That discussion with Tim & Ron was awesome. I especially liked Ron's description of what was great about adventure games.. that moment when you are away from the game, on the bus, or at work thinking of a possible solution. I love to think..and today's gamers would rather kill something than think.
Kickstarter isn’t charity: we champion exchanges that are a mix of commerce and patronage, and the numbers bear this out. To date the most popular pledge amount is $25 and the average pledge is around $70. Small amounts are where it’s at: projects without a reward less than $20 succeed 35% of the time, while projects with a reward less than $20 succeed 54% of the time.
So what works? Offering something of value. Actual value considers more than just sticker price. If it’s a limited edition or a one-of-a-kind experience, there’s a lot of flexibility based on your audience. But if it’s a manufactured good, then it’s a good idea to stay reasonably close to its real-world cost.
They also state limited edition...which the box and your name in the credits are. I do agree that you should get something reasonable for your pledge, but it is also for support. For what you get, I don't see 100 as too unreasonable. Most collector editions of modern game cost that much already(which I rarely see as worth it, so I'm almost proving your point here).
Not to put any other people down, but I think if you're a serious Adventure Game fan, the $100 package is just brilliant, just to outline what you now get:
- Steam Download Key + Access to BETA via Steam (PC + MAC)
- DRM Free Download (PC + MAC + Linux)
- Physical Boxed Copy of the Game (PC + MAC + LINUX)
- Digital Soundtrack
- Digital Documentary Soundtrack
- Documentary in HD
- Special Thanks in the Games Credits (Your name plus 6,000 more!)
- PDF Download of the Artwork Book
- Access to behind the scenes discussions with the team and fans
Granted it's only really two physical items, but all that behind the scene stuff and music, and hopefully demo tracks, etc, not to mention what goodies could be in that Art Book, etc. And since you get a boxed version, you could just go ahead and give your download code to a friend, so buying the game for them to!
Not to put any other people down, but I think if you're a serious Adventure Game fan, the $100 package is just brilliant, just to outline what you now get:
- Steam Download Key + Access to BETA via Steam (PC + MAC)
- DRM Free Download (PC + MAC + Linux)
- Physical Boxed Copy of the Game (PC + MAC + LINUX)
- Digital Soundtrack
- Digital Documentary Soundtrack
- Documentary in HD
- Special Thanks in the Games Credits (Your name plus 6,000 more!)
- PDF Download of the Artwork Book
- Access to behind the scenes discussions with the team and fans
Granted it's only really two physical items, but all that behind the scene stuff and music, and hopefully demo tracks, etc, not to mention what goodies could be in that Art Book, etc. And since you get a boxed version, you could just go ahead and give your download code to a friend, so buying the game for them to!
This isn't how it's broken down.
- Steam Download Key + Access to BETA via Steam (PC + MAC)
- DRM Free Download (PC + MAC + Linux)
- Access to behind the scenes discussions with the team and fans
For $15
- Digital Soundtrack
- Digital Documentary Soundtrack
- Documentary in HD
For $30, $15 more than the previous tier.
- PDF Download of the Artwork Book
For $60, $30 more than the previous tier.
- Physical Boxed Copy of the Game (PC + MAC + LINUX)
- Special Thanks in the Games Credits (Your name plus 6,000 more!)
-Poster(which you forgot to mention)
For $100, $40 more than the previous tier.
So when you look at it, it comes off as more a question of "Is a digital book worth $30? Would I ever pay $30 for a digital book? Is $40 a bit much for a box and a poster? If $30 seems like a bit much for a digital book, doesn't the difference seem closer to that $70 gap between the $30 and $100 tier?
How the hell did I leave out the Poster?? ...well now it makes it look even better value. I'd prefer to see it as a complete package, but hell, I was 100 down anyway because I wanted the poster and this was back when the project was soo far away from it's target, ...like the second hour or something, so I was happy to put that much down, now I'm just getting more for that.
Well, i would easily pay $30 for a new Süskind, a new Vance where he's on his climax again, for some interesting book about astronomy, ... or a Double Fine adventure book including a design document about the game. You want $40? No problem. $50? Okay. ...
