I think they should have kept Larry around longer, he was the most entertaining guy and the story should have gone on a bit longer then it did.
Did ep3,4,5 take place in like 4 days???
Would have been better if it was over a longer period of time, (Lee and Clem getting even closer, him becoming a dad to her etc), No silly radioguy holding a grudge oh and did I say this already MORE LARRY!
Walking dead tv show, comics, and this game... they've all been pretty depressing, think about it. It's reality based - Lee was effed, he just had one last thing.
No, I thought the ending was actually perfect. My only disappointment was the lack of seeing Molly at any point. Not even zombie Molly or something, which is REALLY annoying considering you do see zombie Andrea at one point.
Andrea isn't in the game and she is not dead in any of the Walking dead mediums. She is alive in the comics and the TV show.
Many people posted things like: "I understand it's impossible to make many, many story threads fit together throughout several episodes." That's certainly true. But in the last episode anything was possible. They had the chance to make a gazillion endings based on the decisions throughout the game without worrying that these events wouldn't fit with those other players experienced.
Instead, you get that cliffhanger which is meant to do just what you said: Create the tiny hope that at least next time your decisions will matter. Well, they won't. If the next season includes this seasons' cast, there will be something happeneing in the first few minutes that renders all those decisions pointless again. Because else they'd have the mentioned problem again that every player has a differently trained Clem.
The entire point of the season was Lee's redemption story, whether or not Lee was truly a bad man and the circumstances surrounding his survival and taking care of Clementine--his death was the only way it was going to go down.
You call it disappointing that you couldn't live but you're supposed to want to feel like you have an option of surviving, it's why I cut Lee's hand off and desperately acted in denial throughout the entire episode.
If you thought Lee was going to walk into the sunset with Clementine at the end of the episode, you're (un)dead wrong. This isn't Disney's The Walking Dead.
Well Rick and Carl are still alive after 103 issues to best of my knowledge so it's not unrealistic to imagine Lee making it through 5 episodes. This being said I expected Lee to die but he did not go out with a bang as others have said. He died failing. He will never know if Clementine made it to safety. So where is his redemption? As far as he is concerned he failed to get Clementine back to Christa and Omid which was is mission objective once he told them to meet him at the train station. Even if Lee died he should have still been able to die succeeding his goal. Even the guy in the Dawn of the dead movie was able to help the group get to the boat before he died and Will Smith's character in I am legend died knowing he helped Anna and the kid get away. Lee even looks like he feels he has failed.
Cole Magrath dies in Infamous. I didn't have a problem with it because through his death he saved humanity and died knowing this. The same for Nariko in Heavenly sword where she died knowing she saved her people. After everything, Lee just dies. Yeah he saved Clementine from the kidnapper who was clearly crazy but he didn't finish his mission objective of getting her to safety and depending on how you played the game you may not even save her from the guy in the hotel, in those cases she saves you from him. The ending could and should have been so much more.
I didn't like How Ben was a bigger piece in the final one then we were lead to believe. I dislike how none of our options to decide who comes with us changes who lives or dies. Or that you can't change the outcome. I expected this to be the best tell tale game yet. But I'd rather our choices have a bigger impact.
Walking dead tv show, comics, and this game... they've all been pretty depressing, think about it. It's reality based - Lee was effed, he just had one last thing.
No, I thought the ending was actually perfect. My only disappointment was the lack of seeing Molly at any point. Not even zombie Molly or something, which is REALLY annoying considering you do see zombie Andrea at one point.
How was the ending perfect when Lee failed? Clementine survived but Lee doesn't know that because he wasn't responsible for getting her to safety. He didn't reunite her with Omid and Christa which was his only goal by the end of the game. Where is his redemption? He goes to the grave not knowing if Clementine made it out of the city. Come to think of we don't even know how safe she is when we see her last and won't know for a very long time. So there is no real sense of ressolve. If the season was tied up and conclusive the ending would have been good and rewarding.
The end of episode 4 made it pretty obvious that that was the direction things were heading. Now I'm not gonna lie, I had Lee chop off his arm and I hoped that it would be enough to save him, but alas it was not to be. Ever since the end of episode 4 I was pretty much of the mindset that Lee HAD to save Clementine before it was too late, and he did so. He died a hero in my book and while I would have loved for Lee to survive, I am perfectly content with the ending we got.
Also, this is the Walking Dead...chances of happy endings are never going to be great.
I don't know. Yeah the walking dead isn't usually about happy endings, but the comics aren't all doom and gloom. They have victories aswell as tradgedies and the protagonist for the comics is still alive after 103 issues. I didn't have a problem with Lee dying but the way it happened was underwhelming. Clementine survived but Lee doesn't know that because he wasn't responsible for getting her to safety. He didn't reunite her with Omid and Christa which was his only goal by the end of the game. Where is his redemption? He goes to the grave not knowing if Clementine made it out of the city. Come to think of we don't even know how safe she is when we see her last and won't know for a very long time. So there is no real sense of ressolve. If the season was tied up and conclusive the ending would have been good and rewarding. I would have felt better if I saw Clementine board the train with Christa and Omid at least, considering Telltale chose not to have Lee escort Clementine to the train, which is what I would have wanted and considered a rewarding ending for the time invested waiting for these episodes.
I hope season 2's ending will be rewarding even if it means waiting till 2014 to play it.
I can see why a few people are disappointed by the way things went in episode 5. But all it really seems like to me is "This didn't end how I wanted it to and that annoys me".
From the very beginning I felt like the game's "true" focus was Clementine. Lee did have his own story, and playing as Lee, every player is going to explore his backstory and generally relate to him more.
But Lee was Clem's protector, from episode 3 onward it was made clear you could never be 100% sure that everything was going to be okay and that Lee was basically preparing Clementine for how difficult surviving was to be.
Maybe I'm just a little biased because I expected a sad ending from having gotten used to The Walking Dead comics, but that's just how The Walking Dead stories go. It's the apocalypse, things are tragic, and unfair, and if every dramatic, messed up, terrifying moment in the game series existed only to lead to a one in a million chance that Lee lives and they both walk away, it would defeat the whole point.
Tl;dr version: It's a zombie apocalypse, Clementine survived. That's a happy enough ending for me.
You say that but Rick Grimes and his son Carl are still alive after 103 issues. Carl has has been shot in his body and had quarter of his face shot off. Rick has had his hand chopped off and been shot in the chest and in his stomach and they are still alive. Rick Grimes is the protagonist of the walking dead. If Kirkman killed of Rick I personally wouldn't continue reading the comics and i'm sure many would feel the same way.
The walking dead comics are shown through Rick's eyes. We don't see the zombie apocalypse until Rick wakes up from the coma. Likewise the game shows the apocalypse through Lee's eyes. He was the protagonist. Clementine is to Lee what Carl is to Rick. I don't think it would be any less realistic for Lee and Clementine to survive 9 episodes (season 2 is meant to be 4 episodes long) than it is for Rick and Carl to survive the 300 episodes that Kirkman has planned for the walking dead comic series, considering that 100 issues equates to only just over a year in Rick Grimes's time in this zombie apocalyptic world.
I would have preferred a more conclusive ending. It still wouldn't be a happy ending because Lee died but it would have been a conclusive one if we saw Clementine reunited with Christa and Omid and board the train, explainning how Lee died after saving her life.
Yeah, but the point of having a "Your choices matter" game, is for replayability. For Heavy Rain I have no clue how long I've spent on that game. Everytime I play it something is different than last time I played it. And before haters attack me I know that this has a fraction of the money that Heavy Rain had behind it, but then don't sell it as a "Your choices matter" game.
Again, as an adventure game it's great. As an interactive story it isn't.
The way Lee died in that room, handcuffed to the radiator was very good. Just thinking about him lying there as the story continues if very 'The Walking Dead'.
