I do care about Star Wars. I love Star Wars. However, I respect the filmmaker's opinion if he thinks things need to be changed and therefore any new cuts are superior.
If you want to watch Star Wars old school make a VCD or something. I'm sure the technology to make Blu rays from VHS and that sort of thing is out there....
Getting 1080p HD quality picture from old degraded low-res video recorded on magnetic tape. Yeah. Good luck with that.
The filmmaker's opinion is the one that matters. If you disagree, that's too bad, but I'd agree with the filmmaker's vision.
You suggest that George Lucas is infallible and that any decision he makes is warranted--even necessary, no matter how far removed from the feel of the original work.
You suggest that George Lucas is infallible and that any decision he makes is warranted--even necessary, no matter how far removed from the feel of the original work.
Yes. He made the first two movies, wrote all of them, and owns the rights to them. Anything he says is superior should therefore be the definitive version, and they shouldn't bother with re-releasing the existing cuts.
Yes. He made the first two movies, wrote all of them, and owns the rights to them. Anything he says is superior should therefore be the definitive version, and they shouldn't bother with re-releasing the existing cuts.
So if he replaces Chewy with a Tribble, puts a mickey mouse hat on Luke's head and replaces Billy Dee Williams' lines with voiceover work by Gilbert Gottfried and calls it definitive, you'd have no problem with it?
So if he replaces Chewy with a Tribble, puts a mickey mouse hat on Luke's head and replaces Billy Dee Williams' lines with voiceover work by Gilbert Gottfried and calls it definitive, you'd have no problem with it?
Yes. It's his film, and I won't disagree with the filmmaker.
Guys, since this didn't work the way Icedhope tried it, I'm going to rephrase.
Calm the fuck down.
The discussion has not at all become heated and your post is the first in the thread to use heated profanity. If you're afraid of Lucasfilm for some reason then close the thread. Otherwise let us continue this discussion.
He isn't ruining anything, I like my original copies, I don't give a flying shit if they aren't touched up or if it's a laserdisc transfer....I prefer watching it on laserdisc so that I can see all the film grain...yep...upgrading it to be more crisp, whatever in REALITY is yet another revision.
Yes removing the natural grain like they did for the 2004 release is another revision. I don't know if you own very many blu-rays but quite a lot of them retain their natural grain. Film inherently contains a LOT more picture data than even our 1080p HD televisions can display. That's why most film transfers are done at 8k. Those laserdisc masters have a horrible resolution and have lost a lot of detail. Not to mention the fact that they're riddled with horrible artifacting problems that leave the picture in even more of a mess.
It is not hard or prohibitively expensive to create HD transfers of films. Especially not for a company as big as Lucasfilm. Heck, even the ripoff space adventure films that were spawned because of Star Wars are now being released on blu-ray. So why keep condoning the suppression of the original films? If they're not properly preserved soon they will be lost.
-.- What a stupid response. You obviously care nothing about Star Wars.
Star Wars belongs to the fans as much as it belongs to George Lucas. We love Star Wars as it once was before this Special Edition crap. Many of us grew up with it; feel a connection with the characters; find the story to be compelling... oh and there's so much more to it than just that.
With one hand, George is taking our money hand over fist, and with the other he is beating us about the head and shoulders with a baseball bat.
Implying that having vader scream "noooo" ruins the story or character connection. I really don't see what's wrong with the changes. There's nothing there that ruins the experience. Who know's, maybe it was his original intention to have it sounding/looking like this. If he had released it originally like this, and then edited it to make it like the original versions, people would still complain. The guy's an artist, his work is never done. You don't have to buy the sets anyway. The DVD versions will upscale in a blu-ray player, afterall.
I actually had a lot of fun exploring the other videos by this guy. He's got a re-edit of Revenge of the Sith planned, and he's showcasing a lot of the work on his YouTube account. Take a look, it's really very impressive.
The way I see it, the changes are like website changes. Everyone who used the thing before frequently, instantly hates the change, even if it's for the better.
But I do see tobar's side of this...I guess I honestly just don't stress over, care that much if something is in HD or not. I guess I really just don't care.
I suppose I can see why others do care. Ok, I admit I'm trying to see both sides now. Any one else EXCITED?
I'm a dirty boy Lucas, a dirty boy!
Then again I love my VHS and DVDs and movies, I don't really care about graphics but I loved Simon the Sorcerer 3D...