But i for sure won't pay you $30 for some stupid wannabee designer/film maker/taking blabla to the next level/interactive movie/whatever/mass market/dinosaur-crap. You don't even get $0.03 from me for such a thing.
Why the hell is the physical book $500? That should be in the $100 tier. I would gladly pay $100 for:
Game (Physical, Steam, and DRM-Free versions)
Soundtrack(Physical and Digital versions)
Book (Physical and PDF versions)
Poster
I don't really care about the documentary, but having the Blu-ray of that included(which they're actually making), might be interesting, at a slightly higher tier. ($125 or so)
The rewards are just a bonus to me..I'm giving the money because I want Tim Schafer to make an adventure game..and I want him to have as much as money possible because that will only make the game better.
It for sure is primary about the game but it's also about all the excitement, the perspective and the feeling which surrounds it. I mean look at the videos, read through the updates, that's a pleasure already.
"Ahoy, Backers of Adventure! And potential Backers of Adventure! And Haters of Adventure who come here whenever they feel like gnashing their teeth and seething with rage!..."
The rewards are just a bonus to me..I'm giving the money because I want Tim Schafer to make an adventure game..and I want him to have as much as money possible because that will only make the game better.
This. For the most part. I want the stuff too. But the above reason justifies upping my pledge amount. I might just do it.
I will certainly be raising my pledge to $100 (well, $110). I might raise it bit-by-bit over the course of the next few days, though, so I don't feel so bad.
Why the hell is the physical book $500? That should be in the $100 tier. I would gladly pay $100 for:
Game (Physical, Steam, and DRM-Free versions)
Soundtrack(Physical and Digital versions)
Book (Physical and PDF versions)
Poster
I don't really care about the documentary, but having the Blu-ray of that included(which they're actually making), might be interesting, at a slightly higher tier. ($125 or so)
Your not pledging there to pay for the item a 100 page full color book with arts and design documents probally costs somewhere around 25 dollars to make so if they do it for the 100 dollar pledge they would almost loose money if people go to that stage instead of getting extra from people.
Uhm.. if the book costs approximately $25 to make, and selling it for 100 dollars as part of a pledge.. I fail to see how that's losing money. It always kind of bothers me that certain things go for way more than it costs to produce them. Making something for $10 and selling it for 30 is one thing but having a supposed 600% mark-up is rather unreasonable.
That said, I pledged $15 dollars, and will be upping it to $30 if I can scrounge up some more money between now and the closing date. I don't really have that kind of money to spend on other people, but I've been a fan of Tim & DF for a long time, so I think it's important that I show my support.
...and being guaranteed a copy doesn't hurt. I'd pay more if I had lots of unwanted cash, but I just don't have the means to warrant that kind of spending.
As much as I like the $100 reward tier stuff...
...I can't justify paying $70 for a box, a poster, and a digital book.
This is the big issue for me. I'm already trying to live above my means as it is, and while I can't really justify spending $30 on a game I might not even be able to run on my computer, I certainly can't tell myself that $100 is worth all of the stuff we'd potentially be getting. The difference between a physical object and a digital one is the means with which I can get it. I would like to think the PDF will be available after the game comes out at a much more reasonable price, or that the poster will be available as an image so I could at least see what it would've looked like. That and.. well, I never really was a poster person.
That discussion with Tim & Ron was awesome. I especially liked Ron's description of what was great about adventure games.. that moment when you are away from the game, on the bus, or at work thinking of a possible solution. I love to think..and today's gamers would rather kill something than think.
I wanted to point out that I constantly think about the games I'm playing when I'm not playing them, even the ones that aren't point-and-click games. "What would be the best way to get past those enemies?" or "I wonder how you get up there, what am I doing wrong?" I enjoy pondering the games I am playing or have already finished.