I didn't like a few things, but the Stranger was the biggest disappointment. When he was telling Lee his sob story, I thought Lee was going to get up and slap him with his good hand then walk out with Clementine. He just didn't seem legit to me.
There was a lot of potential with that character. Maybe he could've been charged by her parents to save Clem, maybe he could've been part of some other group. He might have had a kid in Savannah he was looking after and genuinely thought he was more capable, or maybe he was just a murderous psychopath?
Instead he was the moron that abandoned his car. Right, ok.
Great game though, gutted we have to wait for Season 2. I feel like I'm always waiting for such small doses!
Yeah the stranger on the radio plot device definitely screwed up the brilliant flow of the game. I had so many issues with the identity of the man on the radio. There is no way that the stranger could have got to Savannah before Lee when Lee was on a train, the stranger's car had no fuel and he wouldn't of known Clementine was going to Savannah until she knew which wasn't until after they got the train moving.
The stranger explained that a week before the events of episode 5 he was normal and had a family, yet during that week he just so happened to have a similar radio to Clementine and manage to connect to her frequency a week later and plan to stalk Lee's group for revenge and to rescue Clementine because of all the things Clementine told him Lee had done in the game. Here's the kicker in my play through Clementine never saw me do anything bad. I didn't kill anyone in front of her. The only thing the stranger could use to support his case about me not being a good man was that I saved Carly instead of Doug. He didn't even know Doug so that shouldn't of been enough to make him see me as a monster and want to punish me. It made me feel like all the good decision's I made were for nothing because Clementine tells the stranger everything iv'e done and he views it as negative and wants to punish me for it regardless.
I would of preferred if I was able to follow the choice I made in episode 3 to look for her parents. Most of episode 4 was about getting supplies for the boat which ends up getting stolen in episode 5 anyway, again making me feel what was the point to that episode. It was fun to play but an episode filler nonetheless. Episode 3 gave you the choice to plan what you would make a priority when arriving at Savannah; a boat or looking for Clementine's parents. I chose to look for her parents but was made to focus on looking for a boat instead when episode 4 began. The game was fun but it gives the illusion of choice unlike in Heavy Rain where your actions actually make a difference to the games ending and determine who lives and who dies. I preferred the first 3 episodes.
The focus should have stayed on searching for Clementine's parents and finding a safe haven. When the stranger sat me down and explainned why he was punishing me he didn't have anything on me. Clementine had told him everything I had done whilst being with her from episode 1-5. The stranger should have seen me as a saint based on my choices. I didn't steal his food from the car, I didn't kill any of the st john brothers. I didn't help Kenny kill Larry. All he had to criticize me for was the fact that I took Clementine to Crawford, I left Lilly on the road and I saved Carly over Doug. He claimed I saved her because she was pretty and a had a gun. I know that was Telltale speaking to us through him at that point. But that's just it, I didn't save her purely for those reasons. I saved her because I bonded more with her in episode 1 than I did with Doug. Had the choice of been between Kenny and Carly, she still would have been pretty and still would have had a gun, yet I would have bonded more with Kenny since Lee had spent a whole day with him by then. In that case I would have chosen Kenny over Carly. Telltale gave Carly far more script lines, and scenes than Doug. She was involved in all the major arguments and decissions once Lee met that group. Saving her was a no brainner. Then Telltale punish us for choosing the character that they had fleshed out more so the kidnapper uses that as a reason for punishing Lee. Ridiculous. That was Telltale's feable attempt to make it seem like choices matter and there are consequences for our actions.
The guy even said that he wanted to punish the peole that was with Lee, refering to Kenny and his wife, blaming them for the death of his wife and son due to them looting his food, yet he wants to kill Lee because of things he felt he had done to people he didn't even know or care about.
By the end I felt that there was no reward for the way I played the game. I could have been an arse hole, treated Clementine like shit, killed everone for the fun of it and still got the same ending. Ben will still die in the alley way if he was in ep 5, Kenny will still die in the alley if ben was not in ep 5. Lee will still die in the locked room at Clementine's hand and she will still leave the city by herself and see 2 figures in the distance. I don't see why Telltale coudn't have had multiple endings considering this episode was much shorter than all of the others. I had all the group members with me expecting to get the longest game because there was more characters to talk to, yet the game finished in 1 and half hours. I was hoping that the episode would have been the longest. In comics milestone issues like TWD 100 are often double sized additions. I expected the episode to be longer than episode 1 at least. I found episode 5's ending under whelming. Considering we will have to wait a very long time before season 2 comes out I would have wanted the episode to end with some ressolve, at least to see Clementine board the train with Christa and Omid and a longer video seqence. The Tekken games have longer video seqences when you complete them.
You still have to give the player the feeling of some kind of accomplishment. Now Lee has completely failed, he might as well shot himself in the head with the shotgun from the beginning, what difference would it make? Clem is all alone, hungry, thirsty and will probably die from exhaustion in the next couple of hours. We don't even know who the two silhouettes at the end were. There really is no excuse for such a stupid cliffhanger ending.
Oh look, we will make a second season, so you don't need an ending for the first one, because that is, how good writing works.
I agree 100% You should always give the gamers closure at the end of a game because no one knows the future. Shenmue 2 was an awesome game that had the worst cliff hanger and they canned the sequel so we will never know what became of Ryo Hazuki. Dungeons and dragons was one of the best cartoons in the 80's and it got cancelled before the final episode, so the kids in that cartoon never ever made it home but stayed stuck in the other realm. My name is earl and the Reaper are another two shows that were cancelled before giving the viewers any closure. They all finished with cliff hangers and there was no ressolve.
At least in the Uncharted games each one is wrapped up and concluded. Even in the walking dead tv show the seasons end conclusively with a sense of ressolve showing the survivors escape their immediate danger and regroup on the road.
As far as i'm concerned not only is it risky for Telltale to end the season with such a ambiguous cliff hanger since there is no guarantee that season 2 will see the light of day it is also a finger up to all of us that have waited to see this story completed. I think that this level of ambiguity is o.k for a novel or tv show/movie but not for a video game where you invest more of your time and effort.
i was very disappointed by this last episode.. I loved the ones before, all of them but honestly i think this one is really bad.. only 2 hours and half to play it, not a lot of surprises and this end...
i really thought clementime would come back to lee with the couple after she escaped and i was really surprised to see the credit straight away after she left lee.. she leaves and there is the credits, that's it!!!! i was sure something will happens after this and it was the end of the game!!?? o_O
and they could have done this episode as interesting than the others.. what happened to her after this? ( i didn't see her in the countryside) what happened to lee? where are the couple? there was something weird with them and i didn't really trust them to take care of clementine so we should be happy with this end with all this questions left? it's like a very good film with a quick shitty end who completly ruins all the scenario.. i guess there will be another season and lee will be alive if it's like in the film but would have been great to do the last episode more interesting and less predictable compared to the other ones and to say it's not really the end...
Core how did you manage to stretch the game that long? When I played it was only 90 minutes long and the youtube live stream was 90 minutes as well. The episode was way too short, shorter than the first one.
I can't for the life of me figure out exactly what it is you wanted to see. Could you maybe elaborate a little? Because as far as the Walking Dead goes, Clem was safe the last time we saw her, though granted the two mysterious figures does put up a question mark but that's a hook for season two...nothing wrong with that.
Personally, for a finale I would of liked a sense of closure and resolve. It's bad enough knowing that after all of Lee's efforts he failed misserably but to not see his wish fulfilled, for Clementine to be reunited with Christa sucks big time. How did he fail? You might ask. Lee's primary objective when he seperated from Christa and Omid was to get Clementine back and reunite her with Christa before he died. He died not knowing if this was ever accomplished. We don't even know if this was accomplished. In fact it was not accomplished. It may happen in season 2 but until then Clementine's fate is in limbo. That is not rewarding for the delays we had endured between playing these episodes. Telltale are practically flippin us the bird. Even in the interviews their laughing and relishing the fact that they have pulled the rug from under neath us which is clearly how they get their kicks.
