When does she play favourites? When rationing the food? As far as I remember she played a lottery to determine who's getting food. If anyone was played favourites it was Lee and Kenny.
That's not exactly true. He's the one that's siding with her. Plus she even admits that he can be a little tough but doesn't mean ill.
She takes the position she believes is right. She tries to keep the entire group save.
Does Kenny do that? No
Even Lee shows more favouritism than her. Choosing Doug/Carley, choosing the people to feed... etc.
What about Larry trying to kill Lee? He gets a pass for that, and right on the heels of Larry threatening Lee yet again Lilly tells Lee "we're lucky to have you.."
Inconsistency is not what I look for in leadership.
What about Larry trying to kill Lee? He gets a pass for that, and right on the heels of Larry threatening Lee yet again Lilly tells Lee "we're lucky to have you.."
Inconsistency is not what I look for in leadership.
Am, why do you think she knows about that? Do you think that Larry will go and tell her "Am, sweety, I just tried to kill the man that saved me because he's a convicted murderer and might harm you"
So you're calling her inconsistent and playing favouritism for something she doesn't know and hasn't done? I'm sorry, mate, but your arguments do not ring true to me.
In ep 1 it did seem like she always went along with her dad instead of the other way around. Ep2 as well, to an extent. I was excited about seeing her unburdoned by her father in ep3, then again I said the same thing about Kenny and his family. Maybe I should stop wishing for things.
Even before Larry died she was becoming unglued; and in the sequence dealing with the rations, she clearly has a martyr complex.
And her final act as "leader" she murders a member of the group and (if you choose to keep her with the group) abandons the group when the consequences are apparently clear. Not very impressive leadership skills, if you ask me or anyone else with any understanding of leadership.
I understand the structure of the game, but she doesn't undertake any of the key missions (like helping Glenn, gathering supplies or checking out the dairy with Lee). A real leader leads from the front, not from the lawn chair on top of the Winnebago.
She's protecting the group from the traitor... If Carley explained it wasn't her and it must have obviously been Ben since there was nobody else, she would be alive and the traitor gone. Instead she started attacking Lilly back and well, we know how that ended.
Lee's the muscle type of leader that runs around and goes hunting. There needs to be somebody who keeps some sort of order in the group and as well as that protect that kids. If you've saved Doug there will be nobody to defend the camp except for Lilly.
I think you're expecting more of her than anyone can deliver...
That group was bound to fall apart the moment that salt-lick smashed Larry's head.
Edit: What sun sign do you think Lilly is? I would say she's a Taurus - gentle and tender at one moment and devastatingly furious and headstrong at other. She has the need to see everything working perfectly as a true Taurus and has a latent liking for leadership.
I think she killed Carley because Carley never recognized Lily as the leader of the group. Carley and Glenn saved Lee even though Lily and Larry forbid them to. When Kenny were giving out orders for the first time Carley responds "got it, boss" and Lily looks at her mean mugging. Larry definitely didn't like her so they probably talked a lot of shit about her in private. If you help Larry maybe she gets feelings for Lee and becomes jealous pf Carley on top of that (or a least since she doesn't like Carley is trying to protect Lee from a manufactured threats). Lily snapped when Carley expressed her opinion and killed her in cold blood. She is way in the wrong and murdered an innocent woman. It doesn't matter if you feel sorry for Lily because of what happened (which is very sad and unfortunate) she has lost her mind and was not to be trusted. She was a big danger to the group and who knows what she would do if they let her stay in the group? Who she would think did what and who she thinks is her enemy and not to be trusted. She went over the line and is a lost cause.
Lily snapped when Carley expressed her opinion and killed her in cold blood. She is way in the wrong and murdered an innocent woman.
Carley's death (as opposed to Doug's) was so intentional on Lily's part that it makes me think this Ep was rushed. There had to be more than just *that* exchange between them to cause that, maybe something else that happened at the motel or maybe during the bandits was cut or didnt make it into production?
Either way, Lily was prepared to murder someone that night.
Also, we have to remember that while Ep 3 took 2 mos for us to play, Larry died only days ago (if that) when Ep 3 begins. The pain of Larry's death and his killers walking around right in front of her is a memory for us but for her it was like yesterday.
