganeura that would be okay with me really. It's a bigger stretch for the mosasaur to be in the park than meganeura.
AHAHAHAHA! You know I was kidding about the dragonfly right? lol
I was referring to Mosasaur. It's funny, I totally remember having the briefing with Richard about the Mosasaur before comic con... I can't believe I forgot about that earlier.
There's no big secret, I guess... I just forgot that we announced her.
Comments
Anywho, I believe it was said that the difficulty level was toned down for these games because they wanted you to enjoy the story without too much frustration of being stuck on puzzles. Which I can relate to that. I remeber playing scratches and really enjoying the story but then I got stuck on one puzzle for weeks which really got on my nerves. Had to use a guide to get the story moving again. But at the same time, there is a such thing as too easy.
A good BTTF game would have been a commercial success too.
yes, but it would also have taken more time and effort.
and as Sinaz20 declared:
they primarly want to earn money.
the comparison to the voluntary fire brigade gave me the feeling that they don't really care much about players or fans as long as their products are getting sold and keep the developers paid.
(and yes I am glad that there are people who run a voluntary fire brigade!
or work for the ambulance!)
but one thing is clear for me: I won't buy another game done by Telltale unless I've read a few reviews.
this strategy only worked for the first game & you got my money, yes.
but it doesn't work the same way another time.
That's not what he said.
He said that even if one does his job with passion, if there are no results in terms of economical revenue, it cannot last.
Because they've to pay bills, rent, food - they're not just living for free the rest of their lives because they work at Telltale Games.
So, nothing is possible if there's no revenue: working in a company is different than having an hobby.
And - seeing how they delayed JP to give a better game AND give customers a total refund AND give customer an additional free coupon to have a complete free game of their choice - it seems to me that they cares players much better than many other games company around does.
Did you imagine Valve giving refunds and a free game for every 6 months they delayed Half Life Episodes 1-2-3?
I think TT stands out from this point of view.:cool:
For games like JP and BTTF, puzzles should be more like a way of playing a story, like a tool for being immersed by having to solve realistic problems that are part of the story rather than a challenge for itself. To me its way more important to having the feel that you are "doing" the story and a heavy emphasis on story and overall feel of the game than challenging puzzles, and lots of others feel the same, wich is the reason for the success.
With enough resources it may be possible to find a good compromise, but that would be very hard. Hint systems are ok but even using them or being stuck for a little while before using harms a bit of the immersion to me, so you would have to make brilliant puzzles wich makes it almost impossible to satisfy everyone. Maybe die-hard-adventure gamers should look elsewhere, its not like you didnt know what this game will be all about...
I mean, c'mon-- we apparently care so little about our audience that we can't even be bothered to come on to the forums and address their concerns and criticism. Oh wait...
Plus, one of my primary philosophies as a designer is a integrity of vision. But, so as to make sure a game is completed within the parameters of it's production, we make compromise. There are some things I will lose from my original designs, but there are many things that I fight to keep. BttF Ep3 had some of this give and take, and so does JP Ep4. Both games I am proud of, even though I am able to recognize the flaws in the games and the coulda-shoulda-wouldas that I will consider with the next game I make.
If a project needs to dial back some difficulty and complexity to reach the audience it is intended for, then so be it. We didn't want to make a game that would alienate fans of the film that were not adept adventure gamers. It is always important to make sure we expand our install base by appealing to a broad audience- we can teach them to be more sophisticated gamers later.
Also, about that hint system... it's not there for the seasoned adventure gamers. If you felt it was spoiling the game for you, why on earth were you using it? It's intended for players like my dad, who called me one night and was like, "why do I have to keep starting from the beginning? Where's the stupid save feature?" (EDIT: I noticed the criticism is more about the resources put into it-- the feature is pretty much a part of our engine... hints and conditions are worked out near the end of production after the designer has solidified design and the artists, animators, and programmers are in full effect-- so there is little "waste" centered around the hint system-- it gives us designers something more to do after the director has taken ownership.)
I will say that fan reaction to the simplicity of Back to the Future has spurred ideas about how to make a gradient difficulty in puzzle solving. When we next encounter a project where this can be experimented on, you can bet we'll give it a try. Jurassic Park has a little of this under the hood with inputs that simplistically adapt to the player's apparent skill.
@anthoto1: BttF was and is continuing to be a commercial success... so I don't really know what point you are trying to make.
My point was that BttF was a bad adventure game due to its simplicity. If it had been a little bit more challenging, it would have been a commercial success too.
When you play this game, there may be a small part of you that says "boy I wish I could manage an inventory, and steer my character everywhere, and shoot dinosaurs." But ultimately, we tried some of that version for you and discovered how it would have failed. Not to say such a game about dinosaurs couldn't have been made-- but it wouldn't have been a good Jurassic Park game.
Do you mean a "critical success?"
"I do not think it means what you think it means."
What most experienced players fear is the lack of freedom. According to what we understood, there will be no free exploration when every JP fan has always dreamt of being able to explore the islands. But the worst part of the gameplay is that all action scenes are prerendred QTE which leaves no room to players' creativity.