Lee did not get Clementine out of the city she saved her self, she escaped the zombie horde on her own and was probably at more risk when she left Lee than she was before he found her in the hotel when you consider she had to get through a zombie herd. As the gamer I didn't feel like I saved her. The phrase out of the frying pan into the fire comes to mind. It was like Moses taking the Hebrews out of Egypt only to loose some of them in the wilderness. (in some cases,depending how you play it's actually Clementine that saves you since she shoots the kidnapper if you reliquish your weapon and some how manages to drag you away from the zombie horde when you pass out)I wanted to be the hero that Clementine could depend on and deliver her to the safety of Christa like an athlete passing on a torch or baton, not for this little girl to have to shoot me in the face and get through a zombie herd by herself. Even if she is alive her mental state would be fucked. Rick Grimes endured less in quick successions and we all saw him break down talking on an unplugged phone, then there's Michonne who talks to her dead boyfriend. It would be unrealistic for her to be normal after this. Sophia was about her age and she ended up repressing memories of her mum's death, calling Glen and Maggie mum and dad she was hardly normal after what she had seen.
What I wanted to see would have been a lengthy video sequence, maybe even flash backs whilst seeing Clementine leaving the city, seeing her run to Christa cuddling her whilst crying and telling her how Lee saved her from the man in the hotel/tried to save her from the man in the hotel and Christa reassuring her she would be o.k and telling her Lee wanted her to look after her, but ultimatley I would have wanted to see them on the train leaving Savannah. That still would have been a walking dead ending. In fact it would have been more bleak and depressing than any of the comics considering that Rick Grimes, the comics protagonist still lives and the games protagonist does not.
As far as the "hook for season 2" goes that is a risky way to go since there is no guarantee that season 2 will see the light of day. I say this because if history has taught anything we can never take anything for granted. You should always give the gamers closure at the end of a game because no one knows the future. Shenmue 2 was an awesome game that had the worst cliff hanger and they canned the sequel so we will never know what became of Ryo Hazuki. Dungeons and dragons was one of the best cartoons in the 80's and it got cancelled before the final episode, so the kids in that cartoon never ever made it home but stayed stuck in the other realm. My name is earl and the Reaper are another two shows that were cancelled before giving the viewers any closure. They all finished with cliff hangers and there was no ressolve.
it risky for Telltale to end the season with such a ambiguous cliff hanger since there is no guarantee that season 2 will see the light of day it is also a finger up to all of us that have waited to see this story completed. I think that this level of ambiguity is o.k for a novel or tv show/movie but not for a video game where you invest more of your time and effort.
How was the ending perfect when Lee failed? Clementine survived but Lee doesn't know that because he wasn't responsible for getting her to safety. He didn't reunite her with Omid and Christa which was his only goal by the end of the game. Where is his redemption? He goes to the grave not knowing if Clementine made it out of the city. Come to think of we don't even know how safe she is when we see her last and won't know for a very long time. So there is no real sense of ressolve. If the season was tied up and conclusive the ending would have been good and rewarding.
Nah dude, that would have been too much unicorns and rainbows for the hipsters to bear. Better let Lee die like an idiot. Grimdark awesomesauce ending, truly worthy of a zombie apocalypse.
My question about Radioman is this, why did he feel the need to stalk Lee? I get the fact that he blamed Lee for losing his family and he feels guilty but, to go that far? And how did he not get attacked himself by zombies when he was stalking Lee? Why didn't he rescue Lily if she was left out at the road side?
He centers on Lee because he connects with him as a father. He lost his own kids and now sees a man who, in his eyes, is making all the wrong decisions for another child. He thought he could be a better father for Clementine than Lee was, and that she could be a replacement daughter for him. If Duck had answered the radio, he probably would have fixated on Kenny.
Sorry dude. I don't buy that. He centers on Lee because Lee is the character you control. I didn't steal the food so most of the crap he was saying was aimed at Kenny and his wife. The only thing he could criticize me for was taking Clementine to Crawford,leaving Lilly on the road and choosing to save Carly and I find it hard to believe that Clementine would not have put things in context when telling him on the radio the things I had done based on the way she saw my version of Lee. She approved of all my actions from episode 1-4 other than my decission about it being to dangerous to look for her parents.
Telltale just used a default dialogue for the kidnapper so you got the same judgment no matter what you did. I didn't kill anyone because Clementine was present but both the kidnapper and Vernon had default dialogue that condemned me and accused me of being a bad carer. Laziness on Telltale's part. They probably expected most of us to make selfish decissions like looting food and expected us to be revenge seekers and kill people infront of Clementine. I didn't but I might aswell have since the outcome was the same. Apparently i'm not fit to care for Clementine because i'm not a fucking octopus with the ability to save both Doug and Carly at the same time and because I chose not to let a dangerous woman travel in the RV with me and Clementine.
The stranger on the radio plot was tacked and fucked up the game. Telltale caused more questions than answers with that one. For instanace how the fuck was he able to get from Macon to Savannah before Lee when Lee was on a train and the guy ran out of gas. Even if he got more would the roads really have been clear enough and safe enough for him to travel that way not to mention that Clementine could not have told him she was going there until she knew and that wasn't confirmed until after they were on their way when Lee was cutting her hair and he showed her the map. It was not confirmed enough before for him to have started his journey ahead of them. Only a week had past from when they looted the food and got the batteries for the radio to when they arrived at Savannah. During that week he lost his family and made contact with Clementine.
My question about Radioman is this, why did he feel the need to stalk Lee? I get the fact that he blamed Lee for losing his family and he feels guilty but, to go that far? And how did he not get attacked himself by zombies when he was stalking Lee? Why didn't he rescue Lily if she was left out at the road side?
Because none of that is meant to matter. He's a plot device to force Lee to question his motivations throughout the story. The problem is that plot devices are meant to be subtle and not obvious that they are contrivance. Unfortunately he doesn't really work once you start asking questions about Radioman/The Stranger's motivations and location at any given point.
Also, sadly, it would seem that TTG's only defence is the "he's crazy so it doesn't need to make sense" defence. Which is kind of weak. I wish they had put a bit more thought into that part of the narrative.
I don't like how choices really don't matter. Why does cutting Lee's arm off not work? In the TV show it worked with cutting off Hershal's leg. It made it pointless to cut off his arm,.
I don't like how choices really don't matter. Why does cutting Lee's arm off not work? In the TV show it worked with cutting off Hershal's leg. It made it pointless to cut off his arm,.
to much time had passed b4 u cut it, hints the name no time left
to much time had passed b4 u cut it, hints the name no time left
None of which negates the complaint that cutting Lee's arm off had no impact on the story.
If anything, it makes the decision even less relevant and raises the question of why bother having the option there at all if it wasn't going to mean anything to the story?
...you defeated the villain, you saved someone by sacrificing yourself, you finished your story. By YOUR own criteria, you've accomplished a lot.
I DON'T think you need to accomplish something by the end of a game for it to be a good game, but I disagree that you haven't accomplished anything by the end of this one.
Lee still died believing that he failed. He died not knowing if Clementine found Christa or not. How the hell can he rest in peace? His core object was to reunite Clementine with Christa so he could die knowing she was in safe hands, he failed to accomplish this. Do you remember what he told Clementine when he left her house in episode 1? He told her that he wouldn't her leave alone, meaning she wouldn't be by herself. Not being able to keep his promise would have made him feel like he had failed in those dying moments. He left her alone and afraid. It's only by chance that she happened to see Omid and Christa, in the distance if that is them in the first place. We don't know for sure. They could be zombie versions of Omid and Christa. regardless Lee did not finish his mission. He helped her defeat the reanimated guard and said his goodbyes knowing that she was going out into an over run city. From his point view her chances of finding Omid and Christa were pretty slim, he didn't even know if they had made it to the train. Like Lee we didn't find true ressolve in the sense that neither Lee or the gamer saw her safely reunited with Christa and Omid. That is poor for Lee and poor for a season finale.