I don't think she was thinking and planning to kill carley (haven't seen the one with doug). Looks like she just saw red, and she had a gun. To me she looks shocked/stunned after doing it herself.
anything bad u see comes from Lee, is really from the player, he has no say into it...
When I play, I gave every "faction" food, where's the favoritism there?
I gave the kids, Kenny & Larry.
Carley declined, sorry Mark & Ben. This is an initiation for Ben, lol
As for Doug or Carley, hardly favoritism as he/the player want to save both & went on instinct...
Lee is the player and yes it is still a sort of favouritism. Did you flip a coin as to who to feed? I bet you didn't. Plus you still saved the one person that you felt closer to you. It is still a favouritism, no matter how latent it is.
Saying that Lilly shows favouritism towards her dad is ridiculous. It's the same as saying that Kenny would feed his kid and wife instead of Larry.
Plus remember the famous Lilly lottery? She let's chance determine who's going to eat.. and that's fair... as Harvey Dent says in the Dark Knight movie "The world is cruel. And the only morality in a cruel world is chance. Unbiased. Unprejudiced. Fair!"
I don't think she was thinking and planning to kill carley (haven't seen the one with doug). Looks like she just saw red, and she had a gun. To me she looks shocked/stunned after doing it herself.
She snapped, there's no question about it. That's the reason why I think she doesn't let you run away with her. She realizes she's become too dangerous and unpredictable and since my Lee's the only person that has always supported her besides her father I don't think she would want to risk his life.
it wasnt like Ben was behind Carley, they were shoulder to shoulder, there's 0 doubt who her target and what her intention was. I mean, you dont accidentally shoot someone in the face from 18" away
it wasnt like Ben was behind Carley, they were shoulder to shoulder, there's 0 doubt who her target and what her intention was. I mean, you dont accidentally shoot someone in the face from 18" away
I think what rachellouise85 meant to say was that she hasn't been planning on killing Carley as some people try to make it
said she went out with the intention of killing someone. I'm saying that is not true. There is a difference between seeing red and doing something in a moment of anger, and planning and having the intention to kill someone.
Carley's death (as opposed to Doug's) was so intentional on Lily's part that it makes me think this Ep was rushed. There had to be more than just *that* exchange between them to cause that, maybe something else that happened at the motel or maybe during the bandits was cut or didnt make it into production?
Either way, Lily was prepared to murder someone that night.
Also, we have to remember that while Ep 3 took 2 mos for us to play, Larry died only days ago (if that) when Ep 3 begins. The pain of Larry's death and his killers walking around right in front of her is a memory for us but for her it was like yesterday.
Carley didn't kill Larry. What Carley did was challenge Lilly's leadership. Repeatedly.
It's actually in Lilly's first appearance. When Carley and Glenn save your original crew from zombies, Lilly freaks right out and claims they need to throw everyone back into the street with the zombies. Back into the street.
Larry's big and angry, but Lilly's just as cold-blooded as he is. She just speaks more softly. She's just as horrible.
What it all comes down to is, without Larry, she doesn't have muscle. She doesn't have someone to jump out and scare people into following her orders. So when Carley challenges her and Larry's not there to jump in her face and start screaming, Lilly shoots her instead since she really is a coward.
NOTE: Notice how she starts reaching for the gun but doesn't shoot Carley until she turns around. She knows Carley would kill her first if she tried. It was calculated.
I think what rachellouise85 meant to say was that she hasn't been planning on killing Carley as some people try to make it
No I dont think she woke up and was like 'Im killing Carley today'
But maybe she saw red outside the RV or what, but once that gun was pulled her target had been decided
Im sick of Kenny's shit. The one scene where he left my Lee under the door and didn't help really got me mad. His excuse is that there were walkers everywhere? I see him standing there with his thumb up his ass contemplating on leaving Lee. To hell with Kenny, I chose to leave with Lilly but she tricked me! lol. So yes, I appreciate Lilly and all that shes done to keep the GROUP together, not just her family, like some red neck we all know. But to be honest I do feel sympathy to Ken since he lost his wife and son within minutes. Like someone else said I hope Lilly re appears for a scene or even just mentioned. She was a good character, and a good leader.