Anyways, I'll show my kids the original narrative as well as the new and I honestly doubt they'll give a shit, at all if it's HD or crisp or whatever, I'll just show it to them as is. And I'm sure they will enjoy it. I watch my copies on TV, and you can all hate on it, but I think the movies look better than movies from the 90s...as is...
That proves it. There are people out there ready to be analy raped by George Lucas. And there is nothing we can do about it. Nooooooooooooooooooooo!!!
God forbid someone for once gives trust in someone else's opinion. You all haven't watched the new cut, and you're judging it based on the fact it's similar to the old cut which wasn't that bad.
Come on man, it was a joke. I'm going to show my kids both copies. I think my copies look great, it's like a 30 year old movie, that's the problem, people expect it to be upgraded with HD and then all this shit, one day lucas will be dead, no more updates, folks and you say the DVDS look bad but I think they look great, my VHS copies look better than films from the 90s.
We collect Star Wars versions at home, we have it on CDs, and different versions. We collect them. I have it on a old rental even, but the quality is chopped up I hear.
Anyways, I never watched Star Wars without thinking it looked amazing for being from the 70s...and though the scene of vader looks retarded it doesn't turn me off entirely yet, as for narrative and emotion of the movies. I have to see the scenes in their entirety.
I do see other people's side, that the originals should be released, but a orange is a orange, this is a orange, not a apple. Lucas has been doing this for like 20 years now...20 years...it's what he does, it's a orange, a orange is a orange.
I do agree original copies on bluray might be neat, but hey...did we so soon forget? Lucas edited over the original film for special edition, it's destroyed, gone...
As far as stupid changes go and watching it in different versions I will watch these versions of the films.
I'll also show both versions to my kids if I ever have any and I doubt they will complain this looks like crap on my HD TV....
But I do respect some of you are technologically guru and concerned. I never cared about such things.
Come on man, it was a joke. I'm going to show my kids both copies. I think my copies look great, it's like a 30 year old movie, that's the problem, people expect it to be upgraded with HD and then all this shit, one day lucas will be dead, no more updates, folks and you say the DVDS look bad but I think they look great, my VHS copies look better than films from the 90s.
Actually, I heard his son is getting interested in his business...
/insert Vader "no!"/
Hey, maybe we'll get lucky and he'll remove half the crying and whining from the prequels and I'll be able to stomach watching them with my kids one day.
Nah , just kidding. Each to their own. The worse part of the prequels to me, and is something we laugh at as a family is Anakin's dark side speech in ROTS. We all agree Obi Wan makes it very emotional and a good scene but Hayden just about murders it...
We actually enjoy TPM and actually enjoy most of ROTS and ATOC is ok, but it's ...I don't know....
It's ok, yeah star wars!
Who has seriously seen a original copy of Star Wars? Raise your hands if you're like 40 years old...it's never really been on video...
I love Star Wars and grew up with MY copies.
We're lucky and privileged that lucas even brings the movies back to theaters, the first special edition was pretty cool.
Guess what you grew up with YOUR copies, even if you saw it in theaters and guess what your kids will grow up with YOUR and THEIR copies...
And they'll probably love it too, I never watched a 30 year old movie on any media and said, this looks like terd...I mean seriously, this movie looks great, whenever, where ever I see it.
Who has seriously seen a original copy of Star Wars? Raise your hands if you're like 40 years old...it's never really been on video...
.
Actually the last 2 disc editions that came out on DVD had the theatrical releases on bonus discs....untouched, grainy, sound and light problems and all. Title was still "Star Wars" and everything. Star Wars fans, grab them NOW because they're just out of print....then throw away all the disc 1s
I think I have those, were those the limited time editions that come with special editions and a bonus CD?
Isn't that what others are calling lazer disc rip offs? Regardless I love my copies. But, that's what fans want to get then. You're on top of this stuff.
Actually the last 2 disc editions that came out on DVD had the theatrical releases on bonus discs....untouched, grainy, sound and light problems and all. Title was still "Star Wars" and everything. Star Wars fans, grab them NOW because they're just out of print....then throw away all the disc 1s
I've discussed these at length in this thread already. They spliced back in the original Star Wars title scroll from an unknown source and the rest is sourced from a horrible laserdisc master. That goes for all three of the original films in that 2006 release.