Because none of that is meant to matter. He's a plot device to force Lee to question his motivations throughout the story. The problem is that plot devices are meant to be subtle and not obvious that they are contrivance. Unfortunately he doesn't really work once you start asking questions about Radioman/The Stranger's motivations and location at any given point.
Also, sadly, it would seem that TTG's only defence is the "he's crazy so it doesn't need to make sense" defence. Which is kind of weak. I wish they had put a bit more thought into that part of the narrative.
I get that but like you said, once he plays out; his motives for following Lee don't make that much sense. That guy must have been one heckuva tracker to follow Lee and crew.
For the journey, not the ending. Some of the greatest stories ever told have tragic, hopeless endings. Should Romeo and Juliet have lived happily ever after? Should Gatsby have won the love of his life? This was a hopeless story from the very beginning (if you didn't think so, you've never read or watched The Walking Dead) and the fact that Lee managed to find any redemption by the end is an accomplishment.
It's not a game you win.
But Romeo and Juliet was conclusive. You knew the fate of the characters by the end of the book. There was no ambiguity. You knew they were dead and why. Therefore the ending of Romeo Juliet is more fulfilling than the ending of the no time left episode, also when you read Romeo and Juliet you weren't given choices for what the characters did. I don't think a book is comparable to a game considering you invest both effort and time playing a game you only invest time in reading a book unless the person is mentally challanged in which case Romeo and Juliet isn't the book for them.
As far as Lee getting redemption i'm not sure that I agree he did. He died unable to keep his promise of not leaving Clementine alone which he made when he left her house and he didn't successfully reunite her with Christa which was his goal when he left Christa to find her. He died not knowing her fate. It's not just a tragic end for Lee it's a failing one. He couldn't continue to keep Clementine safe so she saved herself from the city's horde, escaping to the city's outskirts on her own. Lee did not play as big a part in her escape as he should have. He only got her half way. She did the rest and would have had to go through far more zombies than the one he helped her defeat before he died.
I wouldn't exclude lee and Clem surviving together as long as there's hope; that's just the way it went down. I was sure left with the sensation of no answers or lack of some closure so to speak; not knowing what happens to clem. i would really want to know.
I have to say, after hearing that the tentative release time for ep. 5 would be in December, I was worried that it might feel rushed with a November date. My fears were right, obviously. If you thought Lee had any chance of surviving, you're delusional at best. What kills me is that the ending felt so terribly rushed. There was no real epilogue - and a dialogue-less scene with two unidentified characters doesn't count, either.
What's the point of saving Ben in episode 4 if he inevitably dies in 5? I was waiting for him to redeem himself ("I just want to help") and I had such strong confidence invested in him only for him to be snuffed out like a nobody. Towards the end I expected Kenny and Ben (or at least Kenny) to show up, Kenny having had pulled a Daryl and using his last round to make a walker "blanket" to spare his and Ben's life.
Why include the option to amputate Lee's arm if it ultimately changes nothing? I went through with the arm chop, though disturbing, I felt it necessary to do so to see my final mission through. I'm surprised that Lilly and a few other characters didn't make a final appearance, as well.
Campman was a pretty big disappointment as well. While his introduction teaches an extremely valuable lesson about "even the small things can come back around", he just didn't have a convincing leg to stand on in terms of being a believable antagonist. I honestly wasn't expecting a character of such irrelevance to be the "man behind the mask". All in all, great series, but it's very obvious the final episode had less of a cooking time than the other four. The synergy and emotional connections of the previous episodes were more or less nonexistent. Very disappointing.
RIP Lee Everett.
That's just it I didn't feel that "Campman"teaches an extremely valuable lesson about how even the small things can come back around because I didn't do anything that should have had negitive repercussions, since I was aware that Clementine was always watching. I made a point not do kill anyone but let others do the killing. I wanted Ben dead but chose not to kill him because I knew Kenny would expose me and tell Clementine. I wanted to kill the st John brothers but knew that they were in no position to escape the farm and they were going to be eaten by zombies. I didn't take the food because Clementine didn't want us to and I didn't agree to kill Larry because Clementine was watching, the same way Rick didn't want to kill Randall in front of Carl in the show. The only thing "Campman" could accuse me of was choosing to save Carly instead of Doug which was a lame reason to conclude he was a better role model and carer for Clementine than me. Really I was being punished for what the others in the group had done, he commented on Kenny and Kat when he was saying he needed to rescue Clementine from us, yet he was adamant that I needed to be punished. What he was saying didn't fit with how I had been playing the game. I first noticed this in episode 4 when Vernon switched on me. I didn't overtly lie about having medical supplies or threaten him, I reasoned with him, referring to Clementine as being my daughter. I didn't say she was my biological daughter. So I didn't lie. Even Bree approved of me and spoke cival because I didn't lie or threaten Vernon. He was fine at the end of the game and then there was some screen glitching and his mannerism completely changed towards me and he started accusing me of being a bad carer and said Clementine wasn't my daughter even though no one confirmed that to him from the group.
to much time had passed b4 u cut it, hints the name no time left
Seriously, this is bullshit. You have absolutely no clue about the infection, how it spreads, whnether it's a virus, bacteria or space magic. All you know is that people only turn if they die from whatever causes that don't damage the brain/head or when they get bitten.
Don't run around telling people that it's unrealistic if you cut a bitten person's arm off and they survive, when the setting is a zombie apocalypse where dead people magically reanimate and try to eat the living. It might come across a little bit ridiculous, you know?
Cut Lee's arm off -> Lee survives.
Don't cut his arm off -> Lee turns.
Making him turn regardless of what you do renders your choice useless and this is nothing but lazy writing, especially since you had absolutely no control about the way he got bitten. I was 100% sure there is going to be a walker near the walkie talkie and I would had grabbed the shovel or a stick, or simply approached the trash bin from the side where I can see what's there, but the game didn't let me. This is just lame. They sacrificed Lee in order to make the story as emotional as possible and as far as I can see they succeeded in making you guys cry rivers. While the story wasn't bad for a movie or a comic, it was terrible for a video game where your experience is supposed to be tailored by how you play. It simply wasn't at all and I was very disappointed that they didn't manage to make choices truly matter, not even in the final episode! I find the ending lacking. It's just lame and lazy.
Personally, I didn't like the plot from episode 3 onwards when they killed Carley no matter what you did, but I could live with it. However, killing Lee in a cutscene and give the players absolutely no choice to get the ending they wanted, the ending that is truly tailored to their gameplay, well that's just lazy and lame. Dunno why you folks play video games but I play them because they're interactive. If I just want somebody to tell me a story where I my decisions have absolutely ZERO impact on I'll go read a book or watch a movie.
What disappointed me was that all the decisions made throughout the game and even in episode 5 really amounted to nothing. It was all smoke and mirrors.
I'm cool with Lee dying, it felt an appropriate close to the story after all. But I didn't like finding out that the same characters die at the same point in episode 5 regardless of who went with you or what decisions you made.
That just made the emotional impact of their deaths feel cheap. What's the point getting upset about Ben's death if there was no way that he could have survived? It would have been better if it turned out that not bringing Kenny or Omid along for the final part of the game meant that Ben survived the fall. Or if Ben died, Kenny manages to escape...
I had hoped that the conversation on the hospital roof had been more relevant with Lee being able to pick in the end who Clem would end up escaping with.
Ultimately, I don't think having the same ending and epilogue regardless of your choices was a good idea. It negated the whole point and showed a failure to understand what it was about The Walking Dead that made it such an appealing game to a lot of people. Yes, the story was a good one. But this is a game too and as such the medium means stories can be told in ways that you can't do with film or television.