It would be cool if she makes a cameo in the final episode only in the stories of those players who have chosen to run away with her Of course that won't happen probably, but still...
Keep dreaming pal.
There is no need for a Lilly appreciation thread. What do you expect?
"ALL HAIL LILLY FOR GOING CRAZY AND KILLING CARLY AND STEALING THE RV!"
I don't think she was thinking and planning to kill carley (haven't seen the one with doug). Looks like she just saw red, and she had a gun. To me she looks shocked/stunned after doing it herself.
Of course she wasn't REALLY planning to kill her when they got in the RV. She most definitely wanted her gone some way or another, though. Carley never recognized her as a leader and didn't follow her "orders". They obviously had feuds behind the scenes (in between the episodes) because none of them are afraid to express their opinions and it didn't seem like they agreed on many things... The various circumstances didn't help.
I'm not biased but I just don't see how the virtual murder of the virtual character Carley was justified in any way. No way for me to flip it around and make Lily look any less bad than any cold blooded killer.
In my game Lily slaughtered her most trusted friend's best friend in front of two kids and Kenny. So she murdered an innocent woman and destroyed her own life (as far as this episode goes) and scarred three others' for life. Oh, but it's cool! She was a little depressed, that's all! It'll buff out!
Of course she wasn't REALLY planning to kill her when they got in the RV. She most definitely wanted her gone some way or another, though. Carley never recognized her as a leader and didn't follow her "orders". They obviously had feuds behind the scenes (in between the episodes) because none of them are afraid to express their opinions and it didn't seem like they agreed on many things... The various circumstances didn't help.
I'm not biased but I just don't see how the virtual murder of the virtual character Carley was justified in any way. No way for me to flip it around and make Lily look any less bad than any cold blooded killer.
In my game Lily slaughtered her most trusted friend's best friend in front of two kids and Kenny. So she murdered an innocent woman and destroyed her own life (as far as this episode goes) and scarred three others' for life. Oh, but it's cool! She was a little depressed, that's all! It'll buff out!
Don't put things that aren't there.
Except for killing few bandits and walkers Carley didn't do anything. She never participated in anything. I don't remember seeing her on watch, nor has she gone hunting. She really didn't do much.
Most arguments were went like this:
Lilly : Kenny..you bla bla bla bla - fighting
Kenny: Lilly, you bla bla bla bla fighting
Lee: C'mon guys, stop it let's do what's best for the kids.
*Carley appears
Carley: Are you guys fighting again?
*Carley goes away
In my game Lilly killed a bitch that decided she would run her mouth at the least appropriate time. You know when you are that worthless you shut the fu** up and obey. As Rick said it at the end of season 2 "This is not a democracy anymore!". I guess in my game it never was Don't get me wrong I'm not gonna shake Lilly's hand for killing Carley, but if she really was stupid enough to talk back at her like that, well she kinda asked for it.
I think Doug's version is far more tragic. Doug is a good fellow and he died saving the traitor. He wasn't that useless either. He was fixing the fence, giving you information about chalk... funny stuff He was a silent guy but he didn't try to be something he clearly wasn't. Poor Doug.
I can't believe that Carley just kept going though. After they had all established lilly was becoming unstable etc. I guess they were all on the point of breaking and everything. Katjaa was right to feel uneasy about everyone carrying guns
Carley didn't kill Larry. What Carley did was challenge Lilly's leadership. Repeatedly.
It's actually in Lilly's first appearance. When Carley and Glenn save your original crew from zombies, Lilly freaks right out and claims they need to throw everyone back into the street with the zombies. Back into the street.
Larry's big and angry, but Lilly's just as cold-blooded as he is. She just speaks more softly. She's just as horrible.
What it all comes down to is, without Larry, she doesn't have muscle. She doesn't have someone to jump out and scare people into following her orders. So when Carley challenges her and Larry's not there to jump in her face and start screaming, Lilly shoots her instead since she really is a coward.
NOTE: Notice how she starts reaching for the gun but doesn't shoot Carley until she turns around. She knows Carley would kill her first if she tried. It was calculated.
I agree, if she had killed kenny lee or (in my game I helped kill larry) would at least have a reason.
I think you are someone who could get one to that point.
What makes you say that? Lets say I got to the point and snapped in a world like this and an innocent woman in front a pair of kids and her best friend... How would I not a monster?