I've discussed these at length in this thread already. They spliced back in the original Star Wars title scroll from an unknown source and the rest is sourced from a horrible laserdisc master. That goes for all three of the original films in that 2006 release.
well they still had the light saber issue that was corrected for VHS trilogy release....so wherever the master came from, it was before that was fixed.
well they still had the light saber issue that was corrected for VHS trilogy release....so wherever the master came from, it was before that was fixed.
I'm not sure what this is referring to, care to clarify?
I'm not sure what this is referring to, care to clarify?
The laserdisc version would have been from a near original version. Once Jedi came out and they put all 3 movies in a VHS boxset, Lucas fixed a few audio visual problems. The most obvious being the fight between Obi Wan and Vader. The light sabers effects flicker and move when they shouldn't be. Just a technical fix.
The laserdisc version would have been from a near original version. Once Jedi came out and they put all 3 movies in a VHS boxset, Lucas fixed a few audio visual problems. The most obvious being the fight between Obi Wan and Vader. The light sabers effects flicker and move when they shouldn't be. Just a technical fix.
Thank you! There you go, and also, it's the best you're going to ever get because Lucas destroyed the original. That's as good as it gets...
The laserdisc version would have been from a near original version. Once Jedi came out and they put all 3 movies in a VHS boxset, Lucas fixed a few audio visual problems. The most obvious being the fight between Obi Wan and Vader. The light sabers effects flicker and move when they shouldn't be. Just a technical fix.
Er, the audio mixes have always been different between the various releases. Lucas never made any changes to the films themselves (other than the scroll in '81) until the special editions in '97.
Thank you! There you go, and also, it's the best you're going to ever get because Lucas destroyed the original. That's as good as it gets...
I really don't understand why you're so adamant in trying to prove we can never have the original films again. There are claims that the original negatives were physically altered in '97 during work on the special edition. This is unlikely but even if it is true they can still reconstruct the film using other existing elements including separation masters and interpositives. Heck even well preserved 70mm and 35mm prints (which Lucasfilm does have) can be used to create an acceptable transfer of the films.
Well, that's the real argument here. It's true he edited over the originals. But, maybe all those techniques might make it possible to salvage the original, it sounds like a heck of a lot of work. But, I guess it MIGHT be possible. You act like it's so easy .
But, I must admit you seem to know more about film than I ever have. But, if you're implying he uses movie reels for theaters and tie it into the original film and monkey around with that, it sounds like a disaster or a train wreck to me...different sizes and all of that, isn't it?
That sounds like a lot of work If you want the very first edition, why not just have jabba as a human in ANH? Seriously where do you draw the line? No one has seen the ORIGINAL copy, debatably in 40 years....
How do you know what Lucas arts has? And even if it were possible what exactly do you want? No one has seen what you're asking for, as far as I'm concerned since the 70s and lots of people probably don't even remember what they saw...
I'm sorry but that entire last post just sounded like a bunch of jibberish. All of the home releases of the original trilogy prior to 1997 were of the original films. Nothing about them was altered other than the audio mixes. The only difference is that in 1981 when they re-released the original Star Wars to theaters they added Episode IV A New Hope to the opening scroll.
And the kind of work I'm talking about to restore the films and create a modern transfer of the original theatrical versions isn't hard. It is literally done every day by studios dedicated to that kind of work. It's its own industry.
Meh...maybe I was wrong. It sounded good at the time. Didn't the original have jabba as a human, in theaters? I thought the theater version was different than the first release. But, I don't really care that much.
I thought it was re leased to theaters SEVERAL times, not just once. Special Edition did it too, I bet fan boys want to complain about that too, how dare he release the movies to theaters !?
The latest sale pitch is 3D, and I know lots of people already hate the idea of 3D...
The original was supposedly destroyed with special edition, but I don't know all the details about that.
Oh, you old people don't remember nothing! I grew up with my copies and I'm happy with those. OLD GEEZERS! Go back to the 60s! or 70s! You don't remember how the films EXACTLY were...get out of here, some of you were still playing with building blocks at the time or Linkon logs.
You're a old geezer aren't you? Aren't you!? XD...I'm just playing, my father is older too, but not my mother, because she's a woman...
Anyways, I'm just babbling now.
I honestly don't care , I love my copies.
Most, all this generations nerds grew up with these releases.
What it all comes down to is you want these on DVD or disc and hate the lazer disc versions. I wonder if you could get it professionally transferred , legally. Or maybe since you're a expert you can find a way to do it yourself...