The problem is most people nowadays have a problem with immediate gratification. If they can't get past a certain part of a game they'll drop it and forget about it until some future point in time when they pick it up again. But, as was also mentioned in the video, most likely people will never pick it up again. It's not like it used to be. There are too many games out nowadays (especially Indie games, as awesome as they mostly are) and people have extremely short attention spans. Nowadays it's more about one developer after another fighting for the gamers' attention. Before we just didn't have that many games and they weren't as popular in the public eye. We didn't have any other games to try (not as many anyway) so we kept going back to what we had. This forced us to accept the fact that we might be stuck with the same game and its puzzles for a while. Developers could afford to make stumping puzzles. It's almost like they can't anymore. Which sucks.
If you're primary looking at the rewards then $500 isn't offering this much, more as the signed posters ran out and this leaves quite a gap between $100 and $500. It also doesn't help that they don't sign the posters for the $500 tier.
So i wouldn't be surprised if they add another tier, maybe between $120-$250, depending on how things evolve, with a softcover being included.
But again, this has a lot more value than just the rewards being included, at least for me.
It sounds reasonable. I can't remember the last shipping fees we had to pay here on TTG but i somehow remember that things looked a lot worse until you didn't take the chance of one of their sales actions.
The problem is most people nowadays have a problem with immediate gratification. If they can't get past a certain part of a game they'll drop it and forget about it until some future point in time when they pick it up again. ... We didn't have any other games to try (not as many anyway) so we kept going back to what we had.
I definitely hear where you're coming from with this. Ordinarily, I would enjoy my games and take them at my own pace, which may be fast or slow depending on the game. In some ways, it's almost GOOD that I've become disillusioned with the majority of the games industry or I'd be like my cousin - constantly buying new games, preordering this and that, and not finishing a fair number of them.
In a way, I already am like that. Between the PS1 and now I've accumulated too many games and actually have a good 30 or so that I've never finished or haven't even touched! It's terrible, but with my gaming purchases steadily declining as the years go by, I suppose this gives me ample time to go back and play said games. The main issue being that they may not always play anymore, or the console/handheld may no longer work (or something may be misplaced).
I do try to go and play some of the games I've not played from time to time. However, I also learned that some of those games simply weren't any good. I got Contact on the DS because several people I knew suggested it and saying how it reminded them of EarthBound's writing and I got it and was throughly disappointed by it's slow pace and lackluster gameplay. Lost Magic kept getting named as a great game, but I found it boring and frustrating. The list goes on.. but I always feel upset that I spent money on these games and not only did I not play them right away, but I wished I hadn't bought them when I did.
Meh, I want the physical copy, dvd/bluray and poster, but I can't justify paying $110 for it. Will keep my pledge at $30. I think if it was about $60, maybe $70, I'd have considered it, but $110 is just too much.
The Dagobert Duck part of me just counted: $2.224462 millions, hurra! Which probably means that DF and 2PP now can utalise two millions. Reaching 2.5 millions will leave 2 millions to DF alone (no idea about taxes though). I wonder how much you have to substract for the postage.
What i found interesting was the part about the number of backers because i also had to think about it for a couple of times. Now whilst it's great having 65k of backers i also was wondering why they aren't more in a range of 100k-200k.
I expect the game also to generate additional sales after it will be released on all these various platforms by new users who weren't backers for some reason and by those who simply want the game on another platform or buy it as a present for someone else as well as by those who wanted but contribute but weren't able to because they couldn't access kickstarter due to a lack of a credit card or another reason.
So there also will be additional sales after the game got finished but shouldn't everyone who once bought a Monkey Island, DOTT or Grim Fandango instantly jump at this opportunity blindly with nothing than pure pleasure? I mean that's how i feel about it. In my opinion it's the best thing happening video games related since many many years. But somehow it seems that some of those 100k-200k gamers don't feel this way which i can't fully understand.
I read a little bit through different adventure forums and whilst people are enthusiastic all over the place there are also some who remain kind of suspicious and prefer to wait what the final game will look like. Again, i can't understand this point of view when i evaluate what's going on and look at the potential of awesomeness against what could go wrong.
I somehow feel ashamed for some of those adventure gamers who hesitate because of the reasons they're doing it.
What i found interesting was the part about the number of backers because i also had to think about it for a couple of times. Now whilst it's great having 65k of backers i also was wondering why they aren't more in a range of 100k-200k.