I mean it could have been more complex and it would still be a commercial success, as it is now.
i think i know how things run at least a bit since i am not too far away from what you are doing.
in our office of architecture we are often faced with the same things: ideas and creative mind at the beginning and project schedules and investment limits that follow. it is always about compromises...well or should I say optimization? although you have to reduce the costs it should not affect the general quality.
making great architecture does not necessarily mean using the most expensive materials.
i guess a game developing company is facing similar challenges.
concerning the accessability i just want developers to be honest.
they can simply declare from the very beginning whom they want to adress and what players can expect from the final product. of course you don't want to drive away any potential buyer but on the other hand people should know what they get:
"BTTF:TG is especially designed for fans for the franchise and therefore not primarly adressed to experienced adventure-game players. it uses very similar objectives and gameplay routines like traditional adventure games but it's more aimed to a fluent story-telling and thus doesn't include very hard puzzles. BTTF:TG is trying to capture the atmosphere of the movies and expands well known characters, places and times."
I guess that Jurassic Park is treated the same way but the main focus is on a cinematic presentation which isn't only used in cut-scenes but throughout the whole game. therefore the puzzle and exploration parts are developed in a different way than in traditional point&click adventures: it follows typical camera angles from movies and is in general designed for a controller-interface allthough for PC users a special keyboard and mouse-control is included.
new for a TTG adventure are thrilling action parts, which are based on QTE gameplay routines. if the player fails he can actually die and is reset to a predefined save point. for every further fail at the same QTE-sequence the chances to win rise because more and more wrong pressed buttons are allowed. this is to ensure that people doesn't get too frustrated at certain points.
dialogue parts are also included and can either be useful to gain background information or to continue the story by talking about the necessary topics in a scene.
.......
We do allow you to explore many of the spaces you are in without limiting you against a timer. We don't let you go free-roaming because A- we simply can't build an entire island for you to explore, B- it would break the story telling, and C- there are certain movie canon geography points that would be impossible to keep contiguous if we tried to rebuild the island... and as we can see... JP fans are finicky (endearingly... endearingly
Also, just to clarify... the QTE's aren't pre-rendered. They are completely in engine. But I do understand your concern that the action is directed. True, the action in this game is more about player reflexes and responsiveness -- we didn't build a 3rd person platforming system to accommodate such play. But what I think you are really misunderstanding here is that we give you action scenes that we feel are in the cinematic spirit of a Spielberg movie-- whether you realize it or not, you lose a huge amount of visual impact to an action sequence when you limit it to a 3rd person over the shoulder camera. We even have a few action sequences where we allow the player to control the camera during key moments, but we still restrict it into a visually striking range. It stays within the spirit of the scene, and it's a mechanic we are excited about.
Additionally, you have to realize that we put a lot of consideration into the game's QTE and mini-game like input. Part of the problem with trying to allow "player creativity" during QTE's is that they are always specific to the scene at hand, and rarely, if ever telegraph the results of one decision over another.
The action sequences tend to be a blend-- there may be parts that are fast and frantic, and are mostly reflexive QTE's... but the tempo of a scene varies, and when an action scene takes a rest, the player has a more granular level of decisions... go left or go right (before the dinosaur eats you)... use another character to distract or unlock a path (before the dinosaur eats you)... even when these rests occur, we manage to still keep a sense of tension and peril.
So you wanted a game that catered to your needs of more complex puzzles? BttF is a success which means Telltale did everything right. Maybe they didn't meet your expectations which happens with every game and company. You continously bring up why Jurrassic Park the game is not up to your standards yet you've ordered the game. So you're purchasing something you don't like, just because it has the name Jurassic Park? Now you say that your ordered the game to give it a chanse despite the fact that you think it looks bad? So go ahead and practice that idea and GIVE THE GAME A CHANSE!
I myself wish for a free-roam Jurassic Park game, but this isn't that game!!! This is a different type of game. The only thing for sure is that you're really not helping your case much given the fact that you try to pass off you're highly critical and insulting "remarks" as anything other than what they are.
Not only that but your spending so much time on these forums it also contradicts your case. You're here for a reason? If that reason is that you really want to let your negative opinion be well known around these forums then you my friend are probably a Troll. If you're here because you really like Jurassic Park the game, then you wouldn't be bringing so much negativity and pessimism.
We can only assume it was time restrictions....who knows.
How about you tell us what we miss out on after the release of the game? Cause right now it would be much more painful. Hopefully no dinosaurs were cut just extra sequences that didn't contribute much to the story....
Sinaz, I really appreciate what you're doing in this thread.
I was among those "puzzled" by the direction Jurassic Park is going, but I guess the real reason some of us original Telltale fans don't fully trust the team any longer is Back to the Future.
Before BTTF, I mainly complained about rushed testing and coding, but I still thought the "meat" was there. Heck, The Devil's Playhouse blew me out. Puzzle Agent was a Layton clone, but the atmosphere was peculiar. Unfortunately, I found BTTF very boring. The easy puzzles weren't the real problem. I don't feel to be the masoch Chuck was talking about. I think all gamers who've been following Telltale since Out From Boneville and Sam & Max Season One know why they are doing it: originality, a smoother approach to the genre, creativity, intelligent stories. I know Telltale games don't aim to offer extrahard puzzles.