Comments
But they're not superior.
Calm the fuck down.
Getting 1080p HD quality picture from old degraded low-res video recorded on magnetic tape. Yeah. Good luck with that.
The filmmaker's opinion is the one that matters. If you disagree, that's too bad, but I'd agree with the filmmaker's vision.
You suggest that George Lucas is infallible and that any decision he makes is warranted--even necessary, no matter how far removed from the feel of the original work.
Yes. He made the first two movies, wrote all of them, and owns the rights to them. Anything he says is superior should therefore be the definitive version, and they shouldn't bother with re-releasing the existing cuts.
So if he replaces Chewy with a Tribble, puts a mickey mouse hat on Luke's head and replaces Billy Dee Williams' lines with voiceover work by Gilbert Gottfried and calls it definitive, you'd have no problem with it?
Yes. It's his film, and I won't disagree with the filmmaker.
Not saying I always agree with the creator but it is their product.
The discussion has not at all become heated and your post is the first in the thread to use heated profanity. If you're afraid of Lucasfilm for some reason then close the thread. Otherwise let us continue this discussion.
Hah, nice. As Leia once said, "It could be worse..."
Why should this make us happy? I'm a big fan of Ady's work but in the end it's just another special edition.
Yes removing the natural grain like they did for the 2004 release is another revision. I don't know if you own very many blu-rays but quite a lot of them retain their natural grain. Film inherently contains a LOT more picture data than even our 1080p HD televisions can display. That's why most film transfers are done at 8k. Those laserdisc masters have a horrible resolution and have lost a lot of detail. Not to mention the fact that they're riddled with horrible artifacting problems that leave the picture in even more of a mess.
It is not hard or prohibitively expensive to create HD transfers of films. Especially not for a company as big as Lucasfilm. Heck, even the ripoff space adventure films that were spawned because of Star Wars are now being released on blu-ray. So why keep condoning the suppression of the original films? If they're not properly preserved soon they will be lost.
Here's something else you might want to check out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxKTJQizURg&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRIn71Zd1fA&feature=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiXy7OpXqmA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMhTjwkoVVg&feature=related
Haters, Lucas OWNS me, abuse me Lucas! Abuse me! Yes, Yes! Hurt me morrrrrreee!
Make me feel it, make me feel alive again!
I'm so buying this...
OMG spoilers!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5VJivJAuD4&feature=related
I'm a free bitch baby!
But I do see tobar's side of this...I guess I honestly just don't stress over, care that much if something is in HD or not. I guess I really just don't care.
I suppose I can see why others do care. Ok, I admit I'm trying to see both sides now. Any one else EXCITED?
I'm a dirty boy Lucas, a dirty boy!
Then again I love my VHS and DVDs and movies, I don't really care about graphics but I loved Simon the Sorcerer 3D...
Anyways, I'll show my kids the original narrative as well as the new and I honestly doubt they'll give a shit, at all if it's HD or crisp or whatever, I'll just show it to them as is. And I'm sure they will enjoy it. I watch my copies on TV, and you can all hate on it, but I think the movies look better than movies from the 90s...as is...
God forbid someone for once gives trust in someone else's opinion. You all haven't watched the new cut, and you're judging it based on the fact it's similar to the old cut which wasn't that bad.
We collect Star Wars versions at home, we have it on CDs, and different versions. We collect them. I have it on a old rental even, but the quality is chopped up I hear.
Anyways, I never watched Star Wars without thinking it looked amazing for being from the 70s...and though the scene of vader looks retarded it doesn't turn me off entirely yet, as for narrative and emotion of the movies. I have to see the scenes in their entirety.
I do see other people's side, that the originals should be released, but a orange is a orange, this is a orange, not a apple. Lucas has been doing this for like 20 years now...20 years...it's what he does, it's a orange, a orange is a orange.
I do agree original copies on bluray might be neat, but hey...did we so soon forget? Lucas edited over the original film for special edition, it's destroyed, gone...
As far as stupid changes go and watching it in different versions I will watch these versions of the films.
I'll also show both versions to my kids if I ever have any and I doubt they will complain this looks like crap on my HD TV....
But I do respect some of you are technologically guru and concerned. I never cared about such things.
Actually, I heard his son is getting interested in his business...