Good storytelling isn't just about the journey. If a story has a weak ending, that is what the audience takes away with them. The feelings that the ending left them with. I loved so much of the game, but learning that my choices didn't have any real impact on the epilogue... That there was no way to save Kenny or Ben by making different choices... That changed this from Game of the Year to just another good game for me.
It also makes it less appealing to bother playing through the game again to see how things change because I know it all turns out the same in the end.
Bioware made the same mistake on a much larger scale with Mass Effect (with the added insult of a terribly written ending, at least TWD had a good ending that fitted the story.)
So yeah. I was keen to rewind my episode to see what I could do differently, but seeing that it doesn't have any meaningful impact on events has meant I'm really not bothered with playing it again. Doesn't seem worth it right now. And I don't think that is how I should be feeling after a game that claimed to tailor the story around my choices.
I agree 100% Telltale blatently lied. The game was good any way they didn't need to lie to sell the game. The TV show will sell this game and fans of the comic will buy this game. Telltale stated quite clearly that your going to have a complete different set of characters by the end of the game based on your choices from someone else's play through. That is a an out right lie. There is no way to have anyone other than Omid and Christa survive episode 5 assuming the silhouettes we see are of them in the first place. The game was good but would have been great if the survivors we had at the end of the game varied based on what we did as originally stated when episode 1 debuted.
I can't believe that people are upset with the ending. The greatest thing about this game is that you are placed in a world that keeps you on your toes pretty much at all times to add a sense of realism to the experience. It would diminish that feeling if you knew that you were invincible. Too many games, books, and movies these days have a happy ending, and it's nice to have some variety at times.
Great work Telltale! I'm looking forward to whatever's in store for Clementine in the next season.
What questions are there? Any questions that I can think of would be explained at the start of the next season.
Rick Grimes isn't invincible but he's alive after 103 issues he's had his hand cut off and been shot at least twice. Expecting Lee to last 5 episodes is not unrealistic. Lee survived the zombie apacolypse for only 13 weeks. Rick has been surviving the zombie apacolypse for over a year as has his 9 year old son Carl.
I was upset at the way kenny decided to kill himself. I understand that he had probably given up after ben had died.
But that speech he made in the house about not ending it because its hard you have to carry on to help those you care about... WELL I THOUGHT HE CARED ABOUT CLEM. so why wouldn't he do EVERYTHING he could to get our little girl back, and THEN decide to end it. It just frustrates me because now kenny will never know if we got clementine back or not.
Y'all need to stop immediately looking for all the reasons to hate the game. I've been over this before so I'll do it one more time, and then you guys can pretend like it isn't true to feel better about feeling worse about episode 5.
You never got to change the story with your choices, and that was never advertised, not even once. You got to tailor your experience to your decisions, which is what happens all throughout the series. I wish there had been a little more going on under the hood but they made most of the flavor dialog feel genuine and I rarely felt like I was totally without impact to the story. The only reason some of you feel that now is because you either came in with the misconception that it was a choose your own adventure book or you tried to replay the game and ruined the mechanics for yourself. It isn't a game about re-playability, it's an adventure game where you make the best decisions you can and you still get screwed in your very own personalized way.
I think the vague ending was the best possible ending but that's just my taste for the grimdark speaking. The best and only possible ending involves Clementine being alone and scared, knowing everyone she ever loved is dead, more afraid of humans than walkers. That's The Walking Dead for me, and that's what makes it great. I think it would have been a terrible cop-out to give you any kind of closure or a happy ending, and I'm super happy they left it as bleak as they did.
That said, there were definitely some parts of the game that felt contrived. Saw off your own arm without meds and just walk it off? Talk through a crowd of zombies like Conan the Barbarian? Immediately regrouped with your party even though you chose to go alone? Meh. Weak writing, but it didn't ruin it for me like 4's writing ruined it for me. I'm happy with what we got either way.
Excuse me! In the walking dead Rick has had just as much victories as he has had tradgeides if not more. Is it unrealistic when he gets a happy ending to an issue or a story arc? When he finds the prison that was a victory since it offered shelter and hope, even if temporary. What about when Rick arrived at Hershel's farm and later saw his son recover, or when he found the Wilshire estate and had shelter for the night,or when he arrived at the camp out side Atlanta to find his wife and son safe, or when he found Gleen and Maggie on horseback when he thought all hope was lost and they took him back to Hershel's farm where he saw Andrea, sophia, Billy, Ben and Dale still alive,or when he arrived at the Alexandria safe zone on the road to washington. Now lets look at the key tradgedy moments; When the Wilshire estate was overrun, When the zombies got loose from Hershel's barn, When he arrived at Woodbury, when The governor attacked the prison, when the Alexandria gated community was over run and more recently when he went up against Negan. These key tragic events are over the course of over a year in Rick's world. Alot of the victories and hope inspiring moments have come at the end of the issues and comic story arcs so they were happy endings even if they were temporary. The walking dead is not all doom and gloom. There is balance, moments where the group even let their guard down because things were so comfortable, times where Rick has encouraged Carl to live like a child and go trick or treating like when he was in the Alaxandria safe zone.
As for our so called misconceptions, telltale clearly stated that we could have a complete different set of survivors by the end of our game from someone else. Just watch the early playing dead videos. I'm sure you can still find them on youtube. I'm going to have the same survivors at the end of my game as you no matter what I do, that is not how the game was promoted, publicised or advertised. I would have bought the game any way because i'm a fan of the comics and the show but I was only expecting what Telltale said this game would do and how different from other games it would be because of player choices. Heavy Rain did not have as much an emphasis in the commercials and publicity about choices and that game actually has replay value since there is countless ways the game can unfold and end. Even in the latest playing dead episode Gary Whitta makes a point how episode 5 has 8 branches which the player can experience and how large the scripts were as a result of this, yet I found episode 5 to be the shortest of the 5 episodes and less conversation heavy than previous episodes.
Plus Rick's just been exceptionally lucky (if you can call it that). Kirkman's never hidden the fact that he's very likely to kill Rick off at some point, and would probably keep the series going past him.
No it's because Kirkman wrote the comics better than Telltale wrote the game. Rick's ability to survive is not purely luck, he has learned to survive in this world. Nothing he does seems out of place or wreckless. He's careful and he's learned from previous experiences. If Rick or any of the original Atlanta camp survivors were to be killed it wouldn't be a cheap kill by a lone zombie it will be at the hand of a human or the result of a herd overruning their area. With all the experience Lee had after 13 weeks of surviving this world he was caught of guard when wrestling a single walker. He was able to over come and get away from the reanimated Mr Parker when he was lying on his back (episode 2 on the truck)and the zombie was on top of him and he had less leverage but he couldn't overcome the zombie when he was standing up, why? Because Telltale wrote it that way.
I had no problem with key characters dying in the game it's the way they died. I think Lee should have been bitten when he was in the midst of the horde when he was fighting to get to the Marsh house. I think Carly should have died struggling with Lily for the gun as opposed to Lily shooting her point blank for calling her a bitch. I think Katjaa should have died by Duck reanimating and biting her when she was saying her goodbyes, she could have been cuddling him at the time. Kenny's death was one of the least realistic. He only has 1 bullet, he shoots 1 of the 10 or so zombies approaching him and tries to fight the rest by punching them when he had plenty of time to run up the ladder with Lee, again, he could have died in the zombie horde on the way to the Marsh house.
How dilusional must one be to accept Lee's death scene as being feasible. Lets put this in context. He has collapsed in the midst of a zombie herd and weighs at least 154 ibs (11 stone if your British) yet Clementine is able to drag him into a shop/building without attracting attention from the countless zombies and she is not persued. In such a situation sudden movements would be enough to alert the walkers to the fact you are not one of them. What would have been more believable would have been if he escorted her to the safe zone then collapsed like the man did in the movie called "The Road" and she pointed out that the train was right there, cried and then shot Lee with Christa and Omid running towards her and crying over Lee's body, taking his body with them to give him a burial. Arriving by train to a building/house in a secluded area, having a burial and saying their final words. That ending would have also been true to the walking dead.