I don't know how you approached BTTF, but I know what it seemed to me: an interactive movie presented as an extra-lite (mandatory?) adventure game with too many been-there-done-that puzzles. This interactive movie was too dialogue-heavy and slow to be bearable, while the adventure game was too limited and rigid to be challenging and interesting. The worst of two worlds.
There was no sign of peculiar interaction in BTTF: no Strong Bad minigames, no Max powers, just an "ok" story which could've been stronger if told with a much faster pace.
All considering, Jurassic Park sounds better than BTTF, because it's clearly NOT trying to be an adventure game AND an interactive movie. As long as Telltale doesn't forget their original audience (Hector and King's Quest are reassuring) and as long as your "new" things are REALLY new (not flat hybrids such as BTTF), I have no reason to dump you.
Just don't think the evolution of adventure games means denying them. I may like an interactive movie, I don't like an adventure game which tries not to be one (BTTF).
Quite possibly none. The TTG five-part "season" has become an expectation, but not because a good story arc necessarily has exactly four cliffhangers. Also, not because the Greek drama has five acts. Maybe this was because roughly four months are needed to finish the game once the first episode is released. So, four episodes instead of five could have nothing to do with game length, but instead with the pacing. Cliffhangers placed less arbitrarily. Same book, different chapter distribution. A reflection of more freedom for the game designers.
That's my positive note here. Unfortunately, when Sinaz compared the gameplay to a "modern Dragon's Lair", I made a dash for the door out. Sorry about that. Just not my cup of tea.
[redacted]
*Have we officially announced our last big "dinosaur?" I don't know-- I see references on google... so I'll let the fans tell me whether or not Marketing has revealed her.
I'm sorry that notion doesn't appeal to you-- I hope after reading some reviews, maybe you'll give it a try during a sale or something, because pure philosophy of mechanics aside, the game is fun and entertaining.
@Diduz: I have some talk back for you, too-- but I also have work to do (so bear with me.)
Now the community falls for their antics, IGN is full of crap, IGN can be the Fox News of gaming. and finally, IGN gives CoD a 100% every time. I think thats enough to call them biased.
yea i agree thank you tell tale for being epic, i havent heard a single company that takes suggestions like you guys.
"Dinosaur"? with quotation marks? so its either the mososaur that youre talking about... or a pterosaur or prehistoric bird..? Good to know...
Anywho, don't let us pressure you into making you spill too many beans, Sinaz20. I do like surprises in my games. lol If there is still a dinosaur that has not been announced then by all means keep it in the dark. I'm looking forward to some moments where I say, "Wow!!! I did not expect that!" Something that I haven't said during a game in a long while. (Since Metal Gear Solid maybe?)
Either that or they may stick with that scene in the novel that really gives off the feeling of a Jurassic Ecosystem, so if they were really thinking about the public and the true Jurassic Park fans out there, they might've went with a group of BIG, red...
Dunno, I'm assuming that its some kinda pterosaur, because the most referred to thing about a "dinosaur" (with the quotations) related to this game are the Mososaur, and the river adventure through the aviary like in the novel and movie. I'm pretty sure its a pterosaur!:D
If this is so I really hope its the Pteranodon. I also really hope it looks like TLW Pteranodon and not the one seen in JP3, if this theory is in fact true.
Yes, I could always be wrong, but it seems reasonable. And I also agree, I would either want the Cearadactyls from the novel or the TLW Pteranodons. THere is no way that I would accept this game if they put those JP/// monsters in for what should be there.
I'm starting to lean more towards the answer being a Mosasaur. For these reasons.
1. The quotations around the word dinosaur could potentially mean its not a dinosaur just a prehistoric creature
2. he mentions marketing might have already revealed the "dinosaur" and the mosasaur was revealed at comic con
3. when he says "revealed her" it kinda hints that there is only one of these dinosaurs on the island....a female. I doubt Pteranodon would be it because if they exist on the island there is probably more than one
4. IF there is only one of these "dinosaurs" on the island. It could mean its a huge, potentially dangerous dinosaur that might fight or kill others of its species hence why there is only one...
....but who knows....
But if it is the mosasaur... what's the big reveal? What's the secret? I doubt that there's some major plot point behind it. Other than, We get to escape from Mosasaurs 0_0!!!
Also I don't really believe there would be a meganeura, just a fun thought though
Edit: They have announced Mosasaurus.... In game interviews at least. I mean if you're not counting that then that's a little strange. I'll try to find the link.
Here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDfILTVwF5A He says it's not mosasaurus it's tylosaurus and it might use echolocation to find it's food. So idk if that mean's it's officially announced but it's good enough for me.
AHAHAHAHA! You know I was kidding about the dragonfly right? lol
There's no big secret, I guess... I just forgot that we announced her.
She's my favorite.