/insert Vader "no!"/
Hey, maybe we'll get lucky and he'll remove half the crying and whining from the prequels and I'll be able to stomach watching them with my kids one day.
Nah , just kidding. Each to their own. The worse part of the prequels to me, and is something we laugh at as a family is Anakin's dark side speech in ROTS. We all agree Obi Wan makes it very emotional and a good scene but Hayden just about murders it...
We actually enjoy TPM and actually enjoy most of ROTS and ATOC is ok, but it's ...I don't know....
It's ok, yeah star wars!
Who has seriously seen a original copy of Star Wars? Raise your hands if you're like 40 years old...it's never really been on video...
I love Star Wars and grew up with MY copies.
We're lucky and privileged that lucas even brings the movies back to theaters, the first special edition was pretty cool.
Guess what you grew up with YOUR copies, even if you saw it in theaters and guess what your kids will grow up with YOUR and THEIR copies...
And they'll probably love it too, I never watched a 30 year old movie on any media and said, this looks like terd...I mean seriously, this movie looks great, whenever, where ever I see it.
Actually the last 2 disc editions that came out on DVD had the theatrical releases on bonus discs....untouched, grainy, sound and light problems and all. Title was still "Star Wars" and everything. Star Wars fans, grab them NOW because they're just out of print....then throw away all the disc 1s
Isn't that what others are calling lazer disc rip offs? Regardless I love my copies. But, that's what fans want to get then. You're on top of this stuff.
I've discussed these at length in this thread already. They spliced back in the original Star Wars title scroll from an unknown source and the rest is sourced from a horrible laserdisc master. That goes for all three of the original films in that 2006 release.
EDIT: Note the T-shirt the minion is wearing.
I'm not sure what this is referring to, care to clarify?
The laserdisc version would have been from a near original version. Once Jedi came out and they put all 3 movies in a VHS boxset, Lucas fixed a few audio visual problems. The most obvious being the fight between Obi Wan and Vader. The light sabers effects flicker and move when they shouldn't be. Just a technical fix.
Thank you! There you go, and also, it's the best you're going to ever get because Lucas destroyed the original. That's as good as it gets...
...some more changes.
Er, the audio mixes have always been different between the various releases. Lucas never made any changes to the films themselves (other than the scroll in '81) until the special editions in '97.
I really don't understand why you're so adamant in trying to prove we can never have the original films again. There are claims that the original negatives were physically altered in '97 during work on the special edition. This is unlikely but even if it is true they can still reconstruct the film using other existing elements including separation masters and interpositives. Heck even well preserved 70mm and 35mm prints (which Lucasfilm does have) can be used to create an acceptable transfer of the films.
But, I must admit you seem to know more about film than I ever have. But, if you're implying he uses movie reels for theaters and tie it into the original film and monkey around with that, it sounds like a disaster or a train wreck to me...different sizes and all of that, isn't it?
That sounds like a lot of work If you want the very first edition, why not just have jabba as a human in ANH? Seriously where do you draw the line? No one has seen the ORIGINAL copy, debatably in 40 years....
How do you know what Lucas arts has? And even if it were possible what exactly do you want? No one has seen what you're asking for, as far as I'm concerned since the 70s and lots of people probably don't even remember what they saw...
And the kind of work I'm talking about to restore the films and create a modern transfer of the original theatrical versions isn't hard. It is literally done every day by studios dedicated to that kind of work. It's its own industry.
I thought it was re leased to theaters SEVERAL times, not just once. Special Edition did it too, I bet fan boys want to complain about that too, how dare he release the movies to theaters !?
The latest sale pitch is 3D, and I know lots of people already hate the idea of 3D...
The original was supposedly destroyed with special edition, but I don't know all the details about that.
Oh, you old people don't remember nothing! I grew up with my copies and I'm happy with those. OLD GEEZERS! Go back to the 60s! or 70s! You don't remember how the films EXACTLY were...get out of here, some of you were still playing with building blocks at the time or Linkon logs.
You're a old geezer aren't you? Aren't you!? XD...I'm just playing, my father is older too, but not my mother, because she's a woman...
Anyways, I'm just babbling now.
I honestly don't care , I love my copies.
Most, all this generations nerds grew up with these releases.
What it all comes down to is you want these on DVD or disc and hate the lazer disc versions. I wonder if you could get it professionally transferred , legally. Or maybe since you're a expert you can find a way to do it yourself...
Anyways, I have no real argument.