I agree, if she had killed kenny lee or (in my game I helped kill larry) would at least have a reason.
Kenny and Lee had kids to take care, so they wouldn't risk dealing with bandits. It is a sound logic and I was thinking of it too when I played this ep. for the first time.
As for Carley, I can't really agree that she was challenging Lilly's leadership. Carley rarely did anything besides shooting a few heads.
Comments
As far as her "military" experience goes...
She's a clerk, for Pete's sake. The dialogue in the game makes her out to be some kind of Green Beret badass.
Pfffft.
When it's called into question she says "he's been through so much, he's lost everything except me..."
Who the F**K hasn't? Every member in the group has lost loved ones- do any of them expect a pass for bad behaviour on that count? I think not.
She takes the position she believes is right. She tries to keep the entire group save.
Does Kenny do that? No
Even Lee shows more favouritism than her. Choosing Doug/Carley, choosing the people to feed... etc.
What about Larry trying to kill Lee? He gets a pass for that, and right on the heels of Larry threatening Lee yet again Lilly tells Lee "we're lucky to have you.."
Inconsistency is not what I look for in leadership.
Am, why do you think she knows about that? Do you think that Larry will go and tell her "Am, sweety, I just tried to kill the man that saved me because he's a convicted murderer and might harm you"
So you're calling her inconsistent and playing favouritism for something she doesn't know and hasn't done? I'm sorry, mate, but your arguments do not ring true to me.
And her final act as "leader" she murders a member of the group and (if you choose to keep her with the group) abandons the group when the consequences are apparently clear. Not very impressive leadership skills, if you ask me or anyone else with any understanding of leadership.
I understand the structure of the game, but she doesn't undertake any of the key missions (like helping Glenn, gathering supplies or checking out the dairy with Lee). A real leader leads from the front, not from the lawn chair on top of the Winnebago.
Lee's the muscle type of leader that runs around and goes hunting. There needs to be somebody who keeps some sort of order in the group and as well as that protect that kids. If you've saved Doug there will be nobody to defend the camp except for Lilly.
I think you're expecting more of her than anyone can deliver...
That group was bound to fall apart the moment that salt-lick smashed Larry's head.
Edit: What sun sign do you think Lilly is?
Carley's death (as opposed to Doug's) was so intentional on Lily's part that it makes me think this Ep was rushed. There had to be more than just *that* exchange between them to cause that, maybe something else that happened at the motel or maybe during the bandits was cut or didnt make it into production?
Either way, Lily was prepared to murder someone that night.
Also, we have to remember that while Ep 3 took 2 mos for us to play, Larry died only days ago (if that) when Ep 3 begins. The pain of Larry's death and his killers walking around right in front of her is a memory for us but for her it was like yesterday.
Uhh, that's the player, not Lee...
anything bad u see comes from Lee, is really from the player, he has no say into it...
When I play, I gave every "faction" food, where's the favoritism there?
I gave the kids, Kenny & Larry.
Carley declined, sorry Mark & Ben. This is an initiation for Ben, lol
As for Doug or Carley, hardly favoritism as he/the player want to save both & went on instinct...
Game = Over.
Lee is the player and yes it is still a sort of favouritism. Did you flip a coin as to who to feed? I bet you didn't. Plus you still saved the one person that you felt closer to you. It is still a favouritism, no matter how latent it is.
Saying that Lilly shows favouritism towards her dad is ridiculous. It's the same as saying that Kenny would feed his kid and wife instead of Larry.
Plus remember the famous Lilly lottery? She let's chance determine who's going to eat.. and that's fair... as Harvey Dent says in the Dark Knight movie "The world is cruel. And the only morality in a cruel world is chance. Unbiased. Unprejudiced. Fair!"
She snapped, there's no question about it. That's the reason why I think she doesn't let you run away with her. She realizes she's become too dangerous and unpredictable and since my Lee's the only person that has always supported her besides her father I don't think she would want to risk his life.
I think what rachellouise85 meant to say was that she hasn't been planning on killing Carley as some people try to make it
Carley didn't kill Larry. What Carley did was challenge Lilly's leadership. Repeatedly.