Yes i'm not debating the fact we saw it coming (lee dying) i'm saying it's shit that you play a whole game only to end up dying no matter what you do. And what "option"? He dies whether you cut it off or not... WTF is the point. All that for stupid clem...
Are you for real??? It's called a story for reason, not written by you. As I said before, you want a different ending...write your damn story:eek::eek:
No it's because Kirkman wrote the comics better than Telltale wrote the game. Rick's ability to survive is not purely luck, he has learned to survive in this world. Nothing he does seems out of place or wreckless. He's careful and he's learned from previous experiences. If Rick or any of the original Atlanta camp survivors were to be killed it wouldn't be a cheap kill by a lone zombie it will be at the hand of a human or the result of a herd overruning their area. With all the experience Lee had after 13 weeks of surviving this world he was caught of guard when wrestling a single walker. He was able to over come and get away from the reanimated Mr Parker when he was lying on his back (episode 2 on the truck)and the zombie was on top of him and he had less leverage but he couldn't overcome the zombie when he was standing up, why? Because Telltale wrote it that way.
I had no problem with key characters dying in the game it's the way they died. I think Lee should have been bitten when he was in the midst of the horde when he was fighting to get to the Marsh house. I think Carly should have died struggling with Lily for the gun as opposed to Lily shooting her point blank for calling her a bitch. I think Katjaa should have died by Duck reanimating and biting her when she was saying her goodbyes, she could have been cuddling him at the time. Kenny's death was one of the least realistic. He only has 1 bullet, he shoots 1 of the 10 or so zombies approaching him and tries to fight the rest by punching them when he had plenty of time to run up the ladder with Lee, again, he could have died in the zombie horde on the way to the Marsh house.
How dilusional must one be to accept Lee's death scene as being acceptable. Lets put this in context. He has collapsed in the midst of a zombie herd and weighs at least 154 ibs (11 stone if your British) yet Clementine is able to drag him into a shop/building without attracting attention from the countless zombies and she is not persued. In such a situation sudden movements would be enough to alert the walkers to the fact you are not one of them. What would have been more believable would have been if he escorted her to the safe zone then collapsed like the man did in the movie called "The Road" and she pointed out that the train was right there, cried and then shot Lee with Christa and Omid running towards her and crying over Lee's body, taking his body with them to give him a burial. Arriving by train to a building in a secluded area, having a burial and saying their final words. That ending would have also been true to the walking dead.
OMG are you asking for a different ending?? LOL.....too hilariuous....deal with it
Are you for real??? It's called a story for reason, not written by you. As I said before, you want a different ending...write your damn story:eek::eek:
It's called a GAME because it's INTERACTIVE. If you want just a good story, read a book or watch a film.
Seriously. Why do some people have a problem with the idea that you can have a good story AND have it be interactive and branching based on player decisions?
The sales pitch for this game was that the story was going to be shaped by the collaboration between TTG and the people playing it through the decisions that the players made.
That was the promise. That was what was constantly mentioned in interviews (along with statements that TTG was paying attention to the choices being made and altering the game based on forum feedback and those choices) and what, ultimately, was not delivered.
None of which negates the complaint that cutting Lee's arm off had no impact on the story.
If anything, it makes the decision even less relevant and raises the question of why bother having the option there at all if it wasn't going to mean anything to the story?
That is the point dude...too late do do anything about it, deal with it
the biggest disappointment I have is that the episode was way to short and didn't seem to have alot of substance. it was like looking forward to Thanksgiving dinner for a month and finding out when you got there it was vegen., or opening presents on Christmas day and findind socks and underwear.
Excellent! I love the analogy. It sums up my thoughts exactly.
That is the point dude...too late do do anything about it, deal with it
Really? That's the best you can come up with?
I'm arguing from the point of narrative - not "real life."
From the point of narrative, why bother having Lee cut off his arm. If it isn't doing anything to change the way the story plays out, what's the point? Decisions characters make in a story are meant to serve some purpose to the plot.
Cutting off his arm *should* have meant that someone else had to go to the bell tower and risk their life. It *should* have meant crossing the sign was near impossible and another route needed to be found.
It should not have meant absolutely nothing to events and actions that Lee faced after that decision.
As such - if cutting off his arm has zero narrative impact beyond a few cripple jokes, why bother having the option at all? It just makes the whole exercise pointless in a rather unsatisfying way.
IF it had meant that there would be a scene all about how he's turning anyway and how hard he had tried to live... then maybe. But the game really just goes "Lee cuts off his arm and that's all."
Comments
Did ep3,4,5 take place in like 4 days???
Would have been better if it was over a longer period of time, (Lee and Clem getting even closer, him becoming a dad to her etc), No silly radioguy holding a grudge oh and did I say this already MORE LARRY!
^^^^
This.
Cole Magrath dies in Infamous. I didn't have a problem with it because through his death he saved humanity and died knowing this. The same for Nariko in Heavenly sword where she died knowing she saved her people. After everything, Lee just dies. Yeah he saved Clementine from the kidnapper who was clearly crazy but he didn't finish his mission objective of getting her to safety and depending on how you played the game you may not even save her from the guy in the hotel, in those cases she saves you from him. The ending could and should have been so much more.
I hope season 2's ending will be rewarding even if it means waiting till 2014 to play it.
The walking dead comics are shown through Rick's eyes. We don't see the zombie apocalypse until Rick wakes up from the coma. Likewise the game shows the apocalypse through Lee's eyes. He was the protagonist. Clementine is to Lee what Carl is to Rick. I don't think it would be any less realistic for Lee and Clementine to survive 9 episodes (season 2 is meant to be 4 episodes long) than it is for Rick and Carl to survive the 300 episodes that Kirkman has planned for the walking dead comic series, considering that 100 issues equates to only just over a year in Rick Grimes's time in this zombie apocalyptic world.
I would have preferred a more conclusive ending. It still wouldn't be a happy ending because Lee died but it would have been a conclusive one if we saw Clementine reunited with Christa and Omid and board the train, explainning how Lee died after saving her life.
The stranger explained that a week before the events of episode 5 he was normal and had a family, yet during that week he just so happened to have a similar radio to Clementine and manage to connect to her frequency a week later and plan to stalk Lee's group for revenge and to rescue Clementine because of all the things Clementine told him Lee had done in the game. Here's the kicker in my play through Clementine never saw me do anything bad. I didn't kill anyone in front of her. The only thing the stranger could use to support his case about me not being a good man was that I saved Carly instead of Doug. He didn't even know Doug so that shouldn't of been enough to make him see me as a monster and want to punish me. It made me feel like all the good decision's I made were for nothing because Clementine tells the stranger everything iv'e done and he views it as negative and wants to punish me for it regardless.
I would of preferred if I was able to follow the choice I made in episode 3 to look for her parents. Most of episode 4 was about getting supplies for the boat which ends up getting stolen in episode 5 anyway, again making me feel what was the point to that episode. It was fun to play but an episode filler nonetheless. Episode 3 gave you the choice to plan what you would make a priority when arriving at Savannah; a boat or looking for Clementine's parents. I chose to look for her parents but was made to focus on looking for a boat instead when episode 4 began. The game was fun but it gives the illusion of choice unlike in Heavy Rain where your actions actually make a difference to the games ending and determine who lives and who dies. I preferred the first 3 episodes.