I expect the game also to generate additional sales after it will be released on all these various platforms by new users who weren't backers for some reason and by those who simply want the game on another platform or buy it as a present for someone else as well as by those who wanted but contribute but weren't able to because they couldn't access kickstarter due to a lack of a credit card or another reason.
So there also will be additional sales after the game got finished but shouldn't everyone who once bought a Monkey Island, DOTT or Grim Fandango instantly jump at this opportunity blindly with nothing than pure pleasure? I mean that's how i feel about it. In my opinion it's the best thing happening video games related since many many years. But somehow it seems that some of those 100k-200k gamers don't feel this way which i can't fully understand.
I read a little bit through different adventure forums and whilst people are enthusiastic all over the place there are also some who rmeain kind of suspicious and prefer to wait what the final game will look like. Again, i can't understand this point of view when i evaluate what's going on and look at the potential of awesomeness against what could go wrong.
I somehow feel ashamed for some of those adventure gamers who hesitate because of the reasons they're doing it.
Well, there is a difference between people who played and enjoyed monkey island, and people who are willing to throw money at Tim Schafer without knowing what he'll produce. I personally am in this latter group of people, but most are going to be in the former, waiting to see if a game is good and buying it on that basis.
Comments
...I can't justify paying $70 for a box, a poster, and a digital book.
Then don't. They're rewards for pledging a certain amount, it's not a store.
Yes it is.
- Steam Download Key + Access to BETA via Steam (PC + MAC)
- DRM Free Download (PC + MAC + Linux)
- Physical Boxed Copy of the Game (PC + MAC + LINUX)
- Digital Soundtrack
- Digital Documentary Soundtrack
- Documentary in HD
- Special Thanks in the Games Credits (Your name plus 6,000 more!)
- PDF Download of the Artwork Book
- Access to behind the scenes discussions with the team and fans
Granted it's only really two physical items, but all that behind the scene stuff and music, and hopefully demo tracks, etc, not to mention what goodies could be in that Art Book, etc. And since you get a boxed version, you could just go ahead and give your download code to a friend, so buying the game for them to!
- Steam Download Key + Access to BETA via Steam (PC + MAC)
- DRM Free Download (PC + MAC + Linux)
- Access to behind the scenes discussions with the team and fans
For $15
- Digital Soundtrack
- Digital Documentary Soundtrack
- Documentary in HD
For $30, $15 more than the previous tier.
- PDF Download of the Artwork Book
For $60, $30 more than the previous tier.
- Physical Boxed Copy of the Game (PC + MAC + LINUX)
- Special Thanks in the Games Credits (Your name plus 6,000 more!)
-Poster(which you forgot to mention)
For $100, $40 more than the previous tier.
So when you look at it, it comes off as more a question of "Is a digital book worth $30? Would I ever pay $30 for a digital book? Is $40 a bit much for a box and a poster? If $30 seems like a bit much for a digital book, doesn't the difference seem closer to that $70 gap between the $30 and $100 tier?
Well, i would easily pay $30 for a new Süskind, a new Vance where he's on his climax again, for some interesting book about astronomy, ... or a Double Fine adventure book including a design document about the game. You want $40? No problem. $50? Okay. ...
But i for sure won't pay you $30 for some stupid wannabee designer/film maker/taking blabla to the next level/interactive movie/whatever/mass market/dinosaur-crap. You don't even get $0.03 from me for such a thing.
Game (Physical, Steam, and DRM-Free versions)
Soundtrack(Physical and Digital versions)
Book (Physical and PDF versions)
Poster
I don't really care about the documentary, but having the Blu-ray of that included(which they're actually making), might be interesting, at a slightly higher tier. ($125 or so)
"Ahoy, Backers of Adventure! And potential Backers of Adventure! And Haters of Adventure who come here whenever they feel like gnashing their teeth and seething with rage!..."
This. For the most part. I want the stuff too. But the above reason justifies upping my pledge amount. I might just do it.