It's actually in Lilly's first appearance. When Carley and Glenn save your original crew from zombies, Lilly freaks right out and claims they need to throw everyone back into the street with the zombies. Back into the street.
Larry's big and angry, but Lilly's just as cold-blooded as he is. She just speaks more softly. She's just as horrible.
What it all comes down to is, without Larry, she doesn't have muscle. She doesn't have someone to jump out and scare people into following her orders. So when Carley challenges her and Larry's not there to jump in her face and start screaming, Lilly shoots her instead since she really is a coward.
NOTE: Notice how she starts reaching for the gun but doesn't shoot Carley until she turns around. She knows Carley would kill her first if she tried. It was calculated.
No I dont think she woke up and was like 'Im killing Carley today'
But maybe she saw red outside the RV or what, but once that gun was pulled her target had been decided
Im sick of Kenny's shit. The one scene where he left my Lee under the door and didn't help really got me mad. His excuse is that there were walkers everywhere? I see him standing there with his thumb up his ass contemplating on leaving Lee. To hell with Kenny, I chose to leave with Lilly but she tricked me! lol. So yes, I appreciate Lilly and all that shes done to keep the GROUP together, not just her family, like some red neck we all know. But to be honest I do feel sympathy to Ken since he lost his wife and son within minutes. Like someone else said I hope Lilly re appears for a scene or even just mentioned. She was a good character, and a good leader.
Keep dreaming pal.
There is no need for a Lilly appreciation thread. What do you expect?
"ALL HAIL LILLY FOR GOING CRAZY AND KILLING CARLY AND STEALING THE RV!"
"THEN WORKING FOR
I think Lilly is a saint when you look at it this way
Of course she wasn't REALLY planning to kill her when they got in the RV. She most definitely wanted her gone some way or another, though. Carley never recognized her as a leader and didn't follow her "orders". They obviously had feuds behind the scenes (in between the episodes) because none of them are afraid to express their opinions and it didn't seem like they agreed on many things... The various circumstances didn't help.
I'm not biased but I just don't see how the virtual murder of the virtual character Carley was justified in any way. No way for me to flip it around and make Lily look any less bad than any cold blooded killer.
In my game Lily slaughtered her most trusted friend's best friend in front of two kids and Kenny. So she murdered an innocent woman and destroyed her own life (as far as this episode goes) and scarred three others' for life. Oh, but it's cool! She was a little depressed, that's all! It'll buff out!
That's true... I don't know how many people I've killed in real life because they called me a "scared little girl"... I take back everything I've said
Don't put things that aren't there.
Except for killing few bandits and walkers Carley didn't do anything. She never participated in anything. I don't remember seeing her on watch, nor has she gone hunting. She really didn't do much.
Most arguments were went like this:
Lilly : Kenny..you bla bla bla bla - fighting
Kenny: Lilly, you bla bla bla bla fighting
Lee: C'mon guys, stop it let's do what's best for the kids.
*Carley appears
Carley: Are you guys fighting again?
*Carley goes away
In my game Lilly killed a bitch that decided she would run her mouth at the least appropriate time. You know when you are that worthless you shut the fu** up and obey. As Rick said it at the end of season 2 "This is not a democracy anymore!". I guess in my game it never was
I think Doug's version is far more tragic. Doug is a good fellow and he died saving the traitor. He wasn't that useless either. He was fixing the fence, giving you information about chalk... funny stuff
I think you are someone who could get one to that point.
Get who to what point?
I forgot to quote him. Get someone to point of just snapping, and doing something without thinking it though etc.
'nuff said
/thread
Lori was by far one of the most annoying characters in both the comic book and the TV show
Sick to my stomach isnt even the tip of the iceberg regarding that woman
I agree, if she had killed kenny lee or (in my game I helped kill larry) would at least have a reason.
What makes you say that? Lets say I got to the point and snapped in a world like this and an innocent woman in front a pair of kids and her best friend... How would I not a monster?
Kenny and Lee had kids to take care, so they wouldn't risk dealing with bandits. It is a sound logic and I was thinking of it too when I played this ep. for the first time.
As for Carley, I can't really agree that she was challenging Lilly's leadership. Carley rarely did anything besides shooting a few heads.
I hope the novel really does focus on her, rather than having her just in it.