The focus should have stayed on searching for Clementine's parents and finding a safe haven. When the stranger sat me down and explainned why he was punishing me he didn't have anything on me. Clementine had told him everything I had done whilst being with her from episode 1-5. The stranger should have seen me as a saint based on my choices. I didn't steal his food from the car, I didn't kill any of the st john brothers. I didn't help Kenny kill Larry. All he had to criticize me for was the fact that I took Clementine to Crawford, I left Lilly on the road and I saved Carly over Doug. He claimed I saved her because she was pretty and a had a gun. I know that was Telltale speaking to us through him at that point. But that's just it, I didn't save her purely for those reasons. I saved her because I bonded more with her in episode 1 than I did with Doug. Had the choice of been between Kenny and Carly, she still would have been pretty and still would have had a gun, yet I would have bonded more with Kenny since Lee had spent a whole day with him by then. In that case I would have chosen Kenny over Carly. Telltale gave Carly far more script lines, and scenes than Doug. She was involved in all the major arguments and decissions once Lee met that group. Saving her was a no brainner. Then Telltale punish us for choosing the character that they had fleshed out more so the kidnapper uses that as a reason for punishing Lee. Ridiculous. That was Telltale's feable attempt to make it seem like choices matter and there are consequences for our actions.
The guy even said that he wanted to punish the peole that was with Lee, refering to Kenny and his wife, blaming them for the death of his wife and son due to them looting his food, yet he wants to kill Lee because of things he felt he had done to people he didn't even know or care about.
By the end I felt that there was no reward for the way I played the game. I could have been an arse hole, treated Clementine like shit, killed everone for the fun of it and still got the same ending. Ben will still die in the alley way if he was in ep 5, Kenny will still die in the alley if ben was not in ep 5. Lee will still die in the locked room at Clementine's hand and she will still leave the city by herself and see 2 figures in the distance. I don't see why Telltale coudn't have had multiple endings considering this episode was much shorter than all of the others. I had all the group members with me expecting to get the longest game because there was more characters to talk to, yet the game finished in 1 and half hours. I was hoping that the episode would have been the longest. In comics milestone issues like TWD 100 are often double sized additions. I expected the episode to be longer than episode 1 at least. I found episode 5's ending under whelming. Considering we will have to wait a very long time before season 2 comes out I would have wanted the episode to end with some ressolve, at least to see Clementine board the train with Christa and Omid and a longer video seqence. The Tekken games have longer video seqences when you complete them.
At least in the Uncharted games each one is wrapped up and concluded. Even in the walking dead tv show the seasons end conclusively with a sense of ressolve showing the survivors escape their immediate danger and regroup on the road.
As far as i'm concerned not only is it risky for Telltale to end the season with such a ambiguous cliff hanger since there is no guarantee that season 2 will see the light of day it is also a finger up to all of us that have waited to see this story completed. I think that this level of ambiguity is o.k for a novel or tv show/movie but not for a video game where you invest more of your time and effort.
Lee did not get Clementine out of the city she saved her self, she escaped the zombie horde on her own and was probably at more risk when she left Lee than she was before he found her in the hotel when you consider she had to get through a zombie herd. As the gamer I didn't feel like I saved her. The phrase out of the frying pan into the fire comes to mind. It was like Moses taking the Hebrews out of Egypt only to loose some of them in the wilderness. (in some cases,depending how you play it's actually Clementine that saves you since she shoots the kidnapper if you reliquish your weapon and some how manages to drag you away from the zombie horde when you pass out)I wanted to be the hero that Clementine could depend on and deliver her to the safety of Christa like an athlete passing on a torch or baton, not for this little girl to have to shoot me in the face and get through a zombie herd by herself. Even if she is alive her mental state would be fucked. Rick Grimes endured less in quick successions and we all saw him break down talking on an unplugged phone, then there's Michonne who talks to her dead boyfriend. It would be unrealistic for her to be normal after this. Sophia was about her age and she ended up repressing memories of her mum's death, calling Glen and Maggie mum and dad she was hardly normal after what she had seen.
What I wanted to see would have been a lengthy video sequence, maybe even flash backs whilst seeing Clementine leaving the city, seeing her run to Christa cuddling her whilst crying and telling her how Lee saved her from the man in the hotel/tried to save her from the man in the hotel and Christa reassuring her she would be o.k and telling her Lee wanted her to look after her, but ultimatley I would have wanted to see them on the train leaving Savannah. That still would have been a walking dead ending. In fact it would have been more bleak and depressing than any of the comics considering that Rick Grimes, the comics protagonist still lives and the games protagonist does not.
As far as the "hook for season 2" goes that is a risky way to go since there is no guarantee that season 2 will see the light of day. I say this because if history has taught anything we can never take anything for granted. You should always give the gamers closure at the end of a game because no one knows the future. Shenmue 2 was an awesome game that had the worst cliff hanger and they canned the sequel so we will never know what became of Ryo Hazuki. Dungeons and dragons was one of the best cartoons in the 80's and it got cancelled before the final episode, so the kids in that cartoon never ever made it home but stayed stuck in the other realm. My name is earl and the Reaper are another two shows that were cancelled before giving the viewers any closure. They all finished with cliff hangers and there was no ressolve.
it risky for Telltale to end the season with such a ambiguous cliff hanger since there is no guarantee that season 2 will see the light of day it is also a finger up to all of us that have waited to see this story completed. I think that this level of ambiguity is o.k for a novel or tv show/movie but not for a video game where you invest more of your time and effort.
Nah dude, that would have been too much unicorns and rainbows for the hipsters to bear. Better let Lee die like an idiot. Grimdark awesomesauce ending, truly worthy of a zombie apocalypse.
Telltale just used a default dialogue for the kidnapper so you got the same judgment no matter what you did. I didn't kill anyone because Clementine was present but both the kidnapper and Vernon had default dialogue that condemned me and accused me of being a bad carer. Laziness on Telltale's part. They probably expected most of us to make selfish decissions like looting food and expected us to be revenge seekers and kill people infront of Clementine. I didn't but I might aswell have since the outcome was the same. Apparently i'm not fit to care for Clementine because i'm not a fucking octopus with the ability to save both Doug and Carly at the same time and because I chose not to let a dangerous woman travel in the RV with me and Clementine.
The stranger on the radio plot was tacked and fucked up the game. Telltale caused more questions than answers with that one. For instanace how the fuck was he able to get from Macon to Savannah before Lee when Lee was on a train and the guy ran out of gas. Even if he got more would the roads really have been clear enough and safe enough for him to travel that way not to mention that Clementine could not have told him she was going there until she knew and that wasn't confirmed until after they were on their way when Lee was cutting her hair and he showed her the map. It was not confirmed enough before for him to have started his journey ahead of them. Only a week had past from when they looted the food and got the batteries for the radio to when they arrived at Savannah. During that week he lost his family and made contact with Clementine.
Because none of that is meant to matter. He's a plot device to force Lee to question his motivations throughout the story. The problem is that plot devices are meant to be subtle and not obvious that they are contrivance. Unfortunately he doesn't really work once you start asking questions about Radioman/The Stranger's motivations and location at any given point.
Also, sadly, it would seem that TTG's only defence is the "he's crazy so it doesn't need to make sense" defence. Which is kind of weak. I wish they had put a bit more thought into that part of the narrative.
to much time had passed b4 u cut it, hints the name no time left
None of which negates the complaint that cutting Lee's arm off had no impact on the story.
If anything, it makes the decision even less relevant and raises the question of why bother having the option there at all if it wasn't going to mean anything to the story?
I get that but like you said, once he plays out; his motives for following Lee don't make that much sense. That guy must have been one heckuva tracker to follow Lee and crew.
As far as Lee getting redemption i'm not sure that I agree he did. He died unable to keep his promise of not leaving Clementine alone which he made when he left her house and he didn't successfully reunite her with Christa which was his goal when he left Christa to find her. He died not knowing her fate. It's not just a tragic end for Lee it's a failing one. He couldn't continue to keep Clementine safe so she saved herself from the city's horde, escaping to the city's outskirts on her own. Lee did not play as big a part in her escape as he should have. He only got her half way. She did the rest and would have had to go through far more zombies than the one he helped her defeat before he died.