Your not pledging there to pay for the item a 100 page full color book with arts and design documents probally costs somewhere around 25 dollars to make so if they do it for the 100 dollar pledge they would almost loose money if people go to that stage instead of getting extra from people.
That said, I pledged $15 dollars, and will be upping it to $30 if I can scrounge up some more money between now and the closing date. I don't really have that kind of money to spend on other people, but I've been a fan of Tim & DF for a long time, so I think it's important that I show my support.
...and being guaranteed a copy doesn't hurt. I'd pay more if I had lots of unwanted cash, but I just don't have the means to warrant that kind of spending.
This is the big issue for me. I'm already trying to live above my means as it is, and while I can't really justify spending $30 on a game I might not even be able to run on my computer, I certainly can't tell myself that $100 is worth all of the stuff we'd potentially be getting. The difference between a physical object and a digital one is the means with which I can get it. I would like to think the PDF will be available after the game comes out at a much more reasonable price, or that the poster will be available as an image so I could at least see what it would've looked like. That and.. well, I never really was a poster person.
I wanted to point out that I constantly think about the games I'm playing when I'm not playing them, even the ones that aren't point-and-click games. "What would be the best way to get past those enemies?" or "I wonder how you get up there, what am I doing wrong?" I enjoy pondering the games I am playing or have already finished.
So i wouldn't be surprised if they add another tier, maybe between $120-$250, depending on how things evolve, with a softcover being included.
But again, this has a lot more value than just the rewards being included, at least for me.
That's a bummer. At least the Canadian $ is worth 0.0005 cents more than the USD.
I definitely hear where you're coming from with this. Ordinarily, I would enjoy my games and take them at my own pace, which may be fast or slow depending on the game. In some ways, it's almost GOOD that I've become disillusioned with the majority of the games industry or I'd be like my cousin - constantly buying new games, preordering this and that, and not finishing a fair number of them.
In a way, I already am like that. Between the PS1 and now I've accumulated too many games and actually have a good 30 or so that I've never finished or haven't even touched! It's terrible, but with my gaming purchases steadily declining as the years go by, I suppose this gives me ample time to go back and play said games. The main issue being that they may not always play anymore, or the console/handheld may no longer work (or something may be misplaced).
I do try to go and play some of the games I've not played from time to time. However, I also learned that some of those games simply weren't any good. I got Contact on the DS because several people I knew suggested it and saying how it reminded them of EarthBound's writing and I got it and was throughly disappointed by it's slow pace and lackluster gameplay. Lost Magic kept getting named as a great game, but I found it boring and frustrating. The list goes on.. but I always feel upset that I spent money on these games and not only did I not play them right away, but I wished I hadn't bought them when I did.
I see...
>Gets 2 and a half million within a week
I can't imagine what the atmosphere is like at Double Fine!
What i found interesting was the part about the number of backers because i also had to think about it for a couple of times. Now whilst it's great having 65k of backers i also was wondering why they aren't more in a range of 100k-200k.
I expect the game also to generate additional sales after it will be released on all these various platforms by new users who weren't backers for some reason and by those who simply want the game on another platform or buy it as a present for someone else as well as by those who wanted but contribute but weren't able to because they couldn't access kickstarter due to a lack of a credit card or another reason.
So there also will be additional sales after the game got finished but shouldn't everyone who once bought a Monkey Island, DOTT or Grim Fandango instantly jump at this opportunity blindly with nothing than pure pleasure? I mean that's how i feel about it. In my opinion it's the best thing happening video games related since many many years. But somehow it seems that some of those 100k-200k gamers don't feel this way which i can't fully understand.
I read a little bit through different adventure forums and whilst people are enthusiastic all over the place there are also some who remain kind of suspicious and prefer to wait what the final game will look like. Again, i can't understand this point of view when i evaluate what's going on and look at the potential of awesomeness against what could go wrong.
I somehow feel ashamed for some of those adventure gamers who hesitate because of the reasons they're doing it.
Well, there is a difference between people who played and enjoyed monkey island, and people who are willing to throw money at Tim Schafer without knowing what he'll produce. I personally am in this latter group of people, but most are going to be in the former, waiting to see if a game is good and buying it on that basis.