Seriously, this is bullshit. You have absolutely no clue about the infection, how it spreads, whnether it's a virus, bacteria or space magic. All you know is that people only turn if they die from whatever causes that don't damage the brain/head or when they get bitten.
Don't run around telling people that it's unrealistic if you cut a bitten person's arm off and they survive, when the setting is a zombie apocalypse where dead people magically reanimate and try to eat the living. It might come across a little bit ridiculous, you know?
Cut Lee's arm off -> Lee survives.
Don't cut his arm off -> Lee turns.
Making him turn regardless of what you do renders your choice useless and this is nothing but lazy writing, especially since you had absolutely no control about the way he got bitten. I was 100% sure there is going to be a walker near the walkie talkie and I would had grabbed the shovel or a stick, or simply approached the trash bin from the side where I can see what's there, but the game didn't let me. This is just lame. They sacrificed Lee in order to make the story as emotional as possible and as far as I can see they succeeded in making you guys cry rivers. While the story wasn't bad for a movie or a comic, it was terrible for a video game where your experience is supposed to be tailored by how you play. It simply wasn't at all and I was very disappointed that they didn't manage to make choices truly matter, not even in the final episode! I find the ending lacking. It's just lame and lazy.
Personally, I didn't like the plot from episode 3 onwards when they killed Carley no matter what you did, but I could live with it. However, killing Lee in a cutscene and give the players absolutely no choice to get the ending they wanted, the ending that is truly tailored to their gameplay, well that's just lazy and lame. Dunno why you folks play video games but I play them because they're interactive. If I just want somebody to tell me a story where I my decisions have absolutely ZERO impact on I'll go read a book or watch a movie.
But that speech he made in the house about not ending it because its hard you have to carry on to help those you care about... WELL I THOUGHT HE CARED ABOUT CLEM. so why wouldn't he do EVERYTHING he could to get our little girl back, and THEN decide to end it. It just frustrates me because now kenny will never know if we got clementine back or not.
Silly fool.
Still
Excuse me! In the walking dead Rick has had just as much victories as he has had tradgeides if not more. Is it unrealistic when he gets a happy ending to an issue or a story arc? When he finds the prison that was a victory since it offered shelter and hope, even if temporary. What about when Rick arrived at Hershel's farm and later saw his son recover, or when he found the Wilshire estate and had shelter for the night,or when he arrived at the camp out side Atlanta to find his wife and son safe, or when he found Gleen and Maggie on horseback when he thought all hope was lost and they took him back to Hershel's farm where he saw Andrea, sophia, Billy, Ben and Dale still alive,or when he arrived at the Alexandria safe zone on the road to washington. Now lets look at the key tradgedy moments; When the Wilshire estate was overrun, When the zombies got loose from Hershel's barn, When he arrived at Woodbury, when The governor attacked the prison, when the Alexandria gated community was over run and more recently when he went up against Negan. These key tragic events are over the course of over a year in Rick's world. Alot of the victories and hope inspiring moments have come at the end of the issues and comic story arcs so they were happy endings even if they were temporary. The walking dead is not all doom and gloom. There is balance, moments where the group even let their guard down because things were so comfortable, times where Rick has encouraged Carl to live like a child and go trick or treating like when he was in the Alaxandria safe zone.
As for our so called misconceptions, telltale clearly stated that we could have a complete different set of survivors by the end of our game from someone else. Just watch the early playing dead videos. I'm sure you can still find them on youtube. I'm going to have the same survivors at the end of my game as you no matter what I do, that is not how the game was promoted, publicised or advertised. I would have bought the game any way because i'm a fan of the comics and the show but I was only expecting what Telltale said this game would do and how different from other games it would be because of player choices. Heavy Rain did not have as much an emphasis in the commercials and publicity about choices and that game actually has replay value since there is countless ways the game can unfold and end. Even in the latest playing dead episode Gary Whitta makes a point how episode 5 has 8 branches which the player can experience and how large the scripts were as a result of this, yet I found episode 5 to be the shortest of the 5 episodes and less conversation heavy than previous episodes.
No it's because Kirkman wrote the comics better than Telltale wrote the game. Rick's ability to survive is not purely luck, he has learned to survive in this world. Nothing he does seems out of place or wreckless. He's careful and he's learned from previous experiences. If Rick or any of the original Atlanta camp survivors were to be killed it wouldn't be a cheap kill by a lone zombie it will be at the hand of a human or the result of a herd overruning their area. With all the experience Lee had after 13 weeks of surviving this world he was caught of guard when wrestling a single walker. He was able to over come and get away from the reanimated Mr Parker when he was lying on his back (episode 2 on the truck)and the zombie was on top of him and he had less leverage but he couldn't overcome the zombie when he was standing up, why? Because Telltale wrote it that way.
I had no problem with key characters dying in the game it's the way they died. I think Lee should have been bitten when he was in the midst of the horde when he was fighting to get to the Marsh house. I think Carly should have died struggling with Lily for the gun as opposed to Lily shooting her point blank for calling her a bitch. I think Katjaa should have died by Duck reanimating and biting her when she was saying her goodbyes, she could have been cuddling him at the time. Kenny's death was one of the least realistic. He only has 1 bullet, he shoots 1 of the 10 or so zombies approaching him and tries to fight the rest by punching them when he had plenty of time to run up the ladder with Lee, again, he could have died in the zombie horde on the way to the Marsh house.
How dilusional must one be to accept Lee's death scene as being feasible. Lets put this in context. He has collapsed in the midst of a zombie herd and weighs at least 154 ibs (11 stone if your British) yet Clementine is able to drag him into a shop/building without attracting attention from the countless zombies and she is not persued. In such a situation sudden movements would be enough to alert the walkers to the fact you are not one of them. What would have been more believable would have been if he escorted her to the safe zone then collapsed like the man did in the movie called "The Road" and she pointed out that the train was right there, cried and then shot Lee with Christa and Omid running towards her and crying over Lee's body, taking his body with them to give him a burial. Arriving by train to a building/house in a secluded area, having a burial and saying their final words. That ending would have also been true to the walking dead.
Are you for real??? It's called a story for reason, not written by you. As I said before, you want a different ending...write your damn story:eek::eek:
OMG are you asking for a different ending?? LOL.....too hilariuous....deal with it
It's called a GAME because it's INTERACTIVE. If you want just a good story, read a book or watch a film.
Seriously. Why do some people have a problem with the idea that you can have a good story AND have it be interactive and branching based on player decisions?
The sales pitch for this game was that the story was going to be shaped by the collaboration between TTG and the people playing it through the decisions that the players made.
That was the promise. That was what was constantly mentioned in interviews (along with statements that TTG was paying attention to the choices being made and altering the game based on forum feedback and those choices) and what, ultimately, was not delivered.
That is the point dude...too late do do anything about it, deal with it
Really? That's the best you can come up with?
I'm arguing from the point of narrative - not "real life."
From the point of narrative, why bother having Lee cut off his arm. If it isn't doing anything to change the way the story plays out, what's the point? Decisions characters make in a story are meant to serve some purpose to the plot.
Cutting off his arm *should* have meant that someone else had to go to the bell tower and risk their life. It *should* have meant crossing the sign was near impossible and another route needed to be found.
It should not have meant absolutely nothing to events and actions that Lee faced after that decision.
As such - if cutting off his arm has zero narrative impact beyond a few cripple jokes, why bother having the option at all? It just makes the whole exercise pointless in a rather unsatisfying way.
IF it had meant that there would be a scene all about how he's turning anyway and how hard he had tried to live... then maybe. But the game really just goes "Lee cuts off his arm and that's all."